M1 Garand Premature Ping


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Double Vision
September 22, 2012, 06:06 PM
Today we took my new-to-me 1.7M serial number 1943 CMP Garand out to the range. Right out of the gate, both my cousin and I shot well with it.

On one clip only 3 shots it, the clip and ammo shot out in a loose mess. We tried another clip and it was fine.

We shot about 10 or 12 clips and about 4 of them had this malfunction. Sometimes the clip and ammo ping'ed all over the place. Other times the clip and ammo sort of stovepiped. We both experienced the problem while shooting.

Before going to the range, the gun was cleaned and a new CMP stock installed. Other than the premature ping, this rifle shot great!

I also have a 5.8M serial number CMP Garand and never had such an issue.

Any ideas what might cause this?

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Reloadron
September 22, 2012, 06:29 PM
There are several possibles:

1. Bent follower rod (cycles operating rod catch and clip latch early).
2. Follower rod forks excessively worn (cycles operating rod catch and clip latch early).
3. Clip latch spring weak or short (clip latch slips or bounces out of engagement).
4. Operating rod catch depressor arm altered or damaged (cycles clip latch early).

Of those 4 most common causes I have seen more of #2 and #3 than the remaining possibilities. Unless you are comfortable working on the M1 Garand and stripping it to parade rest as well as have a spare parts stash I suggest you contact CMP as this sort of problem will not go away and will likely get worse.

The above possibles are out of Jerry Kuhnhausen's shop manual for the US Caliber .30 Service Rifles.

Ron

8mmman
September 22, 2012, 06:34 PM
Most likely a clip latch spring weak and an easy fix too. Try this fisrt as it's easy to do.

JohnFLand
September 22, 2012, 08:40 PM
If the above fixes don't work, tell the gun to think of baseball while shooting. ;-)

Hacker15E
September 22, 2012, 09:01 PM
Clip latch spring replacement is usually the fix.

mshootnit
September 22, 2012, 09:08 PM
There are US army tech sheets which describe the fix. They say to replace the bullet guide. I would replace the bullet guide and clip latch spring. Possibly the clip latch as well that will fix it.

Reloadron
September 22, 2012, 09:30 PM
On the off chance you do not know what these parts are, and I have no idea if the CMP ships rifles with an IPB (Illustrated Parts Breakdown) you may want to give this link a look (http://www.chestnutridge.com/gpic.asp) for a relatively good parts breakdown drawing. All of the parts mentioned are well illustrated in the linked drawing. That should help. :)

Ron

Nugilum
September 22, 2012, 11:11 PM
If you bought it from the CMP, contact them. They'll make it right. They ALWAYS have for me!

Double Vision
September 23, 2012, 12:05 AM
Thanks for the tips guys. Great advice here.

It looks like the clip latch spring is an inexpensive and easy option as the first thing to check.
I'll also contact the CMP for their 2 cents.

Orlando
September 23, 2012, 08:23 AM
Its normally a weak clip latch spring. Remove spring stretch it and replace, fire rifle. If its fixed replace with a new spring
Next most common cause is a worn lobe on bullet guide
May also be bad enblocs, what is stamped on the ones you were using
Hardley ever is the clip latch itself the cause but its possible

Reloadron
September 23, 2012, 09:29 AM
As to the Bullet Guide that is another common cause. If you have a basic vernier caliper or micrometer (or have access to either) you can visually inspect and check the part.

For simple explanation the bullet guides come in two versions an old and new style. The new style has a notch cut making it easy to identify as seen below:

http://bearblain.com/images/Bullet%20Guides1.png

The mentioned lobe is the accelerator cam surface. This is what you want to measure as seen in the below image:

http://bearblain.com/images/Bullet%20Guides2.png

The new style should be 0.179" +.004 while the old style should be 0.175" + .004". While not a great image I am sure you get the idea. A common quick fix was to place the accelerator cam on an anvil and smack it a few times with a hammer.

All in all and all things considered as I mentioned earlier I would just contact CMP and see what they want to do as the problem is a common problem. So you can stretch the spring a little as mentioned and measure the bullet guide accelerator cam to get some ideas. Your choice. Again, I am sure the CMP will be happy to get you squared away.

P.S. Ever wonder why a part that has nothing to do with guiding bullets is called a bullet guide? :)

Ron

mshootnit
September 23, 2012, 10:44 AM
If you are going to do the bullet guide replacement look also at buying an op rod catch assembly to save shipping and swap this out as well.

Double Vision
September 24, 2012, 07:33 AM
Thanks for the help guys. I learned a lot in this discussion.
I sent an email to the CMP and in the meantime put a clip latch spring on order.

Roadking Rider
September 24, 2012, 08:58 AM
Ok before you start getting into the rifle let me ask some basic questions. When loading the clip were all the rounds sitting all the way in the clips?
Another question is when you pushed the clips down in the reciever did you push the center of the round or close to or near the primer end of the round, This sometimes bends the follower and wears the pads on them as they ride in the followers rails of the reciever. As mentioned it could be the bullet guide is bent or possibly the follower arm is bent. I'd also mark the clips and see if it's them and not the rifle at all.

Double Vision
September 24, 2012, 09:47 AM
Roadking, the rounds were firmly seated in the clip. The ammo was CMP stuff.

The clips are CMP issue and previously used in my other Garand with no issue. We first suspected the clips but some clips worked, and also not worked that day.

Both my cousin & I experienced the same intermittent problem, and we were pushing the clip in near the center.

mshootnit
September 25, 2012, 09:09 PM
when you get that thing fixed take it out to an open area if you can find one and shoot at 600 meter gongs or something like a 5 gallon bucket. Those things are fun

Double Vision
September 26, 2012, 07:16 AM
Just a follow-up...

I had ordered a clip latch spring and bullet guide from Fulton Armory and they arrived in 24 hours. The new spring is much stronger than the original and I look forward to trying it out, maybe this weekend. If the spring doesn't work, I'll try the bullet guide.

I had also contacted the CMP via email. They responded almost immediately and also put a new bullet guide in the mail to me.

Just as an aside, I had never looked at Fulton Armory before but will keep them in mind for future parts and accessory purchases.
And as usual, the CMP customer srvice is first class.

1KPerDay
September 26, 2012, 09:17 AM
If it still doesn't work the CMP will likely pay to ship the rifle back to them and get it right. They did for me one one of mine. LOVE the CMP.

Let us know how it goes next time out. :cool:

Fishbed77
September 26, 2012, 05:49 PM
I'll also contact the CMP for their 2 cents.

Just shoot an e-mail to their CS. They will gladly send out every replacement part you need, and they'll do it quickly.

Double Vision
October 15, 2012, 09:43 AM
Just a follow up on this. I replaced the clip latch spring and bullet guide and the rifle fires perfectly every time now. Thanks for all of your input and assistance!

Reloadron
October 15, 2012, 09:48 AM
Yay! Another happy rifle and shooter. Glad things are working fine and enjoy the rifle!

Ron

Fishbed77
October 15, 2012, 12:48 PM
I would replace the bullet guide and clip latch spring. Possibly the clip latch as well that will fix it.

Be sure to contact the CMP. Their service is excellent and they will likely send out these replacement parts very quickly.

When I got my new-to-me CMP Service grade rifle back in June of this year, I noticed a tiny crack on the gas plug (probably had always been that way, since the park went into it). Sent an email to their CS address, and within three days, I had a new plug.

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