Cold hammer forged barrels?


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1911 guy
October 25, 2012, 01:22 PM
I know what cold hammer forging is and how the rifle barrels are made this way. What I do NOT know is what the real advantages are to a CHF barrel as opposed to a "conventional" barrel.

The skinny: This is the last decision I have to make before getting all the parts for my latest AR build. I can get one of two barrels that have identical specs, but one is CHF and the other is not. The barrels are offered by E.R. Shaw and Bravo Company. Price difference of $25. Both barrels are chrome lined government profiles with 1:7 twist.

What am I gaining or losing with or without the cold hammer forging? This rifle will not be used extremely often, but when it does it will be for HD, training classes and paper punching. Reliability is utmost, but I'd like to retain as much accuracy as I can in the process. The BCM barrel is CHF and proofed/inspected. I've had chromed Shaw barrels in the past that shot extremely well with pet loads. So am I gaining or losing by going to the hammer forged from BCM?

If it matters, the rest of the build is:
S&W M&P15 stripped lower
DoubleStar parts kit
KNS pins (I know, not really necessary)
A2 tube, spring, buffer and stock
Aero precision stripped flat top upper
BCM bolt and carrier
M.I. Gen II SS 15" free float tube
Low profile gas block to fit under the tube
Flip up irons (undecided between MagPul and M.I.)
Aimpoint PRO

Thanks for educating me.

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fatcat4620
October 25, 2012, 01:33 PM
CHF is what the military uses do it must be 100x better (sarc). It does make the steel harder which should maje it last longer.

hardluk1
October 25, 2012, 02:36 PM
delete...

Mr. Farknocker
October 25, 2012, 02:53 PM
You can start here to find out what forging does and the different types of forging.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forging

As far as how it plays a part in the barrel, I'll let others chime in.

USSR
October 25, 2012, 03:30 PM
What I do NOT know is what the real advantages are to a CHF barrel as opposed to a "conventional" barrel.

They are simply cheaper to produce than either a button rifled or especially a cut rifled barrel. The machinery to produce them is quite expensive, that is why usually only the major rifle manufacturers use them.

Don

SpentCasing
October 25, 2012, 07:53 PM
CHF is what the military uses do it must be 100x better (sarc). It does make the steel harder which should maje it last longer.

CHF is NOT mil-spec. Diameco (Colt Canada) it is. But not in the US. Its one of the main reasons I prefer FN CHF barrels (PSA, Spikes, Centurion, Noveske etc.) over Colt barrels for my hard use carbine.

gbeecher
October 25, 2012, 08:01 PM
Below are some links that give some background and introductory information on barrel making. I don't think you'll notice any difference whatsoever in either barrel you choose. Happy shooting! :)

http://www.firearmsid.com/feature%20articles/rifledbarrelmanuf/barrelmanufacture.htm

http://www.lasc.us/RangingShotBarrelMakingFeature.htm

http://www.firearmsid.com/feature%20articles/rifledbarrelmanuf/barrelmanufacture.htm

meanmrmustard
October 25, 2012, 09:33 PM
Also, I'd like to add, I work in a machine shop and would like to set one record straight: 4140 is not inferior to 4150 steel. You will likely never see, feel, or observe any superiority.

4150 is a harder steel than 4140. Harder means brittle, due mainly to vanadium. This is what is used on the M4.

4140 is not as hard, but tougher. Heat treated 4140 with kill most drill bits if you try to go through it, other than carbide. 4150 chips. 4140 is what is used for the military's SAWs.

I prefer a 4140 CHF barrel.

fatcat4620
October 25, 2012, 10:45 PM
CHF is NOT mil-spec. Diameco (Colt Canada) it is. But not in the US. Its one of the main reasons I prefer FN CHF barrels (PSA, Spikes, Centurion, Noveske etc.) over Colt barrels for my hard use carbine.
I was more referring to the saw more. I had seen a quote from a study on saw barrels putting CHF chrome and nitride lined barrels against each other. They also tested a non CHF barrel and non CHF/non chromed. The non CHF barrels dogged out early while the CHF went to like 30k (over about 6 or 8 hours with 100 belts and minimal cool down time.).

Okiegunner
October 25, 2012, 11:12 PM
Speaking of barrels...

Do not forget FN. There are FN made CL, 1 in 7 twist, SAW barrels, on the market now for around $200.00 a piece.

At one time, I believe, it was only Noveske that was using the FN manufactured SAW barrel.

The FN made barrels should be very high quality.

Oglee
October 27, 2012, 03:36 PM
I hear alot of people say CFH is superior cause it lasts longer yet never once has anyone shown positive data on it.

The only real data i have seen is the '07 dust test(which was flawed IMO) but at the end of it every rifle(3 had CHF barrels) every barrels head space exceeded safe parameters and had to be replaced. So the only real test flawed as it may have been showed no difference in barrel life.

CHF is a much faster way to make barrels though.

USSR
October 27, 2012, 08:52 PM
Read this and then you will understand the difference between the 3 manufacturing methods used to make barrels.

Don

http://www.border-barrels.com/articles/bmart.htm

MistWolf
October 27, 2012, 09:43 PM
Properly made CHF barrels are very good barrels. The steel structure is denser, especially near the surface from all the pounding.

Colt compared their standard U.S. made barrel to their Canadian CHF barrel and tests showed the CHF barrel offered no real advantage over their standard barrel.

In either case, the cost of a replacement barrel will be a drop in the bucket compared to the cost of the ammo needed to wear it out

Oglee
October 27, 2012, 10:29 PM
Do you have a link Mistwofl? I would be interested in reading that.

Quentin
October 27, 2012, 10:39 PM
I have a BCM standard barrel and Daniel Defense CHF. Honestly I'm more than satisfied with both. Can't see any advantages with either but then I'm only interested in 2 MOA. I don't shoot from a bench. Bench shooting with super accurate ammo should show a difference.

Personally I'd say the variations in individual barrels could make as much difference as the type of rifling.

MistWolf
October 28, 2012, 03:38 AM
Do you have a link Mistwofl? I would be interested in reading that.

No, it was awhile back when I read it online. I do recall it was from a reliable source. I believe it was one of the industry experts over on m4carbine.net but I am uncertain

Oglee
October 28, 2012, 12:44 PM
Thanks mistwolf, with about 20 minutes of google searching I found a refference post about the subject and it looks like C4IGrant posted it.

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=109165&page=3

The refference post I found was dated 2010 so it looks like he has stated it more than once.

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