Ruger SP101 problem?


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5-SHOTS
September 27, 2012, 01:44 PM
Hi, I think that after 2350 factory rounds (950 .357Mag and 1400 .38Spl) my Ruger SP101 DAO is starting to develop a problem: infact, when I was inspecting the gun before cleaning after the last 200 rounds, Iíve discovered a little dent around the firing pin hole that I had not previously noticed (see pics). I donít know if it is something to be worried about or if I can keep on shooting the gun without problems. My fear is that if things get worst, by shooting another x number of rounds, the firing pin could be frozen in its forward position by the reduction of the hole diameter.

Iím thinking to send a letter to Ruger with the same pics posted here to know if I have to ship the gun to the italian importer for inspection and/or repair. I love this gun but at this moment Iím a little disappointed: infact this is the second problem occurred to one of my revolvers (the first was a broken hammer stud on a S&W 649-1 after 800 rounds of standard pressure .38Spl).

I would like to know your opinion and if someone elseís SP101 has developed the same thing.

Best regards, 5-SHOTS.

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weblance
September 27, 2012, 02:49 PM
I was thinking it looked like a manufacturing defect, but I just looked at my 3 SP101s and none of them have that dent. I dont know what would have caused something to damage the recoil plate like that, if it truly is damage and not a defect. I think some contact with Ruger is the correct choice.

98Redline
September 27, 2012, 03:32 PM
Did you possibly smack it with the end of a cleaning rod?

beag_nut
September 27, 2012, 03:42 PM
Just looked at my SP101 in .357, and can't imagine how yours got that ding. As a personal and maybe helpful note, I have noticed that things (wherever and whatever) which were overlooked early on might tend to get noticed as time goes on. I seriously doubt that it will ever get worse, unless it is as 98redline suggests, that it was caused by a cleaning rod.

Revoliver
September 27, 2012, 03:44 PM
Looks to me like you had a round stuck under the ejection star and not only closed the cylinder with it still under the star, but also fired and cycled the gun while it was stuck under the ejection star. This is based off of the drag line scar and rings/dents in your two pics.

460Kodiak
September 27, 2012, 05:32 PM
Looks to me like you had a round stuck under the ejection star and not only closed the cylinder with it still under the star, but also fired and cycled the gun while it was stuck under the ejection star.

This makes no sense. The cylinder would not close if this were the case, unless you were closing the cylinder with a sledge hammer. The gun would also bind up, and the cylinder would not turn.

Every used revolver I have ever seen has a drag mark across that portion of the recoil plate...... come to think of it, most new ones have a slight mark also from inspections, and customers looking the guns over.

OP, I would send those pics on to Ruger. I think you have a valid concern about the firing pin jamming. I doubt it will get any worse, but it doesn't hurt to ask. My SP101 has no such issue.

The cleaning rod idea may be the culprit, but you would have to hit it pretty darn hard. Do you have any recolection of that occuring?

Revoliver
September 27, 2012, 06:11 PM
This makes no sense. The cylinder would not close if this were the case, unless you were closing the cylinder with a sledge hammer. The gun would also bind up, and the cylinder would not turn.Every used revolver I have ever seen has a drag mark across that portion of the recoil plate...... come to think of it, most new ones have a slight...

The example I used may not be exact, but the scenario still makes complete sense. That deep rut scar (not simple surface scratch) combined with the perfect concentric rings around the rear of the frame/firing pin hole leads me to believe that the extractor star was not fully seated (for awhile possibly) causing a round or rounds to be sat flush against the rear of the frame and causing those nice circular dents around the firing pin in the shape of the brass and the primer area.

The drag lines you see on revolvers can be avoided by properly cleaning under the extraction star and making sure it is seating properly. I have not seen any brand new revolvers with this line.

unclenunzie
September 27, 2012, 06:50 PM
This looks like a trip back to the factory for close inspection and repair. It looks like both the firing pin and the recoil shield are damaged, possibly from the same source?

onebadcaballero
September 27, 2012, 10:13 PM
Don't take my word for it but I think the firing pin might be off center. I'm pretty sure I've heard of this problem being caused by that. How are those primers looking?

asia331
September 28, 2012, 12:02 AM
Took a good look at my 101; no such damage there. The cleaning rod thing might be be the case but wouldn't a brass rod deform itself rather the than the stainless steel? I'm thinking it might be a manufacturing issue.

5-SHOTS
September 28, 2012, 04:51 AM
onebadcaballero: I think you are right. Infact I forgot to mention that the firing pin on my SP101 is a little bit off center (approximately 0.02") and obviously the gun left the factory that way. Take a close look at my pics using the concentric circular signs on the shield as a point of reference and you'll see that. It is also clear that the firing pin is slightly off center even if you look at it from the rear, holding the hammer cocked. The dent is in correspondence to the side of the primer where the firing pin leaves "more meat" after the strike and it is also starting to be impressed on the primers themselves. However I've never had a misfire. All strikes are very deep and powerful, only slightly off center.

Seriously, I can't imagine how I can smack a cleaning rod harder than a .357Mag recoiling case... No, I've never hit the recoil shield with a cleaning rod.
The drag line is perfectly normal in a revolver being opened and closed two times a day for loading/unloading and/or practice and, belive me, you can barely feel it with a nail. I always keep the zone under the ejector star clean and dry; for that reason the cylinder always open and close smoothly. Anyway I can't understand what a shield drag line has to do with a dented firing pin hole.
The concentric circular signs in the shield around the firing pin hole are again perfectly normal at that round count and are caused by the recoiling spent cases; If I had only shotted 2350 wadcutters they will be still there. All other scratches or signs or marks are factory, probably left by manual fitting.
All the rounds fired were factory rounds (all Fiocchi and maybe a box of Winchester .38Spl wadcutters). The revolver was purchased new on April 2008.

At this moment the gun is working well with no damages to the firing pin and with no friction between it and the dented side of the hole, but I don't know what is going to happen with a higher round count.

Best regards, 5-SHOTS.

Tophernj
September 28, 2012, 08:54 AM
I'm wondering if it is a void in the casting that with use popped its little head out to say hello. I may be (usually am) totally off base, but that's what it looks like to these uninformed eyes.

C

460Kodiak
September 28, 2012, 11:06 AM
The example I used may not be exact, but the scenario still makes complete sense.

Hog wash I say! Try loading a revolver with a round under the star, and then close the cylinder. If you can get it to close, please post a picture. If you can get it to close without using excessive force, and it is something the OP could have done without noticing, then I'll eat my shoe! If anyone is paying so little attention to loading and unloading that they could do this without noticing, and close the cylinder, and shoot all 5 rounds, then they really have no business owning a gun anyway. The OP doesn't sound like that type to me. I say again, that scenario just makes no sense. Does it to anyone else?

I'm not saying a round couldn't drop in and get in the way, but you sure as heck would notice when closing the cylinder, and it would be pretty hard to do so. You'd also notice when you tried to fire the gun as there would be more resistance in the cycling of the cylinder!

The drag line is perfectly normal in a revolver being opened and closed two times a day for loading/unloading and/or practice and, belive me, you can barely feel it with a nail.

I totally agree. A frequently loaded and unloaded revolver will have that drag line. It's just the way they work. Mine has it too, as it is a frequent carry gun for me. So does my J frame, and my 460 mag since I shoot it a lot.

Anyway I can't understand what a shield drag line has to do with a dented firing pin hole.


Absolutely nothing.

skidder
September 28, 2012, 11:08 AM
How are those primers looking?
I agree.

Look at the spent cases and see if the strikes are off center.

ChefJeff1
September 28, 2012, 11:34 AM
Mine has the same drag mark on the recoil shield but nit the dent on the firing pin hole.

Friendly, Don't Fire!
September 28, 2012, 11:43 AM
Since it is stainless, could a primer have had a small hole or separation where gases escaped and etched the area where the gases hit?

A good cleaning and you wouldn't see black from that incident.

I had a rifle primer blow a pin-hole once and it made about the same size crater in my rifle bolt-face.

Also, the line has little to do with cleaning, it would happen anyway.

Revoliver
September 28, 2012, 11:45 AM
Hog wash I say! Try loading a revolver with a round under the star, and then close the cylinder. If you can get it to close, please post a picture. If you can get it to close without using excessive force, and it is something the OP could have done without noticing, then I'll eat my shoe! If anyone is paying so little attention to loading and unloading that they could do this without noticing, and close the cylinder, and shoot all 5 rounds, then they really have no business owning a gun anyway. The OP doesn't sound like that type to me.

You don't think that is the cause, good for you. If you cannot understand the scenario and still insist on literally interpretting what was posted, that is your dilema. It disturbs me that some people can't comprehend the scenario of the extractor star either being way out of seat or gradually put out of seat.

Not saying that this is the cause and everyone else is wrong, never mentioned that once as a matter of fact. Just that it is what it apears to be to me.

460Kodiak
September 28, 2012, 12:42 PM
and still insist on literally interpretting what was posted

Well next time I'll shoot for a more figurative understanding of your post???? Ummm.... if you don't literally mean what you posted, then why would you post it? That's what posting something is.

I agree that the cylinder could possibly be seated wrong...... do to a manufacturer defect. My point is that I don't think it's anything the OP did to the gun, which is what you stated with the "round under the ejector star" scenario.

Ok I'm done debating this with you and I'm not looking for a fight or to argue with you. I've already made the point that the original scenario is not feasable.

I'm done with this thread until the OP speaks up again.

5-SHOTS
September 28, 2012, 01:45 PM
Please friends relax, we are only speaking about our favourite toys.

Friendly, Don't Fire!: I inspect the primers when I put the spent cases in the box after every cylinder shooted and I've never noticed signs of overpressure in the primers. While shooting I've never heard a different sound or a greater recoil from an overpressure round and I've never experienced a case stuck in one of the chambers. I only shoot factory loads. Yes, as said the strikes are a little off center but that has never been an issue until now... There are ton of guns out there with a slightly off center firing pin that still work perfect like mine, but I don't know what is going to happen to my SP101 after another 1000 rounds.

At this point the "off center firing pin hole" argument seems to be the most realistic, but I also think that the little zone under the dent is not as hard as it had to be.

If I'll contact Ruger I'll report you back everything.
Anyway, all considered I'll probably sell the gun with a huge loss to someone that shoots 50 rounds a year, because I'm thinking that if it is something related ONLY to the off center firing pin issue, even a trip back to the factory is not going to solve anything in the long term and the problem will be there after another 2500/3000 rounds.

Best regards, 5-SHOTS.

98Redline
September 28, 2012, 03:24 PM
I am not going to rehash the possible reasons again but only advise you not to shoot the gun until you get either Ruger or a competent smith to take a look at it.

My biggest concern is that on firing the primer could deform and flow in and around the dent. The excessive deformation could cause the primer to fail and blow back both through the firing pin hole and out the sides. It probably wouldn't be uber dangerous provided you had the proper safety equipment but it certainly wouldn't help the gun in any way.

I would get on the horn to Ruger, get and RMA and send the gun back to them to inspect or check out.

It is your choice if you want to sell it or not but if you do before sending it to Ruger, do the buyer the courtesy of informing them of this potentially safety related issue.

MIL-DOT
September 28, 2012, 04:43 PM
I'm kinda agreeing with 98redline, I can only imagine that happening from a forceful jab with a cleaning rod ( but even then,it still seems unlikely, considering the disparity in hardness of the metals.)
Heck, I dunno....:D

5-SHOTS
September 28, 2012, 04:54 PM
It is your choice if you want to sell it or not but if you do before sending it to Ruger, do the buyer the courtesy of informing them of this potentially safety related issue.

This is my intention at the moment. For that reason I was speaking about a huge loss of money. Maybe it's time to get a Glock 26 or a Caracal C...

Friendly, Don't Fire!
September 28, 2012, 06:06 PM
....I inspect the primers when I put the spent cases in the box after every cylinder shooted and I've never noticed signs of overpressure in the primers. While shooting I've never heard a different sound or a greater recoil from an overpressure round and I've never experienced a case stuck in one of the chambers. I only shoot factory loads.....

I think I need to clarify that, when I had the small pierce in the very edge of one primer in a Remington 700 Bolt Action Rifle, the loads were nowhere near hot loads, in fact there was still quite a radius on all the primers after firing. I did not hear anything different with any of the rounds I was firing.

In fact, other than a small amount of smoke that came out at the bolt-face and out the small side hole, I did not notice anything different about the shots I was taking.

The hole in the primer was so small, unless one were actually looking for a problem, they most likely would have overlooked the cartridge that had the failed primer.

The gases created a small divot, very much like what you have in your photos.

As others implied, why bother asking if you already have all the answers? In telling us all to relax, as these are just our favorite toys, why bother posting the problem in the first place if you do not want some kind of reaction or possible solutions to a potential problem?:o

Friendly, Don't Fire!
September 28, 2012, 06:12 PM
The gov't put that there so they could identify which brass was shot out of that particular gun as that divot would be bound to produce a case marking.:)

Revoliver
September 29, 2012, 12:40 AM
I personally don't listen to people that can't even take care of their guns, but hey everyone else should. My GP100's been used by the entire family for years now and doesn't have that rut yours has and not one single new revolver I've ever seen has a scratch there. Mine doesn't even have a drag line on the outside of the cylinder from the cylinder stop, but hey, that's because I clean mine... Yet some posters know exactly what it is seeing as how they can so confidently say what it isn't.

I trust guns more than people. Those pics look like neglect and now the OP's going to be trying to pawn it off on Ruger or some new sucker. Hope you get stuck with your creation.

788Ham
September 29, 2012, 12:56 AM
The dragline across the rear shield appears to me, it might need a bit of oil or lube in that part of the cylinder, that pin is dragging too hard. If lubed, the pin and spring will retract inside the cylinder, not being held out and not able to be pushed inside like it should. Try some oil in that piece, see what happens.

Lost Sheep
September 29, 2012, 03:56 AM
THR collapsed on me and when I recovered access found I posted an answer to the wrong thread and now cannot delete, so just wrote this.

Lost Sheep

5-SHOTS
September 29, 2012, 06:47 AM
As others implied, why bother asking if you already have all the answers? In telling us all to relax, as these are just our favorite toys, why bother posting the problem in the first place if you do not want some kind of reaction or possible solutions to a potential problem?

Simply because I've never experienced what you are speaking of in my SP101 even if I know what you are speaking of. What you reported makes full sense if it was happened to my SP101, but luckly it was NOT. I thank yor for report your experience, but it was not mine. Again, I shoot ONLY factory rounds so the possibility of a gas escape or a holed primer is very very low.




I personally don't listen to people that can't even take care of their guns, but hey everyone else should. My GP100's been used by the entire family for years now and doesn't have that rut yours has and not one single new revolver I've ever seen has a scratch there. Mine doesn't even have a drag line on the outside of the cylinder from the cylinder stop, but hey, that's because I clean mine... Yet some posters know exactly what it is seeing as how they can so confidently say what it isn't.

I trust guns more than people. Those pics look like neglect and now the OP's going to be trying to pawn it off on Ruger or some new sucker. Hope you get stuck with your creation.

When someone thinks that a cylinder can be closed with a case stucked under the ejector star, every other comment about his knowledge on how a revolver works is unnecessary.

Those pics look like neglect and now the OP's going to be trying to pawn it off on Ruger or some new sucker.

I can tolerate everything except someone that is going to doubt my honesty.





Another couple words about the drag line and the cleaning rod question...
I have this gun since April 2008, I fired 2350 rounds. I've probably dry fired it more than 12000 times. I open and close the cylinder an average of two times a day for loading/unloading (it's my bedside gun and I live with the rest of my family, so I don't want to keep it loaded during the day). I don't even know how many times I've opened and closed it for dry fire practice. So you still think that a drag line that you can barely feel with your nail is not normal? Again: what the drag line has to do with the dent near the firing pin hole? Anyway my SP101 is working like day one, it is smooth, tight, the cylinder spins like butter, cylinder opens and closes like butter, so why you are still speaking about it? The issue is the dent.
Again about the cleaning rod: never smacked a cleaning rod against the shield. To produce that dent I need a cleaning rod and a hammer...Don't you think it is simpler that 2350 spent recoiling cases have produced the dent round after round and I've noticed it too late?
Probably it is not that clear on the pics but the dent has a half-circular shape.
IMHO the issue is a connection between the off center firing pin (which is a fact) and a casting defect (which can be debated).

JRWhit
September 29, 2012, 07:38 AM
5-SHOT, It may be the lighting on the picture, but your firing pin seems to be quite a bit smaller in diameter in relation to the hole then what mine is. Could maybe be a wiggle in the firing pin, slamming against the edge when fired? This may make since given the relation of hardness between the firing pin and the hole.Looking at mine the firing pin looks to fit the diameter of the hole quite a bit closer. Out of curiosity, are your primers cratering?


One other thing, there are more than one ring around the firing pin in the picture, the outer most looking centered. Could the off center dimple in the primer be due to clocking misalignment rather than an off center firing pin? Is the cylinder fairly rigid to the frame when the hammer is cocked? After that many rounds a little play could cause it to be off center.

wanderinwalker
September 29, 2012, 07:48 AM
5-SHOTS, I don't have an SP-101 of my own, but that sure does look like something hit just off center on the firing pin hole, like a cleaning rod or similar. Like the others, I can't see how that is possible because a cleaning rod and jag is a lot softer than Ruger's stainless steel.

I've seen my share of pierced rifle primers (Revoliver is going to love me! ;) For the record, don't use brass colored WSR primers in heavy bullet .223 loads...) and your picture does not show what I normally see from gas cutting a bolt face. Normally you get erosion from the center toward the outside of the firing pin hole. Leaking primers will give you a cookie-cutter pattern around the outside of the firing pin hole, again more of a ragged, dimpled pattern. What you have appears to be a nice, relatively clean mark.

And you can color me impressed that even after 3000 rounds your SP barely has an imprint around the firing pin from the primers and caseheads.

(As for Revoliver, try closing a cylinder with just a smudge of FOD under the extractor star. Ain't gonna happen and anybody with half a clue will figure it out something is amiss. I've had this happen on my S&W 19 from unburnt powder flakes and you're not closing anything until you get the minuscule offenders out of there. There is no way you could get a cylinder closed with the case heads under the extractor. 0% chance. 5-SHOTS dragline looks 100% normal IME.)

Another thought for yout 5-SHOTS, do you have some brass handy that you've fired recently? I'd be curious if you have some flow from the primers that may mirror the indent around the firing pin.

5-SHOTS
September 29, 2012, 10:17 AM
First of all, JRWhit and wanderinwalker, thanks for your observations and questions, I’ll try to do my best answering everything.


JRWhit: after the cylinder is opened and holding the release button like the cylinder was closed (I know on S&W revolver is alot simpler to do that trick), I pull the trigger holding it in its rear position, so I can inspect the firing pin which now protrudes from the shield. I can tell you for sure everything is fine and the firing pin fits its hole as it should. At the moment it shows no signs of drag against its hole. Pushed using its rear portion, the firing pin goes forward and returns in its rest position normally. It seems there’s no wiggle but who knows what happens when the hammer falls? Keep in mind that the internal walls of the hole are fine; the dent is slightly to the right of the hole and FOR NOW it hasn’t damaged the hole’s walls. I don’t know if it can be called cratering but the last cases fired are copying the dent now.
The lockup is tight and the timing is perfect. The strikes are off center even when I stage the trigger not only shooting fast DA and that is from day one. As mentioned before, it is clear that the hole in the frame for the firing pin and firing pin housing was cutted slightly off center.


wanderinwalker wrote: “…your picture does not show what I normally see from gas cutting a bolt face. Normally you get erosion from the center toward the outside of the firing pin hole. Leaking primers will give you a cookie-cutter pattern around the outside of the firing pin hole, again more of a ragged, dimpled pattern. What you have appears to be a nice, relatively clean mark.” You are totally right on this: there’s no sign of erosion, it’s a very clean half-circular mark.

“And you can color me impressed that even after 3000 rounds your SP barely has an imprint around the firing pin from the primers and caseheads.” Sorry my friend but I’m not sure I’ve understood your tought. Can you can explain it simpler for me? No irony of any kind here, I’m italian and sometimes I can’t simply understand well all the sense of sentences. Thanks.


Here is a pic of a case fired long time ago from my SP101. You can see how much the firing pin is off center. However the strike is very positive. As you can see there’s no sign of the dent impressed on the primer, like recent spent cases instead show: that proves the issue was recent, was developed slowly and was not previously noticed during normal inspection as I said in my first post.

At the moment I haven’t any of the last cases fired because I left them at the range for reloaders friends, but this is not a problem: next time I’ll fire a couple rounds to show you the differences and to add data for Ruger just in case.

On the other pic, signed in red, there’s the zone where the dent is being impressed on the last cases’ primers, just to explain.

5-SHOTS
September 29, 2012, 11:49 AM
Could maybe be a wiggle in the firing pin, slamming against the edge when fired?

I've cecked again the firing pin using the trick posted above: the wiggle is really neglegible and the fit is tight.



For the record, don't use brass colored WSR primers in heavy bullet .223 loads...)

Probably the last 700/800 rounds I've fired were Fiocchi Top Target 158gr ,both .357 and .38, with a brass colored primer that seems very soft compared to other primers. In your experience could be that the problem (in a smaller scale than a .223 Remington...)?



I've cecked the pin that leaves the scar on the shield: it has NO signs of wear. It is like new (just like the firing pin), so it's clear that some parts are harder than others.

Jaymo
September 29, 2012, 12:38 PM
Judging by the photos of the fired case, it looks like you definitely have an off center firing pin.

JRWhit
September 29, 2012, 06:08 PM
I'm afraid that's all i got. I can speculate but it sounds like the best answer may come from Ruger. May be some sort of chip on the work hardened area around the firing pin. Over time the metal can become more brittle. But that's not officially coming from a metallurgist. Just a basic understanding of metals.

5-SHOTS
September 29, 2012, 06:19 PM
I can speculate but it sounds like the best answer may come from Ruger. May be some sort of chip on the work hardened area around the firing pin.

I'm thinking the same thing. Thanks again for your toughts and considerations.

sgt127
September 29, 2012, 06:44 PM
I personally don't listen to people that can't even take care of their guns, but hey everyone else should. My GP100's been used by the entire family for years now and doesn't have that rut yours has and not one single new revolver I've ever seen has a scratch there. Mine doesn't even have a drag line on the outside of the cylinder from the cylinder stop, but hey, that's because I clean mine... Yet some posters know exactly what it is seeing as how they can so confidently say what it isn't.

I trust guns more than people. Those pics look like neglect and now the OP's going to be trying to pawn it off on Ruger or some new sucker. Hope you get stuck with your creation.

Go ahead and put me in the "people who can't even take care of thier guns" category. As a matter of fact, Its obvious I can't take care of any of my Smiths or Rugers, as, they all have this wear pattern where the hardened steel center pin drags across the relatively soft breechface of the frame.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j277/sgt127/photo-2.jpg

To the OP. I dug out my SP-101 for this picture. There is nothing I can think of that would make a half moon sized dent into the firing pin bushing except the end of a cleaning rod smacking it. EXCEPT, it could have been there since new and, you didn't notice it or, if you look at the firing pin bushing on mine, you can see it kind of peened out. I remember seeing it do that and dropped a solid rod down the bore and tapped it flat again. Perhaps your mushroomed out a bit and had a little casting flaw in it and the surface broke off leaving the void.

Its really a easy fix. That bushing is removeable by the factory. Ruger will tap it out, replace it and, the gun should be good for another 10,000 rounds or so.

HighRoadRover
September 30, 2012, 12:45 AM
Do you use snapcaps when you dryfire?

I'm just wondering if a rebounding :) portion of a snapcap could make that indent - if hit by the firing pin 12000 times (mentioned as the number of times you have dry fired).

I suppose it might could (maybe?) be from primers (although it looks too small).

To answer the original question, I doubt it would affect function anytime soon, but a trip back to Ruger would settle the question and probably garner you a new firing pin, too.

460Kodiak
October 1, 2012, 12:15 PM
When someone thinks that a cylinder can be closed with a case stucked under the ejector star, every other comment about his knowledge on how a revolver works is unnecessary.


I want a t-shirt made that says this........ my thoughts exactly.

I took a look at my 101 and everything looks identical to your, except that dent by the firing pin. I'll be interested to hear what Ruger says would be the likely cause.

Go ahead and put me in the "people who can't even take care of thier guns" category.

Me too. All my revolvers have the same marks as yours. Why? Because they get used and shot. It's 100% normal.

VA27
October 1, 2012, 06:40 PM
I see the dent in the firing pin bushing. I have no idea as to the cause. It seems that it does not affect the function of the gun. I know that Ruger will make it right if you send it in. If the gun were mine, I would shoot it until it stops working and then send it to Ruger for repair.

I see that the firing pin strikes the primer slightly off center. I understand that it fires properly every time. That tells me that this is something not worth worrying about, and is in fact so common in my experience as to be not worth mentioning, ditto for the drag line on the recoil shield.

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