Buying two guns at a time?


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CoyoteSix
November 16, 2012, 03:10 AM
Hey all, I'm saving to buy a Ruger 22/45. However I know I want more than one eventually.

So I thought: "Why not save a little longer and buy two?" :D

Is there any legislation against buying more than one gun at a time from an FFL? :scrutiny:

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CoyoteSix
November 16, 2012, 03:13 AM
Also worth noting I live in Idaho. :D

allaroundhunter
November 16, 2012, 03:15 AM
Well there isn't anything keeping you from buying two at once legally, but I don't see the reason to wait?

If you have the funds to purchase one and you want it, then get it. Once the funds have accumulated again you can buy another if it is what you still want.

CoyoteSix
November 16, 2012, 03:25 AM
Two is one and one is none. :p

Besides, I like backups. :D

MaterDei
November 16, 2012, 05:16 AM
No federal prohibition. Not sure about Idaho, but doubt it's a problem.

mnrivrat
November 16, 2012, 05:19 AM
Be aware that there is additional paperwork to send into the Gov by the FFL when you purchase more than one handgun at a time.
Not illegal to buy two , but some FFL's make it a policy to only sell one at a time because of this, and some state laws may apply (although your state might not have a regulation)

weblance
November 16, 2012, 09:56 AM
Be aware that there is additional paperwork to send into the Gov by the FFL when you purchase more than one handgun at a time.
Not illegal to buy two , but some FFL's make it a policy to only sell one at a time because of this, and some state laws may apply (although your state might not have a regulation)

I have bought multiple guns, numerous times in my life. If I ever was at a shop, and they told me they could only sell me one gun, because of extra paperwork... that would be the last time they saw my money.

JohnM
November 16, 2012, 10:05 AM
Idaho is about like here. Buy as many as you want, or can afford. :)

allaroundhunter
November 16, 2012, 10:07 AM
Two is one and one is none.

Besides, I like backups.

Yes, but that doesn't answer my question as to why you have to wait to buy the first one until you can afford another. I am all for having two, but it would make more sense to buy one now, and when the funds allow buy the other as a back up. Otherwise, you don't even have one to practice with in the meantime.

evan price
November 16, 2012, 10:08 AM
ATF has a reporting form (3310.4, "Report of multiple sale or other disposition of handguns or revolvers") you fill out for multiple handgun purchases, a copy goes to your local LEO. Otherwise, it's no big deal. I bought SIX at one time once.

Reloadron
November 16, 2012, 10:20 AM
Just for clarification as to multiple handgun purchases:

This form is to be used by licensees to report all transactions in which an unlicensed person acquired two or more pistols or revolvers or any combination of pistols or revolvers totaling two or more at one time or during five consecutive business days. This form is not required when the pistols or revolvers are returned to the same person from whom they are received.

The actual form can be viewed here. (http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-3310-4.pdf)

Aside from all that stuff the merit to buying more than a single gun would be the possible price deal at a small privately owned shop.

Ron

Kyle M.
November 16, 2012, 10:28 AM
For years my lgs refused to sell multiple handguns to a customer because he didn't want to fill out the form. He let that slip during an inspection once and the ATF got on his case pretty bad about it. I've actually bought multiple handguns from other shops that didn't even tell you about the multiple sales form, of course I already knew about it and when I asked them they told me they are not required to inform you of it. Not sure if thats true or not but thats what I was told by the clerk.

PBR Streetgang
November 16, 2012, 10:35 AM
I was told by my local FFL here in Fl you get flagged by ATF if you buy two or more handguns in the period of a week of less. They don't stop you but it is noticed.

JohnM
November 16, 2012, 10:36 AM
None of us like some of this record keeping the Feds insist on, but I don't lose any sleep over it.

geekWithA.45
November 16, 2012, 10:52 AM
Be aware that the requirement for the ATF to periodically purge their paperwork does not apply to transactions deemed to be "suspicious." Records of suspicious purchases may be kept indefinately.

My understanding is that multiple purchases are designated to be in that category.

Krogen
November 16, 2012, 10:59 AM
It's also worth noting that the typical 4473 form is retained by the FFL until such time they go out of business. The multiple handgun form goes right to the BATFE. No sense in tugging the tail of the tiger, IMHO. Just wait the 5 day interval before you buy the 2nd gun.

AlexanderA
November 16, 2012, 11:49 AM
One reason to buy two at the same time is the chance of getting consecutive serial numbers. (These are the sorts of things that matter to collectors, but maybe not to anyone else.)

22-rimfire
November 16, 2012, 11:56 AM
I don't believe there are any restrictions to buying two firearms at the same time in Idaho. Some states have a gun a month restriction as I recall. In my state, you would save a little money on the NICs check fee as it would be the same check for two guns rather than one.

aarondhgraham
November 16, 2012, 12:08 PM
I say order them at the same time.

I did exactly what the OP is considering doing,,,
I purchased a pair of the newer 22/45's with removable grip panels.

I got the Stainless Steel, 5.5" slab-side barrel target version.

One advantage of buying two is getting the exact same model handgun,,,
If you buy one model today it might not be available tomorrow.

I ordered mine from budsgunshop.com and inquired about consecutive serial numbers,,,
I was told that they really couldn't guarantee that service for me,,,
The pistols were drop-shipped from somewhere else.

Ruger availability of some models has been iffy as of late,,,
Not Ruger's fault for the shortage though,,,
They have just been selling fast.

Two months after I ordered my pair,,,
That same model disappeared from Ruger's website,,,
Not long after that budsgunshop.com listed them as being sold out.

If I would have waited,,,
I would not have a matched pair.

I have these pistols cased in a nice wooden box I purchased from Cabela's,,,
They are my Modern Dueling Pistols.

Someday I'll take a picture of the "dueling set".

Aarond

.

Kyle M.
November 16, 2012, 12:28 PM
I don't believe there are any restrictions to buying two firearms at the same time in Idaho. Some states have a gun a month restriction as I recall. In my state, you would save a little money on the NICs check fee as it would be the same check for two guns rather than one.

I never knew that there were states that charged a fee for the NICS check. I've bought 2, 3, or even 4 handguns at once so many times I can't begin to count them. I don't lose any sleep over the multiple purchases form.

1911fan
November 16, 2012, 01:13 PM
I see that no one got around to mentioning the fact that gun prices are going nowhere but UP.:what:

Here, I think the concept might be layaway. You get to freeze prices as well as guarantee that the guns will be there for you when you are ready for them.

You'll still be saving, but the gunshop will be holding the money. This is actually safer--unless you're keeping the $$ in the bank, any cash stash is vulnerable to break ins and casual pilfering by relatives/roomates.:fire:

Besides, if the LGS has it, you won't be able to spend it on frivilous things like food, clothing, shelter and car repairs.:evil:

I'd look into it...if you have two guns you want, you can put them on layaway on the same day, just use different tickets. That way, you can pay more on one and the minimum on the other until you have the first one paid off and picked up, then up your ante until you get the second one.

With used guns, however, dealers are MUCH more likely to bundle if you have a stack o' cash in hand. I once bought a Marlin 30-30 and a Savage 20ga pump for $400 OTD, just because I had the $$$ in hand.

The only other comment I have is that gun buyers seem to want their latest gun in hand RIGHT NOW then start saving the the next one...

Whichever way you go, good luck--

ed

mavracer
November 16, 2012, 02:17 PM
As long as the state has no restriction, buying more than one handgun a week just make the FFL send in a form to local Sheriff and Feds. As long as your not buying a dozen Hi points you wont hear anything about it.
I've bought 2-4 guns at a time a few times and never heard a peep.

aarondhgraham
November 16, 2012, 02:25 PM
I just checked the Ruger website,,,
And the model of 22/45 I ordered isn't there any more.

This was just about 1 year ago when I ordered my pair of 22/45's.

So like I said,,,
If the Rugers you want are available,,,
Do not hesitate but buy them as soon as you are able to.

Aarond

.

JBrady555
November 16, 2012, 04:09 PM
in florida it means extra paperwork for my FFL. I'd rather wait one day for the next gun and save him the time.

1 old 0311-1
November 16, 2012, 04:30 PM
Two you should be OK. I bought 3 and my FFL told me I will get a visit from BATF. 3 weeks later I did.:)

mgmorden
November 16, 2012, 04:51 PM
I was told by my local FFL here in Fl you get flagged by ATF if you buy two or more handguns in the period of a week of less. They don't stop you but it is noticed.

This is gunshop hearsay, but one of the guys doing a CWP training class once told me that the basic deal was that if they submit the form and the ATF sees you buying a 1911, a Beretta, a .22 pistol, and a Colt Revolver, then you don't have anything to worry about. If they see you buying 10 Hi-points at a time then expect a call very soon.

The Hi-point brand wasn't the main thing, but basically if they see you buying large numbers of identical guns that have no collector's value, then they'll likely look into it. Two you could probably get away with being identical though, just don't buy a dozen of em :).

If you'll notice the Form 4473's that have the make/model of the gun don't usually get turns into ATF, and the NICS check doesn't report that information (just handgun or longgun). The multiple purchase report does go straight to the ATF though and does have make/model info on it.

1 old 0311-1
November 16, 2012, 05:16 PM
I bought 3 pre lock S&W K frames was TOLD the ATF would visit, and they DID.

Reloadron
November 16, 2012, 05:39 PM
in florida it means extra paperwork for my FFL. I'd rather wait one day for the next gun and save him the time.
If you go back and look at my post number 12 and read the link I provided you will see that waiting a day or two or three will not preclude the additional form being completed and filed by your FFL.

Years ago I believe the trigger limit for a sale was 5 guns. I had a regular customer come into some money and he bought over 5 guns (handguns) and we submitted the form with his knowledge and he got a call from ATF. It was no big deal as their concern was he wasn't buying 5 or more guns in Ohio and planning a trip to say NYC to sell some guns on the street.

Ron

Ehtereon11B
November 16, 2012, 05:39 PM
Buying 2 doesn't raise any red flags. Buying 3 in the same caliber (.45) while using a school address, does.

1 old 0311-1
November 16, 2012, 06:25 PM
When BATF came to visit me after my 3 at once purchase they said they were concerned about guns ending up in Chicago. I opened my safe and showed them 100% of my handguns were S&W wheelies and asked them how many gangs want wheelies. They said they were just concerned about Chicago. I said YES, I see the problem but it's that the good guys CAN'T GET/CARRY GUNS in Chicago but street punks do.
There was no retort on their part.;););)

Reloadron
November 16, 2012, 06:29 PM
When BATF came to visit me after my 3 at once purchase they said they were concerned about guns ending up in Chicago. I opened my safe and showed them 100% of my handguns were S&W wheelies and asked them how many gangs want wheelies. They said they were just concerned about Chicago. I said YES, I see the problem but it's that the good guys CAN'T GET/CARRY GUNS in Chicago but street punks do.
There was no retort on their part.;););)
Yeah, for you it was Chicago and for my customer it was NYC. :)

Ron

1 old 0311-1
November 16, 2012, 06:50 PM
Hi Reloadron,

The BATF is REAL concerned over the possibility of one or two handguns ending up in Chicago, or NY, BUT 2500 high cap assault weapons can slide to Mexico without a problem.:eek:

Reloadron
November 16, 2012, 06:56 PM
Hi Reloadron,

The BATF is REAL concerned over the possibility of one or two handguns ending up in Chicago, or NY, BUT 2500 high cap assault weapons can slide to Mexico without a problem.:eek:
Yeah, now go figure huh? :)

Also interesting is the major flap going on right now with High Point involving straw purchases. The dealer who was selling guns that had a habit of ending up at crime scenes in Buffalo claims he was submitting the forms. Apparently nobody on the government side was reading the forms?

Ron

FROGO207
November 16, 2012, 07:13 PM
I shall await my visit from ATF for ordering in a bakers dozen High Points for my collection (shoot a different one every month and a spare for new-years) to thumb my nose after the second debate.:D Just for the .gov to help them spend the time to check on little ole me.;)

jakk280rem
November 16, 2012, 09:56 PM
Just to be thorough, in Oregon there is a $10 bgc fee. It is good for a 24 hour period. Buying multiple firearms in a single transaction can save you a bit of money in the long run. Other states with fees may be similar.

9mmfan
November 17, 2012, 03:35 AM
Buying two guns at a time?
Hey, I got two hands. :cool::evil:

mgkdrgn
November 17, 2012, 03:05 PM
some FFL's make it a policy to only sell one at a time because of this

Only the ones that don't like making money, or have some sort of local prohibition.

I just sold 10 (yes, ten) Nagant M1895 revolvers to a fellow yesterday, and just finished selling another two to a guy that came by this morning.

Do I have to do an extra piece of paper ... yes. Do I care? No.

JBrady555
November 18, 2012, 03:02 AM
If you go back and look at my post number 12 and read the link I provided you will see that waiting a day or two or three will not preclude the additional form being completed and filed by your FFL.

Years ago I believe the trigger limit for a sale was 5 guns. I had a regular customer come into some money and he bought over 5 guns (handguns) and we submitted the form with his knowledge and he got a call from ATF. It was no big deal as their concern was he wasn't buying 5 or more guns in Ohio and planning a trip to say NYC to sell some guns on the street.

Ron
Ok I would wait 6 days to save on the paperwork, I didn't realize that it was 2 or more within a 5 day period. I thought it was just a 24 hour period, learned something new today.

theautobahn
November 18, 2012, 12:26 PM
Be aware that there is additional paperwork to send into the Gov by the FFL when you purchase more than one handgun at a time.
Not illegal to buy two , but some FFL's make it a policy to only sell one at a time because of this, and some state laws may apply (although your state might not have a regulation)

The multiple handgun form, if I'm not mistaken, is required if you purchase two or more handguns from the same FFL within 5 business days. I don't know of any gunshop that won't sell two at a time, but I've heard of one or two that might gently recommend coming back in a week to purchase the second one.

Also, I've heard from multiple FFL's that the odds of getting a visit from ATF/LEO's after a multiple handgun purchase runs on the high side of 50%.

When BATF came to visit me after my 3 at once purchase they said they were concerned about guns ending up in Chicago. I opened my safe and showed them 100% of my handguns were S&W wheelies and asked them how many gangs want wheelies. They said they were just concerned about Chicago. I said YES, I see the problem but it's that the good guys CAN'T GET/CARRY GUNS in Chicago but street punks do.
There was no retort on their part.

I don't think I would let them into my house and definitely wouldn't open my safe for them. If I've already got a "black mark" on my record for a multiple handgun purchase, how much worse can talking to them on the stoop instead of letting them in make it?

Kp321
November 18, 2012, 01:01 PM
I too advise my customers about the multiple sales paperwork. Some say go ahead and others come back the next week. Us lucky dealers in "border states" also have to submit multiple sales forms on "assault rifle" purchases in addition to handguns.

CountryUgly
November 18, 2012, 07:13 PM
I say do it! I've been known to pull the occasional two-fer myself.

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