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August 5, 2012, 09:18 AM
Smoking IZ bad for you, Comrade!
Seriously though, that is sweet. Gotta love the brass necklace.:)
August 5, 2012, 09:36 AM
Congrats! I'd love to hear how it shoots!
August 5, 2012, 05:01 PM
100 rounds in 6" circle at 100 yards (including 8 in the bullseye). I'm due for a new prescription on my glasses, I could barely make out the dang target (blurry).
I had some stoppages, all were failure to eject. The manual says this is normal for the first 700-800 rounds until things loosen up. I have 5280 rounds on order from AIM. Will post again after I've gone through a couple cases!
August 6, 2012, 02:25 AM
I am so jealous. I look forward to more pics!
August 6, 2012, 02:29 AM
I envy you. That's a beautiful gun. I've always been a sucker for Russian weaponry. Please post more pics!
August 6, 2012, 02:33 AM
In Soviet Russia PKM smokes YOU!
Seriously, that's a cool piece and very unusual.
August 6, 2012, 02:36 AM
No really though thats cool as hell, how many links you got?
August 6, 2012, 02:36 AM
Awesome:cool:, wow U.S soldiers using them in iraq and afghanistan:cool:
great video of the MAC doing a review on the pkm
August 6, 2012, 06:14 AM
I suddenly feel small & insignificant ... :D
August 6, 2012, 06:23 AM
Funny think about the PKM: it fills the same role as our M240, but weighs 11 pounds less. That's a pretty huge difference when you have to carry that thing around all day.
August 6, 2012, 08:34 AM
I've spoken to more than a few gun cognoscenti who think that the PK/PKM is the best general-purpose machine gun ever made.
August 6, 2012, 09:30 AM
Get rid of those damn cigarettes. Quit smoking. You will enjoy that fine firearm for longer time. (I quit smoking after 47 years and can give that advice better than some lilly livered person who has never had the habit)
August 6, 2012, 10:58 AM
I'm working on quitting smoking. Down to a half pack a day, from 2 packs a day for 20 years. It's getting easier, although some days are harder than others (I run datacenters for fortune 500's, very high stress job). I made the decision about 3 weeks ago, the day my 48 year old aunt died from lung cancer.
Anyway, back to the PKM. :)
I'll need to get my SLR out some day and take better pictures, my cell phone camera sucks.
The rifle came with...
* Semi auto PKM w/ matching barrel
* SPARE matching PKM barrel, spare barrel bag, and sling for barrel bag
* PKM Sling
* 2x 100 round ammo cans with 2x 50 round belts in each (these clip to bottom of PKM, shown in the pics above)
* Two spare parts sets
* Sling connector for ammo cans
* ATF approval letter, manual, and declassified army PKM manual
* Ammo can sling for tripod (allows connecting 2x250 cans to tripod, in backpack config)
* 2x 250 round ammo cans with 10x 50 round links
(have 700 rounds worth of links...)
* PKM tripod with AntiAircraft accessory (this is the 2nd gen tripod, lighter than original, and has AA conversion capability)
* transport bag for tripod (with slings)
* transport bag for PKM
* Transit chest, which fits ALL of the above except tripod, which has a separate bag
* toolkit (broken shell extractor, etc)
What is the purpose of the black tube running through the stock? Is it attached to the receiver or just part of the stock?
If only a slidefire would fit.
August 7, 2012, 09:58 AM
The black tube that runs through the stock is part of the closed-bolt semi-conversion. There's two seperate recoil springs in use, inner and outer, one for the bolt, one for the sliding hammer block (not sure of the technical term; the hammer on this rifle is essentially a heavy rectangular chunk of steel that slides forward to impact the firing pin). The hammer "block" is held back (I'd assume where the bolt ORIGINALLY was held back) by the trigger group and when disconnected, slams forward about 3" with great force on to the back of the bolt.
It adds a few parts and some complexity to the whole design. However, converting an open-bolt belt fed machinegun to a closed-bolt semi-auto is not a trivial task.
There's some other changes to the receiver; top left rail is thicker than the original, there's a ledge welded inside and on the bottom of the receiver, there's guide rails added to the top cover to direct the semi-auto hammer, and so on. Most of those are meant to prevent machiengun parts from being used in the gun. (Technically, since the receiver is dimensionally the same overall, machinegun parts WOULD drop right in if it weren't for all of the extensive modifications done to prevent them from being added).
I can post up more detailed images of the mechanism, and scans of the ATF letter of approval which describes these changes in more detail.
FYI, the rifle has only *8* imported parts, per 922(r). Guess the AWB-language in 922(r) doesn't really "fit" belt fed rifles very well.. :)
You know, in the VIDEO GAMES I play, IT IS MUCH EASIER TO MOVE THAN IT PROVED TO BE IN REAL LIFE.
Oh man a short walk with 400 rounds of each type of ammo and those two guns, that'll wear a dude flat OUT.
After I got the ammo belts un-stuck from my long hair (notice the hair tie on the deck rail), I was yelling at my boy "TAKE THE PICTURE BEFORE I COLLAPSE, SON!"
Heck of a good time.
My boys think I'm crazy.
I think they're right.
Can't wait to take them both (rifles and boys) to the range this weekend. :)
August 18, 2012, 03:56 PM
I figure, I only live once. Can't take a savings account with me. If my heirs don't want these, they can always sell them.
If your heirs don't want these, call me!
August 18, 2012, 04:23 PM
Damn nice rifles. Being in nj um sure i cant own one. Anyway awesome rifles
August 18, 2012, 05:15 PM
Took the PKM and RPD to the range today.
PKM had some regular failure to ejects early on but those are getting ironed out with use - only had one in the last 200 round belt. So parts are starting to "wear together" and it is running smoother. Still running it on the #3 gas position (full gas, no porting) for another 400 rounds (that's when I hit the 1000 mark).
The RPD.. ugh. Whatever that thing did, you certainly couldn't call "run." I had to pull the trigger 3-4 times (with an audible "CLICK") before it'd disengage and allow the hammer block to slam forward to strike the firing pin.
Then it basically self-destructed something inside after 70 rounds. Took a hammer to get the bolt to open - (WITH a live round in the barrel, since on THAT round I had a light primer strike and it didn't fire).
So it's down hard. After clearing it, any time the bolt is moved full forward, it locks up AGAIN. I found bouncing the charging handle on a hard surface shakes the locking flaps loose and allows it to disengage (after 20-30 "bounces'). It's IMPOSSIBLE to open the bolt by hand, otherwise. It just does NOT move.
So, a mixed day.
August 18, 2012, 05:34 PM
I cant see the photos for some reason
August 18, 2012, 05:36 PM
"You know, in the VIDEO GAMES I play, IT IS MUCH EASIER TO MOVE THAN IT PROVED TO BE IN REAL LIFE"
Hahaha, that is true. Always fun to watch new soldiers learn that fact.
Back to the weapons though, I do think the ruskies had us beat here. I know that alot of troopers preferred the PKM to the 240. Shame we didnt just adapt it to 7.62NATO.
August 18, 2012, 06:03 PM
Hope all those RPD problems didn't make you reach for a smoke. Keep trying to limit your smoking to barrels.
Bummer about the RPD. I thought the RPD was an excellent example of what a SAW should be.
I used to laugh about the Automatic Rifleman slot in our Infantry fireteams. IF the AR man was "lucky" he got the big improvement for his M-16A1.....one of those closepin bipods and a canvas zippered case to keep it in. Honestly the only place I ever saw them was in training and in a box of damaged clothspin bipods in my first unit....they were not very sturdy. Meanwhile the "Aggressor forces" had RPDs and/or RPKs.
As for the guys that wat to compare the weight of the PKM to the FN MAG.....The Infantry board did a modification project on the M-60 back in the 1970's that fixed the gas system to the reciever, attached the M2 bipod to the gas system and had a lighter barrel with handle for removal (without the gas system) and dropped the weight to 19.5 pounds. A couple of decades later the Marines discovered the mods and actually fielded some. I think it would have given the PKM a run for its money while fixing a lot of M-60 problems, but we like our new toys and spending the tax payers money.
August 18, 2012, 06:32 PM
Got some of the RPD issues worked out today. Filed the disconnector down a hair, now the hammer block disconnects and moves forward properly.
The bolt locking up problem was finally traced to cosmoline (which surprised me since I cleaned and inspected it before shooting and saw NO trace of any...). Evidently there was still some INSIDE the gas port / gas block assembly. When it was fired and got hot, it liquified, ran/was blown in to the gas piston receiver tube. It gummed up the inside of the end of the gas assembly.
So, that forward-most lockup problem I was fighting was nothing more than simple hydrolock.
Cleaned the living **** out of that gas assembly and it cycles fine now, and with the slightly altered disconnector I don't have to pull the trigger 3-4 times to get the hammer to disengage and strike the firing pin.
Not a very complex design, overall. Hoping it'll be even more reliable as I get it worn in. Put some new divots in my backyard testing off the back deck tonight. 7.62x39 does a lot more damage to my yard than the 22lr I usually shoot off the deck at soda cans, think I'll keep this toy relegated to the range only. :)
I figure, I only live once. Can't take a savings account with me. If my heirs don't want these, they can always sell them.
Well said and beautiful rifles.
August 19, 2012, 06:34 AM
Awesome, and they are in great condition.
used to shoot PKM's and RPD's, RPK's and AK's in the bush war in Rhodesia ('cause is was still Rhodesia then). Very hard to break them. The other interesting one I shot was a DPM the one with a pancake magazine on top. What an action for a machine gun, must have been Swiss made the one I was shooting. It was along time ago so my memory could be fading but if I remember the action was sliky smooth.
PS: The PKM was always shot off the bi-pod or from the hip depending on how much time one had to react.
August 19, 2012, 10:38 AM
I've only had the opportunity to shoot a full auto PK once. My friend Dave took video of it (was at Knob Creek).
That was almost 5 years ago, and ever since then, I've wanted to own one. This year I started looking for one in earnest, and thanks to a board member on here I located this one.
(The guy who sold me this one, BTW, also has a Russian version - one of 25 built - for sale right now, but he's asking 12K for it... steep entry fee)
He put me in touch with another retiree-collector who is selling off his collection slowly. I now have a line on a ZB37, an SG43, and (gasp) DsHK with the authentic mount. The DsHK was converted to 50 BMG.
Might be selling more stock soon. And.. maybe a kidney.
This thread isn't over. :)
August 19, 2012, 11:38 AM
August 20, 2012, 11:25 AM
Old BRP built semi German MG42 shows up Wednesday! Still trying to find a source of "cheap" 8mm ammunition - looks like feeding that beast will be relegated to my reloading bench in the basement. Nervous about how rough it will be on brass, though.
No word on TNW's repairs on the MG34 I ordered yet.
August 20, 2012, 01:15 PM
All I can say is with all the weaponry you're amassing: Trent=An Army of One!
Enjoy reading (and seeing the pics), about your ongoing aquisitions. Please continue to keep us updated.
August 20, 2012, 04:59 PM
Sure will bannock!
FYI The back story here (for those who give 2 squats) ... I've lost trust in the stock market, after investing for many years - for reasons I won't go in to here.
Hence, "the collection."
Unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately) we can't own NFA weapons in Illinois. Which is probably a good thing; if we could, I'd certainly be broke, destitute, and living in a cardboard box after sending my life's savings down range. :)
At least this way I can rectify "each time I pull the trigger it costs me a quarter/half dollar/dollar" or whatever, and it just doesn't go "BURRRRRRRP PLEASE DEPOSIT $300". :)
August 20, 2012, 05:26 PM
Mod, this shouldn't be in the Rifle Thread. It should be under a "machine Gun thread":D:neener:
August 20, 2012, 05:37 PM
Haha but.. but.. they aren't machine guns.
They're semi-automatic belt-fed sporting rifles.
(Edit: Oh, doing a 200 round "belt dump" at 200 yards, I had over 75% hits on a 15" small bore rifle sighting target. I was pulling the trigger as fast as humanly possible, probably 4 shots a second.. those PKM tripods are AMAZING stable shooting platforms, and the minute-elevation adjustment lever on the tripod is fantastic for keeping the rounds on target.)
August 21, 2012, 12:04 AM
Unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately) we can't own NFA weapons in Illinois. Which is probably a good thing; if we could, I'd certainly be broke, destitute, and living in a cardboard box after sending my life's savings down range.
God willing, they'll lighten up on the NFunA weapons and they won't cost as much as car one day. I'd hate to dump 20,000K on a ...idk...M16 or something only to have the registry open and the value drop to 2K instantly :eek:
August 21, 2012, 10:09 AM
barn, I completely agree man. I won't spend 20K on a rifle that, by all rights, should cost (for a budget build) around $800. Those NFA weapons are always just one pen stroke away from being worth ZILCH, too.
The Federal government doesn't even need to be involved for them to be worth nothing. State law is sufficient to prohibit ownership (as evidenced by Illinois and other states). Once laws "get in" they very rarely "go away" - we're still dealing with a machinegun ban here that was due, in large part, to some gangsters actions during prohibition. Heck my grandfather wasn't even alive then. He was born 1933, the year it was repealed.
Three full generations later we're still paying the price - my son is 16, and has a firearms ID card.
Three generations have suffered a loss of rights, because of something that happened before my grandfather was born.
I'll need to get out my SLR and take better pics of it at some point.
August 23, 2012, 07:30 PM
You buildin' a militia or something? :D
August 23, 2012, 08:28 PM
Build one? I thought we WERE one.
August 24, 2012, 09:38 PM
Build one? I thought we WERE one
You mean, "I thought I ARE one already" :D. Nice MG (the '42 is nice, too)
The Federal government doesn't even need to be involved for them to be worth nothing. State law is sufficient to prohibit ownership (as evidenced by Illinois and other states).
Yeah, them, too :cuss:. I don't worry about NFA guns ever being outright banned/confiscated; at this point they're pretty much in the hands of wealthy (read: influential) owners anyway due to their cost, too many for a state govt to ignore here in Texas (or most other currently non-ban places). There'd be some 'splainin' to do at the donors' banquets if they nuked 10's-100's of G's of their supporters' investments.
August 25, 2012, 01:37 AM
Could go either way.
Think they have stripped the Militia out of the citizens over the years and replaced it with the state / federal reserves. My vision of it is every individual being responsible enough about their citizenship, to recognize that our citizenship comes at a price, and that price is keeping at least one functional small arm, and being proficient in it. That's a debate for another day and place though. I will say I'm a fan of the Swiss model. :)
So, are we, or were we, either is equally valid if you argue from a given context.
NFA may be OK for awhile and I wouldn't worry about two things; number of guns in trusts, and inheritance.
The problem with corporate trusts, which so many people seem to use for NFA ownership these days, is simple - corporations do not have the same rights and protections, under law, that peoplehave. Thus, it's entirely possible for corporate trusts ownership of NFA items to get wiped out with one stroke of the pen.
The other is inheritance. YOU have a right to keep what you own or to be justly compensated if ownership is lost due to government action or law. Nothing truly protects your ability to inherit this property to heirs. There is a lot of case law that protects most inheritance and estates, but I'm not even remotely close to being up to current on probate law. If they ever want to truly ban them, they *could* conceivably limit ownership to people already ON the NFA register.
It's like that in Canada, from my understanding, and eventually - if I recall the situation correctly - one guy will eventually "own" all of the full auto weapons in the country, and when he dies, they will all be forfeit to the state.
I could be remembering wrong, don't have the best recollection - think the gray hairs suck brain cells out of your head...
August 25, 2012, 10:41 AM
No Browning 1919 or 1917 yet? :evil:
My next semiauto machine gun will be a Chinese Bren, and then a DPM. I have a semi 1919 and live Vickers, and that's enough of the really heavy stuff for me.
August 25, 2012, 01:11 PM
Ian, I've shot a full auto 1919 and, to be completely honest, I didn't really care for it. It's a personal preference, but I prefer something I can put up against my shoulder. I realize there's modern versions that are dressed up with stocks/ etc, but I'm trying to collect things that A) I'll enjoy shooting, and B) which are rare enough that I won't risk losing a great deal of money (value) on over time, and C) which are as close to historically accurate as I can get, living in the "Peoples Republic of Illinois."
1919 fills B, but not A and C. I wouldn't really enjoy it as much as other types of firearms of similar role. And if I got the version I would enjoy, it wouldn't fit with the pattern of historically accurate designs.
Now, give me a line on a semi M60, M249, or M240, and we'll talk some money. I can shoulder those babies. :)
On a related note - firing a PKM, RPD, or MG42 offhand is a real struggle, even at 6'2 185 lbs. I need to work out more. :)
August 25, 2012, 02:23 PM
I admire your rifles and enthusiasm. Hope those run real nice for ya!
August 25, 2012, 03:57 PM
Ohio Ordnance Works makes a semi 240, but you'll really have to save your pennies:
A friend of mine has one, but I have yet to get the chance to shoot it.
I do agree on the 1919's lack of a stock, which is why I have an Israeli A6 kit (buttstock and bipod) for mine. The nice thing about the 1919 is that it can be easily adapted for a variety of different catridges...although you've pretty much got them all covered already. I have setups for mine in 8mm, .308, and .30-06 - and you can also get 7.62x54R and 7.62x39.
August 25, 2012, 04:46 PM
GAAAHH!! 14 THOUSAND DOLLARS :what::what:!!
August 25, 2012, 05:52 PM
Yep. About ten times what I have in my 1919. :eek:
August 25, 2012, 06:35 PM
I've got a budget of 58K for belt guns (total). If I end up getting that DsHK that'll set me back some. A lot of some actually. ;-)
So far it's gone down like this;
8600 - PKM
4600 - MG42
2200 - RPD
3400 - MG34 (yet to be received... shipping gorillas..)
So I'm sitting at $18,800 right now.
That leaves 39.2K in reserve.
I'm being picky as I can possibly be, trying to maximize A+B+C as I listed earlier in the thread.
M2HB semi auto is on sale at TNW through middle of this month, 10% of, $7200 .. been considering it, but haven't bit on it yet. Might kick myself in the ass if I don't get one.
M240 Bravo sure as hell ain't out of the question, but that's a big chunk of the reserves, and I'm not sure if I want to drop that much on a single piece .. of course, there's also the "going to kick myself in the ass if I don't do it" factor.
This is turning out to be a HELL of a lot more fun than investing in stocks and bonds, by the way.
August 25, 2012, 06:38 PM
Oh, and for what it's worth.. 58k goes a LOT further on semi-auto conversions than on NFA arms. Looked at the price of a registered MG42 earlier today and about pooped myself.
August 25, 2012, 06:47 PM
It may go farther, but not necessarily much farther. I paid $12k for my Vickers, which isn't too far from your PKM. You could easily get a live MG08/15 for under $10k.
August 25, 2012, 07:01 PM
Woah, I can only dream of holding a buddy's Yugo M53-demilled kit converted into airsoft MG3...and you have a firing one + 3 other s
August 25, 2012, 08:38 PM
There are others with far more impressive collections than mine. By no means am I trying to be 'the guy with the most toys'. I know of at least three local collectors who put what I have to shame. I'm sure there are guys out there (particularly ones I've seen on the firing line at Knob Creek) that have collections I'd stroke out over seeing.
I just enjoy the hell out of guns. :)
With Illinois' gun rights future very uncertain, due to Chicago politicians, and no intention of leaving for greener pastures until my kids are grown and launched in to the world, I'm making due with what I can.
"Get it while the getting is good", I guess you'd say.
Yes, I'm fortunate where I'm at in life, after a lot of hard work to get here, and believe me, I don't take any of this for granted.
Just wish I had some of these back in '04. Local Marine reserve unit wanted hands on time with Klashnikovs before going on their third trip to the sandbox, I knew a guy in the unit; I happily obliged with a truck load of semi AK clones and 3K rounds of ammo, enough to last the company a couple hours on the range. Gave me a t-shirt and a challenge coin for my "troubles", and some time with the machinegun crews in the bay, cleaning M240B's.
Good folks, those Marines. Maybe I'll give them a call again one day, see if they want to do it again. They don't get enough range time with what they're issued, being a reserve unit... :)