Help a revolver guy pick a serious autoloader!


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snakeman
July 28, 2012, 11:55 PM
So lately my fiance and I have been considering getting a home defense/personal defense autoloader and we've narrowed it down to a few. We're definitely a revolver family with single actions getting the nod on the ranch. However, we would like to venture into more serious autoloaders than the buckmark and cz-82 that we have. Here are the choices:
Sig p2022-this one has a great trigger and is available with night sights. It also has an easy to operate slide release and a good sort of heft.

Springfield XD service model-- this one fits both of our hands well and we like the sights and grip safety. Trigger feels a bit heavy for us spoiled people but is supposedly modded easily.

CZ P07 duty--I love the feel of this gun, fiance doesn't. The sights are excellent and the trigger is great. I like the ability to swap the decocker for a safety. Texture is a bit rough for carry though.

Taurus pt 809-- this is the bargain end piece. I do like some of the features and am a fan of the pt92 and their revolvers.

EAA polymer witness. -- I like the cz look and feel this gun brings.

Beretta px 4 storm.-- I like almost everything about it but it's pricey.

On most days in the Texas heat we will most likely be carrying a J-frame or something similar, but I want some firepower for the winter time when I have a coat on.

Please vote, and if it's not too much trouble explain your vote to better inform me of what to expect.

Thanks.

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Walking Dead
July 29, 2012, 12:05 AM
Sig SP2022. I own one and carry it daily. Typical Sig reliability, great price, and great trigger. You can pay a lot more for a good pistol but the SP2022 proves you don't have to.

NWcityguy2
July 29, 2012, 12:06 AM
I voted XD service but really any of them will work. When I am choosing between two equally good products I usually go with the cheaper one. For me that was actually a Ruger SR9c (perhaps you should look at the full size SR9) for $350 lightly used.

I tend to give the nod to XDs though because lots of people use them at the competition matches I shoot at and I know Springfield stands behind their product. Modding the trigger bar is easy, I did it to my SR9c myself.

WinThePennant
July 29, 2012, 12:16 AM
Since you're a revolver guy, I'm going to suggest another option.

Sig P250.

It's got a DAO (smooth as butter) trigger pull that is usually well received by revolver guys.

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 12:16 AM
I shot an sr40c and my honestly didn't like that boarish trigger at all. The gun just wasn't for me.

56hawk
July 29, 2012, 12:18 AM
I defiantly think the Beretta is the best gun on the list. I've got one and it's accurate and completely reliable. Not sure what you mean by pricy. I thought it was one of the most affordable pistols out there.

jim243
July 29, 2012, 12:20 AM
There are tons and tons of good pistols out there. You did not say what caliber or the purpose it was for. (CCW, HD, SD, range shooting or what?)

Since you are a wheel gun person (that's good, everyone has their preference) I would suggest a 45 ACP or 40 S&W, the recoil will not bother you or the misses. Now if you want something small, a 9 mm will fill the bill and provide protection.

What to buy, what to buy. I'd start out telling you to look at the Ruger's & the M&P line of pistols first. If price is a concern then Stoeger or Taurus. Mid range, CZ, Beretta, EEA, Sprinfield Armory, S&W just to name a few. High end, Kimber or STI.

Large guns, Taurus PT-1911 (45 ACP or 38 Super), Taurus PT-92 (9mm) or 100 (40 S&W), CZ 75 B (9mm) or CZ 75 P-07 (40 S&W).

Compacts, well there is a bushell and a peck of those, CZ P-01, M&P Shield, XDc, Ruger SR-9c, etc............... (too many to list)

Good luck on finding one.

Here are some of my choices.
Jim

http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt284/bigjim_02/IMG_1495.jpg

http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt284/bigjim_02/IMG_1221.jpg

http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt284/bigjim_02/IMG_1224.jpg

http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt284/bigjim_02/SAM_0501.jpg

http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt284/bigjim_02/SAM_0426.jpg

http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt284/bigjim_02/IMG_1225.jpg

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 12:20 AM
^^^ 56hawk Obviously you have a more beefy financial backing than this poor insurance adjuster.

gunnutery
July 29, 2012, 12:21 AM
I was going to suggest the Px4, but you mentioned it was pricy. Otherwise it's really easy to cycle the slide for females, which is a must.

I can't remember if I've tried the slide on the P2022 (the option I chose above), but the price is definately right. IMO, it's also the best looking Sig.

biggameballs
July 29, 2012, 12:28 AM
If your okay with striker fired buy the Walther PPQ. You won't be disappointed.

The smiling swordsman
July 29, 2012, 12:30 AM
Beretta PX4 is/was my choice. The more I shoot it, the more I like it.

tarosean
July 29, 2012, 12:32 AM
Beretta px 4 storm.-- I like almost everything about it but it's pricey.

Pricey? What are they selling them for in your area?

They are less than 450 from buds (9mm)

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 12:33 AM
^^^this is true. They're 550 in store here or 599 depending on the store!

tarosean
July 29, 2012, 12:40 AM
^ what part of TX?

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 12:53 AM
San Angelo area

wlewisiii
July 29, 2012, 12:59 AM
Get a Glock 19, put a NY1 spring and a 3.5 pound connector in it. It'll feel just like a slightly light DA revolver. The rest are fine, but if you're a revolver person like me, you'll shoot the modded Glock better than the rest.

56hawk
July 29, 2012, 01:10 AM
^^^ 56hawk Obviously you have a more beefy financial backing than this poor insurance adjuster.

Sorry about that. I do spend a lot on guns, so I consider $500 to be on the cheaper end. If cost wasn't an option I would suggest getting one of these:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=168996&d=1343534803

marksg
July 29, 2012, 01:15 AM
I voted for the sig 2022.
In all honesty,of what you have listed,i have only shot the 2022 and the XD,both great guns.I liked the trigger on the sig better is all.

From your post, you both like the fit of the XD and seem to be divided on the rest.
Maybe you answered your own question?

As a side note, Nothing wrong with DA revolver for HD/PD. IMHO

Just my .02. Worth what ya paid for it.:D

sniperlongshot
July 29, 2012, 01:33 AM
i think you should take your wife down to a large volum gun shop and pick out something she feels comfy with,....make sure she can get the slide back to load it, and somthing that's not real complicated.....my vote is smith m&p's....i've got a smith and an XDM. plus a few others,for my personal concealed i like the walther ppks and my wife shoots best with it and my berreta 92.

Skylerbone
July 29, 2012, 02:33 AM
How about a Kahr K9 or K40 Elite series? Slim, concealable, excellent short trigger and reliable. They're expensive but I feel worth a look.

Already mentioned, STI makes some great 1911s not 200 miles from your front door, and what Texan wouldn't want his pistol's slide to feature his home State as its logo.

Two not inexpensive options that should definitely be tracked down. Of those listed, the Sig.

labhound
July 29, 2012, 03:02 AM
I voted for the PX4. If you like the PX4 but consider it pricey, then look at the Stoeger Cougar 8000 F. The Cougar is the forerunner of the PX4. I have both and both are excellent guns, but IMHO the Cougar is one of the best buys going today. I also like the XD Service although mine is a 45ACP and not a 9mm. My Cougar and XD45 both fit my wife's hand better than the PX4. I also have an FNS-9 and a Beretta 92FS and would strongly recommend both of them. The FNS-9 has nightsights and has ambidextrous slide stop, mag release and thumb safety. The 92FS is an all around great pistol, accurate, very reliable, it's easy to rack the slide and slide release is also easy to operate.

Kiln
July 29, 2012, 05:28 AM
I chose the XD Service. It is, in my opinion, the best performance to price ratio of the firearms listed.

cocojo
July 29, 2012, 07:33 AM
I would buy the S&W SD in 9mm, I own two of them and they are gems. My guns are the original SD's, which were in the 400.00 range but the new SDVE's are about $329.00 and they shoot excellent plus a life time warranty. The trigger is very revolver like but lighter at about 7 to 8 lbs and smooth. These are real sleeper guns and once you shoot them you are hooked. These guns are so closely built like a glock, only with a better more comfortale grip and a very smooth trigger with no slack. My sd9 cuts the center out of the target and has 2000 flawless rounds through it. My forty has 300 flawless rounds.

ku4hx
July 29, 2012, 08:04 AM
Shoot many; buy one. Find a rental range.

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 08:50 AM
^^^^^^good idea

Ar180shooter
July 29, 2012, 11:27 AM
Since you're a revolver guy, I'm going to suggest another option.

Sig P250.

It's got a DAO (smooth as butter) trigger pull that is usually well received by revolver guys.
I have to agree with that. The P250 has a surprisingly smooth DAO trigger. One in 9mm should suit the OP's needs, and without breaking the bank.

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 01:07 PM
did I forget to mention I shoot my wheelguns in single action mode almost exclusively?

Ar180shooter
July 29, 2012, 01:30 PM
Then a 1911 of some sort might work better for you.

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 01:59 PM
I thought about a 1911, actually wanted one for years but the cost of ammo, recoil, relatively low capacity, cocked and locked carry, and lack of accessory rails, except on the really expensive ones, has led me other places.

BRE346
July 29, 2012, 02:12 PM
I liked the XD Service 9 while I had it. Solid, steady, better than the Glock, some say.
I really love my CZ 75 P-07 duty. But if the mrs. doesn't like it....
Glock, Sigma and others have a revolver feel to the trigger.
Anything with hammer you can cock. A 1911?

Carter
July 29, 2012, 02:23 PM
My bias is for the cz, but due to your comments I'd say the sig. Just keep in mind it only comes with one mag, and I believe they are pricey.

bds
July 29, 2012, 07:52 PM
+1 on actually shooting different pistols at the range before making the purchase.

I didn't see M&P listed in the poll but I highly recommend considering the M&P with the new trigger (according to S&W, 9mm and 40S&W models with new triggers should be available by now).

Skylerbone
July 29, 2012, 07:59 PM
did I forget to mention I shoot my wheelguns in single action mode almost exclusively?

You certainly did not, most respondents either look past info or have never spent time with a great trigger. I stand by my recommendation of an STI 1911 or some flavor of Kahr with the Elite trigger. Neither will make you want to plant your revolvers but both are nicer than any on the list.

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 08:15 PM
Fair enough, I tried to be as descriptive as possible. I've handled the m&p and didn't like the feel of it. I'll give it another try.

Dicktracey
July 29, 2012, 08:22 PM
my first gun sig p250 and if it is anything like it...you will not regret buying it

Buck Kramer
July 29, 2012, 08:27 PM
I voted XD, it was a toss up between that and the p07 duty but the mags are $50!!!

snakeman
July 29, 2012, 11:32 PM
I've never seen this many votes on one of my threads! WOW! Thanks, I really appreciate the help guys.

Mr.510
July 29, 2012, 11:58 PM
I also voted XD and I carry the .45 Compact version every day. The trigger is indeed easily modified. In my opinion a well-done trigger job on an XD puts the weapon in a whole other class of performance, far above it's price range (including the cost of modification). The difference in mine after Springer Precision did the 4# combat/carry trigger job was astonishing to me. It was a great gun stock, as are all the guns on your list, really. I do not know how much a trigger job or other mods would improve the shortcomings of any of the others on your list as I have no experience with them stock vs. modified.
If possible rent the serious contenders you're thinking about and buy whatever you shoot best. Since you mentioned the possibility of a trigger job if you got an XD apply the same thinking to the others as well. If you're not set on buying and using a stock weapon (and you don't seem to be :)) consider the mods that could "fix" the things you don't like about any of them up for consideration.

I make my living designing and building racing and high performance parts for cars. None of my vehicles are "stock" and none of my firearms are either. They've all been modified to better suit my intended use for them. To me this is a logical progression.The threads I read where somebody won't buy this or won't buy that because of one feature (crappy stock sights, mushy stock trigger, whatever) that can be easily "fixed" or modified to their liking with what we call bolt-on parts in the automotive world drives me nuts. It's a personal defense weapon, modify it as required to be the best tool for the job!

Some people will only carry a completely stock pistol because of a perceived risk of a modded gun making them look bad in court should they have to use it in self defense. I understand this argument and it may be a valid one based on things I've read by Ayoob and others. However, I have never read of a case where the weapon used being modified had any bearing on the outcome in court. If someone is dead-set on running their gun(s) completely stock not buying one with crap sights or whatever makes perfect sense.

Why run them stock when they can be so much better if modified?

rcmodel
July 30, 2012, 12:04 AM
I own S&W, Colt, Glock, SIG, Astra, and a few others.
My oldest son owns a Springfield XD

Were I to go out tomorrow to buy one semi-auto handgun to defend my house & home with from now on?
It would be an XD of some sort.

A slightly heavy trigger on a self defense handgun shared by two people is not a bad thing to have!!
And neither is a grip safety.

If you want a range gun with a light trigger, that might be another special niche you need to fill separately later.

rc

LeonCarr
July 30, 2012, 12:07 AM
XD of the choices mentioned.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

snakeman
July 30, 2012, 03:44 PM
I'm kind of surprised at the number of votes for taurus and eaa.

Auto426
July 30, 2012, 03:52 PM
If I were to go out and buy a polymer framed handgun today I would most likely opt for a Sig 2022. I prefer the DA/SA operation over that of a striker fired handgun and the price that they go for, even with factory night sights, is hard to beat.

Godsgunman
July 30, 2012, 04:21 PM
Well first off the CZ 82 is a great gun and deserves plenty of respect. That said, since you are a revolver guy, I think a S&W 3rd gen would fit you well. Very nice DA pull and light crisp SA pull. As far as semi autos go they are probably the most reliable you can get. Nice sites, very accurate, durable. And you can get them for quite abit cheaper than anything you've listed.

bannockburn
July 30, 2012, 04:38 PM
Of the choices you have listed I would have to give a nod to the SIG P2022. Well designed, great handling gun with a nice trigger and a very affordable price. I would also recommend the SA XD Service model though with my small hands I have never been all that comfortable with the size and shape of the grip.

snakeman
July 30, 2012, 04:55 PM
There's nothing wrong with the cz-82. I like mine for what it is and its been reliable with everything put in it. That said there are much better options out there for me.

Shuler13
July 30, 2012, 05:11 PM
I seriously support the 2022. The trigger was great and for accuracy I shoot it better than most of my full size including some that cost twice as much. That includes P226, 5906, M&P 9mm, Glock 22 and S&W sigma.

If you can, go shoot one.

snakeman
July 30, 2012, 06:49 PM
Well, I just called the indoor gun range and they don't have the xd or the sig to try out! What kind of a range is that?! I live on a ranch, so I've never needed to use a range other than my own. Bummer

Walking Dead
July 30, 2012, 09:42 PM
Where abouts in Texas are you?

nra-life-member
July 30, 2012, 09:55 PM
With the choices you are listing, I would go with the Sig Pro 2022 and get the 17 round magazines - I think there is also a 22 / 25 round also available from Sig

snakeman
July 30, 2012, 09:59 PM
I live between san angelo and abilene

Walking Dead
July 30, 2012, 10:05 PM
It's no wonder your the snake man.

snakeman
July 30, 2012, 11:36 PM
Ha Ha yeah. Where are you from?

Walking Dead
July 31, 2012, 12:03 AM
Between Dallas and Sherman.

C0untZer0
July 31, 2012, 12:09 AM
I didn't vote.

IMO some of the choices aren't what I consider serious.

If you want a serious autoloader get the HK Mark 23

zxcvbob
July 31, 2012, 12:13 AM
How about a Browning Hi-Power?

Walking Dead
July 31, 2012, 12:17 AM
I didn't vote.

IMO some of the choices aren't what I consider serious.

If you want a serious autoloader get the HK Mark 23
Which ones would you not consider serious? And why?

Inebriated
July 31, 2012, 12:18 AM
I voted the Sig Pro. All the ammenities of the P220/226/228/229/224's, at a lighter weight and a lighter price. Though I'd still take my 26, I wouldn't feel disadvantaged at all with the Pro.

I didn't vote.

IMO some of the choices aren't what I consider serious.

If you want a serious autoloader get the HK Mark 23

And just what exactly is your definition of "serious"?

snakeman
July 31, 2012, 12:18 AM
^^^+1

Mr.357Sig
July 31, 2012, 11:25 AM
Voted for the Sig Pro 2022. I have one with the Sig Nite sights and love it. It's nails and great fun to shoot. Love the DA/SA trigger.

I also like the CZ. I would pick the SP-01 over the Duty just because I prefer the all-steel frame, which soaks up felt recoil, and the classic lines. It has a 1913 rail to hang a light/laser on, so it's good to go for HD.

Ash
July 31, 2012, 03:01 PM
If you're using single-action mode, I would go with the CZ Duty. I'm a hard-core Tanfoglio fan, but I accept that CZ does polymer better. Plus, the CZ is the only one that gives you an option of using a decocker or using a safety.

skoro
July 31, 2012, 08:04 PM
Put a S&W M&P on your list.

snakeman
July 31, 2012, 08:17 PM
Well I tried the m&p and like it almost as much as the xd but it's 30 bucks more. I think I've decided on the xd for the way it fits in my hand and the sights are on target as soon as the gun is up. The popularity of this pistol drives production of aftermarket accessories and cheaper magazines. Hopefully, after a couple of months on layaway, I'll have an xd and 500 rounds of 9mm in my hand...hands

The_Armed_Therapist
August 1, 2012, 11:09 PM
Two of my personal favorites on that list--The Sig and the Beretta. However, you can't go wrong with the CZ or the XD, either; all four of them are fantastic. I voted for the Beretta because it feels absolutely amazing in the hand, and in my opinion, it is also the most attractive of the bunch.

bluethunder1962
August 1, 2012, 11:13 PM
don't go plastic. I like my Beretta 92fs or the m9 will do.

barnbwt
August 1, 2012, 11:50 PM
And just what exactly is your definition of "serious"?

I'll go out on a limb and guess the HK23 guy isn't keen on the Witness or Taurus...maybe the CZ, too. Hopefully my assumption is wrong...

My vote is for the Beretta, the rotary lockup really helps tame recoil impulse in the .40S&W my father owns; it is more controllable than some 9mm guns I've tried.

It's stupid-simple to break down, and also has a decocker, manual safety, and external hammer (my favorite auto characteristics). It's also not an ugly soap bar in the hand, the grip is much more rounded than any competitors I've held.

TCB

(I need to try out a CZ at some point, since I love my CZ52 and my VZ58)

clance
August 2, 2012, 12:29 AM
Conceal carry: Kahr P9

Comparable to a J-Frame Smith in size, thinner, very reliable if you follow the manufacture's manual.

Compact double stack: CZ 75 D PCR

Almost as light as the CZ P0-7 but IMO far better ergonomics and was design to meet or exceed NATO requirements.

snakeman
August 3, 2012, 12:41 AM
Well, Here goes...I bought........a smith and wesson M&P 9mm kit. Turns out the large backstrap really fits my hand and the medium fits my fiance. The trigger is a LOT better than that on the first one I held, and the sights are on target as soon as I am. Hopefully It'll be accurate. I like the fact that it's made in the U.S. and all the accessories seem to be ok. I'm not keen on retention holsters but I'll give it a try.

KTXdm9
August 3, 2012, 11:06 PM
Nice choice! I own an XDm and a Shield, and enjoy them both.

DAdams
August 4, 2012, 12:02 AM
walther PPQ

snakeman
August 4, 2012, 11:08 AM
I'll be posting a range report within the next week.

Walking Dead
August 4, 2012, 11:29 AM
Very impressed with the number of votes for the SP2022. Not surprised just impressed.

akheron
August 4, 2012, 11:33 AM
I also like the CZ. I would pick the SP-01 over the Duty just because I prefer the all-steel frame, which soaks up felt recoil, and the classic lines. It has a 1913 rail to hang a light/laser on, so it's good to go for HD.

I realize the OP has already picked out his pistol (I hate when posters reply with "Get the ***!" right after the OP mentions making a purchase already), but this is more directed to somebody else in the same boat.

My wife and I love my SP-01 at the range, but she absolutely cannot rack the slide with any form of consistency. There's just not enough purchase on the slide. She can manage it if she cocks the hammer first, but even then she has trouble. As such, that would be something to double check prior to purchase.

GlackAttack
August 4, 2012, 03:59 PM
I suggest looking at glocks too. They were first made to replace revolvers.. no external safeties, goes bang ever time you pull the trigger just like your revolvers. Also they were made to be easily cleaned and maintained, like revolvers. If you are avoiding polymer because it is not durable, you have been misled IMHO.

GlackAttack
August 4, 2012, 04:03 PM
Also hold onto a ruger sr9c. Everyone likes the ergos, has external safety, and has 10 rd magazine for carry and 17 rd magazine for home use.. great price point for the quality too ...
just a thought.

Lost Sheep
August 4, 2012, 04:40 PM
I noticed that the Springfield is the ONLY ONE that you specified that you both liked.

Picking a gun for someone else is like picking a spouse for someone else.

What is wrong with a revolver? Single action revolvers (for those practiced with them) are viable self-defense options and double action revolvers have done duty for over a century. They are immune to ammuntion feeding problems and if you don't need a high round count or fast reloads, do very well, still.

Personally, I am fond of 1911s. I do have a Taurus Millenium 45ACP that is accurate, reliable and very easy to carry. It has a 10-round capacity. That's my gun for concealed carry if with an automatic. Though it is a tough decision against my Officer's Model Colt 45 ACP or Randall Raider (size of Colt Commander) or Ruger SP101 or Ruger 2.75" Security Six (both .357 Magnum).

If you are going to share one gun, the first criteria would be that it fit both your hands and point naturally. Beyond that, I am just applying my prejudices, which include 1) .45 or .40/10mm caliber 2) accuracy 3) second strike capability (without recycling the slide) 4) ability to feed a variety of ammunition reliably 5) carryability 6) I have never gotten used to a slide-mounted safety and hammer-drop safeties make me nervous.

Lost Sheep

akheron (post #73), I don't like it when I have an answer to a thread after it is too late to affect the outcome. However, many people have been attracted to threads for the sole reason that they themselves have the same question. My answer may have some utility for them and that is enough reason to post it, I think.

snakeman
August 4, 2012, 06:39 PM
fair enough, the fiance can handle the m&p fine she's going to shoot it with me today probably. I've already shot it, but we'll see how she likes it. All she really likes is my buckmark and single six. She did like the witness polymer we looked at today.

Skylerbone
August 4, 2012, 07:24 PM
M&P? Horrible choice, just horrible! S&W must have done a number on the old trigger as it was one of the few objections I had with mine.

I still hope you run across a Kahr Elite sometime soon, an SA revolver guy should be impressed.






http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=135999&d=1297298565

savanahsdad
August 4, 2012, 07:53 PM
something else to think about. mags. and holsters. whats out there, and how much some of the guns you listed have pricie mags and some are limited to any good holsters I got my wife a sig p238 Lady. and mags are $46.00 each

snakeman
August 5, 2012, 04:05 PM
I like the blackhawk in the forground.

Skylerbone
August 5, 2012, 04:16 PM
Wish it was, just a nice little Single-Six. There's a Beretta Neos hiding to the right and an RRA in back. Now I'm dreaming of revolvers, great!

snakeman
August 5, 2012, 06:57 PM
Ha Ha sorry. I love my single six as well.

RmB
August 5, 2012, 07:36 PM
I did not vote because I did not see the preffered weapon. Try an M&P .40, .45, or a 9 if you wish. Note that I am not discounting any of the weapons you have listed.

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