H&K USP 45: How good is it?


PDA






el Godfather
July 20, 2012, 07:46 PM
Dear THR:
H&K USP 45: How good is it:
In accuracy, reliability, durability, and value for money.

When compared to other full size polymer 45s.

Thank you

If you enjoyed reading about "H&K USP 45: How good is it?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
FIVETWOSEVEN
July 20, 2012, 08:49 PM
I'd say that a new one is over priced but they are darn good guns and you can't wrong with them. Compared to others I would say that the USP is on par.

pittspilot
July 20, 2012, 10:56 PM
Those of us with smaller hands find H&K ergonomics to be lacking. But if it fits you, it should work fine.

9mmepiphany
July 21, 2012, 12:22 AM
I think the ergo is the USP 45 are a bit behind the SIG 220 or a polymer pistol like the S&W M&P45.

That is why H&K introduced the H&K45, to address the shortcomings of the USP with many of the ergos of the P2000

CPshooter
July 21, 2012, 12:56 AM
That is why H&K introduced the H&K45, to address the shortcomings of the USP with many of the ergos of the P2000Yes, but in the process of addressing the USP's "shortcomings" they made some compromises. Round capacity has been reduced by 2 and the thick magazine floor plate makes the gun look gaudy. I also think they messed up the HK45c. What was the point of adding an accessory rail that doesn't even work with the full-size Surefire X300 light? I'd rather have a USP 45 Compact with the rail adapter because it looks better and the light fits it well. I also don't care for their rattling right-side slide release levers. I own a P2000sk and the only complaint I have is the stupid rattling slide release lever. Doesn't affect performance one bit, but when you are right-handed it just doesn't make sense to have extra crap on the gun, especially if it makes noise and makes a $900 gun feel cheap.

Just sayin...the new P30 models are nice, but if I want a H&K .45 I'm sticking with the USP. As long as you don't have small hands there is nothing wrong with the USP ergonomics.

9mmepiphany
July 21, 2012, 01:10 AM
They point of the HK45 was to build the ultimate .45ACP platform when they realized that they couldn't build a 1911 at a price marketable in the numbers needed to justify production.

The rail is supposed to be a mil-spec standard replacing the USP's proprietary rail. The frame was designed to fit a wider range of hand sizes and the grips were designed by Nills. They incorporated many lessons learned in the intervening years, from the USP introduction, and already used in the P2000. The HK45c was designed as a big brother to the P2000...why would you even put a light on a compact gun?

I don't have a problem with large framed gun...the Glock 30 feels fine...but the USP 45 feels like a 2"x4", especially with its oversharp checkering, while the HK45 just felt comfortable the first time I picked one up

FMF Doc
July 21, 2012, 01:22 AM
I find it over rated, and would rather have a good Sig P220 any day of the week.

CPshooter
July 21, 2012, 01:29 AM
The HK45c was designed as a big brother to the P2000...why would you even put a light on a compact gun?The USP.45 compact tactical and the HK45ct are both great candidates for a light. Why have all those ugly rail notches on a compact gun in the first place if you aren't going to put a light on it? My point was that if they went through the trouble of putting a real mil-spec rail up front, they should have made the dust cover a tad bit longer to accommodate a real light.

9mmepiphany
July 21, 2012, 03:08 AM
The USP.45 compact tactical and the HK45ct are both great candidates for a light. Why have all those ugly rail notches on a compact gun in the first place if you aren't going to put a light on it? My point was that if they went through the trouble of putting a real mil-spec rail up front, they should have made the dust cover a tad bit longer to accommodate a real light.
I understand your reasoning and would offer that they are there for the same reason that they still have have a squared trigger guard...even when proper technique has shown that it is redundant.

But a more likely reason is that they either didn't want to design a separate frame than that on the fullsize or they just thought the family resemblance looked good

balance 740
July 21, 2012, 04:35 AM
H&K makes excellent pistols.

The only two complaints I normally see when people speak of H&K pistols, is the price, and the trigger. I almost never hear of complaints with the accuracy, reliability, durability, or quality of their pistols.

If an H&K fits you, and you shoot it well, then you will more than likely find that it is an excellent pistol for you.

usp9
July 21, 2012, 06:59 AM
My USPs are very reliable and accurate. I prefer the controls on them over other brands such as the Sig P220. Makes a great duty weapon. Excellent choice.

9mmepiphany
July 21, 2012, 11:35 AM
The only two complaints I normally see when people speak of H&K pistols, is the price, and the trigger.
Well...you also hear complaints that H&K CS don't love you unless you are Jack Bauer ;)

On a more serious note, I do prefer the SIG 220's trigger to that of the USP or HK45

balance 740
July 21, 2012, 12:19 PM
Well...you also hear complaints that H&K CS don't love you unless you are Jack Bauer

On a more serious note, I do prefer the SIG 220's trigger to that of the USP or HK45

People seem to be reporting that their CS has been improved over the years. I've never had to use them, but I hear they hate us less now.

:D

I prefer Walther and the 9mm, but if I was to pick up a .45, I'd probably pick a Sig 220 SAO or an H&K HK45c.

easyg
July 21, 2012, 04:48 PM
Very reliable and very durable.
No more accurate than any other polymer .45.
Not a great value for your money IMO (overpriced).

Coal Dragger
July 21, 2012, 07:01 PM
I used to own one. Very accurate, and highly reliable; saddled with an awful trigger.

Bentonville
July 21, 2012, 10:57 PM
CS is battin' 1000 with me. I have used them for several different reasons over the years and have always had fast turn-around times, perfect and professional work, reasonably priced for what I wanted done, and eager to please. Just my two cents based on personal experience and not hearsay. Oh..and the guns are worth the money in my estimation. DA triggers don't please but the SA is fine and the light LEM is really nice .....again based on my personal experience only.

el Godfather
July 22, 2012, 04:13 AM
It is very interesting that a few of you mentioned that it is good in accuracy yet complained about trigger.

I wonder if the trigger was improved the accuracy would most likely improve tremendously.

usp9
July 22, 2012, 07:59 AM
I have both the standard HK trigger and the excellent match trigger. While one is noticably better than the other, almost all of my shooting is done single action anyway and the standard HK trigger is just fine for good accuracy results IMHO. The gun will always be better than my eyesight and rapidly aging muscular control ability.;)

NG VI
July 22, 2012, 09:47 AM
rapidly aging muscular control ability.


That's got to be hell on your underwear.


I had a USP .40, it was great.

HKGuns
July 22, 2012, 11:39 AM
Too much is made about triggers. HK's triggers are fine. No, they're not revolver target triggers, but they're not target pistols. Oh, and I also have small hands and the controls work just great for my small hands.

You'd be hard pressed to find a better pistol than the USP 45. If your goal is concealed carry you should look at the 45C. Pictured below.

http://hkguns.zenfolio.com/img/s1/v21/p228151365-5.jpg

PO2Hammer
July 22, 2012, 12:02 PM
In accuracy, reliability, durability, and value for money.
Top notch in the first three categories, good value, but ergonomics that only a robot could love.

grptelli
July 22, 2012, 05:38 PM
I bougtht a H&K USP 45 in 1997 with SS slide fulsize. It was my best gun and a sopft shoting 45. It was more accurate than me! DUMBEST mistake I made was to sell it for another gun. I miss my USP but can't seem to come up with the $$$ right now to buy another one. Back when I bought it I was single and had extra $$$. Now I'm married with kids, and a lot of bils.
Maybe when tax return time next year. Love H&K. If I had a choice now, I'd take the HK45 over the USP.

Grunt
July 22, 2012, 06:27 PM
My USP-45F is my "go-to" gun of choice. Quality is top notch as is accuracy and reliability. The recoil reduction system works great where 230 grain ammo feels like 185 grain ammo through lesser designs. Some folks complain about the propriety rail design rather than the standard picatinny rail that is so common now. Keep in mind H&K pioneered the rail design with the Mk23 and USP designs before there was such a thing as a rail on a pistol. These were the first and with no standard to go by, I won't fault them for it. Besides, if it really is an issue, there are adaptors that will mate up with the USP rail to work with standard lights and lazers. Others complain about the poor trigger is solved by either going with the match trigger like I did on my USP-45F or the LEM trigger like I did on my USP-40C.
One other thing about the USP is the ability to be carried cocked and locked yet still have a second strike capability or the option to carry it hammer down like a traditional DA/SA pistol. Another advantage to the USP that every other maker out there lacks the foresight of is operations in cold weather. Now when I talk about cold weather, I'm NOT talking about spending an hour or two out in 20-30 degree temps. I'm talking about spending entire days in 20-30 BELOW zero temps! True, I have Glocks, Sigs, 1911s, CZs and others that work just fine in cold weather as well but ever try to get a glove that's heavy enough to keep your fingers from freezing and falling off in those conditions in the trigger guard or say a Glock, Sig or 1911? Probably not going to happen and if it does, it's a tight fit that is now on the brink of accidently depressing the trigger because you don't have enough room. Not a problem with a cocked and locked USP since the trigger guard is freakin' huge! The CZ-75 and EAA Witness come close but still not as large as the USP design. You may think this is a minor thing but if you spend any amount of time in those conditions, it becomes pretty danged important!
Another thing about the USP is you can make it any way you want it. Right handed and want to carry it cocked and locked only, there's a variant for that. DAO or lefty that wants a decocking lever only? There's a variant for that. Maybe you're like me and like the safety lever and decocking feature but want it in ambidextrious design. Yup, there's a variant for that one too. Maybe you want the precocked mainspring and light pull of the LEM trigger. That's do-able and maybe you want that same LEM trigger but with a manual safety because you are concerned about gun-snatching bad guys. Yup, you can even do that too! Standard barrels, threaded barrels, barrels with O-rings for enhanced accuracy can be had as well as various sights can be had as well. No, it's not anywhere close to the 1911 or Glock for aftermarket parts but then again, it really doesn't need any either. So, does this answer your question is the USP is really that good?;)

Grunt
July 22, 2012, 06:35 PM
OH BTW, before the "We're HK and we hate you" crowd shows up to parrot on about poor customer service, let me tell you about my first hand experience with them. When I got my USP-40C, it was a used gun. When I got it back home I took it apart to clean it and found that the washer and snap ring that keeps the recoil spring and guide rod as a single unit was missing. Granted, my USP-40C still worked 100% even with those parts missing, it was just harder to assemble. I called HK's customer service on a Monday and told them about the problem. They said I could either send it in or they would send me the parts to put them in myself. I opted to have them send me the parts and when I asked them how much it would cost, they told me there was no charge. I again told them that this was bought as a USED freakin' gun but they didn't care and still wanted to send me those parts out free of charge. By Friday I had those parts in hand and installed so that was a matter of 5 days shipping between Virginia to North Dakota so they got them out ASAP. Now I don't care what the haters say because in my experience they are 180 out on this. If that's what somebody calls poor customer service, I'd have to question just what a manufacturer has to do to make these people happy?:confused:

FIVETWOSEVEN
July 23, 2012, 01:18 AM
Too much is made about triggers. HK's triggers are fine. No, they're not revolver target triggers, but they're not target pistols.

Never a HK thread without fanboyism. You can find pistols that are just as reliable, accurate, and a better trigger to boot. I would imagine that a pistol that costs a grand have a better trigger like other brands.


You'd be hard pressed to find a better pistol than the USP 45.

Right.....:scrutiny:

vaupet
July 23, 2012, 08:25 AM
I have a usp9 and a usp45 match. The 9 is great for home defence, the 45 match is used in competition. IMHO it is mandatory to try them on for size. I have huge hands and the usp series fits me right there. The checkering is sharp, that is why i put on a pachmacher sleeve on the 45 match.

Never had a failure in any H&K pistol execpt for the time where i had put in the round backwards, loading up with an Uplula magloader whilst talking to someone.

balance 740
July 23, 2012, 10:19 AM
Too much is made about triggers. HK's triggers are fine. No, they're not revolver target triggers, but they're not target pistols.

Can you shoot a VP-70 as well as a P7?

I think a good trigger definitely makes a difference. Trigger quality is one of the aspects of a pistol that will determine how easy it is to shoot, in my experience. It is the one and only aspect of H&K pistols that I really think H&K needs to improve on.

Now I don't care what the haters say because in my experience they are 180 out on this. If that's what somebody calls poor customer service, I'd have to question just what a manufacturer has to do to make these people happy?

Well, to be fair, they did have years and years, and years, of first hand reports claiming some pretty bad customer service. It's good to see that they are improving though.

Never had a failure in any H&K pistol execpt for the time where i had put in the round backwards, loading up with an Uplula magloader whilst talking to someone.

You mean H&K pistols don't work that way?:

http://i51.tinypic.com/2d9o9e9.jpg

:D

Thaddeus Jones
July 23, 2012, 10:30 AM
Accurate, reliable and extremely durable.

In 17 years of owning HK pistols, I've never had a malfunction or needed their customer service. Fine pistol well worth the asking price.

For all I read about the USP's trigger, it is a match grade trigger compared to that "m&p" trigger. :)

Hk Dan
July 23, 2012, 06:19 PM
Well, you DO get a lot of comments about the HK trigger. The truth is that the SA is fine. The DA is pretty bad, but shoots in nicely. I have 2 USP45s and they are both reliable to a fault, surgically accurate, and have not needed so much as a light oiling. Helluva good gun.

silicosys4
July 23, 2012, 06:54 PM
I paid $400 for my USP45 in perfect shape. It never fails to go bang. It holds a flashlight so I don't have to (not that I can reach the switch on it because the grip is huge), and thanks to that huge grip it holds 12 rounds. My friends think its cool. My glowing praises end there. Its the least shot of my .45's....and it was my first. I'm not accurate with the thing, for whatever reason...I fire a mag, grimace, and go back to my 1911's...that I can afford to shoot because they take cast handloads. (poly barrel in HK means cast reloads are a nono according to HK) The DA trigger is terrible, its stiffness only accentuates the fact that the trigger is polymer and is somewhat flexible. I'm perpetually waiting for the rubber hammer spur to fall off...(really HK? you couldn't have made the WHOLE HAMMER out of metal?) I have small hands so at least some of my dislike for the pistol originates there, but it just doesn't hold, feel, point, or shoot pleasantly to me. The mags are $60.
$60 freakin $

mes228
July 24, 2012, 07:39 AM
I've owned 4 H&K's three in .45 and one in 9mm. Some I liked and some I didn't like (hated the one with the LEM trigger module). The one I liked incredibly well was the H&K Tactical 9mm with Jet Funnel. I traded for it from a Gentleman that competed with it. He has several very high dollar pistols, including full Custom 1911's . He was so filled with sellers remorse, and was so good at pleading (grin). I ultimately sold it back to him. Bad move, now I'm filled with sellers remorse. The tactical 9mm is an exceptionally good pistol in all respects.

HKGuns
July 24, 2012, 08:35 PM
Never a HK thread without fanboyism. You can find pistols that are just as reliable, accurate, and a better trigger to boot. I would imagine that a pistol that costs a grand have a better trigger like other brands.

Just go away, if that is all you can add to the thread. Have you ever in your life shot one? Bet not....Next time take a step back and ask yourself if you should even be posting in the thread where you have nothing to add.

Nothing fanboy about it, I own a very wide array of pistols from many different companies.

Did I say Go away? Oh, and welcome to my ignore list.

Can you shoot a VP-70 as well as a P7?

Oh, you again. Always jumping in aren't you....Yes I can, all it takes is practice. Next?

For all I read about the USP's trigger, it is a match grade trigger compared to that "m&p" trigger.

I have an M&P and to tell you the truth I don't understand why it takes so much of a bad trigger rap either. All I can say is there are sure some opinionated people.
I think a good trigger definitely makes a difference. Trigger quality is one of the aspects of a pistol that will determine how easy it is to shoot, in my experience. It is the one and only aspect of H&K pistols that I really think H&K needs to improve on.

I suppose that is determined by what you're used to using. Show me two polymer pistols with triggers that are the same. Hmmmm, seems a lot of them are sold.

Here is a question for all you "NON" fanboys. Exactly which HK trigger are you referring to as being so bad? Match? LEM? Light LEM? DA/SA? DA? P7? Better yet how many of you have actually shot an HK pistol or are you simply repeating the stuff you read?

FIVETWOSEVEN
July 25, 2012, 12:21 AM
Just go away, if that is all you can add to the thread.

Clearly you missed post number 2 which was mine:

I'd say that a new one is over priced but they are darn good guns and you can't wrong with them. Compared to others I would say that the USP is on par.

Did I say Go away? Oh, and welcome to my ignore list.

:rolleyes:

I guess one cannot speak against the amazing and invincible H und K! Don't worry, nothing of value was lost.

You'd be hard pressed to find a better pistol than the USP 45.

Justifying a bad trigger pull on a $1,000 pistol and claiming that there is realistically no better option than HK is fanboyism. They are good guns but not the best. Maybe the best for you but not everyone as you claim.

balance 740
July 25, 2012, 05:12 AM
Oh, you again. Always jumping in aren't you....Yes I can, all it takes is practice. Next?

Yep, it's me. Touchy are we? :D

Of coarse I "keep jumping in" (even though I participated in this thread before you did). How many rounds have you put through a VP-70 with it's 18lb gritty trigger? If you can't shoot a USP any better than a VP-70, then I think that speaks volumes about the trigger on the USP.

"Get used to it" always seems to be the response of H&K fans when it comes to complaints about the triggers, just like it always seems to be the response of Glock fans when people complain about the grip and grip angles of their favorite pistol. Funny how nobody ever uses the logic of "get used to it" when speaking about an aspect of a pistol that is universally accepted as being "good". It's always something that is almost universally accepted as being "bad", when fans use this phrase and logic.

Didn't you complain about Glock's blocky grip in another thread? Why don't you advise people to just practice and get used to it?

It would surprise me NOT to see the trigger of H&K pistols mentioned in a PRO and CON thread on H&K pistols. They are almost universally accepted as being "not as good as they could be". I think this is informative to the OP.

I suppose that is determined by what you're used to using. Show me two polymer pistols with triggers that are the same. Hmmmm, seems a lot of them are sold.

What are you asking here?

If the trigger doesn't matter, then why does H&K make the Match trigger? Why don't they just tell competitors to "practice and get used to it"?

The USP 45 and the USP 45 with a Match trigger are two of the same pistols, but with different triggers.

Here is a question for all you "NON" fanboys. Exactly which HK trigger are you referring to as being so bad? Match? LEM? Light LEM? DA/SA? DA? P7? Better yet how many of you have actually shot an HK pistol or are you simply repeating the stuff you read?

I've owned a USPc, a P7M8, and a P30S.

The USPc had the worst trigger out of all of them. The DA and SA were gritty, and the pre-travel of the SA mode felt like it staged 4 times before I hit the break point.

The P7M8 had an excellent trigger. No complaints at all about the P7 trigger.

The P30S had a smooth DA and SA pull, but the reset was too long.


This was my first post in this thread:

H&K makes excellent pistols.

The only two complaints I normally see when people speak of H&K pistols, is the price, and the trigger. I almost never hear of complaints with the accuracy, reliability, durability, or quality of their pistols.

If an H&K fits you, and you shoot it well, then you will more than likely find that it is an excellent pistol for you.

I stand by it.

FIVETWOSEVEN
July 25, 2012, 10:53 PM
This was my first post in this thread:

He missed my first post as well. I say that they are good guns and then when he states that it's the best. He got mad and put me on the ignore list when I called that fanboyism. 1911s aren't the best, Glocks aren't the best, my choice in pistol the XD isn't the best, and HK isn't the best. Out of all the handguns I've used the XD best fits me put that may change in the future but so far, it's the best for ME.

My complaint with the USP for having a bad trigger with the standard DA/SA is why would a $1,000 pistol have a trigger that isn't as good as less expensive. Sure you can get used to it but you'll never be as good with it as you can be with something with a better trigger. I don't buy the whole thing that you can be as good with a bad trigger as you can be with a good one. Do you really think that someone with a rusty Nagant revolver can shoot as well as someone with a high end 1911 with a trigger job? That's, in my opinion, nonsense.

IkenI
July 26, 2012, 10:16 PM
I've always been a SIG fan and converted from DA/SA sometime back to DAK guns. I shoot them just as well or better than the DA/SA. Some don't like them but I do. I like the consistent trigger pull. However, it took an HK45c and HK P2000sk to make me stop carrying the SIG P220 and P229 9mm. They both have the LEM trigger and I really like it. I like the ergonomics of those two. I have had no experience with other HKs except for handling one with the spiderman grip and I didn't care for it. I have heard the P30 is an excellent handgun.

mnhntr
July 27, 2012, 12:41 AM
I have 2 HK USP compacts, one in 45 and the other is a 357sig. I really enjoy them. I also have smaller hands and the ergonomics are excellent for me. I think you can get cheaper polymer pistols that have similar quality, durability, reliability. However I cannot find one that feels as good in my hand, or that I shoot better.

el Godfather
July 27, 2012, 05:26 PM
I do have Mark 23- excellant trigger
I also have USP 9mm- I have no complaints
I carry p30- combat trigger. No complaints

If you enjoyed reading about "H&K USP 45: How good is it?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!