.223 reloading and swagging question


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Josephnagy1
October 30, 2012, 08:47 AM
I am just getting into 223 reloading and i have a question. some of my brass has the military primer pocket. now i have been told to get a swag tool but i also saw a rcbs primer pocket swagger that looks like it works with a die in the press. can anyone explain it? which one is better?

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Tackelberry11258
October 30, 2012, 08:50 AM
I have the RCBS Swagger die set. It works well, but may not be as fast as say the dillon. It took me almost all day to swag 1000 pockets.... but it fits my budget and I'm not in a hurry....

Josephnagy1
October 30, 2012, 08:57 AM
i have seen the dillon and the rcbs tool but never the die. does it just pop them out?

angus6
October 30, 2012, 11:09 AM
Have had the Dillon , RCBS swagger dies and Hornady reamer. I still have the Hornady I put it on a 1/40hp motor and it works great. I didn't care for the Dillon or RCBS units

SlowFuse
October 30, 2012, 12:34 PM
This question comes up a lot...

The outcome of this is usually most tell you to go all out and get the Dillon. I didn't see the point because I don't do a high volume of crimped 223/5.56. I'm also in the same boat as Tackelberry. I don't get in a hurry when reloading.

That said, I use the RCBS combo press mount swaging tool. You could go to youtube and easily find videos of it in action. I paid around $25 for mine which made more sense for me than over $100 for the Dillon Superswage. The only problem I've had is one of the first times using it I adjusted it down too far and bent the small rod. That was my own fault. Of course RCBS had a replacement (free) to me a few days after contacting them.

I'm happy with the RCBS. If you do really low volume crimp removal you may be able to get by with the right size philips head bit or a lee hand chamfer tool in a drill until you decide what to go with.

ArchAngelCD
October 30, 2012, 12:42 PM
I also use the RCBS combo tool and it works just fine. I like swaging better than cutting tools because when you swage you put all the material that came with the brass back where it belongs instead of removing some.

BUT, it's you intend upon doing many thousands the Dillon 600 will be faster but then again, once they are done, they are done and won't need to be addressed again. (did I mention I'm cheap?)

rcmodel
October 30, 2012, 12:48 PM
does it just pop them out? No, the de-priming pin in the sizing die pops them out.

The swaging tools are used to removed the remaining primer crimp ring after the normal FL sizing die has de-primed them.

rc

W.E.G.
October 30, 2012, 12:53 PM
Everything you wanted to know about the RCBS and Dillon primer pocket swagers:

RCBS
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=rcbs+primer+pocket+swager

Dillon
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=dillon+primer+pocket+swager

I don't like reaming.
While reaming certainly works, it also removes part of the primer pocket that supports the primer after the round is fired. If you've ever had a primer fall out of a reamed case, and get stuck under the trigger arm during circumstances where a "time out" is not a good idea, you will not like reamed primer pockets either.

cheygriz
October 30, 2012, 01:22 PM
I used the RCBS for a while and was not happy with it.

I bought a Dillon, and it's great.

Dillon is expensive, no doubt. but the very best always is.

TFL
October 30, 2012, 02:19 PM
I have the rcbs and a C-H 4D The RCBS you can bend the spindle is you dont set it up right. The C-h is faster by along ways but a little harder to get set up so you don't bend the rims. but I like it better then the RCBS

kingmt
October 31, 2012, 09:26 AM
I have the CH4D I can do them at a rate of 1K a hour. Of course I don't keep up that pace for a hour. I usually work at it for 10 minutes then do something else for a few minutes then go back to it.

It takes very little movement & is easy to setup. There is no need to run it to the bottom of the hole where you can bend a rim. You will feel when it passes the swage & that is all you need. It takes no effort to work. It is so reasonably priced that I suggest getting the ram prime at the same time but please spend $2 more(probably not that much) to get a extra priming rod. The hardest part is changing that little tiny stem for the primer cup. Your hands are probably better then mine & you may not mind it but for the cost it is worth it.

I think I have a total of $40 for everything but I paid shipping twice so I could get the extra rod. Should be about $35 TYD.

littleguns223
October 31, 2012, 01:48 PM
I use the Dillon it is fast and easy to use.

wv109323
October 31, 2012, 10:03 PM
The RCBS has a "button" the size of a large and one the size of a small primer pocket. The "button" of the needed size ( in the case of 5.56 is the small) is in place where the shell holder normally goes. The die is threaded into the press. The die has an adjustable rod(s) that goes into the case (same size as case neck) that limits the case's upward travel.
When the case has stopped it's upward travel ,the "button" is forced into the primer pocket cavity via the travel and force of the presses upward stroke. By forcing the button into the primer pocket any brass that formed the crimp is swagged back into the base of the case.
Both the RCBS and Dillon work on the same principle. I used both and there is little difference. If I paid as much for the Dillon as they want I would brag on it too.

mtrmn
November 1, 2012, 09:48 AM
Kingmt:
"I have the CH4D I can do them at a rate of 1K a hour. Of course I don't keep up that pace for a hour. I usually work at it for 10 minutes then do something else for a few minutes then go back to it.

It takes very little movement & is easy to setup. There is no need to run it to the bottom of the hole where you can bend a rim. You will feel when it passes the swage & that is all you need. It takes no effort to work. It is so reasonably priced that I suggest getting the ram prime at the same time but please spend $2 more(probably not that much) to get a extra priming rod. The hardest part is changing that little tiny stem for the primer cup. Your hands are probably better then mine & you may not mind it but for the cost it is worth it.

I think I have a total of $40 for everything but I paid shipping twice so I could get the extra rod. Should be about $35 TYD. "

THIS^^^^^ King is 100% correct, and get the extra primer ram.
Swaging and trimming are the 2 operations I just absolutely despise, and any tool that makes it faster/better is worth it. The CH4D is hands down THE BEST swager I've ever seen, and a real bargain at the price. American made, cheap in price-not in quality.

hentown
November 1, 2012, 10:14 AM
Is a "swagger" anything like a swager? :eek: I've found it pretty quick and effective to chuck the cases in my 3/8" drill and, using a Hornady primer pocket swager with handle, just giving the cases a quick spin.

mdemetz
November 4, 2012, 07:18 AM
Is a "swagger" anything like a swager? I've found it pretty quick and effective to chuck the cases in my 3/8" drill and, using a Hornady primer pocket swager with handle, just giving the cases a quick spin.

Your reaming not swaging

Mr.Revolverguy
November 4, 2012, 08:09 AM
I am not a fan of the RCBS die swager I have one and it feels like I have to beat my bench to death trying to get the case to eject. Alot of people don't know RCBS has made a bench mount that I am waiting to come in. I ordered it on Thursday of last week. It is cheaper than the Dillon.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/319662/rcbs-bench-mounted-primer-pocket-swager

CountryUgly
November 5, 2012, 04:56 PM
I've just been reaming them by hand but I also don't have a high volume of military brass to do either. I've checked out the RCBS bench mount swagging tool and like what I seen for the most part but again I don't do a whole lot of them at the moment.

blarby
November 5, 2012, 05:38 PM
#3 phillips, again :)

On a budget ? Will run you about a dollar for a really good one. Fast, and effective.

kayaks
November 5, 2012, 07:11 PM
I have owned both the RCBS press mounted type and Dillon bench swagers. I didn't like the RCBS product for volume work. It would be good if there aren't a lot of cases to process. I did find that applying some case lube to the "button" helped with the process.

I found an used Dillon on this site, it works well and it looks like it will last forever. I might have bought the RCBS bench mounted swager, but you still don't see many of out there.

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