Scam Alert: Buyer Beware of Purchases on Armslist.com


PDA






Wachtelhund
December 8, 2012, 10:10 AM
Buyers should beware of scams on Armslist.com. I just got scamed on a purchase and loss my money. It was a deal too good to be true. Seller corresponded with E-mail until they received my postal money order, then all communications stopped. No tracking number was provided.

I've contacted Armslist and no response so far. I also contacted the police. After it happened I took a closer look at Armslist. Their policies allow scaming to happen more offen than other gun selling sites. They do not require the sellers to post a username and allow sellers to list guns for sale from different states. In my case, I went back and took a closer look at the seller that scammed me, their other listing were all from different States.

If you enjoyed reading about "Scam Alert: Buyer Beware of Purchases on Armslist.com" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Javelin377
December 8, 2012, 11:52 AM
Not to sound like an a-hole, ok maybe I am but, sounds to me that you should have check out the ad and seller more.

floorit76
December 8, 2012, 12:01 PM
Armslist is like craigslist to me, face to face only. I'd never send money to someone on craigslist either.

MachIVshooter
December 8, 2012, 12:03 PM
It was a deal too good to be true.

That right there should have told you there was a problem with the item or the seller.

I'm sure next time you'll do your due diligence.

TKL
December 8, 2012, 12:41 PM
Thanks for the warning about the use by scammers of Armslist.

Wachtelhund
December 8, 2012, 01:02 PM
That right there should have told you there was a problem with the item or the seller.

I'm sure next time you'll do your due diligence.
MachIVshooter, You are correct! I've bought a lot of nuns off the internet and I should have been more careful with this purchase.

clem
December 8, 2012, 01:11 PM
Contact your local "Postal Inspector" and report this incident.

95XL883
December 8, 2012, 01:19 PM
+1 on contacting the postal inspector. Probably your best bet at recovering something. Sorry you got burned.

MachIVshooter
December 8, 2012, 01:46 PM
I've bought a lot of nuns off the internet and I should have been more careful with this purchase.

Yah, a hard lesson, but one not easily forgotten. Hopefully you're not out too much dough.

It's tough when we see these deals, because we realy want to ignore our instincts that tell us something isn't right. Sometimes you'll get lucky, but usually it's a bogus offer or the product is inferior.

There are screamin' deals out there, but it's caveat emptor. Usually if the seller is legit and the product is OK, there's a circumstance responsible for the price. Maybe a weak market, or, more often, the seller needs fast cash. I have scored a lot of CL deals and a few firearms buys because someone either spent money they didn't have or fell on hard times. Occassionally, the seller didn't do their due diligence and correctly determine the value of the item they're selling (I scored an SVT-40 for $200 this way). And no, I don't feel guilty when I buy well below market value if the seller was too lazy to research what their item is worth.

khegglie
December 8, 2012, 02:06 PM
all of the NUNS iv'e brouhgt on the internet have been very nice but they make me sit still with my hands folded :neener:

KevininPa
December 8, 2012, 02:16 PM
........is what a nun goes for these days?:neener:+1

Wachtelhund
December 8, 2012, 07:18 PM
All may not be lossed. This seller contacted me again this afternoon, saying I would have the gun on Tuesday. This was after a 6 day absence and 6 days after the gun was supposed to be shipped; and after ignoring a dozen E-mails. .

This morning I sent the seller an E-mail saying, "I had reported them to my local police and Monday I would be reporting them to the Postal Inspector and FBI. That I would pursue this until they were caught, even if I had to go and drag them into their local sherriff's office.

I knew where they lived, I had Goggled them and mailed the paymet to their home address instead of the PO Box that they wanted me to mail it to. I knew who their friends were from their Mylife page (how stupid can some people be using a real name and having a Mylife page. I knew they had recently been arrested (thanks to Goggle) and I would also learn the owner of the E-mail address that they had used. I had contacted Armslist and had flagged their other gun sales as scams.

I also, sent E-mails and called Armslist and told them they were complict in the scams being conducted on their site by not policing the sellers and allowing seller to sell from different States. I had to look up the IP address own to get the phone number for Armslist.

mf-dif
December 8, 2012, 08:19 PM
Armslist follows the Craigslist model. Face to face transactions.

Go to gunbroker if you're going to be doing mail transactions.

MachIVshooter
December 8, 2012, 11:43 PM
Go to gunbroker if you're going to be doing mail transactions.

Or use the for sale section here.

Still adviseable to make sure you're doing business with an established member, not someone who signed up just to list a gun.

I have bought one and sold a half dozen in our for sale/trade forum, always went smoothly (well, except for a post office delay that had myself and the buyer a little concerned about the MO for a couple days)

JH225
December 8, 2012, 11:57 PM
I ALWAYS get a copy of the other persons drivers license (or permit if required) whether I am buying or selling. There should be zero reason for the other party to balk. If they do, deal is off, period. File it away just in case.

ChCx2744
December 9, 2012, 12:09 AM
I'm also a firm believer in face-to-face only. Face-to-face transactions ensure that you can examine the product before purchasing, you can make proper identification on the person who is selling it and there is a physical location where there should be other people or at least you can see the person's car.

TKL
December 9, 2012, 12:36 AM
The OP needs to be careful less he be charged with the crime of extortion. If one threatens criminal prosecution to obtain money or property from another they may have committed a crime - even if they are only trying to force the other person to return their property. Check the laws of the applicable state (even if it is not a crime in your state it may be on the other end of the telehone or electronic communique (e-mail). Your mileage may differ depending on state law. Some states may not call it extortion but blackmail.

Impureclient
December 9, 2012, 12:58 AM
"If one threatens criminal prosecution to obtain money or property.....if they are only trying to force the other person to return their property"

HUH?

MachIVshooter
December 9, 2012, 02:29 AM
The OP needs to be careful less he be charged with the crime of extortion. If one threatens criminal prosecution to obtain money or property from another they may have committed a crime - even if they are only trying to force the other person to return their property.

Ummm, no.

It's not extortion to threaten reporting the crime of theft if the other party breaches contract and your money/property is not returned.

Wachtelhund
December 9, 2012, 10:41 AM
This is no threat! It is fact! I did report this to my local police on Friday and I'm following the advise of the deputy taking the report. I just sent the seller a copy of the police report and copies of their Armslists.com gun ads and the URL's all showing sales from different States. I have saved the seller's gun ads on Armslist to my computer, so I have the ads and URL's even if they are deleted. Also, informed them I have a meeting scheduled with a Postal Inspector on Monday.

PS; This was an expensive purchase of a rare gun. Before sending the money order I had Goggled the person and their address, both checked out. They wanted the money order sent to a PO Box. In stead, I sent the money order to the actual street and city address.

Elkins45
December 9, 2012, 11:26 AM
Armslist is the gun equivalent of Craigslist: in-state and face to face only. And meet in a public area, and don't let them know your home address, and all the other precautions you should take when dealing with people you don't know.

Not to sound like a jerk, but the Armslist people do a pretty good job of telling you what not to do in their FAQ document:

Q: How do I avoid scams?

Follow these common sense rules to help avoid getting scammed:

Deal locally and transact in person - This will help you avoid almost all scams
Never send Cashiers Checks or Money Orders to sellers
Never wire money via Western Union, Moneygram, or other wire services
Never accept Cashiers Checks or Money Orders as they can be easily faked
Never give out financial information
Avoid deals involving shipping or escrow services
If a deal is too good to be true, it probably is
ARMSLIST is not involved in any transaction, we do not handle payments, guarantee transactions, provide escrow services, or offer "buyer protection" or "seller certification"

Wachtelhund
December 9, 2012, 11:39 AM
Armslist is the gun equivalent of Craigslist: in-state and face to face only. And meet in a public area, and don't let them know your home address, and all the other precautions you should take when dealing with people you don't know.

Not to sound like a jerk, but the Armslist people do a pretty good job of telling you what not to do in their FAQ document:

Q: How do I avoid scams?

Follow these common sense rules to help avoid getting scammed:

Deal locally and transact in person - This will help you avoid almost all scams
Never send Cashiers Checks or Money Orders to sellers
Never wire money via Western Union, Moneygram, or other wire services
Never accept Cashiers Checks or Money Orders as they can be easily faked
Never give out financial information
Avoid deals involving shipping or escrow services
If a deal is too good to be true, it probably is
ARMSLIST is not involved in any transaction, we do not handle payments, guarantee transactions, provide escrow services, or offer "buyer protection" or "seller certification"


This is true. I was sucker into a deal that was to good to be true. This was the first and last time I'll ever use Armslist. I've purchased many guns off GunBroker and never had a problem. But Armslist should police their sellers and not allow the same seller to sell from more than one State.

Elkins45
December 9, 2012, 04:32 PM
This is true. I was sucker into a deal that was to good to be true. This was the first and last time I'll ever use Armslist. I've purchased many guns off GunBroker and never had a problem. But Armslist should police their sellers and not allow the same seller to sell from more than one State.
I couldn't disagree more. They aren't Armslist's sellers. Gunbroker is a commercial service where the sellers pay a fee. It's run as a business.

Armslist is just a website that lets gun buyers and sellers connect. As they tell you right from the outset, they are NOT involved in any transaction. They don't get a commission from any sales that take place. All they are is the "bulletin board" where people can place free ads to sell guns.

What you are saying is the equivalent of boycotting the newspaper because you bought a used car that turned out to be a lemon from a dealer advertisement. Armslist CAN'T police their sellers because they don't even know who they are.

Flogger
December 11, 2012, 11:56 AM
Who would send off money to some anonymous listing on Armslist?

If you are not registered on a site and able to see that someone has been registered with the same username and info for months or years why would you trust them?

rugerdude
December 11, 2012, 03:06 PM
I've had nothing but good experiences with Armslist. Although I did end up emailing a scammer one time because I didn't know the market value for a gun.

If the listing seems too good to be true, click the "other listings by this user" link and normally the scammers will be trying to sell things in several different states. That's the biggest clue that it's a scam artist, also they normally don't specify a city within the state.

tyeo098
December 11, 2012, 03:36 PM
Buy fresh, buy local.
I only use Armslist for FTF transactions.

If you enjoyed reading about "Scam Alert: Buyer Beware of Purchases on Armslist.com" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!