Glock 17 v. H&K USP for loaded chamber carry.


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el Godfather
November 29, 2012, 02:27 PM
Dear THR:
I have both USP 9 and Glock 17. I always carry with a loaded chamber. I want to know which do you think is a better option among the two when carrying while chamber loaded?

Off course, other then internal safeties Glock has none other. Whereas on USP you can carry it loaded and cocked, cocked and locked, de-cocked, and de-cocked and locked.

I personally prefer the USP with a loaded chamber. Generally de-cocked and locked unless situation and circumstances dictate otherwise. I have carried Glock 17 with loaded chamber and I am fine with that as well. Just felt to utilize the variety of options available on USP.


Thanks.

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2wheels
November 29, 2012, 02:47 PM
In absolute terms, I'd say the USP is safer. A safety + a longer and heavier DA trigger pull makes AD/NDs a little harder.

On the other hand, there's the argument that the Glock doesn't have a safety to forget (if you use it) or a long/heavy initial DA trigger pull to deal with.

That said, a competent gun owner who trains with and takes care of his equipment should be safe carrying either gun.

hAkron
November 29, 2012, 02:56 PM
The one you can still use to defend yourself in the (very unlikely) event that the safety on the other one fails.

psyopspec
November 29, 2012, 03:00 PM
Either. If a person is competent and safe in their gun handling, the Glock is fine. If they are not, a safety liver will not protect them from their own negligence.

hardluk1
November 29, 2012, 03:48 PM
I have no worry about ether one. I have carreid stricker pistols for 6 years + that have no other safety other than in the trigger/fireing system. I will not carry a handgun for defence that has or needs any external safety.

Bovice
November 29, 2012, 03:55 PM
I have heard of Glock ADs when holstering because of clothing being drug into the trigger guard and snagging. The standard glock has neither a heavy or long trigger pull.

The USP will have a DA first pull if the safety is off and carried hammer down. That's harder to AD.

jcredman
November 29, 2012, 04:03 PM
I agee with Bovice, the term glock leg just didntvcome from out of thin air, that being said , I own both and have carried both, just a bit more comfortable with a safety, especially under concealment

Robbins290
November 29, 2012, 04:45 PM
pratice makes perfect. I won't wanna try to manipulate a safety in a situation where I only have one hand. I want to be able to draw and pull as soon as humanly possible. I carry my 30sf that way. I was nervous at first, but with caution and pratice. I'm 100% confindant.

Dan-O
November 29, 2012, 05:07 PM
My first handgun that I purchased the day I turned 21 was an HK USP 9mm. At the time I was young and dumb and thought that a handgun might mistakenly fire if it didn't have an external/manual safety.

Now that I am quite a bit older and more experienced with firearms....especially handguns, I carry a Glock on a daily basis as my CC weapon.

Skribs
November 29, 2012, 05:32 PM
Not voting. Both should be safe if you're following the four rules and using a proper holster. Both can cause NDs if you don't. Thinking one is safer probably makes that one more dangerous by the very virtue that you won't practice as safe handling with that one. That said, I'd rather have the Glock between the two.

el Godfather
November 29, 2012, 11:55 PM
Robbins
Why usp safety is a problem when using one hand?

56hawk
November 30, 2012, 12:22 AM
Easy answer for me since the USP was my first choice for concealed carry. I usually carry mine cocked and locked with a holster that has a thumb strap that goes between the hammer and slide. Any other time it's decocked with the safety on.

Bobson
November 30, 2012, 12:48 AM
It did take me quite a while to get used to carrying my Glock 19 with a round in the chamber, even knowing the obvious benefits and importance of doing so. I carried it for close to three weeks without a round in the chamber, because I just couldn't get used to the idea of carrying with the round chambered without a safety - despite knowing cops do it every day all over the country.

Once I forced myself to get past that, it was only a day or two before it stopped bothering me. All that to say I think both are just fine, but the USP definitely offers more options, which you pointed out. I wouldn't hesitate to carry a USP in any configuration you mentioned, and I actually did vote for the USP in your poll. Mostly because of the various carry options Glocks just don't offer.

RBid
November 30, 2012, 03:56 AM
Either.

Inebriated
November 30, 2012, 04:10 AM
I carried Glock since day one.

I'm comfortable carrying it Condition 1, so obviously I'd be comfortable carrying a DA/SA in Condition 1.

Heck, give me a revolver cocked with a hair trigger, and I'd carry it. As long as the gun is in proper working order, is in a holster, and I keep my finger off the trigger, it doesn't matter what the trigger mechanism is.

Jed Carter
November 30, 2012, 07:47 AM
I would carry what ever I shot better, what I can draw and hit a target multiple times the fastest. It's been said "If it wasn't dangerous I wouldn't carry the damn thing" I agree.

jon86
November 30, 2012, 08:05 AM
Not voting. Both should be safe if you're following the four rules and using a proper holster. Both can cause NDs if you don't.

Yeah, this.

Bovice
November 30, 2012, 11:14 AM
Some people are incorrectly thinking the HK requires disengagement of a safety to fire. That's not necessarily true. It can be carried decocked with the safety off, like you would any standard SIG Sauer pistol.

It's not me keeping my fingers off the trigger that worries me. It's that jacket hood toggle dangling into my holster that snags the trigger during a reholstering. Plus, having an exposed hammer allows you to place your thumb over it while reholstering. If the trigger is snagged, it has to push your thumb out of the way in addition to the DA pull weight.

More layers of safety are better.

el Godfather
December 1, 2012, 05:37 AM
If I am not mistaken pt92 has safety/decock set up like usp,, but off course it taurus

Onmilo
December 1, 2012, 06:12 AM
I have both and carry both "chamber loaded".
Both are equally as safe as the other.

Girodin
December 1, 2012, 02:49 PM
They are both perfectly safe to carry with a loaded chamber provided proper gun handling. Without proper gun handling neither is safe. I think the original question is kind of silly (I was trying to find a nice word to use) and loaded chamber would not factor one bit into which I would prefer.

481
December 1, 2012, 02:53 PM
I own both, but usually carry the Glock 17 due to it's less bulky design.

SwampWolf
December 1, 2012, 05:10 PM
They are both perfectly safe to carry with a loaded chamber provided proper gun handling. Without proper gun handling neither is safe.

I agree with this synopsis. But I'm also of the opinion that the Glock is a less "forgiving" design in the context "to err is human"...

Knockdownpower
December 1, 2012, 06:28 PM
I have a Glocks and a HK USP 45 compact, (same decock & safty sys. and the 9mm) and I always carry +1 in both designs. Perfectly safe as long as I am.

Fremmer
December 1, 2012, 06:37 PM
With all those different carry options on the hk, better pick one and use it exclusively.

So you carry hammer down safety on, first shot double action?

allaroundhunter
December 1, 2012, 08:14 PM
El Godfather,

Why do you prefer to carry decocked with safety on?

Warp
December 1, 2012, 09:27 PM
Both.

el Godfather
December 1, 2012, 09:38 PM
allrounder
Like I said, its dictated by the circumstances. Thats mostly when I am in office when i am in office, just an added safety measure- I know there is no need for it. I am a politician and sometimes I go to places where I have to take my pistol off and hand it to my policeman for a while or something. At which point safety on makes lots of sense. Sometimes I dont have time nor i looks appropriate that I stand in hallways and clear my weapon before handing it to him. The few policemen who are detailed with me are well aware of my carry methods and well trained themselves.

FIVETWOSEVEN
December 2, 2012, 12:31 AM
I won't wanna try to manipulate a safety in a situation where I only have one hand.

I swipe the safety off when the gun is first clearing the holster. One hand is used. It becomes instinctual and you don't think about it.

PabloJ
December 2, 2012, 12:33 AM
Dear THR:
I have both USP 9 and Glock 17. I always carry with a loaded chamber. I want to know which do you think is a better option among the two when carrying while chamber loaded?

Off course, other then internal safeties Glock has none other. Whereas on USP you can carry it loaded and cocked, cocked and locked, de-cocked, and de-cocked and locked.

I personally prefer the USP with a loaded chamber. Generally de-cocked and locked unless situation and circumstances dictate otherwise. I have carried Glock 17 with loaded chamber and I am fine with that as well. Just felt to utilize the variety of options available on USP.


Thanks.
It makes no difference unless you want to carry Glock in huge pocket or in male purse. If that is so then by all means choose the H&K pistol.

Warp
December 2, 2012, 12:34 AM
It makes no difference unless you want to carry Glock in huge pocket or in male purse. If that is so then by all means choose the H&K pistol.

Even in a pocket, purse, bag, etc...a holster should still be used.

PabloJ
December 2, 2012, 12:35 AM
Yes, I would not want to ruin my Filson 'tin coat' those are dreadfully expensive.

Robbins290
December 2, 2012, 09:53 AM
good point 527

el Godfather
December 5, 2012, 11:22 PM
Well thats the point. If one is trained enough to make it just routine to disengage safety as pistol is leaving holster then I believe USP becomes a better choice.

allaroundhunter
December 5, 2012, 11:31 PM
Well thats the point. If one is trained enough to make it just routine to disengage safety as pistol is leaving holster then I believe USP becomes a better choice.

Well, better choice is an opinion and what is a better choice for one person is not necessarily a better choice for another. Me personally? If something could possibly go wrong on me, it will go wrong. For that reason I prefer to have extra safety measures in place.

However, the other part of me knows that with a proper holster nothing short of a free pistol* is going to go off on its own.


*Free pistols are a generic term for handguns used in 50m pistol competitions with trigger weights that can go down to just grams. If the gun is held muzzle up, the weight of the trigger alone will cause the gun to discharge.

Free Pistol (http://www.gun-tests.com/performance/sept97freepistol.html)

el Godfather
December 6, 2012, 01:10 AM
I dont think I will be ccw a competition pistol.

dirtengineer
December 6, 2012, 01:46 AM
While shooting IDPA, I have failed to disengage the safety more than once. Never had that happen when I was shooting my Glock.

My problem is I shoot several different pistols of different configurations. I now only carry my four that don't have external safeties. One less mistake to make.

Of course, you have to have a good holster that covers the trigger and train to keep your finger off the trigger. This should be standard regardless of the pistol features.

mljdeckard
December 7, 2012, 10:43 AM
Neither one allows for unsafe gun handling. Both require training and minimum competency.

Onmilo
December 7, 2012, 12:47 PM
As we all know, the Glock "Safety" is on the trigger.
Keep your finger OFF the trigger until your sights are aligned on your target.
My 9mm USP is a variant 3, decocking lever on the left side of frame.
If you need to move position you can use this lever to decock the weapon rendering it safer than running with a fully cocked firearm.
It also makes the weapon safer to decock when holstering the weapon for carry.
My USP Elite .45 is a variant god only knows what which is a variant 1 & 2 combined. (ambidextrous safety lever)
In other words, the lever can function as a decocking lever or it can be pressed up a la 1911 to function as a manual safety which allows the gun to be transported or holster carried in condition one, chambered, cocked, & locked.
All are slightly different in application and all are just as safe as the other if one takes the time to practice and familiarize with the system of operation.
With familiarity most people will find a system that works well for them and that they feel comfortable with.

Corpral_Agarn
December 7, 2012, 04:42 PM
I think DA/SA, no safety, is the better system for Concealed Carry.
I like the long heavy pull of the DA followed by the lighter shorter SA when you really need it. Of course: YMMV

David White
December 7, 2012, 10:45 PM
I bought the S&W M&P .40 caliber with the optional manual safety.
I've had Glocks and I don't like a pistol without a manual safety.
I started years ago with the 1911 pistol and all my guns since have had safety's.
It feels weird to me if its not there...

TheReiver
December 8, 2012, 02:02 AM
I voted Glock personally. My 17 had a 3.5 pound trigger and I always carried it chambered. Make sure your holster covers the trigger and exercise good trigger discipline (as with any firearm). Mechanical safeties make me anxious......

David E
December 8, 2012, 02:20 AM
Whereas on USP you can carry it loaded and cocked, cocked and locked, de-cocked, and de-cocked and locked.

I personally prefer the USP with a loaded chamber. Generally de-cocked and locked unless situation and circumstances dictate otherwise.


Changing the ready condition of your carrygun is never a good idea.

Pick a way, then practice that way all the time.

Robbins290
December 9, 2012, 08:11 AM
I agree david e. should stick with one way and pratice.

el Godfather
December 9, 2012, 01:23 PM
I am well trained in handling both ways. My circumstances dictate this.

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