K-38 Masterpiece - ouch - what am I doing wrong?


PDA






jmace57
December 9, 2012, 03:18 PM
I recently acquired on of my dream guns, a 1947 Masterpiece (target) and went to the range to shoot it for the first time yeserday. Ouch! It has the standard diamond grips, a 6" barrel and I was shooting standard loads.

Every time I shot the gun, it (the trigger guard) whacked me on the middle knuckle of the middle finger on my shooting hand.

I already have a S&W model 19 and 2 model 28s - all with target grips. I have a model 10 with rubber pachmeyer grips. I have never had any problem like this before with these or any other (of 25) handguns.

I guess I have fairly large hands. I notice when I am gripping the gun, that knuckle is almost resting against the back of the trigger guard. Am I doing something wrong? Holding it wrong? Not gripping I tight enough? It is just a mis-match between the gun design and the size of my hands?

I shot 3 cylinders through it yesterday before I had to quit. It was not enjoyable. Has anyone else ever experienced this? Thanks all.

Jim

I am attaching a shot of me holding the gun. I am holding it funny so that I could take the picture, but wanted to show the size of my hands versus the size of the gun.

http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i390/jmace57/grip.jpg

If you enjoyed reading about "K-38 Masterpiece - ouch - what am I doing wrong?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Manny
December 9, 2012, 03:28 PM
I'm not an S&W guy, but I can recall a whole lot of pictures of vintage ones wearing Tyler T grip adapters, so I don't think your experiance is unique. I believe they're available in repro and bet the addition would make shooting that old timer a lot more pleasurable.

rcmodel
December 9, 2012, 03:31 PM
Get a Tyler -T-Grip adapter for it and enjoy.

http://www.t-grips.com/

http://www.t-grips.com/whiteivorex21m.jpg

rc

dprice3844444
December 9, 2012, 03:31 PM
large k frame wood grips or pachmeyers,tyler t grip also

steveno
December 9, 2012, 03:38 PM
I'm surprised that you could put any safe load in a K-38 and get hurt even a little bit

bikemutt
December 9, 2012, 04:55 PM
I second trying target-style grips for it first. I found my 1950 K38 felt better with standard k-frame targets. They didn't "look" quite right on the gun to my eyes but sure shot better.

snooperman
December 9, 2012, 05:02 PM
The grips do not fit your hand. Try the Tyler T grips that others have mentioned or buy larger wood grips that will fill your hand adequately.

Lucky Derby
December 9, 2012, 05:28 PM
Common problem with the Magna, and earlier Service style grips. The Tyler T grip added to the Magnas you have lets you keep the look and solve the problem. Larger Target grips, factory or aftermarket, that fill the area between the trigger guard and grip frame will also solve it.

Hondo 60
December 9, 2012, 05:31 PM
Or just use a 2 handed grip.
That's what I do & I don't get whacked.

Iggy
December 9, 2012, 05:39 PM
Factory Target grips will improve things.
http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p246/Iggy25/Model14WTWH.jpg

Tyler T grip adapter will be the least expensive thing to try first.

There are a myriad of grip options that will work on K frame S&Ws.

SwampWolf
December 9, 2012, 08:23 PM
Or just use a 2 handed grip.

Not "legal" when competing in the game the K-38 Masterpiece was originally intended for: Bullseye matches. Follow the advice of some posters and fit your revolver with some "target" grips. It will make all the difference in the world.

BYJO4
December 9, 2012, 08:26 PM
Your 38 and model 19 are both K frame. Put the grips from the model 19 on the 38 and see if that solves the problem.

jmace57
December 9, 2012, 09:06 PM
Thanks to all for your suggestions.

Driftwood Johnson
December 9, 2012, 09:10 PM
Howdy

As you have discovered, the problem is the proximity of the trigger guard to your knuckle. Yes, a Tyler T grip will help, so will more modern grips that lower the position of your hand.

But the cheapest thing of all for you to try is to stop trying to cram your entire hand onto the grip. Take a look at what adding a Tyler T grip or modern target grips actually does. It repositions your hand so that your knuckle is further down on the grip. That way, it is impossible for the trigger guard to whack your knuckle, your finger ain't there when the trigger guard recoils back.

You can accomplish the exact same thing by simply re-gripping lower on the grip. If you grip lower, and allow your pinky to fall off the bottom of the grip, you will create a space between the rear of the trigger guard and your knuckle. I know, this is anathema to most pistol shooters who have been taught to grip as high as possible, particularly with a 1911, but there is no physical way to get your knuckle behind the trigger guard of a 1911.

Your photo illustrates this beautifully. If you shift your grip down a little bit, your pinky will fall off the grip. This will allow a gap of about 1/4" to open up between your knuckle and the trigger guard. A 38 Special is not going to recoil enough to hit your knuckle if you leave a 1/4" gap.

I shoot all my single action revolvers this way, and it has migrated over to my double action revolvers too. I have lots of old K frame and N frame revolvers with service grips. Like this one.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v495/Driftwood_Johnson/smith%20and%20wesson/Model19051stChange-1.jpg


Here is my K-38, and its predecessor, the M&P Target Model. Look at the grips. Those are the grips these guns were issued with, and they were the most highly prized target pistols of their day. Do you think everybody was shooting them with special target grips in their day? If so, how come mine still have their service grips on them? Shooters learned how to shoot these guns without getting their knuckles whacked. I can shoot any of these guns all day long with standard 38 Special loads without getting my knuckle whacked.

Try it, you may like it.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v495/Driftwood_Johnson/smith%20and%20wesson/K38andMPTargetModel.jpg

joneb
December 9, 2012, 11:34 PM
I prefer these to the factory grips that came with this M-10
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=46463&d=1161061837

ArchAngelCD
December 10, 2012, 12:20 AM
I agree, the Tyler T-Grips will solve that problem of trigger guard bite and so will the older Pachmayr grip adapter too.

T-Grips:
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o26/ArchAngelCD/M36-gripadpt.jpg

Pachmayr adapter:
http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o26/ArchAngelCD/M686gripadpt.jpg

Or you can replace the grips with larger combat style grips which will take away the bite too.

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o26/ArchAngelCD/DSCN2079.jpg

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o26/ArchAngelCD/DSCN2080.jpg

Guillermo
December 10, 2012, 09:56 AM
it is defective

send it to me for disposal

(I know...I know...but no one said it yet. And it HAD to be said)

Bikewer
December 10, 2012, 11:40 AM
As Archangel says... Back when everyone in police work was carrying revolvers, you saw a lot of T-Grips and upgrades to the stock "target" grips on these weapons.

I went with the Herret's "Jordan Trooper" grips, which were designed by Bill Jordan and looked somewhat similar to the grips pictured above but without the finger grooves.
Jordan preferred a totally smooth grip that allowed for what he called "micro adjustments" in the grip under fast-draw combat shooting conditions.
Naturally, if you're just plinking, not necessary.

snooperman
December 10, 2012, 12:57 PM
Like Bikewer, I also like the Jordan trooper grips. I have never cared for finger grooves at all on any revolver.

pendennis
December 10, 2012, 04:57 PM
As Archangel says... Back when everyone in police work was carrying revolvers, you saw a lot of T-Grips and upgrades to the stock "target" grips on these weapons.

I went with the Herret's "Jordan Trooper" grips, which were designed by Bill Jordan and looked somewhat similar to the grips pictured above but without the finger grooves.
Jordan preferred a totally smooth grip that allowed for what he called "micro adjustments" in the grip under fast-draw combat shooting conditions.
Naturally, if you're just plinking, not necessary.
The only problem with Bill Jordan, was that he had "gorilla" hands! :D :D :D

Iggy
December 10, 2012, 05:00 PM
The only problem with Bill Jordan, was that he had "gorilla" hands!
__________________
You got that right. I spent an afternoon shooting with him.. A Combat Magnum looked
like a Chief's Special in his mitts.

Dayam, that man was fast!!!

TrueTexan
December 10, 2012, 08:14 PM
If you don't mine the looks S&W has some Uncle Mikes grips of sale for around $14.95 Just put a pair on my 686 3 inch.

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Category4_750001_750051_757889_-1_757837_757837_image

Jim K
December 10, 2012, 10:18 PM
I don't know how many K-38's were ever shot with anything but wadcutters; I know mine wasn't.

Jim

Ky Larry
December 11, 2012, 12:48 PM
My Model-19 did the same thing to my middle finger. I tried a set of Bill Jordan Signature grips and they solved the problem.

SwampWolf
December 11, 2012, 07:34 PM
You can accomplish the exact same thing by simply re-gripping lower on the grip. If you grip lower, and allow your pinky to fall off the bottom of the grip, you will create a space between the rear of the trigger guard and your knuckle. I know, this is anathema to most pistol shooters who have been taught to grip as high as possible

Each to their own and whatever works for each individual shooter I suppose but, as Driftwood Johnson acknowledged, many shooters prefer to grip any handgun as high up as practical. Though a lower grip will help mitigate "knuckle slap" for some shooters, it's been my experience that a high grip affords the best straight-through trigger pull and aids in controlling recoil. On a revolver, I want the web of my hand intersecting the highest point of the grip. As I and others have suggested, the best way to reduce knuckle slap is to install a Tyler T-Grip or, better yet imo, put some quality "target" style grips on.

Peter M. Eick
December 14, 2012, 01:04 PM
I agree with the post above, but that is what I do with Magna grips. I loop my pinky under the grip, grab the grip with two fingers and use the pinky to index the grip height to keep it from riding up.

Basically welcome to the world of factory grips. If you want to shoot them without getting whacked, you are going to have to change your grips, or change the way you grip the gun.

jmace57
December 14, 2012, 09:14 PM
I want to thank everyone for their input. I'm going to try to change my grip first (since it's the cheapest - free) - and then look into other options mentioned.

Guillermo
December 14, 2012, 09:15 PM
let us know how it works out

Good luck amigo

If you enjoyed reading about "K-38 Masterpiece - ouch - what am I doing wrong?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!