Why so few SxS 10 gauge shotguns?


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guitarguy314
October 25, 2012, 11:15 PM
Hey guys,

Does anyone know why there are so few 10 gauge SxS shotguns? Gun broker has a few, but they're all rather expensive. Is it just the rarity of the cartridge? Not enough demand?

Thanks guys,

L

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GCBurner
October 25, 2012, 11:21 PM
Could be because they kick like a mule, and weigh too much for quick handling. A 3" 12-gauge performs better, and has a wider variety of factory ammo available.

Virginian
October 26, 2012, 12:36 AM
Not enough demand. I had two, when I was much more into goose hunting and in a lot better shape. They are HEAVY, and if you don't have a lot of upper body strength they are tough to handle. The Richland was a goose killing machine, but I finally ended up with a specially lightened BPS before tungsten came along and I went back to a 3" 12.

jaguarxk120
October 26, 2012, 09:50 AM
The 10 gauge Remington Hyper Sonic shells are $38 for a box of 25.

The 12 gauge 3 1/2 inch Remington HyperSonic shells are also $38 a box.

The advantage is a 12 gauge can shoot any length of shell from the big 3 1/2 down to a special 2 inch. The 10 gauge is sonewhat limited as to the loadings you can purchase.

Kyle M.
October 26, 2012, 10:34 AM
Has anyone ever made a 10 gauge double chambered for 3.5" shells? I've seen some older 10 gauge doubles that were chambered for the now obsolete two and seven eighths shells, but have yet to see a 3.5" one.

Gordon
October 26, 2012, 11:02 AM
I keep a 20" AyA 10 ga. hidden and not fully closed on Federal 3.5" loads of #4 Buckshot in the TV room to repel boarders. It weighs 10 pounds in it's shortened state with the rib hollow filled with hard lead. When I pulled it in fear a couple times in last 20 years it feels like a feather. Bet I would not have heard the noise or felt the recoil off it's 13" LOP pad either if I had to use it.:evil:

Fred Fuller
October 26, 2012, 12:36 PM
There are several reasons - smokeless powder, harder, rounder shot, better wads and shot cups etc. all work together to make smaller gauges more effective and efficient at delivering shot in the pattern and on target (if the shooter does his/her part of course).

So the larger gauges have fallen more and more into disuse, simply because the smaller gauges do the job just as well with less powder and shot to start with. For example, back in black powder/dropped shot days, the 8 gauge double was the waterfowler's gun of choice. You think a 10 gauge is scarce, go looking for an 8 gauge :D. The 12 gauge now fills the role a 10 gauge used to fill, and does it very well for most shooters.

DM~
October 26, 2012, 03:15 PM
I've owned two 10ga. doubles with 3-1/2" chambers...

Like was already said, too big with too much recoil, just to get 12ga. 3-1/2" performance.

DM

Dave McCracken
October 26, 2012, 05:00 PM
I recall shooting some SC with a pleasant gent with an English made 10 gauge chambered for the old 2 7/8" load. He let me try it out for a few stations.

Weighing a bit more than 7 lbs, it's finely made 30" barrels with a slightly swamped rib went well with the marblecake walnut. It was a slightly enlarged game gun suited for live pigeon when new and lots of things now.

It swung well, though differently than my 870. And it smashed targets well with the 1 1/4 oz loads he had built. I coveted it horribly. Recoil was noticeable but not bad.

Gordon
October 26, 2012, 08:05 PM
10ga in the middle
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i203/gordonhulme/spring2008117.jpg
http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i203/gordonhulme/spring2008118.jpg

Swing
October 26, 2012, 08:36 PM
Has anyone ever made a 10 gauge double chambered for 3.5" shells?

Aguirre y Aranzabal (Spain) did. I believe the original 60s Beretta Silver Hawk was as well. The 3" chambering was introduced, iirc, in 1932, so there is likely others.

Liberty1776
October 26, 2012, 09:11 PM
Yes, all the 10 ga made for many decades now are 3 1/2". I've had two, a Matador and something else that I don't remember. Should have kept the Matador if I wanted a 10 double, but they are very heavy and swing slow. My 3" Winchester Model 12 Heavy Duck is as good a goose gun as any of the tens. Now, my Parker 10, EH Grade, (basically the G with a straight grip stock) is lighter, handles well and is a whoppin' good pheasant gun as it's chambered for the old 2 7/8" shells. (about the same as a magnum 12) They're kindof hard to find anymore though...

MCgunner
October 26, 2012, 09:32 PM
I just bought a 3.5" 12 gauge, a used Mossberg 535. I doubt very seriously it's going to pattern as good as the 90+ percent patterns I get with steel T shot out of my H&R 10 gauge single shot on a 30" circle at 40 yards. There's no place for a snow to hide in that pattern, either. :D I AM going to see how that 12 patterns, soon as I get in the position to. The Mossberg is light, should kick like all billy hell. The H&R is 9 lbs, shoots about the same payload, and doesn't bother me at all. I shot 21 rounds one goose hunt and felt it, no worse really than 3" in my Mossy 500.

There is really not much difference in 12 gauge 3.5" and 10 gauge 3.5". 12 holds 82 T shot and the 10 holds 85 IIRC. But, that 10 sure does pattern sweet. I would think about getting a BPS 10, but I can't justify it no more often than I book a goose hunt. I didn't even hunt 'em last season, hope to book a hunt or two this year up around Eagle Lake, Texas.

I picked up a guide's AYA (I think) 10 gauge double once. The thing musta weighed 12 or 13 lbs. It was kinda shocking. I'm not sure how a gun like that could have much recoil. My buddy's BPS 10 is sweet. If I upgrade my 10 to a multi shot repeater, I'll go BPS. But, I am almost good enough at reloading, now, to shoot a double with the H&R. I managed to finish a cripple with it with a second shot. I'm getting better. :D I like the single shot, really, gives it's own challenge and, heck, I shot as many as my bud last couple times out. That H&R is really pretty cool. :D

plumberroy
October 27, 2012, 12:17 AM
Gorden when I was much younger(and dumber:D )A friend had a shorten ten similar to that one. I loaded it with 2 remington 2 1/4 oz #6 shot nitro express rounds and pulled both triggers:what: Back them I was a recoil junkie, I thought there was no such thing as to much recoil untill that day. I had a recoil over dose that day.:scrutiny: In all truthfulness a 12 will do 98% of anything you need a shotgun for, but with a max load of big shot a 10 will out pattern any 12 I have tried with a little more speed and because they are always heavier with less felt recoil I still have a H&R 10 with a 32" barrel

MachIVshooter
October 27, 2012, 02:12 AM
A 3" 12-gauge performs better

On what? a 3-1/2 mag 10 ga. holds almost twice the payload of a 3" 12 ga.

The 12 ga. is certainly a more versatile and handier shotgun, but it's still tough to beat the mighty 10 for waterfowling. Nothing else on the larket will throw as much steel.

And just for fun, play with some 10 ga slugs. Recoil is brisk, for sure, but the satisfaction of throwing a 1-3/4 ounce, .77" hunk of lead at over 1,500 FPS is far greater :D.

MCgunner
October 27, 2012, 11:02 AM
The 12 ga. is certainly a more versatile and handier shotgun, but it's still tough to beat the mighty 10 for waterfowling. Nothing else on the larket will throw as much steel.

Well, there's waterfowl and then there's WATERfowl. You don't need as much steel on ducks. But, yeah, tossing full 10 gauge charges of BIG T steel on snows that just won't drop below 50 yards on a blue bird day, well, no 3" 12 short of a $3.00+ round of hevishot BB will even come close and, frankly, the hevishot is a bit lacking considering how that 10 patterns.

But, I shoot steel 3s or 2s in fasteel out of 2 3/4" 12 gauge on ducks and have no gripes. The big ten's specialty is high flying big birds. Works pretty well as a turkey gun with 6s, too. A 12 works, but the ten shoots tight patterns out of a turkey choke and there's a lot more shot in the pattern. I'm not a turkey hunter, just sayin'....;) I have patterned that turkey choke, impressive.

Anyone who categorically claims the 3" 12 is the 3.5" 10's equal in all matters either has no clue or is wealthy enough to buy hevishot with pocket change. But, then, you could always load hevishot in the 3.5" 10 gauge. :D No need for that with T steel and I get factory loads for a buck a round.

Virginian
October 27, 2012, 03:00 PM
If going after big birds at long ranges, nothing (legal) beats a 10 gauge. Before tungsten, I went through two SxSs, two semi autos, and 3 pumps. The best handling was a BPS I lightened considerably. But, that first shot in the morning would flat wake you up.
In that period where steel was the only thing legal, I will never understand why the firearms manufacturers didn't come out with much lighter 10 gauges. We were throwing much less weight of shot than the old 3" twelve with lead, and they thought we needed 3 pounds more gun to do it with.

AJumbo
October 27, 2012, 09:43 PM
I knew a man who used his 10 as his primary coyote gun. The guys who called coyotes with him used to joke that it was best to let him fire first, thereby defoliating the area and allowing them a clear shot at the dogs. That may not have been much of a stretch....

chas08
October 28, 2012, 12:32 AM
If going after big birds at long ranges, nothing (legal) beats a 10 gauge.I've been shooting a 10 on geese for near 25 years and I couldn't agree more! Especially here in South Texas where shots in your spread can be 60 yards! No platform better delivers a load of T's better than a 10! and I own and have compared the 3.5 12 ga. They all three have failed at pattern density at distance. At 50-70 yds nothing can touch a 10!
As a note to the OP; I hunted with a fellow in Illinois a few years ago who's Deer, Goose, and Turkey gun was an AyA SxS 10 ga. I don't think there is enough money in Texas to make him part with it!...lol

MCgunner
October 28, 2012, 12:37 AM
Dang, wondered when you'd show up on this thread. :D Took ya long enough.

As a note to the OP; I hunted with a fellow in Illinois a few years ago who's Deer, Goose, and Turkey gun was an AyA SxS 10 ga. I don't think there is enough money in Texas to make him part with it!...lol

Yeah, but like I said earlier, thing weighs a TON. I was shocked by the one I picked up, nearly through my back out again. LOL! It's like two 9 lb H&Rs welded together. But, I've LOVE to own one. :D

chas08
October 28, 2012, 12:39 PM
Dang, wondered when you'd show up on this thread. Took ya long enough.

Hey MC,
Yeah, I've been reading more than commenting here lately. You just get tired of saying the same thing over and over. I still have two 3.5 inch 12ga guns. They serve as a backup goose gun, or my front line Duck gun if I'm hunting ducks where an occasional goose is known to roam.
I've all but retired my BPS 10ga since I picked up a used SP-10 three seasons ago for a very good price. But I sure wouldn't have minded owning that AyA!
I'll always choose a 10 over a 12 for Geese in Texas. And after comparing Remington HD BB to T-Shot (both in 10ga) I like the T-Shot better too!

I hope you have a great Waterfowl season....chas

multigauge
October 28, 2012, 05:05 PM
I, too enjoy throwing a 10-gauge slug at a deer, none of which have been able to stop a slug yet. However, the Federal slugs are somewhat less than .77 in diameter and have a muzzle velocity of (only) 1280 fps.

Virginian
October 28, 2012, 07:42 PM
I had an AYA, but I have to say I liked the Richland 811 I think it was slightly better. They were very similar.

MCgunner
October 28, 2012, 11:22 PM
I hope you have a great Waterfowl season....chas

Same to ya and me too. :D I have my trailer in Port O'Connor again this year, can run down to the delta, but we're trying to close on our new house in the woods near Sheridan and not far form Eagle Lake. I'm going to try to book at least one hunt with an outfit in the Lissie prairie this season with my buddy from Waco and his kid. Got to have at least three to book. If you get to wanting to go there, let me know. I've done some googling of outfitters in that area, but haven't made a decision. Won't know until I get settled in, whenever that will be. Living in an 18 ft trailer at the moment as we sold the house in Corpus. I'm SO ready to close! LOL

Jaymo
October 28, 2012, 11:53 PM
I wish I could find a good 10 gauge double. My Sicilian great grandfather had a 10 ga double, and it patterned beautifully.
A 12 gauge 3.5 can never pattern as well as a 10 ga 3.5, for the same reason a 20 ga 3" won't pattern as well as a 3" 12 ga.
A longer shot column will result in worse pattern than a short shot column. A longer shot column has more pellets impacting other pellets than a short shot column.

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