7.62x38r nagant


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targetback
October 7, 2012, 09:07 PM
Info needed on reloading . I have dies lee 32-20. What kind of brass bullet? ect

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kingcheese
October 7, 2012, 09:45 PM
32-20, starline brass tends to be,best, and 308 pistol slugs, i like lead because the jacketed bullets tend to bind up the brass, small pistol primers

jdgreen
October 8, 2012, 10:07 PM
I use that Lee die set and Starline 32-20 brass. I've tried these cast bullets:

.32 cal .313 76gr FP) from Hunter's Supply
.32 cal .313 115gr FP from Hunter's Supply
.32 cal .313 95gr FN from Cast Performance Bullet Co.
.32 cal .313 100gr RNFP from Suter's Choice Bullets

All of these worked pretty well. I'm sure anything remotely close will be fine. I've never tried a jacketed bullet. I suppose if I run across some of them sometime I probably will. I somewhat standardized on the 100gr Suter's Choice just because a guy carries them at the gun shows near me. I've tried (what seems to me) like a lot of power charge/bullet combinations before making this one my "regular":

I use 3.5 or 3.6 grains Trail Boss powder and seat the 100gr Suter's Choice bullet to 1.515 OAL. I give it a slight roll crimp in a separate operation after seating the bullet. That is, I back the crimping part of the die way out when seating the bullets, then after that I back the bullet seating part way out then apply the crimp. I think this method works better than the single operation (for this cartridge, anyway).

Here's where I ran into a snag. Initial loading of new 32-20 brass worked great because those cases are slightly necked-down. After firing them, however, they expand to a straight wall. I had problems with the case being unable to hold the bullet, even with a huge crimp. Another reloader whom I was reading at the time said to use a .30 carbine sizing die on them. So I bought one and use it to size the cases after the initial full-length sizing operation. That gave enough neck tension to hold the bullets firmly.

So, in summary, here's the process:

1. Decap & full-length size. The Lee Nagant Revolver Die set are not carbide, so you must use case lube.
2. Size with the .30 carbine die.
3. Prime
4. Flare the case mouth slightly
5. Powder charge
6. Seat bullet of choice
7. Slight roll crimp

I've never fired mil-surp ammo in my Nagant until recently. My hand loads are not quite as hot as the mil-surp, so I think I could probably go hotter than 3.6gr, but I've not tried it.

I got a lot of info from the Nagant Man on youtube. Watch these videos if you haven't already.

I've made and shot wax bullets and shotshells for this revolver.

This should get you started. The Nagant is fun to shoot and remarkably accurate (in single action). Whenever I'm at the range and trigger pull is mentioned, I bring 'er out :)

RandyP
October 8, 2012, 11:38 PM
I use a combination of the Midway Lee Nagant set and the 32-20 set - using .312 Berry's plated bullets, Win231 powder. OAL about 1.5".till shorter than a factory Nagant round, but it chambers fine.

For new brass one sizing die was fine but once fired I needed to switch to the other die to get any bullet retention. Various dies will work to get enough neck tension on the case.

Lots of good info at the Nagant forum:


http://forums.gunboards.com/forumdisplay.php?18-M1895-NAGANT-Pistol-Collector-Forum

targetback
October 9, 2012, 12:07 AM
I will get some 32-20 brass but I have some bullets that are reg Nagant will they work our do I have to get nagant brass? Thanks .

kingcheese
October 9, 2012, 07:04 AM
True nagant brass is not reloadable, and making ammo from 32-20 brass does not get you the true gas seal, I've shot around 50 handloads, 200 privi, and 100 Russian milsurp, and none of it is reloadable unless you use a 30 carbine die on the 32-20(at least not safely, the original brass was punched through the side to get a good solid crimp-like effect because the bullet set completely in the brass

RandyP
October 9, 2012, 09:02 AM
There certainly are reloaders using Nagant brass quite effectively. Surplus Nagant that is Berdan primed (two holes) of course make reloading that impractical, but modern Ngant like PRVI and HotShot are quite reloadable and thus retain the unique gas-seal feature that is lost using 32-20 or other brass.

Pete D.
October 9, 2012, 11:36 AM
You can make Nagant brass from .223 Rem. cases. You really have to want to do it as it is labor intense.
http://i492.photobucket.com/albums/rr287/PeteDoyle/Nagantbrass.jpg
The proper bullet is a TMJ DEWC of 98 grains at .308" dia.
Grafs Reloading has them. http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/5400

Pete

Cosmoline
October 9, 2012, 02:09 PM
True nagant brass is not reloadable,

The boxer primed Fiocchi is absolutely reloadable. I've done it with the Lee dies, though it's not easy and you have to rig some things differently. You drive the bullet deep into the case and roll-crimp the case mouth over to replicate the original round. It works, but I don't think it's worth the difficulty. One issue I never really resolved was how slight variations in the mouth dimensions could lead to jam-ups after the brass forms the seal. I believe the mouth as expanded in firing needs to be trimmed just right or it will protrude too far and cause a minor jam.

runes
October 9, 2012, 04:03 PM
I'm With Pete D.
I use .223 brass and size in .30 carbine die. This leaves a "belt" near the groove that I take off in a small lathe.
This actually leaves a rim.
I don't leave the brass long enough to gas seal so Lots of blast around the cylinder but who cares, I only shoot for fun.
I couldn't figure out how to crimp the case if I used full length shells.

kingcheese
October 9, 2012, 08:51 PM
Fiochi and privi are not true nagant rounds, they are made to work ok in the revolver but they don't give you the same seal the stuff from the 40s does

RandyP
October 10, 2012, 07:50 AM
I am holding a surplus and a PRVI in my hand - the OAL and case mouth ODs are virtually identical. I am of the belief that yes the newly manufactured will create the same gas seal as the surplus. The PRVI does have a different shape in the case reduction but it would not affect its ability to gas seal.

Cosmoline
October 10, 2012, 01:21 PM
Yeah that's news to me too. The crimps can be different, but the brass on the Fiocchi certainly seems to make the seal as well as the CCCP stuff.

The modern rounds do tend to be underpowered, though.

kingcheese
October 10, 2012, 09:15 PM
The original ammo isn't crimped as much over the top, and the bullet is a tad heavier creating a better seal, I've shot handloads, privi and surplus, 32-20 isn't long enough to seal, and privi doesn't make as good of a seal as the original, and privi looks nothing like the original

targetback
October 11, 2012, 03:18 AM
OK Thanks so far . I load for a 327 Fed has anyone used this brass or is that not a workable brass.? Target

targetback
October 12, 2012, 10:12 AM
I fired the revolver . That went well I used factory ammo at 12 yards about a 4" group. just to give it a try I had some fired 327 brass tryed to to put one in the cylender . It did not fit. then sized with the lee Nagant die and it fit . I might see what I can work out there also review the INFO and make a list and see what I can find at the GUN show Saturday.I was satisfied how the revolver worked overall.Some fun with this one . target DO NOT USE 327FED FACTORY AMMO IN THIS REVOLVER.

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