Glock 17 Gen 4...problems still?


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defjon
October 2, 2012, 11:26 AM
A buddy of mine is looking at a gen 4 for sale, the price is pretty good...but I remember hearign scuttlebut that there were some issues with the gen 4s. Heard Glock had incorporated a MIM process ,a new recoil system etc- tried ot standardize on all models, and was having a lot of problems with FTF FTE.

As a newbie, I was pointing him towards the G17 as something very simple to operate and likely to work if needed...but would I be wrong to advocate that if he's looking at a gen4?

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ku4hx
October 2, 2012, 04:47 PM
Approaching 4,000 rounds through my Gen4 19 and have experienced zero problems. Somewhere around 2,500 rounds (give or take a few hundred) I replaced the 336 ejector with the newer 30274. No particular reason, it was cheap at about $8, I wanted a spare and may as well do the upgrade.

Once in a row does not constitute a trend, but my Gen4 19 is everything I expected from a Glock.

SIGLBER
October 3, 2012, 11:52 AM
The guns are still having problems. I see it evertday at my range. After several trips back to Glock and 3 (yes 3) replacement guns I got an M&P9c and have never looked back.

eam3clm@att.net
October 3, 2012, 01:30 PM
I picked up a blue label G17 about four months ago with a test fire date of 06/23/12. I cant say if it has the gen 4 issues, but in the five rounds I ran through it were Indeed perfect.

TAKtical
October 3, 2012, 01:33 PM
Just buy a gen 3. I dont know why glock wanted to mess with "perfection", but it didnt work out so well.

mdauben
October 3, 2012, 02:00 PM
Just buy a gen 3. I dont know why glock wanted to mess with "perfection", but it didnt work out so well.

My understanding was that the current production Gen3 guns started using the same problematic MIM parts as the Gen4 guns a while ago. Can anyone confirm or refute this?

stumpers
October 3, 2012, 02:21 PM
Newer Gen3 guns have the same MIM extractor and 336 ejector that are a problem with the Gen4 guns.

Last year I bought a Glock 19, a newer Gen3, in the RXT serial range that had the 336 ejector. UMC, WWB ejected shells struck me in the forehead constantly - as many as 15 out of 15 sometimes. I replaced the extractor with a Lone Wolf which didn't fix the problem. When I replaced the ejector with the 30274, everything has been great.

I think Glock changed the extractor without changing the ejector on the Gen4 and newer Gen3 guns. At $8 + shipping, I would try that fix. The ejector easily slides out of the trigger housing and can be inserted into the original trigger housing on the pistol.

This week I just bought another G19 in the SYG serial range and it has the same MIM extractor and 336 ejector common to the newer Gen3 guns. I'm going to run a few rounds through it with the 336 and see how ejection is. I have a 30274 ready to drop in, but I want to see for curiosity's sake how the 336 is in this pistol.

And for what it may be worth, the G19 I bought in 2005 in the F-serial range has been rock solid and perfect with around 10,000 rounds.

I have never had a failure of any kind with any Glock, just erratic ejection (at my forehead).

WinThePennant
October 3, 2012, 10:50 PM
Glock screwed up with the initial release of the Gen 4. Now, they run as good as any Glock.

Of course, no one is perfect, and Glock makes the occasional lemon.

Inebriated
October 4, 2012, 12:13 AM
Glock fixed the issues a year or so ago...

3000 rounds through my Gen 4 26 and about 2500 through my Gen 4 21, and zero malfunctions or brass to the face.

Just buy a gen 3. I dont know why glock wanted to mess with "perfection", but it didnt work out so well.

Many of the Gen 3's at the time had the exact same issues as the Gen 4's. Also, I don't know about your idea of "perfection", but a God-awful grip texture, grip shape, and mag release are hardly my idea. The Gen 4's changed a lot of what people disliked about them.

TAKtical
October 4, 2012, 12:22 AM
I was joking about the glock slogan.

coolluke01
October 4, 2012, 12:30 AM
I've had 3 Gen 4 Glocks in the last two years. I traded a Gen 4 17 for the Gen 4 34 that I have now. I also have a Gen 4 26. No problems with the exception of the replaced ejector on the G26. The 17 had the old style and I never had any problems with it, but I replaced it anyway.

The Gen 4 is better than the Gen 3 in many ways. Dual recoil springs have a longer life and help reduce recoil slightly. The texture is great! Backstraps are a fantastic improvement. The oversized mag release are great for competition.

Go Gen 4 without any worry. Any one that says they are "Still having problems" either doesn't know what they are talking about or are regurgitating old internet info. Read the dates on anything you read on the internet.

TAKtical
October 4, 2012, 12:36 AM
Well the sad truth is that gunshops are still selling those early gen 4's so you have to be careful with your purchases. My buddy bought a gen 4 17 last month and had to replace the guide rod and ejector.

Inebriated
October 4, 2012, 12:39 AM
I was joking about the glock slogan.

Figured... but the fact remains that the Gen 4 did fix a lot of what people hated about the previous generations.

Well the sad truth is that gunshops are still selling those early gen 4's so you have to be careful with your purchases. My buddy bought a gen 4 17 last month and had to replace the guide rod and ejector.
True. I asked about when they received the model for both of my Gen 4's. Definitely something to look out for.

coolluke01
October 4, 2012, 12:40 AM
I highly doubt there are much of them left that are new. I can see that people may have traded or sold them without the most current parts.

Glock will replace any "old" components for no charge.

If you have any questions call them and they take care of it for you. You will have to send in the gun if you don't have a Glock armorer near you.

Glock 1-770-432-1202

Inebriated
October 4, 2012, 12:43 AM
Glock will replace any "old" components for no charge.

This is often overlooked in these discussions.

Sid Nitzerglobin
October 30, 2012, 03:05 AM
Well the sad truth is that gunshops are still selling those early gen 4's so you have to be careful with your purchases. My buddy bought a gen 4 17 last month and had to replace the guide rod and ejector.
Unfortunately I just picked up one of those old stock NIB G17 Gen 4s from a local shop yesterday as my first handgun. I had read about the ejection issues when researching prior to purchasing but unfortunately never came across the specific part numbers or test fire dates to check for. Test fire date was 9/12/2011 and it looks like I've got the 336 ejector, 2912 extractor, and 042 recoil spring.

After successfully reining in my urge to spend $900 for the P30 v3, I was debating whether to go for the Gen 3 for a good 5-10 minutes given the issues I had read about but the ergonomics seemed a lot better for me on the Gen 4 and the sales guys said not to worry about the issues as they were all fixed.

Ran 100 rounds of Federal 115 grain through it on Sunday and had 3 FTFs, 5 FTEs, and ~ 1 in 4 casings smacking me in the forehead w/ none of the ejections any more to the side than say 5 o'clock. 200 rounds of Winchester 115 grain tonight and I had 2 FTFs, at least one FTE per clip, and I lost count of the casings bouncing off of my glasses, forehead and face. At least I'm gaining confidence in dealing w/ misfeeds/jams :)

I talked to the gunsmith types at the shop/range and they keep saying limp wristing is the cause of the issue. I could buy this being the case seeing as I have next to no idea what I'm doing techinque wise at this point aside from the fact that I put 500 rounds total through relatively beat up P30, G17 Gen 3, XDM, USP 9, and USP .40 rentals over the course of the weekend trying to decide what I wanted to purchase and never had one failure or casing hit me.

Anyways, thanks to everyone who posted here previously as I now have a complete list of parts to ask for when I call Glock tomorrow. Hope this takes care of it or I'm going to be kicking myself for not ponying up the extra cash for the P30 (or trying harder to find a PPQ to shoot before I made the decision)...

DPris
October 30, 2012, 04:02 AM
Much traffic on Glocktalk about reliability problems and the brass-to-the-face ejection on current Gen 4s after about 800-1000 rounds.
They're trying all sorts of mixes & matches among parts, without much success.
Some report guns sent back to Glock returned un-fixed or replaced entirely.

For a Glock-fan-based forum, many are pretty disgusted.
Denis

Sapper771
October 30, 2012, 10:56 AM
I purchased a Gen4 G19 a few weeks ago. It has all of the "upgraded" parts in it. When loaded with standard pressure ammo, it is reliable and ejection is very consistent. I say standard pressure because my Gen4 G19 doesnt like some of the powder puff loads I have loaded specifically for my Gen3 G19.

My Gen3 G17 and G19 did not show any ejection issues until after I got some rounds through them. Reliability was good, but ejection was awful. There was no pattern. Occasionally I caught a piece of brass to the face and head. It didnt really bother me at first. Then one day I was shooting my G19 and caught a piece of hot brass to the face and got burnt. Nothing serious, but it pissed me off.

I called Glock and spoke with CS Rep. "Dan". I didnt get any help from him. So I decided to fix it myself. I ordered several ejectors and two extractors. Next time I went to the range, I started swaping the extractors and the ejectors around til I found a suitable match that worked in my G19. No more brass to the face.

DPris
October 30, 2012, 01:34 PM
Most reports state the ejection to the face issue doesn't begin till several hundred rounds are fired through a new pistol, so a new one running fine out of the box won't tell you anything.

Based on all those posts & reports, I cancelled a new Gen 4 17 order & switched to the S&W M&P that I picked up yesterday.
I haven't given up on new Glocks entirely (and my older 17s work fine), it's just a wait & see on the Gen 4s for now.

One of the great things you used to be able to count on with a Glock is that you could buy one, take it outa the box, and shoot it till your arm dropped off exactly as it came.
I personally am not sufficiently committed to the brand to go through a bunch of parts swapping to get a new one to function correctly a thousand rounds down the road. :)

Jury's still out on the Gen 4s.
Hopefully Glock will get it all straightened out, but for now just make an informed buy if you spring for a new one.
Denis

Sapper771
October 30, 2012, 02:50 PM
I personally am not sufficiently committed to the brand to go through a bunch of parts swapping to get a new one to function correctly a thousand rounds down the road. :)


Thats understandable. I was not happy about it either. Then I remembered all the tweaking and tinkering I had to do in the past to get a 1911 running. I realized my Glock issues were not so severe. $50 worth of parts is a small investment, especially when I did not have to send my pistol away for an "X" amount of time or rely on the services of a Gunsmith.

DPris
October 30, 2012, 03:04 PM
In my case, I'll cheerfully sink another $1500 on top of the purchase price into a good 1911 (and have) (more than once). That's not to go fancy, just to improve efficiency & reliability in my hand.
But, not a plastic gun.

Two of the greatest selling points for Glocks, again for ME, was reliability out of the box & low price.
I've carried 'em in uniform & carried 'em privately, and have no reservations about any of the seven Glocks I own.
But- I'm simply not willing to go beyond a sight replacement & possibly a grip reduction on a new one.
Used to be tritiums & a Glock sock would get you by, and I'm simply not gonna play around with a Glock chasing parts down to install reliability that used to come with the base purchase price. :)
AND, risking failure at the end.

My 1988 Gen 1 has malfunctioned exactly once in all the years I've had it. Originally an issued pistol, it retired with me when I did. I could have left it behind, but it worked then & still does, and it was followed over the years by a Gen 2 police trade-in and three Gen 3 new 17s. Woulda been followed by a Gen 4, but... :)

In no way am I saying don't buy one, just advising of the Glocktalk comments & adding my own feelings on the matter.
Denis

Nebuchadnezzar
October 30, 2012, 03:16 PM
My new 3rd and 4th gen G19s have run several hundred rounds each flawlessly. If I had to give up one it would be a hard call.

But, by all means listen to the friends cousins dog internet hearsay if you wish. I have owned over a dozen Glocks and none have had an issue of any kind, going through many thousands of rounds.

DPris
October 30, 2012, 03:48 PM
My older Glocks have given me no problems, aside from that one single incident.

When dedicated Glock fans on a dedicated Glock forum raise issues regarding new ones, yes- I will listen.

After you have a thousand rounds through your new Gen 4 Glock, come back & I'll listen to you, too.
Nobody, including me, has said they're all bad. Just enough of 'em to be wary of.
Denis

WinThePennant
October 30, 2012, 04:41 PM
Well, of the millions and millions of guns that Glock sells, it should be no surprise that you're going to hear about ejector issues. Especially since Glock did screw up with the Gen 4 release.

The upside is that if it does take a new part, then the cost is minimal. Around $7 for a new ejector with the trigger mechanism housing. Maybe $20 for a new extractor.

Bozwell
October 30, 2012, 04:52 PM
My Gen 3 G34 (purchased NIB 2-3 months ago) was kicking brass into my face, on top of my head, on my arms, basically all over me. I replaced the extractor with a Lone Wolf extractor and I pulled the ejector out of a Gen 4 housing and installed that. I ran 100 rounds through it this weekend (pretty weak loaded WWB) and it at least kicks brass 2-3 feet to my right now. I'm used to CZ's spitting it 6-8 feet away, but I'll take 2-3 feet over spitting it in my face any day.

A bit silly to have to fix this on a new gun that's renowned for its reliability, but it is what it is. I probably could have called them, sent it off, and had Glock take a look at it, but that's a) a hassle and b) I'd already installed some aftermarket parts (new trigger and extended controls) and I didn't want to deal with any potential pushback related to those parts. I can't say the G34 is my favorite gun, nor do I shoot it as well as some of my tuned CZ's, but I do like it.

WinThePennant
October 30, 2012, 05:08 PM
By the way, a lot of people have had good results with Lone Wolf's ejector.

For the 9mm, part # is: LWD-1895.

Bozwell
October 30, 2012, 05:39 PM
If you mean the LW extractor, mine seems to be working fine. I plan to run a bit more ammo through it over the next few weeks and test it, but it already felt better (i.e., spent casings weren't hitting me in the face every 3 or 4 shots).

WinThePennant
October 30, 2012, 06:09 PM
Whoops. Yes, I meant extractor.

9mmepiphany
October 30, 2012, 07:40 PM
It is a combination of issues that is causing BTF and it became more sever when Glock changed the geometry of the extractor hook to improve feeding and the angle of the ejector.

A side issue that arose from the uncontrolled cases during extraction was that they were hitting the side of the ejection port. It had always been a bit high, but it wasn't such a large issue prior to the extractor losing control of the case during extraction.

The fix isn't complicated for a company the size of Glock, but there has to be a willingness to first admit their fault and to decide that the number of complaints justify spending the money to modify the parts

On the other hand: I'm very happy with my Gen2 G19 with a serial number that starts with MD (that is old)

gym
November 1, 2012, 07:04 PM
When asking a dealer who sells a lot of glocks, why he didn't have more with night sights, he responded, "people have a price in their head with Glocks" , if have to charge them another 100 for the sights and $25.00 to install them, they will usually not want them, you went from a 500 to a 625 dollar gun, and that 22% hike will turn them off. If he continues I was selling them a $1000.00 pistol, it would make very little difference.
Fact is folks have price points, in their heads, and a dealer and I said at the same time , this passed weekend, "it doesn't matter what I put in it, it doesn't change what your going to pay me for it. Just because I spent a day of my time polishing parts and changed a trigger shortened up the pull and removed the slop, two dealers would not even take a look at the gun once they found out they were modified.
The guy who had 1911's was trying to convince me that every 1911 he buys must be restored to it's original mim parts, or his liability insurance won't cover him.
So all those wilson beavertails triggers hammers and springs, you are tearing out I asked?, yep he said I have to. I quicklly walked away and sold the gun 10 feet away for more money. There is no end to the garbage you will hear at a gun show.
The good thing with Glocks is you can return them to stock pretty fast, unless you started cutting things off. After 6 of them I never touch them other than to put a front NS on, and a plug in the hole in the grip. They really don't require any custom work, same with M&P's.

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