[joab]

I have finally decided to by one of the evil AWs, But I'm new to all this, so far other than a SKS Yugo the closest thing I have to a battle rifle is a Winchester .
I have narrowed my choices for a first to a Cetme or an AK, eventually I'll get both but they will be at least 6months to a year apart.
What I'm asking for is a list of Pros and Cons on each rifle.
Most of the problems I've read about with Cetmes seem to be due to operator ignorance of the sighting system and to dirty rifles shipped from the dealer (Century)
The Ak would be Romanian if I buy one and the only issue I have is the short stocks whick I would not change because I hate plastic guns.

[Slimjim]

Well, the ak is nowhere close to the Cetme, Being a intermediate cartridge, Where the cetme fires a full power carrtridge and is considered an main batttle rifle.

[standingbear]

get the ak varient.watch for the crooked sights and gas block-check the piston and be sure it isnt bent or slides in the gas block correctly....if nothing else,get the ak to p.o. a sheeple politician.I had the g3 copy..not the cetme.the issue i had was the rollers in the bolt(worn out) and the receiver halves were welded together slightly off center.the chamber has fluting which is good for reliability but bad for reloading.its 308 chambering isnt as cheap as the 7.62 x 39mm ak ammo.there was some other issues with the receivers of the cetmes and g3 copies.something about the older stainless steel ones.

[OEF_VET]

AK:
pros:
inexpensive to shoot
mags are affordable and plentiful
combat accurate, particularly within 100 meters
intermediate sized round; not too much recoil, not too much wieght

cons:
intermediate sized round; not as much stopping power as .308
accuracy deteriorates greatly past 100 -150 meters
look out for canted sights and gas tubes
SAR-1's infamous for 'trigger slap', can be remedied with a new FCG

CETME's:

pros:
accurate at further distances
full-sized round, really great stopping power

cons:
full-sized round, plenty of recoil, heavier ammo
mags are more expensive and less plentiful
ammo is more expensive (although not prohibitively so)

Hope this helps. By the way, you say you hate plastic guns, but aren't most CETME's equipped with synthetic furniture?

Frank

[joab]

Hope this helps. By the way, you say you hate plastic guns, but aren't most CETME's equipped with synthetic furniture?
Apparently not the older models . The ones I'm looking at all have wood furniture

http://img5.photobucket.com/albums/v14/bugman/CETME_C_y.jpg

[hksw]

CETME's:
.
mags are more expensive and less plentiful
.


:confused:

CETME (G3, HK) mags can be had for as low as $4-$5 used, $9-$10 new. About the same as AK mags.

[geekWithA.45]

Cetme: There's more you can do with .308 than you can with 7.62 commie.

[Slimjim]

Granted 308 is a few bucks more expensive per case, almost everyone makes it.

7.62x39 = 60 bucks for 700 rounds
.308 = 149 for 1000 rounds.

Also, the AK is in a different class of rifles. Because of the size of the round it fires compared to the CETME.

I mean, if you want something that looks like it should be hanging off a camel go with the AK, if you want something a little better built and better looking go with the CETME. Or G3, OR FAL :D

[OEF_VET]

hksw,

Thanks for correcting me. I must have been thinking of something else, or I was just off my rocker.

Frank

[Moparmike]

Personally, I wouldnt hang this:
http://img5.photobucket.com/albums/v14/bugman/CETME_C_y.jpg
off of any camel I owned. Talk about fugly guns....daaaayyyymmmnnn:eek: :uhoh: :scrutiny:

I would hang an AK off of my Benz before I would hang that CETME off of a camel.:barf:


YMMV. I have heard complaints about CETME's reliability, but have not experienced it first hand. Again, YMMV.

[Gewehr98]

What's an AW? I fear I may already know the answer. :scrutiny:

[jobu07]

Well, let me just put in my .02 I own both a CETME and a SAR-1. Both are extremely reliable, no issues at all with either. Ammo is fairly cheap and plentiful for both. The CETME mags are actually cheaper and just as plentiful as AK mags, albeit they are limited to 20 round capacity where the AK can go from 5 up to 75 rounds. The AK is more compact rifle, very usful and easy to move around. The CETME is far larger as it is a main battle rifle, fires the full powered round, and when you fire them off at the range, people have this tendency of giving oyu plenty of room to shoot:D Well, I guess i'm not much help, I love both my AK and my CETME! Just get both now and don't worry about it later!:)

edit: oh yes, and the CETME, at least mine in my opinion is a beautiful rifle that many of my friends drool over. I'm proud to display it at the range. Of course, the AK's a pretty girl in her own right too ;)

[Black92LX]

Aimsurplus has the wood furinutre ones.

for $359.99

http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Cetme_G_3__308_Rifle.html



http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/cetme.gif

[DMK]

I'd get the CETME.

7.62x51 ammo is a bit more expensive than 7.62x39, but more powerful. The CETME's I've seen are much more accurate than my SAR-1. Many CETMEs are made by Century Arms which has spotty QC, but so are the SAR-1 AKs. The CETME feels a lot more substantial than the stamped reciever AK.

OTOH, the AK shoots the same ammo as your SKS. It's simple and rugged. Recoil is less and it looks more evil. It's also easier to ID a bad SAR (canted sights or gas block) on sight than it is with problem CETMEs.

[Marcus]

They`re both must have guns! I went with a Saiga 7.62x39 first because the SARs I personally looked at were really crappy. The Saiga won`t take hi caps but the quality is MUCH better. It`s a lot of fun and cheap to shoot but something was missing. I found it after I finally found a good CETME (look at a LOT of them before you buy!). Where the AK goes "boom,boom" the CETME goes "BOOOMMM,BOOOMMM!!!" :D Ahhhhhh. Long range accurate firepower,big noise and big cases ejecting about 30 feet away. It`s great fun! 20rd. G-3 mags are available all over for <$6 and from Cheaper than Dirt for $2.97!!! They`re nice too. There are 30rd. cheap USA mags available too. They look and feel cheap but mine work just fine and they were $10ea. on sale from CTD! You gotta love 30rds. of 7.62 NATO. Marcus

[son of a gun]

Gewehr98

What's an AW? I fear I may already know the answer.



Assault weapon

[Dave R]

I have one of each, and agree with Jobu07's assessment.

If I could only have one, I'd get the AK first. But only because of economy. The CETME is more fun to shoot, as others have described. Hitting moderately small targets at 200 yards with iron sights it quite a kick.

Speaking of kick, the CETME has very low recoil for a .308. Makes a lot of noise, but doesn't kick much.

[G1FAL]

Speaking of kick, the CETME has very low recoil for a .308. Makes a lot of noise, but doesn't kick much.

Really? I've heard from numerous people that not only is the CETME extremely loud, but it has pretty hefty recoil (Compared to the FAL, anyway).

Both is a good idea (glad you thought of it). Even though I greatly prefer the FAL to the CETME, its still a MBR, and thus in a completely different class from the AK.

But everyone should have AT LEAST one AK. Preferrably several. And in a couple different calibers, too.

What AK were you thinking of getting? 7.62, 5.45, or 5.56?

[Daedalus]

You can bumpfire the AK and get really large magazines. IMHO AK is more fun, CETME is more serious.

[Mulliga]

The CETME might require some tweaking out of the box. It will be loud as all hell, but not too much recoil (compared to other .308s).

The AK is basically idiot-proof. No tweaking or mods required - it was designed for conscript troops to use, and it shows.

[Chuck Jennings]

What's an AW? I fear I may already know the answer.

Its a brand of rootbeer!! :neener:

[joab]

What AK were you thinking of getting? 7.62, 5.45, or 5.56?
That's a whole nother issue

[c_yeager]

There are a lot more goodies available for the AK. On the other hand there are a limited amount of CETMEs available. There will ALWAYS be new and used AKs on the market. (assuming legislation doesnt kick in).

[Gewehr98]

Assault weapon


An intermediate cartridge long arm, capable of selective fire to include full-automatic.

Or are people really succumbing to the anti-gunner's labeling of military-style weapons? Looks like the brainwashing of the sheeple has taken effect. :(

[c_yeager]

Like it or not

Assault Rifle (n) Any of various automatic or semiautomatic rifles designed for individual use in combat.

American Heritage Dictionary

[Dave R]

Really? I've heard from numerous people that not only is the CETME extremely loud, but it has pretty hefty recoil (Compared to the FAL, anyway).

Nope. CETME recoil is very light for .308. Less than 20 ga. Much less than my .308 Remington. Just a bit more than my .223. Very fast back on target after a shot.

At least mine, with the Century muzzle brake, is that way. I see the newer ones are shipping without a muzzle brake, so maybe they have more recoil?

I kinda doubt it. The CETME roller-locking system soaks up a lot of recoil. Also, it unlocks and opens "earlier" than a G3, so not as much recoil gets transmitted to the shooter. That's probably why it chucks brass 30 feet.

I've heard that G3's have more recoil than a CETME, because they unlock "later", but that's Internet lore, so take it with a grain of salt unless you've shot both. I haven't; I'm just repeating what I heard.

[joab]

Or are people really succumbing to the anti-gunner's labeling of military-style weapons? Looks like the brainwashing of the sheeple has taken effect.
I'm sorry Gewehr I would have thought that my use of the word evil in front of AW would have conveyed the proper sarsasm.

[TooTaxed]

Just a few for grins::D

Check out your Shotgun News for dealers and ammo.

7.62 x 39 is available for less than $80/1000...got mine recently at an Atlanta gunshow with no shipping charges. (HP seems to be a tad more accurate than FMJ in my SKS.)

www.jgsales.com has .308 Non-Corrrosive, boxer-primed, brass cased reloadable ammo for $100/1000, plus shipping...cheaper than reloading!

Gotta make a plug for the SKS...longer barrel and sight radius than the AK if you want to shoot at the range...same ammo. FAR less expensive a rifle! Neither is particularly accurate, but I get 3" 100-yd groups with my SKS, which is much more accurate than the AK. The standard SKS magazine is far better than the 30 to 40-round aftermarket detachable magazines for range shooting...that long mag is really a handicap for prone or benchrest shooting! But, with a large cap detachable mag the SKS CAN spray out the bullets like an AK if that's what you want to do! (Used full-auto AKs in action during my 3.5 yr in Vietnam.)

Am eagerly awaiting delivery of my CETME...:evil:

[Gewehr98]

But over the last few years, new-ish gun people have actually adopted the terminology as gospel, without realizing how they portray themselves. Now even one dictionary uses it in the common vernacular. Sad commentary on the times and education level of the populace. :(

[benEzra]

Assault Rifle (n) Any of various automatic or semiautomatic rifles designed for individual use in combat.
It gets worse. For the absolute most ignorant, silliest, confused, and self-contradictory definition of "assault weapon" you've ever seen, check out the otherwise excellent Encarta Dictionary. It looks like it was culled from a bunch of confused news clippings.

I've been meaning to write them a polite letter suggesting they add a correct definition of "assault rifle" (>Sturmgehwer, I know I misspelled it), and then define "assault weapon" (if they must) as "1. a rifle that externally resembles an assault rifle, but is incapable of automatic fire. 2. any firearm said to resemble an assault rifle." Or something similar. (I know I could come up with a better one, but I'm tired at the moment.)

[Feanaro]

The CETME is a great rifle... if you can get one that works. You might have to send it back to CAI once or twice to get it fully working.

But when they work, they can be great rifles. Accurate(not super-match-grade but good), reliable(On par with the AK or slightly less), dirt cheap and easy to supply. Magazines can be bought from Cheaper Than Dirt for three bucks.(A warning though, some CETME style mag-wells can be out of spec and take the curved 20 rounders but not the straight HK 20s) If you get the G3 sporter then you can exchange parts pretty much freely from a G3(with some exceptions). The CETME can take some G3 parts freely, some with light modification and some can't be interchanged, period.

[G1FAL]

TooTaxed, watch out on that cheap .308 from J&G. Its Indian, and there have been lots of bad things said about it. I saw that ad a while back and was going to get a group buy going on at work, till my wife called J&G for me and they told her it was Indian.

[pinetree64]

The AK's have a cult like following with a lot of info and accessories. I owned one and sold it by mistake. I recently bought an SKS and since I'll be buying 7.62, I might get another AK. However the SKS is a much more solid rifle than the stamped AK's being sold.

tjg

[joab]

Gewehr98
I agree with your sentiment. At work even amongst the shooters I can talk about my .22s, revolvers or even 1911s but as soon as AKs or ARs come up so do the postal jokes.