The 7.62x54R for hunting: I'm a believer.


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meanmrmustard
November 13, 2012, 09:09 PM
There are better rounds for hunting, this much is true depending greatly on that which one plans to hunt. There are worse as well.

My hunting for the last decade is primarily predator and whitetails; that's all there is here. Either can be taken effectively with the same chambering. I've taken both with many different cartridges, some better than others. One I've found that performed great on both for the ranges I hunt at is the .223 Remington. Light end of the spectrum for song dogs, medium to heavy soft points or bonded rounds for deer at moderate to short range.

Recently, I've been shooting the Mosin...a lot. I've a 1932 hex receiver 91/30. It's heavy, cumbersome, and lets face it, fun. The range of weights it can handle is covered greatly and the ammo, for the most part, is uber cheap. The gun is cheap, the ammo is cheap, what's not to like?
Practice, practice, practice. After several months of shooting different weights, at different ranges, in varying weather and elevation conditions had me making a sight tool out of S7 tool steel and sighting this beast in with 203gr Silver Bear soft points. Groups at 100 yards are inside a baseball. Goody.
Our opening day for firearms deer season was Saturday, November 10th. The day was at an abnormal high: 75 for the high, with southern winds in excess of 25mph and morning drizzles. Not great weather. But, deer are deer rain or shine. So, I climbed into a 30' elevated blind with wraparound porch (we hunt in style!) and sat awaiting the action.

At 7:30am, two large does tried sneaking across a CRP field from a woodblock into a creek bottom. I took aim with the iron sights, putting the larger doe down with a shot to the base of the neck (my only reliable kill shot due to the grass height), dropping her where she stood. The other deer retreated back from whence she came. The distance was 157 yards, neck pass through, and she weighed 178lbs on the hoof.
The evening hunt was even more fun: winds picked up faster, and I was stuck finding a new location. I picked a crick bottom stand, a creek with water in it and a slough of draws and ridges behind me and a whet field to the north and west. Bleating and grunting in between wind gusts up to 5pm, I had a buck in bow range with no open shot. 8 point, big bodied, and I'm hungry. He messed up: after racking on a cedar for several minutes, he walked into the wheat field and at 35 yards, took the 203gr through his right shoulder and out behind his left. The lungs and heart were all pulverized, and he just fell over. No running, no fighting, just one and done.
I've never hunted deer with a round this large (not necessary) but its cheap. I made the most out of practicing and knowing my abilities as well as the rifle's. it's also the first time I've hunted with irons only, with a rifle nearing ten pounds in weight.

For anyone who'd like to try stand hunting with the Mosin Nagant, practice, become efficient, and sight in for you desired round. It's inspired confidence in me while being the only one on my farm to take any deer this weekend (several mishaps), as well as our neighboring farms. A crappy opener turned into a great beginning for a freezer of meat, and a new friendship with an 80 year old war rifle turned deer slayer!

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nathan
November 13, 2012, 09:17 PM
Nice story and advance Thanksgiving Day. ANy pictures?

meanmrmustard
November 13, 2012, 09:18 PM
Nice story and advance Thanksgiving Day. ANy pictures?
Crappy cell phone pics, but I'll try ASAP. Buck was 230ish on the hoof, 195 field dressed. Rack was only about 120, but not bad for public land deer hunting methinks. I'm glad you like the story.

nathan
November 13, 2012, 09:20 PM
If you want to advance to something new, get the Finn M 39 . They can cost a little more but very nice. www.gunsnammo.com

firesky101
November 13, 2012, 09:21 PM
The 7.62x54r has some very respectable power, and I would not hesitate to use it on deer. Glad you had a good time and bagged some meat. Also like the new sig line, I am going to have to go listen to some Weezer now.

meanmrmustard
November 13, 2012, 09:25 PM
If you want to advance to something new, get the Finn M 39 . They can cost a little more but very nice. www.gunsnammo.com
Thank you for the link. The fiancÚ is going to posy my deer picks tomorrow night ( sorry...), I'm anxiously awaiting next weekend for our doe extension! I'll be using the Mosin again with great confidence.

meanmrmustard
November 13, 2012, 09:26 PM
The 7.62x54r has some very respectable power, and I would not hesitate to use it on deer. Glad you had a good time and bagged some meat. Also like the new sig line, I am going to have to go listen to some Weezer now.
Thank you!

Everyone has to Weeze every now and then...

ArchStanton
November 13, 2012, 10:23 PM
only concert I've ever been kicked out of...

morcey2
November 13, 2012, 10:33 PM
only concert I've ever been kicked out of...
If I had a nickel for every time I said that.....:neener:

meanmrmustard
November 14, 2012, 07:23 AM
Sunday, while walking back to the truck with my dad, we were eyeballing cedar trees looking for bedded deer in the rain. He was carrying a .260 Remington, Ruger M77 compact, and spied a doe laying on a hillside at around 70 yards. He whistled, she stood up, and he fired. The deer acted hit but left very little blood. We tracked for a few hours, and found the deer several hundred yards from where it was shot, still alive, laying in a thicket. He put another round in her and down she went. First shot got one lung, second passed through. From what I could tell the .260 didn't expand (ballistic tip Nosler 120gr.) and there was a neat hole roughly bore diameter in the deer. I've never had this problem.

CharlieDeltaJuliet
November 14, 2012, 07:40 AM
Awesome MrMustard, a good buddy has a Mosin. I was surprised by it's accuracy.

Aaron1100us
November 14, 2012, 08:37 AM
I've heard 7.62x54 will take anything in North America. Double Tap has 7.62x54 Moose loads. I'd love to hunt with my 7.62x54 Russian Tiger but we can hunt deer in Iowa with a rifle.

Sent from my PB99400 using Tapatalk 2

fatcat4620
November 14, 2012, 12:07 PM
Why do you need to become "a believer"? Were you not aware of the cartridges ability?

BP Hunter
November 14, 2012, 02:12 PM
Nice shot at 157 yards with open sights!

In another thread about a year ago I remember one of our THR members hunting with the Mosin and harvesting yacks in the frigid Alaska winter. He was very successful with it.

Kachok
November 14, 2012, 02:19 PM
From a ballistics standpoint, if a 308 can kill it so can a 7.62x54R. Absolutly no doubt about it, they will put deer and elk in the freezer. I will say though that it is a tad behind the 30-06 because they can sling heavier lead then their modern counterparts, but CXP2 class game would never know the difference.

ShooterGuy
November 14, 2012, 02:39 PM
I'd easily agree its absolutely a viable round for hunting depending on the game. My most recent with it, was a Bobcat at about 120yrds with my Vepr and a 3-9x40 scope. No more chickens for it....

brnmw
November 14, 2012, 03:14 PM
Why do you need to become "a believer"? Were you not aware of the cartridges ability?

Never been a doubt in my mind, I would not think twice about using it... it's one of my favorites!

I wish more modern gun Mftr. companies offered a new rifle chambered in it. (Hint...Hint... Winchester Model 70 "Metric Express" ;) )> and yes I would be first in line to buy one.

ScrapMetalSlug
November 14, 2012, 03:32 PM
The caliber is excellent for hunting. The reason people don't think it is ideal is because the caliber is mainly available in only old Mosins. The heavy weight people complain about makes shooting a full powered rifle a lot more pleasant than something that weighs 6 or 7 pounds. I remember a few years back shooting a 91/30 at my local range when some old timer was sighting in his rem 700 for deer season. I assume he dismissed it when he saw me firing, but when I brought my target back to the bench he said, "that gun is accurate enough to hunt with!" with an amazed look on his face.
The mosin is more than capable for any deer sized game, and I have dropped deer with 54r as well. You have the ability to practice a ton with relatively cheap ammo, which isn't really possible with the cost of other more modern center fire ammunition in different calibers.

Congrats on your deer. It sure is fun to take deer with a rifle so old and low in cost isn't it:D

meanmrmustard
November 14, 2012, 05:07 PM
Why do you need to become "a believer"? Were you not aware of the cartridges ability?
Not the cartridge, but rather my abilities with the rifle non scoped. The believer aspect was a "see it for yourself" statement. I'm from the Show Me state, after all, and having never hunted with the cartridge/rifle combo I wanted to see what I'd been missing.

meanmrmustard
November 14, 2012, 05:10 PM
Awesome MrMustard, a good buddy has a Mosin. I was surprised by it's accuracy.
Thank you! I too am very impressed. It's not as refined as my K31, but two different deer shot at two different distances in two different locations on the body and both drop! I know it isn't magic (I'd like to think practice was at play), but I'm beginning to have great confidence.

meanmrmustard
November 14, 2012, 05:12 PM
The caliber is excellent for hunting. The reason people don't think it is ideal is because the caliber is mainly available in only old Mosins. The heavy weight people complain about makes shooting a full powered rifle a lot more pleasant than something that weighs 6 or 7 pounds. I remember a few years back shooting a 91/30 at my local range when some old timer was sighting in his rem 700 for deer season. I assume he dismissed it when he saw me firing, but when I brought my target back to the bench he said, "that gun is accurate enough to hunt with!" with an amazed look on his face.
The mosin is more than capable for any deer sized game, and I have dropped deer with 54r as well. You have the ability to practice a ton with relatively cheap ammo, which isn't really possible with the cost of other more modern center fire ammunition in different calibers.

Congrats on your deer. It sure is fun to take deer with a rifle so old and low in cost isn't it:D
Yes it is!

mgkdrgn
November 14, 2012, 07:44 PM
7.62 x 54R will make anything that walks in North America (and most other places as well!) DRT (daid raight thar) with a solid body shot, and even the commercial Privi ammo isn't expensive.

mickeydim468
November 14, 2012, 08:53 PM
I just bought one of these Mosins and I want to know one thing... Where the heck are you finding cheap ammo?

I can't even find any ammo here locally for it. I had to buy the one box I found for it at Big 5 but it cost me $25.00 for 20 rnds. Winchester brand.

I do agree that the rifle surprised me too. Off hand at 100yds I was able to consistently hit a 5" gong using the open sights. Not much kick and easy to hold on target too. Must be the weight of the rifle huh?

Back to the cheap ammo...

Do you have to buy it in bulk on the internet or something? If so, where? Can someone help a fellow shooter out? :confused:

Mike!

ShooterGuy
November 14, 2012, 09:03 PM
Last time I bought was in bulk at Cabelas for spam-can silvertips. Had to ask the guy behind the counter though, they didnt have it out on the floor. They still have it but it looks like a 880rnd box has gone up about $30 since the last time I bought to around $180

Advice though, it's worth it to buy the whole crate just for the big can opener tool that comes attached to the lid, otherwise those spam cans are a pain in the *** to get open.

meanmrmustard
November 14, 2012, 09:33 PM
I just bought one of these Mosins and I want to know one thing... Where the heck are you finding cheap ammo?

I can't even find any ammo here locally for it. I had to buy the one box I found for it at Big 5 but it cost me $25.00 for 20 rnds. Winchester brand.

I do agree that the rifle surprised me too. Off hand at 100yds I was able to consistently hit a 5" gong using the open sights. Not much kick and easy to hold on target too. Must be the weight of the rifle huh?

Back to the cheap ammo...

Do you have to buy it in bulk on the internet or something? If so, where? Can someone help a fellow shooter out? :confused:

Mike!
I got Silver Bear 203gr soft point for roughly $12 for 20 at Sportsmans Warehouse. I bought several boxes, sighted in, practiced, and have taken the two deer thus far in my OP. it's a dandy round, and cheap.

Mine kicks a bit, but the trigger is predictable, making it a deadly stand rifle.

RSR
November 14, 2012, 09:39 PM
I rifle hunted with a Nagant last January and the doe ran about 20 yards.......Needless to say, the whole front quarters were mush. Bad shot, but some of that meat has too many tendons for my likings. Great post mustard.

meanmrmustard
November 14, 2012, 09:40 PM
I rifle hunted with a Nagant last January and the doe ran about 20 yards.......Needless to say, the whole front quarters were mush. Bad shot, but some of that meat has too many tendons for my likings. Great post mustard.
Thank you.

What bullet type were you using?

nathan
November 14, 2012, 09:50 PM
Can't go wrong a 203 gr SP. Thats a lot of kinetic energy .


http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/product_info.php/pName/100rds-762x54r-brown-bear-203gr-sp-ammo/cName/762x54r-soft-point

TrickyDick
November 14, 2012, 10:03 PM
I'm using my 1939 MN 91/30, with Prvi Partisan 147 Gr SP, just iron sights.... except here in maine, we're limited to 1 deer a year (or at least per season) I saw 2 does and a fawn last saturday, about 50-75 yards, i had a doe permit (required in our state to shoot doe) but i'm not the kind of person to shoot a doe with its fawn. hopefully i'll see a nice buck this saturday.

meanmrmustard
November 14, 2012, 10:07 PM
I'm using my 1939 MN 91/30, with Prvi Partisan 147 Gr SP, just iron sights.... except here in maine, we're limited to 1 deer a year (or at least per season) I saw 2 does and a fawn last saturday, about 50-75 yards, i had a doe permit (required in our state to shoot doe) but i'm not the kind of person to shoot a doe with its fawn. hopefully i'll see a nice buck this saturday.
Good luck with the rifle, and your upcoming hunt.

I'm not opposed to shooting a doe with yearling in tow; they're resilient animals with great survival skill. I've not taken one with spots and do not aspire to. I do, however, put meat in the freezer when need be.

Get your buck!

WardenWolf
November 14, 2012, 10:47 PM
If I wasn't so terrible with iron sights, I'd use my Mosin for hunting. I've seen what that 203-grain soft point can do to a hard drive. :)

5rf3_PRNnxI

FYI, the drive exploded into multiple pieces. The bullet hit a screw that goes into the base, resulting in the heavy aluminum base shattering into 3 pieces scattered about 10 feet apart, with other bits of the drive here and there. Don't worry, we cleaned up our mess, including our shell casings.

mickeydim468
November 15, 2012, 12:00 AM
Hope I didn't hijack the thread, but really do appreciate the ammo info.

Isn't 203Gr a bit heavy for this rifle? What about ballistics? Are they available somewhere for this round?

I would like to hunt elk with this rifle next year maybe. Should be good for that here in Oregon huh? Black bear too I would imagine.

Sure a good story Mr Mustard... Keep up the good hunting and story telling too! :)

Mike!

Ignition Override
November 15, 2012, 01:13 AM
Finns vs. Soviets in the Winter War on the Karelian Peninsula.
The Eastern Front. "Enemy At The Gates".

Did the Russian Military Rifle Team with MN 91/30s do quite well against some US Marines in a match?
Their snipers might still be using the SVD.

firesky101
November 15, 2012, 01:18 AM
the original military loading for the 7.62x54r was a 210gr round nose bullet. The twist rate for the M1891 was @ 1 in 9.5" to stabilize this very long bullet. The soviets were not big on changing their tooling, so that twist rate stuck. So a 203gr is well within the capabilities for the 7.62x54r.

mickeydim468
November 15, 2012, 01:27 AM
the original military loading for the 7.62x54r was a 210gr round nose bullet. The twist rate for the M1891 was @ 1 in 9.5" to stabilize this very long bullet. The soviets were not big on changing their tooling, so that twist rate stuck. So a 203gr is well within the capabilities for the 7.62x54r.

Wow, you guys are great. Loading for my 30-06 or 300Win Mag, I find that 150, 165, and 180 Gr, are the most common weights for deer/elk hunting, at least on the heavier side. This is why I thought a 203 Gr bullet would be heavy. I know larger weights IE: 225Gr... are available in 30 Cal, but I thought those were for the larger 300 Wby Mag or 300 RUM cartridges.

Mike!

meanmrmustard
November 15, 2012, 07:43 AM
FiancÚ is going to upload deer pics tonight, she got home late last night.

Thank you for all the kind words and info!

For anyone who doesn't know, the slow, heavy 203 gr is a great round in my opinion. It didn't trash meat, and passed through with relative ease.

WardenWolf
November 15, 2012, 08:27 AM
Hope I didn't hijack the thread, but really do appreciate the ammo info.

Isn't 203Gr a bit heavy for this rifle? What about ballistics? Are they available somewhere for this round?

I would like to hunt elk with this rifle next year maybe. Should be good for that here in Oregon huh? Black bear too I would imagine.

Sure a good story Mr Mustard... Keep up the good hunting and story telling too! :)

Mike!
Most people who handload find rounds in the ~200 grain range to be the most accurate. Additionally, on this rifle at least, the heavier bullet takes away a lot of the recoil's sharpness, and turns it into more of a heavy push. You thus get two benefits: a rifle that's both more accurate and more pleasant to shoot.

nathan
November 15, 2012, 09:31 AM
Back in the 80s i saw a picture of a Siberian native armed with a M 44 taken by National Geographic magazine in the deep snow hunting for Siberian grizzlies.

meanmrmustard
November 15, 2012, 05:58 PM
Most people who handload find rounds in the ~200 grain range to be the most accurate. Additionally, on this rifle at least, the heavier bullet takes away a lot of the recoil's sharpness, and turns it into more of a heavy push. You thus get two benefits: a rifle that's both more accurate and more pleasant to shoot.
Good points. I did notice this contrast between Silver Bear and the surplus I practiced with. Groups tighter, and a less violent shove.

caribou
November 15, 2012, 08:14 PM
hunting with a Mosin is a very doable thang......nothing alive in North America can best it, and its very comparable to the 30-06.

The Mosin Nagant is one fine Rifle. The M-39 is the best of the best.

Consistant ammo is hard to find, but milsurp Czeck and certain Russian are VERY consitant in bullet weight and powder throw, and accurate as ever needs be.

The weight of the M-39 dampens recoil and swing/sway so I get a very solid hold that makes the freestanding, unsuported two tap to the Brain is easy for me with the M-39 as the Tool, even at 400 yards.....I preferr carrying the extra weight when the accuracy and durabilty are assured. Its a Riflemans rifle.


http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g71/edwardhailstone/th_BB11AgnesIandaBrownbear.jpg (http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g71/edwardhailstone/BB11AgnesIandaBrownbear.mp4)

Only accurate rifles are interesting, and the Mosin Nagant is Very interesting:D

meanmrmustard
November 15, 2012, 08:39 PM
FiancÚ loaded pictures boys. They're in the OP. Sorry if they suck, best I could do!!!:)

nathan
November 15, 2012, 10:17 PM
Caribou, how does the grizzly meat taste? Great for grilling ?

caribou
November 15, 2012, 10:43 PM
Baked or fryed fresh.

I only eat it in the Spring, so its a very mild 'Bear' tatste, if any at all. Therfore I only hunt them in the Spring, just when they come outta the den and havent eaten a thing.

No matter the caliber, every Bear gets two bullets....my personal rule.

None of the women in my house, My wife, daughters and all the women in her clan will not eat Bear, their rules..... so I give most of it away to men my age and older, my friends and all, as most women around here wont eat such..

nathan
November 15, 2012, 11:23 PM
Must be a cultural thing for women not to like bear meat? Two shots thats pretty good assurance they are down and done.

meanmrmustard
November 16, 2012, 06:36 AM
hunting with a Mosin is a very doable thang......nothing alive in North America can best it, and its very comparable to the 30-06.

The Mosin Nagant is one fine Rifle. The M-39 is the best of the best.

Consistant ammo is hard to find, but milsurp Czeck and certain Russian are VERY consitant in bullet weight and powder throw, and accurate as ever needs be.

The weight of the M-39 dampens recoil and swing/sway so I get a very solid hold that makes the freestanding, unsuported two tap to the Brain is easy for me with the M-39 as the Tool, even at 400 yards.....I preferr carrying the extra weight when the accuracy and durabilty are assured. Its a Riflemans rifle.


http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g71/edwardhailstone/th_BB11AgnesIandaBrownbear.jpg (http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g71/edwardhailstone/BB11AgnesIandaBrownbear.mp4)

Only accurate rifles are interesting, and the Mosin Nagant is Very interesting:D
Excellent shots. You are obviously a Rifleman.

I feel I need more practice.

Clipper
November 16, 2012, 11:52 AM
I'm always amused by the number of threads about how surprised someone is that they can shoot a rifle that compares ballistically almost exactly with the 30/06, and get 30/06 results! :what:

Shoot... Norma loads 180gr X54 hotter than their '06...

Shadow 7D
November 16, 2012, 12:31 PM
Go look up Caribou's threads in Hunting, then there would be no surprise.

meanmrmustard
November 16, 2012, 06:11 PM
I'm always amused by the number of threads about how surprised someone is that they can shoot a rifle that compares ballistically almost exactly with the 30/06, and get 30/06 results! :what:

Shoot... Norma loads 180gr X54 hotter than their '06...
I wouldn't know, I don't own, shoot, or really care for 30/06. Can't really compare them, other than the handful of times firing the 06, so I don't pretend to do a "VS" write up.

meanmrmustard
November 16, 2012, 08:44 PM
Go look up Caribou's threads in Hunting, then there would be no surprise.
For whom? There is no surprise, merely firsthand evidence that I acquired myself.

gaweidert
November 17, 2012, 04:54 PM
On another site a few years ago a guy did a thread of a black bear e took in in Pennsylvania using the 203 grain SP round in his Mosin Nagant. 30-06 is essentially the same as the 7.62 x 54r /Russian round. Just 15 years younger.

repawn
November 20, 2012, 05:16 PM
I used my mosin to take this buck at 50 yards using 150gr sp handloads. It dropped on the spot. I was in a stand - my mosin is a 1929 Tula hex receiver. I can easily shoot 2" groups at 100yds.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/11/21/avedeve9.jpg

nathan
November 20, 2012, 05:54 PM
Thanks to Mother Russia for making these great rifles be available to us at affordable prices. The 54 R is lot of power even in today's standard considering its 122 yrs old. Amazing .
Im proud i got several collection of the Mosin nagant and the Finn M 39 which i used to take a wild hog. The Seller Belliot 180 gr SP is also one of the best commercial loads out there and very accurate. Only ammunitiontogo has them from what i know.

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