Light loads in 10mm


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franke1951
October 2, 2012, 03:39 PM
Has anyone had any problems with light loads of Power Pistol, . Berry's plated 10mm, 135 gr

I loaded up about 25 Starline 10 mm brass with .5cc, Lee dipper, leveled off at about 7.0 gr of Alliant Power Pistol and Berrys 135 gr platedl.

While testing them at the range, I noticed extreme recoil with 3 or 4 loads. I always check for double charges while loading.

it felt like a detonation of the whole charge of power pistol at once in my Glk 20. ( similar to full power 180 gr loads). Scared the heck out of me

When shooting them in my 1911, I raised the gun up and shook it to let the powder rest on the primer opening. No problems with these loads in my 1911

Any thoughts? I later noted that PP is not listed in the Alliant reloaders mauual until you get up to about 165 gr. loads.


Normally I use WW-231 in my target loads (and Unigue) for 10mm and .45 acp. Never had this happen before.

In one of the burn rate charts, it shows that Power Pistol is very close to Unique.

Think I will save the PP for 180gr, Rem. hollowpoints pushing 1100 - 1200 fps.

Any comments. I'm an old reloader, and was careless this time for assuming something before verifying it with data manuals.

Will not use power pistol in anything under a 155 gr moly flat nose.

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JRWhit
October 2, 2012, 03:41 PM
3 or 4 out of how many? What kind of crimp?
Make sure and check for set back.

franke1951
October 2, 2012, 03:55 PM
First used a light crimp with Lee FCD, then run them through a Lee taper crimp.

franke1951
October 2, 2012, 03:57 PM
I had about 25 loaded up and never saw any set backs. They wouldn't cycle the slide on my 1911.


.

JRWhit
October 2, 2012, 04:03 PM
I'd wonder if you had a couple of longer pieces of brass, possibly crimped harder.
To be honest if your and old loader you'd probably have a better idea than me.
I've always heard you have to be more careful with setback on the 10mm. could have also maybe had a couple of shorter pieces of brass that the crimper didn't reach, resulting in significant setback when hitting the feed ramp. Maybe.

rsrocket1
October 2, 2012, 04:24 PM
Power Pistol is a terrible powder to use in reduced loads. It is a slower powder than Unique and burns even less completely than Unique even at full power loads. I use about 7g with a 180g LTC bullet in my 40 and it packs a wallop (about 1060 fps).

You should use a much faster powder if you are trying to get reduced recoil. Somewhere around 3-3.5 grains of Red Dot or Clays will expand the case to seal off the gasses and still be enough to ensure the bullet will exit the barrel. I've used as low as 2.5g Clays with the 180g 40 bullets and they shoot great at about 700 fps. I've run as low as 2.5g Red Dot and got down to 670 fps, but about 10% will not cycle the gun.

franke1951
October 2, 2012, 04:38 PM
I agree with you.

I really think that using PP in a reduced load and light bullet caused a complete detonation of the 3 rounds out of the 25 that I loaded, as, I think that the powder was scattered along the bottom of the long 10mm case and having a light 135gr plated bullet, however I did use a med-hvy factory and taper crimp. I have heard about bullseye doing this. And everyone knows not to use light loads of WW-296 or H110


I normally use WW 231 exclusively when loading light loads.

rsrocket1
October 2, 2012, 11:43 PM
I don't think it is detonation, but it could be a double peak in pressure. That's where the primer pushes the bullet into the rifling but doesn't set off enough of the powder to build up pressure quick enough. By the time the powder gets going, the bullet is lodged in the rifling and the pressure goes way up. You get a more complete burn because of the high pressure and a higher velocity/more recoil, but without a tranducer, you have no idea of what pressures your gun experienced. reference: look about 1/2 way down this very good article under the heading of "too much primer" (http://www.shootingtimes.com/2011/01/04/ammunition_st_mamotaip_200909/). It is not exactly your case, but the primer pushing the bullet into the rifling before the powder going off is the same phenomenon.

You are right about 231 being a better powder for lighter loads.

Josh45
October 3, 2012, 08:51 PM
I loaded up about 25 Starline 10 mm brass with .5cc, Lee dipper, leveled off at about 7.0 gr of Alliant Power Pistol and Berrys 135 gr platedl.

I hate to be the one to ask, But did you weigh these charges with a reliable scale?

While testing them at the range, I noticed extreme recoil with 3 or 4 loads. I always check for double charges while loading.

it felt like a detonation of the whole charge of power pistol at once in my Glk 20. ( similar to full power 180 gr loads). Scared the heck out of me

This is the main reason I am asking about the scale thing, Also did you use a manual in regards to this load seeing as you said you didnt notice any load data for it on the Alliant Website?

As for your 1911 having no issue with the recoil, I dont believe that the weight is enough to off set the recoil but I do know that each gun has its different taste...

JLDickmon
October 3, 2012, 09:31 PM
I think you might be so light, you are getting screwy ignition.
I don't think you have nearly enough load density (powder in the case) to be reliable.

Alliant does not list data for a 135 for 10mm.
I think you need to look more at Hodgdon TiteGroup or Winchester AutoComp

PowerPistol is a middle/slow powder.. like Unique or Universal Clays or HS-6. And I think way to slow for the charges you're using..
which you should be weighing, anyway.

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