saturday night specials

ok,before this thread gets out of hand,i am not posting a 'should i carry this' or 'how dependable is this' or even a 'which caliber is best' thread.
i wanted to start this thread to see if anyone else collected 'saturday night specials' or other 'taboo' handguns like .25 automatics.
i have just startedmy collection.
so far i have a Rohm rg10 with a 2 inch barrel,a Rohm rg10 snubnose,a Colt model 1908 pocket .25.
i DO NOT carry these as ccw,nor are they for any type of defence.i just collect them because i like them.

http://i1140.photobucket.com/albums/n577/gpwelding1/0113020005.jpg
http://i1140.photobucket.com/albums/n577/gpwelding1/0113020006.jpg
sorry,no pic of the rg10 snub nose yet.but i will add one soon.
so,now show me yours!!!


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I love little guns, but I certainly would not call that colt a SNS.

definatly not!
i just put it in because of the .25 auto round.
its one of my prize peices.when i got it,it was a bare frame with no grips or magazine.finish was completely gone and the firing pin was broke.
i completely restored it,and it is a sweet shooter!hasnt jammed at all after over 200 rounds.and you will not find a .25 acp on the market today with that kind of accuracy at 25 yards.
i dated it by the serial number on line,and it was made in 1919.:D

Just looking at those RGs shivers my timbers.

i have
1 jennings 22 w/ floral slide
1 jimenez 22
1 jimnez 32
2 raven 25s 1 chrome1blace
1 burgo 25
1 iver johnson 25
1 davis 380
1 lorcin 380
1 lorcin25
1 rg not sure of model but its 38 special

I don't collect 'em per se, but I do own both a Jennings J-22 (nickel, with wood grips) from 1987, and a Phoenix HP-22A, purchased in 2009. Both have been good at what they were intended to do; neither is a carry weapon.
The rest of my guns, for the most part, are "beer budget" guns (Taurus, Kel-Tec, Bersa, Charter Arms, etc), but they're not SNS guns.

I have a .25 ACP Baby Browning I slip in my pocket occasionally.

But I didn't know it was taboo.

I have no interest at all in cheap Saturday Night Specials.

rc

Oddly, one of those RGs is the ONLY gun ever, that I wouldn't take for free and that was just last month. The front would spin or fall off, the loading gate was a joke, the cylinder looked like slave laborers had machined it. it was altogether the single worst firearm I've ever personally held in my hands.
I didn't have the least bit of confidence that even in it's .22 short configuration it wouldn't cause injury in some way so a friend is making a lmp ppost outa it now.

Only one "SNS" here; a chromed Raven 25 ACP. Back in 1995 a local gun shop owner took in several guns on trade in for something else. One of those trade-ins was the Raven. When I asked; "what are you gonna do with that thing?" He replied; " I don't stock crap like that; if you wanna take it off my hands just gimme 25 bucks"........So I did. Just for grins.... I would never carry it as a defensive gun and I checked my shooting logs and since 1995 I've put 207 rounds through it. I'm almost afraid to fire it anymore after all the stuff I've heard about those things falling apart after several hundred rounds and this thing was used when I got it. Did have to replace the firing pin in the late nineties but Gun Parts Corp. has Raven parts. Recently took it back to the gun shop just for laughs and everyone just had to see it. Couple guys had heard of Ravens but had never seen one. I must be getting old. I can remember when these things were real common. So now I guess it's a real curiosity and conversation piece.

i agree with you RC.but some people are dead set against .25 acp.
i have seen more threads turn into p***ing matches over that caliber than almost any other topic.

I dont collect old, inexpensive, guns with suspect reps but I do find them fascinating. Almost like slowing down to look at a car crash, with the attendent wow what a mess reaction.

does anyone know how to find the manufacture date on Rohms?
i know you can use the sl# one some firearms,but not sure if this is the case with Rohms.

I also have a Raven .25ACP in chrome. Cute gun. Very reliable and accurate for what it is (for me) which is a novelty. In the 70s, the SNS was all you heard about on the nightly news when there was a shooting. The Raven is a very hardy pistol with a fixed barrel which also makes it pretty accurate as well. It is not a light weight gun but it is small in size.

I'm almost afraid to fire it anymore after all the stuff I've heard about those things falling apart after several hundred rounds and this thing was used when I got it.

The Raven isn't one of those guns that fell apart after a few hundred rounds. If your frame is solid and the barrel is still in good shape it should be good for as many rounds as you wish to put thru it. The frames are pretty solid. There are many good write ups about the Raven in years past if you Google them. It is from the Ring of Fire generation of crappy pistols but the Raven has stood above the rest. It's probably the best of the worst, so-to-speak.

http://i342.photobucket.com/albums/o435/larryh1108/CCW/Raven25left2.jpg

In the 70s,the SNS was all you heard about on the nightly news when there was a shooting.
this was one reason i started collecting them.there is a history there.
plus,i like them

My brother has an affinity for the el cheapos. I recall looking through his collection and seeing an RG, a Cobra derringer, a Jennings that actually pointed very well, a rough-looking Charter Arms Undercover, and a couple others. A friend of mine has one of those Italian .25s, a Tanfoglio I think? I kinda like that little gun.

I use a titan 25 auto as my tackle box gun. 65 bucks and that included a zippered pouch and two full boxes of shells. No worries if this one falls in the pond or gets muddy. I will just rinse it off and throw a little oil on it and back in the box it goes!

Tanfoglio actually makes a good gun, continuing the CZ line and the EAA Witness as well.

I started my police career in '68, and back then the typical SNS was an old "owl's head" type revolver. Break-top, .32 or .38 S&W, and generally in bad shape.
We were slightly past the era of "zip guns" which had been popular a decade earlier; I never saw one on the street.
Another popular weapon with the criminal element was the sawed-off; most commonly a cheap old break-open 12 gauge single with both butt and barrel cut off.
These became vastly less common right about then due to the '68 Gun Control Act.

Have a few of these. . .

Jennings J-22 around 30 years old, lots of rounds fired. Saftety broke long ago, so it is a range toy now.

Cobra FS-380, 100 bux and came with 3 boxes of ammo.

Accutek AT-380, Got it for about 3 hours work. Hammer broke off after the 9the round fired. Still haven't sent it in to the factory.

IntraTEC Protec 25. Love this one, it shoots and does not jam.

larryh1108: I hope you're right about those Ravens not falling apart after a few hundred rounds. Other than replacing the firing pin once my Raven has been trouble free and always fed & functioned with no problems whatsoever.
It's just that I heard so much negative stuff about them that I guess I had a fear of it falling apart. Mine looks like a clone of yours and is actually a better gun than I thought it would be. Not that I would want it as a carry gun or have to depend on anything in 25 ACP for defensive purposes.

I bought mine used 5 years ago or so. I've put at least 1000 rounds thru it and it has been perfect, literally. The frame is solid, if you look at it. It is a simple design with a fixed barrel. Change the recoil springs and shoot away. The Raven you can shoot. The others are suspect, at best, and aren't built as solidly as the Raven. The .25ACP is a weak round and does not batter the frame like the heavier rounds do if the springs are fresh.

you know that now you have posted that, you are going to light on fire and all those guns will melt....

I'm actually kinda OK with the import ban, helped domestic production, that said, I like early Continental pocket guns, they are NEAT.

I had a Jennings J-22 that lasted for about a year, but I put a LOT of rounds downrange during that time. I ended up giving it to my brother, who promptly dropped in a lake while fishing...probably better off that way.

I also had a Targa .25 that I carried as a last ditch gun on my vest. I shot the heck out of it until the firing pin flew out of it. The gun cost me $35 when I bought it, and I figured it gave me $35 worth of service ofver the couple of years I had it.

now the absolute worse SNS i ever owned was a Lorcin .25,didnt keep it long.
sometimes when you chambered a round,it would fire as soon as the slide came to a stop:what::uhoh::cuss:thing scared the crap out of me!
gave it to my uncle,under the condition that it NEVER leave his possesion and he keep it locked up.

I don't collect them, but I have a Jennings J-22 that was given to me by a friend that found it in their attic. I've heard all the negative feedback there is to hear about these lil guns and have decided I must've got really lucky with mine, as it's literally 'unbelievable-accurate', I've made shots with it that just left me scratching my head in wonder while sceptically staring at its 1" barrel (not including chamber which would be 2"). I've also found it to be 100% reliable with CCI ammunition, and 90% reliable with most other types, and I've put thousands upon thousands through this little gun. I've heard from a lot of folks that hate 'em, but mine is a really fun gun and I'll never get rid of it, I shoot it every time I go shootin' :)

.38 Special Colt Cobra, was the old man's back up piece for the better part of 12 years in the Palm Beach Sheriffs Department. Given to me when I graduated high school, now serves as my back up gun

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zUGd-VC3wk

I enjoy cheap guns alot, some of them have bad reputations mainly because of the Brady bunch. The media pushed alot of their BS right along into the mouths of gullible people and those people who watched all the biased news coverage unfortunately still repeat the same garbage today. This is the same media that blamed Brandon Maxfield's gunshot injuries on the Bryco .380 and not the babysitter who shot him in the face when she pulled the trigger with it pointed in his direction.

If a $100 Raven jams it is a POS that belongs in the trash. $1000 Kimber? It either is a magazine issue or needs more breaking in.

I have:

1. Raven MP25 (initially had issues but after I adjusted magazine lips the gun works perfectly)
2. Rohm RG23 with short barrel (works 100% with some ammo, light strikes with other)
3. Rohm RG23 with long barrel (works fine with any ammo)
4. Phoenix HP22a (cracked frame around 3,500 rounds, they sent me a new gun that works as good as the first one)

Will a zamak gun outlast a steel one with heavy use? No. They do work fine for infrequent range guns or hideaway guns. I've put quite a few rounds through my Raven and it still works great. Don't dry fire them. Almost everyone with a broken firing pin admits to dry firing the MP25.

I won't say I collect them but I have accumulated 16 mouse/pocket guns.

i wanted to start this thread to see if anyone else collected 'saturday night specials'

Not only do I not collect them, I have no desire to own even one.

Not only do I not collect them, I have no desire to own even one.
So why post?

While I don't feel I'm collecting them, just like with motorcycles - I'm drawn to bobbed and lobbed for simplicity and function's sake.

My mother had an RG 10 that I inherited in 2002. Her's had white plastic grips. I know there is lttle if any monetary value in it but it has plenty sentimental value to me. I don't carry it or use it for anything other than to look at.

The very term "SNS" as well as the application of laws were very faintly veiled racism at its best; and a complete trampling on the 2nd amendment rights of the 'Non-Desirable" citizens at its worst.

This is the same media that blamed Brandon Maxfield's gunshot injuries on the Bryco .380 and not the babysitter who shot him in the face when she pulled the trigger with it pointed in his direction.

26 May, 2000: Palm Beach County schoolteacher Barry Grunow was intentionally shot and killed by a student (Nathaniel Brazill), who was armed with a Davis .380. Grunow's survivors, and the local media to some degree, attempted to place blame on the weapon's manufacturer; the resulting civil suit against it was tossed. Not long after that, Florida passed a civil-immunity law designed to protect firearm manufacturers from such suits stemming from the criminal misuse of their products.

In fairness those Rohm RG10s are POS and deserve all the crap heaped upon them. The fact that the poor in this country had to use that for defense and hope it somehow worked and didnt have a malfunction is just depressing as hell. :cuss:

That said I do find things like that perversely fascinating in the same way I find iPad and iPhone knock offs fun (comes from doing iplaw). The fact that they even existing is sometimes as crazy as the "unique feature" of the guns themselves.

So why post?


Because the entire point of the thread is to see whether or not people shared an affinity for these types of guns. I merely voiced that I do not. I said nothing derogatory or insulting.

Not a collector, but I have two that would fall into this category. One is an RG-38. No picture of it, I rarely take it out, and never shoot it. The one cylinder I did shoot out of it was about 3 feet high at 10 yards.

The other is a Cobra FS380. $100, 2 boxes of ammo and a holster. I have put about 1200 rounds through it, which in turn would buy like 3 of these pistols... I have replaced a broken firing pin and spring and also the recoil spring, twice. I like shooting this thing! I have heard about the frame cracking, so I always look it over good after every few magazines. It jams about once a magazine with steel cases, but has been somewhat reliable with brass cased ammo. Id say a jam every 3 or 4 magazines with brass.

From what I hear they have a decent warranty. I haven't had anything major happen that I can't fix yet, but am somewhat looking forward to it to see if that is true.

http://i362.photobucket.com/albums/oo67/SloFoFo/COBRA0-1-1.jpg

Saturday Night Specials, huh.

You mean like these??

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v473/Leanwolf/44JPG.jpg

;)

L.W.

If a $100 Raven jams it is a POS that belongs in the trash. $1000 Kimber? It either is a magazine issue or needs more breaking in
amen brother !!!!!!!!!!

I don't really 'collect' them specifically, but I do have an interest in inexpensive pocket guns....'Ring-Of-Fire' manufacturers in particular. I don't own many, but looking at my spreadsheet I count 26 hand guns in my possession which would be considered 'SNS' made by;
RG, Sedco, Davis, Raven, Jennings/Bryco, Lorcin, Sundance, Reck, FIE, EIG, QFI, HA, IJ, Intratec, Bauer, Excam, US Revolver, and Phoenix.

No, I normally do not use any of these as my carry gun....I own them for fun. However, the majority of them are surprisingly reliable (contrary to the internet standard wisdom of, 'a friend of a friend of my second cousin's mother's son-in-law looked at one once and it blew up.......') .

http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/ff461/pockets25/mp25-15small.jpg
.

I have an old 38 derringer that I wouldn't shoot for nothing that my dad left me. I figure I would sell it at the next firearm surrender


Posted from Thehighroad.org App for Android

All the guns listed..Jennings, Cobre, Raven, Titan, Colt , are NOT Saturday Night Specials. Please take time to research. Hi-Points are not SNS. They have been gone since the 60's. Rohm was.
Sorry but you're wrong on this one, I have done plenty of research. Any small concealable pistol made from zamak alloy is considered a Saturday Night Special. The phrase was used extremely frequently during the 80's when referring to the Raven MP25 and various other cheap firearm manufacturers mainly associated with the "Ring of Fire".

Edited for link to a Wikipedia article that adequately explains it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturday_night_special

Saturday Night Special IS a term from the 1960s that phrase was used to outlaw so many small firearms back then...the term was just revived to include all those later cheap firearms...

Please don't call you Dad's Colt Cobra a Saturday Night Special...

Bill

Delete.

Jeeze guys, get over your locked in stone opinions on this one. SNS is just a catch all grouping phrase that evolves with generations, much like the use (misuse?) of; "muscle car", SUV, "special forces" and the like.

I once had a 25 acp Raven just like the one "larryh1108" has. Same grips and everything. I took it to Galveston with us one year. I had a 9mm TA90 at the hotel room but carried the Raven since I could hide it in my swim trunks.

I looked down the beach and saw two salty characters following my wife and mother-inlaw step for step.I fell in behind and increased the pace. Once they saw be behind them they made a bee line to the right and left the area. I never showed the gun but approched in a determined way. Good thing for me, I would hated to use that Raven. No confidence in the .25 ACP for me but it was better than a sharp stick.

That was my first experience with a SNS. I did later own a RG in 38 special. It fired with no issues but still got a vote of no confidence from me.

Both are gone now and good riddence.
Dallas Jack

I suppose saturday night special is just a catch phraise like Assault Weapon, 45Long Colt, or clip vs magazine.
Yup. Don't forget the fact that the media thinks any hi capacity rifle is an AR15 or an AK47 and doesn't know the difference between semi automatic rifles and fully automatic rifles.

I don't collect "saturday night specials" or "suicide specials" or "junk guns" either... but I have some. Couldn't beat the price... which was free... :D

Actually, those cheap guns are as valid collectors' items as any other guns, but they are still junk. The mistake would be to believe that a collection of such guns will be a good investment. There is interest in the way those guns were made, and how they managed to make any gun that could sell at retail for under $10 even in the 1950's. The problem is that allowing for inflation, those guns are worth less today than they were back then; not exactly an investment to put your kids through college or provide for a comfortable retirement.

Jim

If you shoot someone with a 22 s,l,lr or a .25acp it has a tendancy to change their mind about certain things unless they are crazy or doped up. Nobody likes to get shot; it hurts.

Eee gads. What a coincidence - I just put my own weird gripped H&R up in another thread. Mine had the entire original grip replaced with a blob of lead and enamel.

I wouldn't mind owning a Raven .25 just to have one. Back in the day they were THE handgun for the gangbangers. Now they carry Glocks.

Actually, those cheap guns are as valid collectors' items as any other guns, but they are still junk. The mistake would be to believe that a collection of such guns will be a good investment. There is interest in the way those guns were made, and how they managed to make any gun that could sell at retail for under $10 even in the 1950's. The problem is that allowing for inflation, those guns are worth less today than they were back then; not exactly an investment to put your kids through college or provide for a comfortable retirement.

Jim
Hogwash, buying a crate of Rohm RG10s is a sound investment policy! lol

Actually, those cheap guns are as valid collectors' items as any other guns, but they are still junk. The mistake would be to believe that a collection of such guns will be a good investment. There is interest in the way those guns were made, and how they managed to make any gun that could sell at retail for under $10 even in the 1950's. The problem is that allowing for inflation, those guns are worth less today than they were back then; not exactly an investment to put your kids through college or provide for a comfortable retirement.

Jim
good point Jim.
i dont collect them for profit or monitary value though,i just collect them because i like them.

i dont collect them for profit or monitary value though,i just collect them because i like them.

Exactly!

Back when I was a kid growing up on the lower east side of Detroit, every 'hoodie had a Raven .25. They have now moved on to Glocks.

Junk can still be very valuable. Likewise SNS pistols.

Just to put this into historical perspective: The GCA 1968 did not use the term 'Saturday Night Special', but was designed to ban the importation of small handguns. One of the guns banned was the FN 1910. The same pistol used to assassinate the Arch Duke of Austria. It also banned many fairly expensive pistols, such as the Walther PPK.

And gave birth to the Walther PPKS... ;)

Bill

Amazing that this thread has remained free of "blew up in my hand" stories thus far.

I'm proud of you guys.

Back when I was a kid growing up on the lower east side of Detroit, every 'hoodie had a Raven .25. They have now moved on to Glocks.
I doubt it, Glocks while very affordable, are still nothing like the price of a Raven or Ring of Fire merchant. While not exactly a systematic study take a look at the Kentucky State Polices confiscated weapon auctions.

http://www.kentuckystatepolice.org/conf_weapons/index.htm

I seem to have accumulated a few cheap guns, but most of them seem to work okay for their intended purpose - being inexpensive, but functional enough for emergency self defense. I don't carry any of them on a daily basis, but I take them out and shoot them occasionally for fun. The Tanfoglio-made Excam .25 is actually a well-made little pocket gun, as is the Iver Johnson TP-22. The Harrington & Richardson .32 Long revolver works well, and I don't think it ever had a full box of ammo shot through it before I got it. The most powerful is a Lorcin 9mm, which is heavy, awkward, and not particularly accurate past 7 yards, but it goes Bang! ten times in a row, and I got it essentially for free.

Well...ahem, not being a collector kind of guy and buying what I want to shoot puts a different perspective on this topic for me. I have absolutely NO interest in junk, historically significant junk, profitable junk, Sanford and Son verifiable junk or otherwise. I guess this thread wasn't started with me in mind.:barf:

P.S. Smith and Wesson Safety Hammerless revolvers are not junk! There are plenty of knockoffs that are.

Saturday Night Special is a anti-handgun term. As a result, they don't exist.

Saturday Night Special is a anti-handgun term. As a result, they don't exist.
this is true,but it appears pretty much everyone knew what i ment.
it was slang for cheap,low quality,not too well made.
but as i have said i like the ones i have.

Saturday Night Special is a anti-handgun term. As a result, they don't exist.
While it may be true, I think there are valid points about low quality or dangerous products....HOWEVER, that is more with older products and pre-GCA 1968 (then again neither a Walther PPK or that one Glock in 380 are not junk guns). It's weird because the term is so vague and poorly defined it defies categorization (is it Ring of Fire guns, cheap guns, guns that break, guns found in trace reports, poor construction, etc). However, there are guns that were made for a few shots and nothing more, the Liberator is an example. Now how people use them is entirely different. I think we all agree than ANY gun maker who was directly involved in intentionally trying to supply criminals deserve the book thrown at them coughNorincocough, but while people may have gotten them and heck even manufacturers figured that was what many might do, a lot of people bought Raven's because they were cheap, and could sit in a drawer, hopefully never needing to be fired besides a quick function check. They weren't meant to be torture test guns.

It is interesting how guns could be made and sold for 12.95. There is one sitting at my gun dealer for 88 bucks (even has a box and all)...no way I'm getting that after reading numerous comments of people who personally chucked their guns in lakes. In about six years a lot of the GCA banned guns will all be C&R, then it might be a lot easier to collect them. Lord knows filling out a PSP Handgun form for a Rohm is a PITA.

http://www.nrvoutdoors.com/WORST%20GUN/RG10%20AD%20JULY%201960.jpg

Amazing that this thread has remained free of "blew up in my hand" stories thus far.

I'm proud of you guys.

I'm sure they're out there. Just kinda hard to type with...well... you know. ;)