Kel-Tec P-11


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USAF_Vet
October 31, 2012, 09:47 PM
I did a quick search but found nothing here regarding the P-11

I hear a lot about the PF-9, but does anyone have any experience with the P-11?

Why my interest in the P-11? It's mostly due to the magazine interchangeability with my S&W 469. It's lighter, with a smaller frame than my 469, making it a better option for carrying in warmer weather. At roughly $250, it fits my budget.

Online reviews have been mostly positive, as well. Seems that they've been around long enough to have all the kinks and bugs worked out, too.

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Mike J
October 31, 2012, 10:19 PM
I have one. I have had some problems with it but it is working fine now. If you want to learn about these I would suggest going to www.ktog.org & reading the P11 subforum on the bulletin board there.

The P11 uses a plastic mag catch. If you slam the magazine in you can damage it & then you have a single shot pistol. This happened to me. Kel Tec sent me another mag catch but I decided to buy a metal one. There is a member at KTOG that makes them & sells them.

I had a problem with the trigger spring jumping out of the trigger bar. Kel Tec sent me replacement parts & I fixed it.

The slide stop has broken twice on this gun. Pretty easy to replace & Kel Tec sent me the parts promptly. This did not interfere with the function of the gun other than the slide not locking back after the last shot.

I still have this pistol & it has been working fine for a while now but I have a lot more trust in my other semi auto's. There are many members here that have this same model pistol & like it very much but the I have written what my experience with this gun has been.

56hawk
October 31, 2012, 11:02 PM
I have a P-11. What's not to like about a pocket size 9mm with a 10 round magazine? I do wish someone would make a higher quality copy, but mine always works so I can't complain too much.

hso
October 31, 2012, 11:04 PM
I wish I had never gotten rid of mine. It was a great pistol.

The PF9 I have now has impressed me as well.

needmorecowbell
October 31, 2012, 11:33 PM
I sold mine. Wasn't comfortable having a carry/defensive handgun with that hard of a trigger pull. To me much worse than a j-frame. My concern was that if I actually one day needed to use it, and adrenaline/nerves kicked in, I'd have trouble hitting the broadside of a barn and be yanking shots everywhere. I can understand your wanting to be able to use the S&W mags, so maybe would work well for you, but I'd recommend most to spend a bit more and get a Kahr CM9/CW9, Ruger LC9 or something similar. If you do get, I'd look into changing the springs as I know that supposedly helps the trigger pull.

USAF_Vet
November 1, 2012, 12:55 AM
That's for the feedback.

It does not appear to have an external safety, is that correct? Is there any safety on it at all, or does on have to rely on the heavy trigger pull? My Smith has a pretty stout trigger pull on Double action, then a pretty light pull on Single action.

I actually prefer a heavier trigger on a defensive gun, you have to really want to take that first shot. And since I train with a heavy trigger, I'm fairly accurate.

I'll see if I can rent one before I put it on my short list.

Magazine quality, how do the Kel Tec mags compare to the S&W mags? Factory Smith mags are about $40 new, with Kel Tec about $25.

dirtengineer
November 1, 2012, 01:18 AM
I had one and traded for a Kahr CM9. It was a fine pistol, but unrefined. The trigger was the main detractor and the ultimate reason that I got rid of it. I had the belt clip and carried it routinely mexican style.

chris in va
November 1, 2012, 01:45 AM
I had one for a few years, using a factory belt clip. As others pointed out the trigger is...interesting. Not particularly difficult, but the sear release is right up against the grip frame, so quick shots are not happenin'.

It's a very nice size though especially for a 12rd double stack. There is a way to lighten the pull force...using a bent nail of all things.

chris in va
November 1, 2012, 01:49 AM
I had one for a few years, using a factory belt clip. As others pointed out the trigger is...interesting. Not particularly difficult, but the sear release is right up against the grip frame, so quick shots are not happenin'. It's a very smooth pull and is similar to a revolver.

It's a very nice size though especially for a 12rd double stack. There is a way to lighten the pull force...using a bent nail of all things.

josephbw
November 1, 2012, 05:48 PM
I carried my P11 for over 6 years, then got the PF9 when I finally found one. One thing I never liked about either one, is how they beat up your hand when firing them. The PF9 is a little easier on your hand, has a lighter trigger, and is easier to conceal, but it's not a gun you want to take to the range and shoot more that 20 rounds either. My P11 is now relegated to a hidden back up gun.

I thought the PF9 was going to be my carry gun from now on. WRONG, I finally found a new Springfield XDs. This gun is everything the Kel Tec's wanted to be, but in a larger caliber (45acp). Today I just recieved my 7 round mags for the XDs that I ordered from Midway on Sunday night.

I am now content, and convinced that my quest for the perfect carry gun is over. :D:D:D

wild cat mccane
November 1, 2012, 06:08 PM
Be aware they have no firing pin block and ARE NOT drop safe.

They also have an unfixed issue of having the trigger bar fall out of the recess in the frame. KTOG will detail this better.

JohnB
November 1, 2012, 08:53 PM
I have had a P-11 for 3 years or so.
Mine has been 100% reliable with a variety of ammo.
Yes the trigger pull is long and hard but to me it was easy to get used to.
I don't consider it a pocket pistol. Too fat and heavy. I carry a P3AT for a pocket pistol.
It is not a range gun for burning 100s of rounds in a day.

USAF_Vet
November 1, 2012, 09:41 PM
Joseph,
the Springfield XDs is a nice gun. I fired one at my CCW class. But man my hand hurt after only 5 rounds. Great gun in a pinch, but not exactly something I'd want to shoot repeatedly.

But as I'm really only looking for a back up/ warm weather carry to supplement my S&W, it isn't something I plan to send thousands of rounds down range with. Rather a mag or two to maintain proficiency, then on to something else.

I've been reading reviews by the dozen on KTOG, and while the P-11 is not a perfect gun, it still seems like it will go on my short list. Then I'll have to find a Sub 2000 set up for the same mags and stock up on a bunch. Having 3 guns that can share mags is something that makes me smile.

MrDig
November 1, 2012, 10:45 PM
I like mine. a great deal as a matter of fact. but I don't use it at the range much except to shoot a mag ot two when I'm there. It works every time and I carry it as often as I carry.

walker944
November 1, 2012, 10:52 PM
I have two...one is my carry pistol, the other stays in my truck at all times. Both have a slip on rubber groove grip. I have shot both of them sufficiently enough to know that both ar rock solid reliable. I like the rugged design and finish. Suits my purposes just fine.

josephbw
November 1, 2012, 11:20 PM
Joseph,
the Springfield XDs is a nice gun. I fired one at my CCW class. But man my hand hurt after only 5 rounds. Great gun in a pinch, but not exactly something I'd want to shoot repeatedly.

But as I'm really only looking for a back up/ warm weather carry to supplement my S&W, it isn't something I plan to send thousands of rounds down range with. Rather a mag or two to maintain proficiency, then on to something else.

I've been reading reviews by the dozen on KTOG, and while the P-11 is not a perfect gun, it still seems like it will go on my short list. Then I'll have to find a Sub 2000 set up for the same mags and stock up on a bunch. Having 3 guns that can share mags is something that makes me smile.
I shot a box of 50 rounds the day I got my XDs, and it didn't bother me at all. I think I could have shot another box or two, but that was all I had at the time. The only thing I'm not too fond of, is racking the slide. It is pretty stiff, but other than that, I love it.

As far as the Sub 2000, I have one of those too. I got mine in the Glock version. They come in several different versions, but none of them use the same mags as the P-11 or PF9.

USAF_Vet
November 2, 2012, 12:36 PM
I read online (fwiw) there is a model that accepts S&W model 59 mags. The 59 series work in all three generations, which is the same mag as the P-11. Again, I had not ever put hands on one.

marb4
November 2, 2012, 12:56 PM
Mine has never had a single feed or ejection failure. I have had two other issues. One, the trigger return spring would occasionally pop off of the trigger bar. Two, the slide stop lever broke (which didn't cause a failure). Kel-Tec sent me replacement parts and I've never had an issue since.

Maybe due to the trigger I have never been able to shoot any kind of decent groups. For this pistol's intended purpose that really isn't a huge issue.

I decided to get a Glock 26 for EDC and since the P11 has no real resale value I decided to keep it tucked away in my truck.

56hawk
November 2, 2012, 01:18 PM
Magazine quality, how do the Kel Tec mags compare to the S&W mags? Factory Smith mags are about $40 new, with Kel Tec about $25.

The factory P-11 magazines are made by Mec-Gar, which is the only aftermarket company I would consider buying magazines from. On the other hand my P-11 has jammed almost every time I have tried using a S&W magazine in it.

FREERANGETIME!
November 2, 2012, 01:21 PM
USAF is correct, the 59 series mags are compatable with the P11 and Sub 2000 that being said, the P11 factory mag will not work in a Sub 2000, because it is simply too short to lock in.

JR47
November 2, 2012, 01:43 PM
I bought a P11 when they first came out. The trigger pull isn't too bad, it's the length of pull that requires getting used to. Aside from that, nothing has "slipped off" or "broke" in several thousand rounds.

It's NOT a shoot-a-lot gun. It's meant to be carried more, and shot less. Not a single bobble as of yet.:)

MedWheeler
November 2, 2012, 03:24 PM
The gun is considered to not be "drop safe" simply because its hammer is always fully at rest. Certain jurisdictions require handguns sold within them to be "certifiably" drop-safe, and this design would not make the cut. But, I know of no one who can say they actually got theirs to fire when dropped.
A plus side of a hammer-at-rest design (as opposed to the partially-cocked design of all of Kel-Tec's other DA pistols) is that the gun can be repeatedly dry-fired without manually cycling the slide. Another is that the gun has so-called "second-strike" capability (the PF9 does not.)

Wes Mantooth
November 2, 2012, 09:39 PM
I've had one for a few years now. It's my CC gun. I've shot it plenty with no problems. It's the smallest 9mm to fit my big hands.

I don't understand the whole "it hurts my hands when I shoot it" thing. Or the "it has a heavy trigger" thing.

If it's your carry gun, when you need it I don't think you're gonna worry about it hurting your hands and how hard it is to pull the trigger.

PS. Man up a little bit. Geez. Stop putting lotion on your hands sissy and get out from your cubicle sometime. Maybe you can handle a little recoil.:neener:

Shadow 7D
November 2, 2012, 09:54 PM
HA
Wes
go find a P40 and come back.....
Or come over to my house and I'll save you the cost of ammo and just take a ball peen hammer to your hand.

That said, my P11 with 115 isn't bad.

MCgunner
November 2, 2012, 10:08 PM
Been carrying a P11 for since 1996. It's got in excess (stopped being able to keep an accurate estimate some years back) of 11K rounds through it. It feeds what it likes reliably. I had an extractor snap on it last year, KT sent me a fresh one. Seems they did a re-design since mine was produced, sent the wrong extractor first time. I shoulda gave 'em my serial number, didn't know.

Anyway, it's 3.5" at 25 yards accurate from a rest and shoots to POA with a 115 grain Hornady XTP at 1263 fps. Shoots a might high, but still accurate with WWB and my light practice handload of choice. The thing has defended me, too. I won't part with it, is what I have in my pocket as a primary probably 70-80 percent of the time. I have a Taurus M85SSUL and a little Radom P64 I like a lot, too, but the little P11 is a more logical carry choice of the three. It's got 410 ft lbs on tap, 11 of 'em, and is dead accurate and reliable. I also like the long DA trigger, very revolver like if a might longer. If you know how to shoot DA, once you get used to it, it's a very easy trigger to hit with, and very safe to pocket carry.

OH, BTW, recoil? The P11 is not a problem. That 20 ounce Radom in 9x18 will HURT you with its stock plastic grips. I had to wear a shooting glove with it until I got Marschal grips on it and a Wolff spring kit in it. It's still a lot snappier than the P11, but it don't hurt anymore.

dirtengineer
November 3, 2012, 12:43 AM
I've had one for a few years now. It's my CC gun. I've shot it plenty with no problems. It's the smallest 9mm to fit my big hands.

I don't understand the whole "it hurts my hands when I shoot it" thing. Or the "it has a heavy trigger" thing.

If it's your carry gun, when you need it I don't think you're gonna worry about it hurting your hands and how hard it is to pull the trigger.

PS. Man up a little bit. Geez. Stop putting lotion on your hands sissy and get out from your cubicle sometime. Maybe you can handle a little recoil.:neener:
The P40 is a handful to be sure. My dad (aka John Wayne) has one and it definitely hurts. He can handle a few magazines before he starts to flinch.

Mike J
November 3, 2012, 10:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAF_Vet View Post
Magazine quality, how do the Kel Tec mags compare to the S&W mags? Factory Smith mags are about $40 new, with Kel Tec about $25.
The factory P-11 magazines are made by Mec-Gar, which is the only aftermarket company I would consider buying magazines from. On the other hand my P-11 has jammed almost every time I have tried using a S&W magazine in it.

The 5906 magazine I have jams my P11. The folks at KTOG say if you get a Wolff plus powered spring they will work though. I still haven't gotten around to ordering one for mine.

orionengnr
November 3, 2012, 10:53 AM
I had one several years ago. At the time I was carrying a Kahr PM9. The P11 was a similar size, but had a capacity of 11 rounds. So I bought one.

Long story short, between the horrible trigger and the frequent malfunctions, it didn't stick around long. A friend tried it and took it off my hands at a substantial discount.

I still have the PM9. :)

charlie fox
November 3, 2012, 06:19 PM
I've owned both a P-11 and P-40; the P-40 was, by far, the least comfortable gun I've ever shot! I bought it when my agency switched to Glock 22's to use as a back-up. After the qualification course I slipped it quietly into its ankle holster and never fired it again (I left the department before the next qualification). I sold it and bought a P-11 and have never had any issues after about 3K rounds downrange. It is my second most-carried pistol:)

Kiln
November 4, 2012, 11:12 PM
I've got the P40 and the recoil is not as horrible as people believe in my opinion.

I thought it was bad until I took out my Rossi .44 Mag with a 2" barrel...now that is bad.

Nuclear
November 5, 2012, 03:50 AM
I have a friend who owns one, who was having problems shooting it. So since he doesn't shoot regularly anymore, had me shoot it. I could barely keep it on target. Don't know if it was the heavy, long, gritty trigger, minimal sights or 357 level recoil, but it wasn't fun to shoot or accurate. And as I told him, the BG would have your wallet and be around the corner before it went off.

CoRoMo
November 5, 2012, 10:52 AM
I've owned, carried and used one for many years now. I'm going to get another one soon.

Kiln
November 5, 2012, 03:47 PM
Practice makes perfect with DAO pistols like the P11 or P40, if you're a revolver guy you'll probably have no problem with them. Granted striker fired guns are much easier to use, hardly any of them are small enough to carry easily all day.

PT92
November 6, 2012, 11:01 AM
I did a quick search but found nothing here regarding the P-11

I hear a lot about the PF-9, but does anyone have any experience with the P-11?

Why my interest in the P-11? It's mostly due to the magazine interchangeability with my S&W 469. It's lighter, with a smaller frame than my 469, making it a better option for carrying in warmer weather. At roughly $250, it fits my budget.

Online reviews have been mostly positive, as well. Seems that they've been around long enough to have all the kinks and bugs worked out, too.
I have long said that the Kel-Tec P11 is the "unsung-hero" of the compact Hi-Cap pistols market (I maintain it's even a very viable pocket pistol to boot if preferred--I will sometimes pocket-carry and others use an Israeli Fobus holster which is great). I bought a couple of P11's about 6-7 years ago prior to the Explosion in the small compact CCW market and it was the best choice IMO by far as there were not many alternatives in that size via capacity as a key variable. That said and even today where everybody and their brother has an entry in the small compact CCW market (I was amazed just this past Spring @ the NRA Convention in STL that this segment of our industry seemed to be the focus and a vendor Rep told me that they are seeing a bigger than expected % of their profits coming directly from this niche) the P11 still holds it own and can be argued to be the best little hi-cap 9 to be had. Very reliable for its "intended purpose" which is to PRESERVE LIFE and nothing more. It's simply not a range gun or IMO even fun to shoot but it does allow for me to feel VERY secure for self & family when CCW'ing with it as my primary (Beretta Bobcat 21A is my BUG). If you want something that's small and hi-cap and will go bang when needed in a CQC situation, look no further.

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