inexpensive s.s. nipples for Pietta revolvers


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unknwn
October 21, 2012, 10:30 PM
While putting together an order at Buffalo Arms for a rotary wad cutter ( http://www.buffaloarms.com/wad_punches_pr-3756.aspx ) I came across an item on thier site that was previously unknown to me.
A company called Rydon (They also mark thier packaging RMC) are marketing stainless steel nipples to fit Pietta revolvers that will allow the use of #11 caps.
The most interesting thing about this product is the price, less than $15.00 per 6 pieces !
Do anyone out there have any experience with these nipples? And, would you know anything more about the actual manufacturer?
http://www.buffaloarms.com/Detail.aspx?PROD=714717

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mykeal
October 21, 2012, 10:45 PM
I've never heard of the nipples but I know from personal experience that Rydon makes the hardest (and thus best) one piece revolver nipple wrench I've ever used.

arcticap
October 21, 2012, 10:58 PM
Those nipples are a good find.
Rydon Corporation owns RMC Sports Outlet and also Ox-Yoke Originals which includes shooting patches, wool wads and Wonder Lube which is like TC Bore Butter.
They're a reputable Pennsylvania company and their nipples should be worth trying out.
Buffalo Arms seems to be selling them for the lowest price.

http://www.rmcsports.com/catalog.htm

http://www.rmcsports.com/

http://www.rmcoxyoke.com/

Lunie
October 22, 2012, 12:37 PM
Nice find. Let us know how you like 'em if you get some.

Hellgate
October 22, 2012, 04:14 PM
rmcsports has them for $25.99 (does not specify if stainless) but rmcoxyoke says $15.99 for stainless. I have used several sets of Uncle Mikes/butler Creek SS replacement nipples and they work great for Remington #10 caps. If these are the same, it's a good deal.

Jaymo
October 22, 2012, 06:50 PM
I only need 4 sets of them. One for each of my 2 Pietta Rem New Army .44s, and one for each of my Pietta 51 Navy "Colts".

This hobby is seriously eating into the money I'm trying to save for a Ruger SR9.
Blasphemy, I know. But, hey, this self contained cartridge thing could actually take off. :D

hhb
October 22, 2012, 06:51 PM
Dixie Gunworks, Union City, Tn.

1KPerDay
October 22, 2012, 06:59 PM
What's wrong with the OEM pietta nipples?

Jim, West PA
October 22, 2012, 07:25 PM
But, hey, this self contained cartridge thing could actually take off.

Man, i hope yer wrong there Jaymo.That would certainly ruin the neighborhood.:rolleyes:

unknwn
October 22, 2012, 07:35 PM
The OEM nipples don't work with #11 caps, and since my ROAs use 11s, I'd like to keep the caps needs all the same.
Most stainless steel nipples are harder than the OEM carbon steel nipples also.
And I can also hope that they incorporate some of the desirable characteristics (smaller flash holes) that some of the other aftermarket manufacturers use on thier products.
We'll see when I get some. The supply at the Buffalo Arms dried up before I could submit my completed order.

Pancho
October 23, 2012, 09:49 AM
I've made it a habit to call a company, if I can, to ask questions before I buy online.
Questions like:
Is the flash hole smaller than OEM?
Who makes them?
What cap/manufacturer do they design to.
It's worth a try TOW was able to tell me that their SS nipples have a smaller flash hole,
they make them in-house, and they designed their's to the CCI #11.
I'm a happy man.

KSUJedi
November 4, 2012, 04:05 PM
Well, I took the plunge and bought two sets from rmcoxyoke.com, was hoping that for less than the price of one set of either TOW or slixshot, I'd be able to get working replacements for my 2 Cabelas "stainless" Marshall "1851's" I'm wanting to get set up reliably for CAS.

Unfortunately, looks like I'm going to be trying to return these, bite the bullet, and get some more expensive nipples with more proven track records.

The nipples are nicely made, good threads, and I think a quality product, however the actual cone that the cap goes on, seems to be almost too true to its inspiration, and appear to be almost exactly the same as OEM. Ie the same problems I'm having with the OEM, namely the caps not fitting snugly and coming off under recoil, would not be remedied by these nipples. Tried Remington #10's and 11's, and CCI #11's, and all where quite loose on the nipples.

Only difference dimensionally I could find between these and OEM, seems to be that the "waist" of the nipple where a nipple wrench torques on, seems to be a little thicker, making these a little longer than OEM. Installed in the cylinder, naked eye can tell there's a difference, with these sticking up slightly more, however didn't take calipers to them.

Oh, and the flash holes appear to be the same size as OEM.

Guess it was worth a try, and at least I could be a guinea pig for posterity.

Pancho
November 4, 2012, 11:27 PM
My latest nipple experience is with a Uberti 62 Colt Police and it is a fussy gun to shoot because of the small frame and is prone to jam due to cap crap. Like you I found the OEM nipples to be too large for #10's and too small for #11's.
It is a pet peeve of mine that aftermarket makers would think that offering a SS nipple with the same dimensions of the OEM is sufficient.
Just the fact that TOW could tell me that their nipples were designed to be used with CCI #11 caps convinced me to try them and TOW was right the CCI caps fit snug but can be seated with finger pressure. After firing the caps split but don't shatter which is a vast improvement over the OEM. Small fragments get into small places that can end the shooting session. To try and improve the TOW nipples even further I had a set of them vented like the Slix Shot nipples but to date have not had the time to try them. The object is to keep the cap whole and still on the nipple after firing. We'll see

Hellgate
November 4, 2012, 11:31 PM
Jedi,
Sorry to hear the SS nips from Oxyoke didn't work out. I have bought Uncle Mikes/Butler Creek SS replacement nipples and I believe some from TOW. All accepted Rem#10s. Some needed shimming out a bit to reach the hammer face. All had smaller flash holes.

Friends of mine developed the Slix shot nipples and every time I shoot with them and have a misfire they razz me and give me a "shudd-a got a set of SlixShots!" My problem is with a bad case of old caps that go POP but no BOOM. Their nipples are good however.

arcticap
November 5, 2012, 12:34 AM
I feel bad about them not working out for you.
CCI #10's are said to have the tightest fit but it's hard to be optimistic after that report.
Smokin'Joe and Mike 56 describe how to resize loose caps in the following posts:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=7814928&postcount=22

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=8035800&postcount=67

unknwn
November 5, 2012, 12:08 PM
Well since I'm the one who brought this whole thing up in the first place let me tell my tale of " more woe with caps and nipples -I shoulda' bought the xxxx" .
Thinking that I would save shipping costs, and since I had many Piettas to outfit, I purchased a half dozen of the RMC stainless nipples (this was before the reports on them showed up here).
Well, as you now know, the nipples won't fit Remington #11s, and I had some CCI #11s -no go with them either-.
So far as #11s are concerned I tried some RWS1075 (pricey!!) caps also.
Since none of the above would stay on the cones AT ALL , I then got ahold of some Remington #10 caps along with yet another package of Rem.11s (new lot) and found that these nipples just won't work with any caps that were readily available to me.
When I called up the manufacturer? to discuss the problem the customer service guy at the RMC/OxYoke co. told me that the caps were developed to fit #10 caps. When I told him about how they were being marketed by thier associated e-tailers he repeated "they are made to fit #10 caps" .
Then I explained that none of the caps I tried would work, -EVEN Remington #10s- they all just fell right off, again he repeated, "they are made to fit #10 caps".
So, before I wrapped them up for return I made the additional effort last weekend to find an LGS (about 30 miles away) that had CCI #10 caps (from everything I have read the SMALLEST cap available anywhere) so that I could (hopefully) still use the otherwise quite nicely made stainless steel nipples by just shopping for those particular caps.
Well, the CCI #10 caps wouldn't stay on the nipples either. Again, they just fall right off. The nipples are simply undersize and will not work without deforming the caps ( bad juju ), so they are going back for refund.
So what I really hoped would help solve the nipple/cap sizing problem with something in the less than $35.00 per gun area has been a total bust.
Besides the hassle of returning goods that can't perform as described, I've got the expense of the CCI #10s, gas both ways to get them, and losing a few hours of time that I would have rather spent -EVEN CLEANING- my BP revolvers.
Now why is it do you think the company that is making and packaging those nipples couldn't check to see if they would fit ANY of the caps available anywhere?

Will the Track of the Wolf stainless steel (or even thier ampco) nipples work on my (all late model) Pietta revolvers using whomever's #11 -or-#10 caps ?Or can I look forward to spending twice as much per set as that last fiasco while still leaving me to scratch my @$$ and return more nipples?
I've got a all encompassing collection of currently marketed percussion caps now. It looks like I might as well give up finding any replacements that aren't overly expensive, and concentrate on a reliable source for nipples that are just made right.
I apologize for the overly long (yet another) nipple rant, but I thought maybe I owed it to you all since I seem to have found the product in question to begin with.

arcticap
November 5, 2012, 12:57 PM
If an after market nipple maker is going to make ill fitting nipple cones, then I would rather see them made to be over size instead of under size.
That way the individual nipples could be adjusted to fit the cap of choice instead of needing to be squeezed into ovals in order to fit.
And some folks probably wouldn't mind adjusting each nipple cone individually if they were able to buy them at a bargain price.
Just being able to adjust them for a custom fit by doing it yourself could be a welcome selling point.

unknwn
November 5, 2012, 01:37 PM
Articap, I'm with you all the way. Making an arbor to thread the offending cones onto and spin them to size on my lathe would be much preferable to the "can't get no joy at all" that occurred like these latest rendition of "Pietta revolver replacement nipples" .
I'm sure it hurts to find that you have paid to produce hundreds (thousands?) of undersize parts, but it really turns off the end user that needs to go through ALL of the available caps to prove to the manufacturer that the ill-fitting nipples aren't only unsuitable, but potentially dangerous to boot!

Pancho
November 5, 2012, 01:44 PM
In a thread sometime ago Mykeal provided a list of the commonly available caps and their dimensions. The conclusion as I saw it was that there is no industry wide standard for cap dimensions. This is contrary to virtually anything else we deal with. A 1/4-20 is a 1/4-20 no matter who makes it.
The only tool we have is responsible consumerism, SEND THEM BACK with a note that there is no such thing as a #10 cap industry standard and to forewarn us that the nipples aren't a bargain.
At least at TOW I was able to talk directly to the machinist that designed and machined the nipple. That made me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

Hellgate
November 5, 2012, 07:20 PM
The only cap I know of that is smaller than the CCI#10 is the RWS #55 (or is it 1055?). Good luck finding them. They are too small to fit any nipples I've come across but they are indeed, the smallest cap I have.

Sounds like those replacement nipples are useless. Obviously the maker hasn't tried them out yet.

dickydalton
November 5, 2012, 08:19 PM
I bought Treso nipples from The Possibles Shop for all my cap n ball revolvers.
2 ROA's, 4 Pietta Colts, a Pietta 1858 New Army a 2nd Gen Colt and an Uberty 1862. They all use #10 remingtons from Cabelas and they don't fall off or missfire. One cap for all and I don't care a bit it cost me about $30 a cylinder (I have extras) to know I can shoot every chamber every time.:)

mykeal
November 6, 2012, 01:46 PM
This thread is a hoot.

Percussion caps cost, approximately, 4 to 6 CENTS apiece.

Nipples cost, approximately, 4 to 6 DOLLARS apiece.

The nipples have a tapered cone; a precision fit would require holding dimensions to ten-thousandths of an inch.

You don't get precision machine work on detail parts for 4 to 6 cents apiece, nor even for 4 to 6 dollars apiece.

And even if you get lucky and find a match, I guarantee you that the next batch of caps or nipples, or the batch after that won't match.

deforming the caps ( bad juju )
Bad juju? We're truly down to witch doctor magic and myths?

Pancho
November 6, 2012, 02:44 PM
You are so right Mykeal. Perfection is not possible as you've shown there is no standard between cap manufacturers and there can be little quality assurance within a manufacturer because there are a lot of variables.
The questions still remains, what criteria does the aftermarket build to?

mykeal
November 7, 2012, 11:09 AM
Sigh.

The criteria they build to is a price point, and it's as high as they can make it using non-precision tools and equipment. There is no mystery here. It's pound out as many as you can as cheaply as you can and charge as much as you can get away with.

Pancho
November 7, 2012, 10:31 PM
I should have been more explicit, I was referring to the aftermarket nipple manufacturers not the cap manufacturers. Granted that Remington, CCI, etc.'s main business is not making caps but ammunition and only make caps because they feel they have to. On the other hand I would guess that the aftermarket nipple manufacturers are more cottage industry in nature. TOW's SS nipples are made in house.
This forum and ones like it are a great place to make or break a good reputation.
If I called whomever and they answered my problems by saying over and over that "they are made to fit #10 caps" and me knowing that there really is no such standard I would
RETURN THEM and do exactly what unknwn did and let us decide for ourselves wether to waste our time and money.

KSUJedi
November 7, 2012, 10:58 PM
FWIW, I got no grief from Rydon/RMCoxyoke about my request for a return. I didn't actually say what type of caps I used, just left it at the caps I want to use don't work on these nipples. They promptly responded "sorry they didn't work out for me," send them back and return your payment. Plan to put them in the mail back tomorrow. Just figured I'd give them credit that they didn't give me any run around about returning them.

unknwn
November 8, 2012, 12:53 AM
I really must say that I didn't get a run-around about returning the offending nipples, just that I was told more than once that they were "..designed to use #10 caps..." . A strange aspect of this whole story is that the place that I originally found the nipples for sale had the product advertised as made to use #11 caps.
How I really wished they would have worked with any caps at all, but as I stated earlier I tried every type commonly available, and they just wouldn't hold any caps at all, so I was issued a return authorization number that resulted in a refund of the shipping costs I incurred from the order to begin with, which was highly unusual, but a welcome attempt by the seller to mend fences.
By the way, I really liked the Rydon/RMC hardened nipple wrench that was recommended by mykeal in the first response to this thread.
It was first rate stuff at a very fair price, which should go to show you that the manufacturer does produce quality products, it's just that the nipples in question didn't "cut the mustard".
I wouldn't be fearful of trying other products from them in the future, but I did learn a lesson about aftermarket replacement nipples in general.

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