Old C&R 870 Wingmaster, beat up gun project


PDA






AJAX22
December 1, 2012, 04:12 AM
atyqGpR0gQs


I dug through the garage and have dusted off this rainy day project that I've been saving...

She's an early 1950's Remington wingmaster 12 gauge, the receiver was found in a barn in the midwest

I have been picking up internals as I find them...

The concept behind this gun is "Honest Wear"

I'm trying to put togeather a rock solid, reliable shotgun, that is pieced together from parts that have honest wear.

The barrel that I'm using right now is wayyyyyy too nice, but its what I had in the parts bin.

It should be a straightforward project, just a matter of tracking down a bit here, a bit there...

I think I'm missing forend nut.... mag tube spring.... some wood.... a truly ugly barrel..... maybe an uglier/more worn shell lifting gate.... a stock bolt.... and i think some internals are missing from the trigger group... and I could use some help putting the trigger group together

If you enjoyed reading about "Old C&R 870 Wingmaster, beat up gun project" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Nappers
December 1, 2012, 04:22 AM
I really enjoy your video's and effort to keep these old guns alive!

I have some wooden stocks if needed.

AJAX22
December 1, 2012, 04:32 AM
I really enjoy your video's and effort to keep these old guns alive!

I have some wooden stocks if needed.

Thanks,

I derive a lot of satisfaction from keeping them shooting...

A gun that can shoot is a tangible representation of freedom, a broken gun is a travesty
Do you have any well worn wood?

I've been thinking about trying to find a really beat up Law enforcement top folding stock for her... and running a wood forend (probably a police model with the corncob)

not sure yet though... I'm looking for something that 'speaks to me'

btg3
December 1, 2012, 01:09 PM
Do you have any well worn wood?


This brings to mind the "antique-ing" fad with furniture afficionados to impart the appearance of "honest wear". At least that was the concept, without getting overly technical as to precisely how truly honest the result might be as long as the image is effective to the consumer. The nuances of honest wear versus neglect, repair, induced-wear, parts cannibalized from questionable origin, etc are all insignificant. In that spirit, you have a perfect palate to work with. I'm envious in that this is a project I would also enjoy. Wish I had the parts you're needing, but my wood is the checkered Express. Although I have trigger groups for both Express and Wingmaster, they're like new, so they'd require some work to make them ugly. Have fun!

AJAX22
December 1, 2012, 03:45 PM
This brings to mind the "antique-ing" fad with furniture afficionados to impart the appearance of "honest wear". At least that was the concept, without getting overly technical as to precisely how truly honest the result might be as long as the image is effective to the consumer. The nuances of honest wear versus neglect, repair, induced-wear, parts cannibalized from questionable origin, etc are all insignificant. In that spirit, you have a perfect palate to work with. I'm envious in that this is a project I would also enjoy. Wish I had the parts you're needing, but my wood is the checkered Express. Although I have trigger groups for both Express and Wingmaster, they're like new, so they'd require some work to make them ugly. Have fun!

Thanks, its going to be a great project.....

Its surprising how hard it is to find ugly gun parts

AJAX22
December 2, 2012, 02:50 PM
kLUc5kTJa3A

First electrolysis bath results are in...

gp911
December 2, 2012, 10:21 PM
Don't add faux patina to good wood, you know as well as I do honest wear can't be faked. Wait for another barn/pawn shop find to scavenge wood from. A surplus police gun could be a good source if it's in fair-to-good condition. Fake wear looks fake to anybody that knows how wear occurs.

AJAX22
December 4, 2012, 06:40 AM
Mts9m8H-yNc

Receiver is coming along nicely.... dug a known good 870 out of storage... will start testing for functionality with the known good parts and the ugly parts

AJAX22
December 5, 2012, 12:01 AM
f0OQdObhOJU

the 3rd round of electrolysis did the trick...

I was able to get the parts from the known good doner 870 into the rusty 870 receiver.

In the process the ejector spring broke, but that was really to be expected.

The receiver is much more pitted than it appeared on initial inspection.... it has a rust type similar to the 1991A1 blood damaged evidence gun, not the buried early 1911. Deep pits surrounded by relatively unmolested surfaces.

Now its a matter of tracking down the following:

barrel (too pretty)
action tube
for-end
action tube nut
mag tube spring
shell stop springs (both sides)
ejector spring
trigger housing pins
topfolding stock (ugly)
ugly for-end wood

she is coming along very nicely

AJAX22
December 10, 2012, 04:36 PM
hylAVMVWaEw

HFKxljKof9k

Making steady progress

throdgrain
December 10, 2012, 05:39 PM
A gun that can shoot is a tangible representation of freedom, a broken gun is a travesty


Well said Sir.

mr.scott
December 10, 2012, 06:08 PM
I've got a 870 Wingmaster from the mid 50s that has great everything except the exterior of the 28" barrel is a bit scuffed up. The bore looks great though.
Might can do a trade if your barrel is good inside and out.

AJAX22
December 12, 2012, 09:18 PM
vdnhw3xLVC0

Internals are coming along slowly, but they are coming along


I've got a 870 Wingmaster from the mid 50s that has great everything except the exterior of the 28" barrel is a bit scuffed up. The bore looks great though.
Might can do a trade if your barrel is good inside and out.

I'd love to see a pic

The barrel I have is very clean, I'll have to check it over for scratches, but overall its quite nice....

It is short (I'll have to measure it, its over 18... under 21) with a cylinder bore

AJAX22
December 15, 2012, 11:49 PM
luv_x4LiOIE

Electrolysis continues,

Bolt and bolt components are finished.

Slow... but its going...

I'll try to get a comprehensive parts list compiled here while I'm on the plane to Thailand (gonna go shoot rocket launchers in cambodia)

AJAX22
February 20, 2013, 10:38 PM
sDTqgwCv4SU

Just a recap of where we are at...

I have a donor trigger group on order which I'll be robbing the missing parts out of.

Still need a stock, forend, action tube, magtube spring, stock bolt, and trigger group pins

Hapworth
February 20, 2013, 11:11 PM
I think I'm missing...some wood...http://www.ebay.com/itm/butt-stock-and-fore-end-for-a-remington-870-12-ga-/111014640371?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d8fcfaf3

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Factory-Remington-870-wood-butt-stock-recoil-pad-fore-end-stock-set-police-/111012299818?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19d8d9442a

tiamat
February 21, 2013, 04:13 PM
interesting project.

I suggest you contact someone like AI&P Tactical (http://aiptactical.com) Having worked with 870's for years, I'm sure he's got bins full of older parts that he's replaced with newer parts - maybe nothing as 'distressed' as you're looking for, but they'd be more vintage, sort of like what you're looking for, specifically for some of the trigger group parts you need. Probably has some good vintage furniture as well.

As to the spring that's riveted to the inside of the receiver, not sure what you're going to do about that. AFAIK, that's not a user serviceable part. Normally that would have to be sent back to Remington for repair, so I dunno what your chances are of finding a replacement part or if Remington even offers it.

I recently stumbled across an 870 parts diagram and list in .jpg format that I saved but upon looking at it, all I managed to save was the parts list and not the diagram. Doh! If I find the other half, I'll make sure to post it here for you.

Old Shooter
February 21, 2013, 04:17 PM
Now THAT looks like a fun project!

Can't wait to see it in it's final form.

tiamat
February 21, 2013, 04:23 PM
wow, i take that back - Brownell's actually has the ejector, rivets and spring in stock!

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=0/sid=2/schematicsdetail/870_Express

btw, that link has both the parts diagram and the corresponding parts list/factory sku's

AJAX22
February 26, 2013, 01:21 AM
1Sa7SEnlZ9s

Been working on the trigger group.... I now know wayyyyyyy more about 870 fire control groups than I had ever intended on learning.

AJAX22
February 26, 2013, 02:29 PM
hlUSII39oFI

Making progress

AJAX22
February 28, 2013, 11:32 PM
DRWW8O7x7YQ

Making progress

AJAX22
February 28, 2013, 11:35 PM
n5w--p09JRM

VAPOPO
March 1, 2013, 12:10 AM
There are any number of products out there that would bring the appearance back to acceptable, cerrokote or any of the cured paint products come to mind.

AJAX22
March 1, 2013, 01:04 AM
There are any number of products out there that would bring the appearance back to acceptable, cerrokote or any of the cured paint products come to mind.

Yeah, but that would defeat the purpose.

She came by those pockmarks honestly, it would be a shame to cover up her battle scars.

tiamat
March 1, 2013, 03:26 PM
as much as i want to see the final project, I have to say that that table cloth is perhaps the worst possible background for you to be working with all those small parts (and for any of us to be able to see them in your videos).

"so...yeah"

AJAX22
March 2, 2013, 01:40 AM
as much as i want to see the final project, I have to say that that table cloth is perhaps the worst possible background for you to be working with all those small parts (and for any of us to be able to see them in your videos).

"so...yeah"
I'll see what I can do about different backgrounds in the future

AJAX22
March 2, 2013, 01:41 AM
1MGYx7I31kg

Better?

paintballdude902
March 2, 2013, 03:02 AM
ive got a barrel id be willing to send you but its a 3.5" so wont work for the project


keep up the good work

AJAX22
March 2, 2013, 05:43 AM
Can a 3.5 inch barrel fit on a 2.75 action?

I think the only difference is the ejection port right?

Whats the part interchange between the two?

AJAX22
March 2, 2013, 05:54 AM
Word on the street seems to be that a 3.5 inch barrel will work just fine on a 2.75 or 3 inch receiver.

The issue is only that you cannot cycle 3.5 inch shells.... they will still allow for single loading 3.5 inch shells(successfully)

And the 2.5 and 3 inch shells cycle perfectly

Interesting

dprice3844444
March 2, 2013, 08:27 AM
melonite at losok custom arrms

dprice3844444
March 2, 2013, 08:30 AM
find somebody or parts store with a bead blaster.got bondo for the pits?

AJAX22
May 21, 2013, 09:14 PM
Wp7j9Fhu1Ho

FINALLY tracked down the perfect forend/action tube for the beat up 870...

Now just need a stock, trigger pins, a firing pin, a magtube spring, shell latches and the little ejector/receiver rivit and dingus.

AJAX22
June 21, 2013, 11:40 PM
T_RhpQWKpYo

Progress!!!!

one bit at a time... she is coming around.

AJAX22
July 1, 2013, 08:46 PM
YJm_tewTk7s

One piece at a time.....

AJAX22
July 3, 2013, 08:31 PM
usu8xSRnsX8

Video on scrounging a bolt for the remington LEO topfolding stock.

AJAX22
October 11, 2013, 09:21 PM
IyfD1dMIJtk

Coming along... coming along

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u115/Ratduster77/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154756_994_zpsa9825e8d.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/user/Ratduster77/media/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154756_994_zpsa9825e8d.jpg.html)

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u115/Ratduster77/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154812_069_zpsef9521a9.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/user/Ratduster77/media/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154812_069_zpsef9521a9.jpg.html)

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u115/Ratduster77/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154831_776_zps7940f85c.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/user/Ratduster77/media/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154831_776_zps7940f85c.jpg.html)

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u115/Ratduster77/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154842_481_zps75ec6c8a.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/user/Ratduster77/media/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154842_481_zps75ec6c8a.jpg.html)

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u115/Ratduster77/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154849_089_zpse6586e54.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/user/Ratduster77/media/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154849_089_zpse6586e54.jpg.html)

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u115/Ratduster77/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154943_804_zps53b5cc8f.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/user/Ratduster77/media/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154943_804_zps53b5cc8f.jpg.html)

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u115/Ratduster77/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154957_228_zps615ac8da.jpg (http://s166.photobucket.com/user/Ratduster77/media/Explorer/IMG_20131011_154957_228_zps615ac8da.jpg.html)

Nickel Plated
October 11, 2013, 09:41 PM
Looking really nice. In regards to your latest video about shortening the mag extension. You know they're supposed to stick past the barrel right?

That smaller diameter section on the end of the extension is for mounting a bayonet in conjunction with the barrel clamp/ bayo mount/ heat shield thing Remington used to make for old Vietnam era 870s.

http://beaniam.com/guns/m870_dones.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2518/3902486892_0854ecfbfc_b.jpg
http://s20.postimg.org/9m7er7xwt/870_Bayonet_Adapter_With_M9.jpg

In fact i think you should cut your barrel about an 1/8th of an inch so it ends flush with where the extension steps up to it's normal diameter.

AJAX22
October 11, 2013, 10:02 PM
Actually the bayo lug extension was designed to be shorter than the barrel.

The MK1 military barrel was the only factory 21 inch barrel (improved choke) that remington ever made.

When people install them on non mk1 shorguns they tend to stick them on factory 20 inch barrels, which winds up with the bay nub hanging out too far.

http://www.whq-forum.de/cms/uploads/pics/remington870-03.jpg

The police 3 shot factory extension was essentially the 3 shot extension used in the bayo lug for the mk1 but modified with a little clamp instead of the big reinforced armature to take the bayo lug.

The 2 shot factory extension was modified from the 3 shot factory extension tooling so it kept the stepdown even though it doesn't really do anything.

I actually have some oriinal MK1 parts, two forend's, and the bayo lug extension... (if you ever want to get rid of yours I would LOVE to do up two matching MK1's) ..... I just ordered the corect era sage stock to duplicate the look from the classic photo.

On my MK1 clone's I use a factory 30 inch barrel and then cut it down to 21 inches to get the 'correct' look, even though it gives me a cylinder bore not an improved choke like I really should be running.

Nickel Plated
October 12, 2013, 09:55 AM
Heh those ain't my bayo mounts. I wish. Just found some pics online.
I would ask to buy yours but I'm broke right now and who knows how much they go for nowadays. :what:

I saw that pic too actually and it kinda confused the hell out of me. But I'll admit you most likely know more about 870 than I do. Though I still prefer the mount sticking past the barrel. Gives it an odd cool look. :cool:

Uniquedot
October 12, 2013, 11:43 AM
When people install them on non mk1 shorguns they tend to stick them on factory 20 inch barrels, which winds up with the bay nub hanging out too far.

That's because it says right on the factory box that it's (3 shot extension) for 20" barrels.

The MK1 military barrel was the only factory 21 inch barrel (improved choke) that remington ever made.

Remington made several 21" 870 barrels in all chokes including tubes for the special field guns, but they don't interchange with standard 870's. They do still make a 21" standard 870 barrel for turkey.

AJAX22
October 12, 2013, 02:27 PM
Isnt the Turkey barrel a vent rib?

If its plain, what choke van you get it in?

I would love to get a 21 inch factory imp choke plaim Jane barrel.

Uniquedot
October 12, 2013, 11:44 PM
Isnt the Turkey barrel a vent rib?

Yes it's VR, but remington makes a plain 18.5" barrel that's threaded for choke tubes and it comes with a breacher choke tube in it. Carlson's also imports an 18.5" plain barrel for the 870 that is chrome lined and threaded for tubes and can be purchased with cylinder- rifled and breacher choke tubes and it's also available with rifled sights as well as plain bead and standard remchokes fit them.

tiamat
December 12, 2013, 05:03 PM
wow, can't believe it's been a year.

and yes, the paper towels were an improvement over those place mats. keep sourcing parts and let's see this thing in action!

horsemen61
December 12, 2013, 06:42 PM
Awesome project

Deltaboy
January 3, 2014, 11:45 AM
Great final product.

If you enjoyed reading about "Old C&R 870 Wingmaster, beat up gun project" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!