Poor quality WIN primers in 45ACP range brass


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FROGO207
November 14, 2012, 05:38 PM
A beginning reloader that I am teaching stopped by the other night and wanted me to go over 40 S&W loading with him as he had a few questions. After the rounds were loaded and questions answered he produced a bag of 45ACP range brass for me he had saved as a thank you. :) Anyway I started to decap them this afternoon and some of them would catch in the shell holder with the top of the primer half ripped off. I also found upon inspecting there were several others that had ripped completely off. Found a total of 36 in the pile. All of them were Winchester head stamped with a dot on each side between the brand on the top and 45 auto stamps on the bottom. The primer also looked like it was made out of the same brass as the casing as they both were shaded the exact same way. I am thinking that they were from a couple boxes of premium SD ammo as there were not 50 0f them in the pile. The brass was clean and not tarnished at all so I feel it was not due to corrosion. Anyone else having problems decapping this crap? Or is this an isolated thing?

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tightgroup tiger
November 14, 2012, 07:54 PM
Honestly, I''ve never seen or even heard of this with decapping cases. I've been doing this for a long time, 41years now, I wounder if the primers were glued in with locktite or something. I have had people tell me they use it for sealer. Always sounded like a big mistake waiting to happen to me.

Sorry Frog, can't help you.

john16443
November 15, 2012, 10:41 AM
Winchester primers have a brass color like the cases, and factory Winchester ammo uses brass colored primers. So far as having troubles decapping this brass, haven't had any issues with any known first fired factory Win brass I collect at the range.

Frog - take a close look at these cases and confirm that they are NOT sized to accept small pistol primers instead of LPP's.

FROGO207
November 15, 2012, 09:23 PM
I have some small primer cases---mostly CCI and these are not that, the head is indeed ripping off the primer and leaving the complete side rim in the primer pocket or leaving tab that catches the shell holder. If I can get a clear enough picture tomorrow with my crappy camera I will post some evidence up for you.

Any way whatever is going on these casings are nothing but scrap now.:(

Cleftwynd
November 16, 2012, 02:54 AM
Have you tried a primer pocket uniformer on these? The bit might grab the remaining portion and twist it out.

I have heard of some bad lots of winchester primers lately, Winchester has been great about making it right though.

USSR
November 16, 2012, 07:37 AM
FROGO207,

While I have never had this happen with handgun brass, I have had it happen with some once-fired USGI Remington produced 7.62x51 brass that I bought. The decapping pin punches thru the primer and the sides of the primer are left in the primer pocket. It is indeed very frustrating.

Don

KeithET
November 16, 2012, 05:19 PM
I have had some primers that the decapping pin just punched right through. They were all due to crimped primers on some 5.56 brass. Sometimes the crimp is real tight. Did it look like your primers were crimped?

KeithET

FROGO207
November 16, 2012, 05:33 PM
No the primers were not crimped. Also the punch did not pierce the primer the whole top was ripped off leaving the sides of the primer in the pocket. I just think that Winchester loaded some poor quality primers (as far as for brass reuse by reloaders) in their brass. They are not planning on reloading this stuff so they probably do not care if it is like this or not.

USSR I have had this happen here and there with brass that had weathered some but not with new looking brass before.:(

I mainly posted this so anyone that has the problem will see what the problem is.:cool:

MarshallDodge
November 16, 2012, 06:06 PM
Strange. I have averaged 3000 rounds of 45ACP per year over the last 20 years and I have seen two cases with this issue.

Must be bad primers.

0VERKILL
November 17, 2012, 11:32 AM
I've had that happen too, looks like a soup can with the lid still hanging by a small tab. They can be a pain to get out of the shellholder with the "lid" still hangin on. I had always assumed it was water, or the slight acidity of rain rather, that caused it since it's always happened with weathered cases.
If I read it right your friend gave you these after he fired them himself? You didn't say they looked weathered but maybe ask him if there were any not his laying around he picked up.
My theories, and only theories are that there must have been something wrong with the primers. I know the priming compound is put in wet for safety. I wonder if they were kept damp too long if that would weaken the brass? Another thing I wonder is if the corners were too rounded and when fired they stretch out sqaure with the primer pocket it may have left the edges thin and weak, although if the primer pocket were too rounded I suppose it would have the same effect. Keep in mind I'm just throwing thoughts out there not known facts.
I do know that one of the cases I had that happen on was Winchester. I made a keychain out of that 357 Mag case and still have it. It was brown, not brass colored, when I found it so I assumed it was weathering. I'll check my scrap brass box to see if I have any more that I've not hauled off and check the headstamp. I can say it's happened to me a lot more with pistol brass though.

mdi
November 17, 2012, 12:47 PM
Jes a thought. Measure the case head to see if mebbe the brass was loaded to higher levels. Mebbe high pressure damaging the primer cups?

Kp321
November 18, 2012, 10:08 AM
I have had this problem a few times, but always on brass that had been wet for one reason or another. I have tried to salvage some but the primer wall is stuck TIGHT. Just toss in scrap bucket.

Ky Larry
November 18, 2012, 06:48 PM
In my 38 years of reloading range pickups, I have never had this happen. No matter how long I reload, I am constantly learning.

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