Petition to press charges on MSNBC's David Gregory


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coebam
December 25, 2012, 10:01 PM
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/press-charges-against-david-gregory-possession-30-round-high-capacity-assault-rifle-magazine/gMNRPpPl#thank-you=p

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TenDriver
December 26, 2012, 12:48 AM
Need some background information, although I can gather what happened from the write up on the petition.

toivo
December 26, 2012, 02:52 AM
He held up a 30-round AR mag when he was "interviewing" Wayne LaPierre. The studio is in DC, so if it's a real mag, it's a felony. Now the gun banners are falling all over themselves trying to defend him. One that I read online said that it was probably a "spent one with no bullets left in it."

Yeah, that'll fly: "It's OK, officer -- it's empty. I shot all the bullets already." It amazes me that people feel entitled to have strong opinions on subjects of which they are totally ignorant.

cassandrasdaddy
December 26, 2012, 10:03 AM
the network was aware. sought permission from cops. cops said no. network went ahead

Sam1911
December 26, 2012, 10:08 AM
Looks like the Metro Police are indeed investigating: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=691503

jimmyraythomason
December 26, 2012, 10:20 AM
Tried to sign the petion and got this response "The petition you are trying to access has expired, because it failed to meet the signature threshold."

Johannes_Paulsen
December 26, 2012, 10:34 AM
If I don't support the law, why would I want to encourage them to enforce it?

murphys_law
December 26, 2012, 10:38 AM
If I don't support the law, why would I want to encourage them to enforce it?

Probably to show how utterly ridiculous it is...

Sent from my Inspire 4G using Tapatalk 2

Johannes_Paulsen
December 26, 2012, 10:41 AM
But that can be done without petitioning the government to enforce a law like this that violates someone's civil rights.

If I have a right to buy this magazine, then everyone does -- even *******s like David Gregory.

jimmyraythomason
December 26, 2012, 10:42 AM
Originally Posted by Johannes_Paulsen
If I don't support the law, why would I want to encourage them to enforce it?
to show how utterly ridiculous it is... Exactly! The reporter proved our point for us. He was calling for a law restricting full capacity magazines while violating an existing one proving the futility of such laws.

coebam
December 26, 2012, 11:33 AM
The petition is open until jan 22 2013. Almost 18k votes are still needed.

Johannes_Paulsen
December 26, 2012, 11:37 AM
@jimmyray: fine, and the point was taken. That does not require me to hector public officials into enforcing this law.

Colonel
December 26, 2012, 11:58 AM
D. C. Police — NBC requested and was denied permission to use high capacity magazine in news segment
Posted by William A. Jacobson
Wednesday, December 26, 2012 at 11:23am
http://networkedblogs.com/GozP6

As noted in an earlier post, an email has surfaced purporting to be from the D. C. Metropolitan Police Department stating that NBC requested permission to use a high capacity ammunication magazine and that the request was denied.

The email first appeared on the AR15 gun forum, and then at the The Patriot Perspective blog which first broke the Gregory story.

Here is the email, with the addressee’s identity removed:

“From: “DC Police (imailagent) ” <customerservice. mpd2@dc.gov> Subject: Email from DC Police (Intranet Quorum IMA00519327) Date: December 24, 2012 4:13:12 PM EST To: -

The Metropolitan Police Department is in receipt of your e-mail regarding David Gregory segment on “Meet the Press. ” MPD has received numerous e-mails informing us of the segment. NBC contacted MPD inquiring if they could utilize a high capacity magazine for their segment. NBC was informed that possession of a high capacity magazines is not permissible and their request was denied. This matter is currently being investigated. Thank you for taking the time to bring this matter to our attention.

Customer Service – Metropolitan Police Department”

Fearing the email was a hoax, I was cautious about running the text of the email. But as earlier reported, a confidential source who works for D. C. government verified that the email was in a format used by the MPD:

“… the Metropolitan Police Department email reply you received is genuine. DC Government uses “Intranet Quorum” software designed by Lockheed to manage general inquires. The email address and the subject line of the email you received are consistent with that software. ”

Now I have received confirmation that the e-mail is authentic.

I forwarded the text of the email, exactly as it appears above, to Gwendolyn Crump, Director, Office of Communications for the MPD, with the following question:

Can you confirm that is a real email sent from your system. I am informed that the email format is consistent with the Intranet Quorum format you use. Putting aside the substance of the investigation, I just want confirmation that it is a genuine email sent from your system.

I would appreciate your response on that specific question. Thank you.

Ms. Crump responded:

“Yes. I can confirm that what you sent appears to be the IQ system message. ”

I further followed up to make sure that the email was an actual email sent by MPD, not just that it “appeared” to be one, and Ms. Crump confirmed:

“Yes, that email was sent from MPD. “

Officer Aziz Alali of the MPD Public Information Office further confirmed the authenticity of the e-mail, and gave me this statement by telephone:

“NBC contacted the Metropolitan Police Department inquiring if they could utilize a high acapcity magazine for thie segment. NBC was informed that that possession of a high capacity magazine is not permissible and the request was denied. This matter is currently being investigate and I cannot get into any further specifics on this investigation. ”

NBC News has not responded to multiple inquiries as to the request and denial, or whether the magazine was real or just a prop. During the segment in question, Gregory stated “here is a magazine for ammunition that carries 30 bullets. ”

AirForceShooter
December 26, 2012, 12:32 PM
Here's my question.

Where did he GET the magazine??????

If the cops even hint at charges Gregory will be screaming FIRST AMENDMENT!!!!!!!

AFS

BCCL
December 26, 2012, 12:41 PM
The 1st amendment is not an excuse to break a law, IIRC, there was a case years ago where a reporter bought child porn for a story on it and got in trouble, tried to use that defense and it didn't work.

jimmyraythomason
December 26, 2012, 12:57 PM
That does not require me to hector public officials into enforcing this law. No no-one is requiring you or anyone else to do anything. It is just a golden opportunity to use THEIR own words and actions against them.

SidRon
December 26, 2012, 01:11 PM
Signing this petition is a bad idea in my opinion. While I am sure that it would give a momentary surge of satisfaction to many gun owners if charges were brought up against this guy the long term effect is that it would further enforce the public perception that second ammendment advocates are intolerant people that try to punish anyone that disagrees witht them. True advocates of the second ammendment would not want to see anybody prosecuted for possessing a 30 round magazine even if it was David Gregory. The average person is going to see this petition as a politically motivated attack against someone because of their beliefs similar to the petition to deport piers morgan. Actions such as these are tactically short sighted and actually undermine the casue in which they intend to support.

jimmyraythomason
December 26, 2012, 01:41 PM
The average person is going to see this petition as a politically motivated attack against someone because of their beliefs similar to the petition to deport piers morgan. I don't see a negative here. What is wrong with using their own weapons against them? If they want possession of an object to be illegal for others along with penalties they should be willing to PAY the same penalty when THEY break that law. If nothing else it will point out their ignorance of laws already on the books(where they are located).

Warp
December 26, 2012, 01:59 PM
If I don't support the law, why would I want to encourage them to enforce it?

Because laws that are not consistently enforced are the worse thing there is.

Do you really want them to pass laws that apply to you and me but not to people who are "somebody"?

Not just no...but HELL NO!

Lucifer_Sam
December 26, 2012, 02:02 PM
I'll sign it. I obviously don't support the law, but you can bet if a pro gun advocate had violated the law like this, there would be all kinds of media "investigative reports", follow-ups about how the evil gun advocate skirted the law, and hounding of the police/DA to prosecute. I don't feel that he had any moral high ground, and perhaps his getting prosecuted for just having a magazine might help him understand things a bit better.

TenDriver
December 26, 2012, 02:46 PM
I won't sign it either. This man bought the rope and tied the noose should the authorities decide to pursue it.

No matter the outcome, this is an excellent opportunity to show the idiocy of such laws and why they are ineffective. All we have to do is sit back and watch.

Demitrios
December 26, 2012, 03:21 PM
Oh god, this is special. This is the equivalent of me walking into a police station with a some crack and a pipe, asking the police, "Hey is this legal?" and then start smoking away to demonstrate what I meant.

Johannes_Paulsen
December 26, 2012, 03:43 PM
@Warp:

You either have a right to own a 30-round magazine, or you don't.

If this is a right, we ought to stand up and defend anyone who is prosecuted under this unjust law.

If it isn't a right, let's come down from the soapbox and start working out what sort of "reasonable" gun control we're willing to accept.

SidRon
December 26, 2012, 04:30 PM
Jimmyray, the public is already aware of the issue and the police are investigating it. You already have all of the benefits of being able to use this situation to point out the hypocrisy and the uselessness of the laws. I don't really see any additional benefit to pursuing a petition to prosecute someone for a law that you are in opposition to. I only see the downside when joe public perceives the petition to be the gun lobby bullying someone that doesn't agree with them.

Warp
December 26, 2012, 04:36 PM
@Warp:

You either have a right to own a 30-round magazine, or you don't.

If this is a right, we ought to stand up and defend anyone who is prosecuted under this unjust law.

If it isn't a right, let's come down from the soapbox and start working out what sort of "reasonable" gun control we're willing to accept.

Laws that are not applied consistently are the worse possible option.

ilbob
December 26, 2012, 05:48 PM
I am not in favor of public opinion deciding whether charges should be brought or not in any case, even though it is often a major factor.

Warp
December 26, 2012, 05:49 PM
I am not in favor of public opinion deciding whether charges should be brought or not in any case, even though it is often a major factor.

Consider it public attention and awareness.

If he broke the law, the broke the law. It's a very straightforward did he do it, or not, kind of thing.

Bovice
December 26, 2012, 06:17 PM
LOL I'm gonna sign it. I'd love to know I contributed to stuffing somebody legally with a law they want. Kinda like the president of M.A.D.D. getting a DUI in FL and whining about the extreme punishment.

1911 guy
December 26, 2012, 06:21 PM
That's pretty rich. Crying about how nobody aught to be allowed to have these "evil high capacity magazines" then waving one around, in violation of the law, to prove his point about how "dangerous" an inert piece of metal is.

Johannes_Paulsen
December 26, 2012, 06:21 PM
@Warp: Do you disagree that we have a right to possess 30-round magazines?

Having strict but fairly enforced laws is a far worse option vs. having and actually standing up to defend all of our rights.

I don't particularly like Gregory's use of his 1st amendment rights either, but I would stand up to stop the government from harassing him because of something he said. Same principle.

Bovice
December 26, 2012, 06:37 PM
I don't disagree that we have a right to own these magazines. What it's about is giving him some of his own medicine and making an example in our favor and at his and NBC's expense.

Look at it this way, if he's convicted, he's not able to vote anymore. One less ignorant voice is a positive move.

Warp
December 26, 2012, 06:41 PM
@Warp: Do you disagree that we have a right to possess 30-round magazines?

Having strict but fairly enforced laws is a far worse option vs. having and actually standing up to defend all of our rights.

I don't particularly like Gregory's use of his 1st amendment rights either, but I would stand up to stop the government from harassing him because of something he said. Same principle.

The principle is that he shouldn't get a pass on committing a crime because he is in the media

1911 guy
December 26, 2012, 06:49 PM
Bingo! To top it off, NBC *KNEW* they were in legal trouble because they asked for a variance from the police and were denied. They went ahead anyway, in full knowlege they were commiting a crime.

I think it's a dumb law, but we cannot allow those who
A) would use those very laws to hang us
B) speak to us as the unwashed and uneducated masses
C) seek to sway public opinion in their favor with lies and misrepresentation
to get a free pass.

If I had a say in legislation, I'd vote to repeal this law. But I don't, so I'll use the opportunity to expose it for the fraud it is and motivate those who DO have a say to repeal it.

gc70
December 27, 2012, 07:21 AM
From the Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/police-nbc-asked-for-high-capacity-clip/2012/12/26/4c8f77da-4f76-11e2-8b49-64675006147f_story.html?hpid=z4):

The situation presents authorities with an unusual decision: file charges in a crime that is infrequently prosecuted or appear unwilling to enforce the District’s gun laws. Gun rights advocates were among those who called police to complain.

Therein is the issue: gun control advocates do not take existing laws seriously, even while calling for more laws; gun owners may despise existing laws, but expect them to be enforced.

steelerdude99
December 27, 2012, 09:05 AM
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-1008820.html

Just like the case where the late Redskins owner Jack Kent Cooke had a firearm in his home at a time when all handguns were banned there; they'll investigate and find "Insufficient Evidence".

chuck

MtnCreek
December 27, 2012, 09:34 AM
How bout this one?

https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/eliminate-armed-guards-president-vice-president-and-their-families-and-establish-gun-free-zones/6RDGkxLK

"Eliminate armed guards for the President, Vice-President, and their families, and establish Gun Free Zones around them"

"Gun Free Zones are supposed to protect our children, and some politicians wish to strip us of our right to keep and bear arms. Those same politicians and their families are currently under the protection of armed Secret Service agents. If Gun Free Zones are sufficient protection for our children, then Gun Free Zones should be good enough for politicians."

ultramag44
December 27, 2012, 09:39 AM
I will not sign a petition.

The Metro Police are investagating. Allow them to their jobs. If they find sufficient evidence, file charges. Of course the DA has the option to administratively reduce or even dismiss charges.

Now, should Mr Gregory be put in county jail and every legal method used to deny or slow down the bail process and if Mr Gregory should get "exposed" to the very people he and his ilk pretend to champion, well it will be a "boots on the ground" learning experience about the criminal justice system for Mr Gregory. That "up close and personal" insight will, no doubt, make him a better reporter.

LNK
December 27, 2012, 09:52 AM
I will not sign a petition.

The Metro Police are investigating. Allow them to their jobs. If they find sufficient evidence, file charges. Of course the DA has the option to administratively reduce or even dismiss charges.

Now, should Mr Gregory be put in county jail and every legal method used to deny or slow down the bail process and if Mr Gregory should get "exposed" to the very people he and his ilk pretend to champion, well it will be a "boots on the ground" learning experience about the criminal justice system for Mr Gregory. That "up close and personal" insight will, no doubt, make him a better reporter.

The way I see it, this is a no lose situation for gun owners. They wont prosecute Gregory because he is one of them. So it sets a precedent about enforcement. Were they to prosecute him, that would be one less idiot on TV. I really don't see the reason for the petition. They really don't care what we think. Right now they are just trying to figure out how to spin this to keep one of their own out of trouble, while still trying to keep us inline. Sit back and watch the show I say.....

LNK

LiENUS
December 27, 2012, 11:07 AM
I absolutely hope the police try to press charges. I hope the courts then go through and give him some sort of leniency that the rest of us can then use to our benefit. I would expect Mr Gregory to be put in a cell alone if he does go to jail for the brief period of time he has until he makes bail.

legaleagle_45
December 27, 2012, 11:19 AM
If he is charged, expect a plea bargain... dismissal of all charges in exhange for a 60 second public service anouncement during Meet the Press concerning evil guns.

Cooldill
December 27, 2012, 11:49 AM
I don't like David Gregory. His voice is oddly soothing. It makes me feel funny!

I to wonder where the heck he got the magazine. I can't believe they didn't think that one through. Not exactly difficult to find pictures of 30 round magazines!

CharlieBT
December 27, 2012, 12:22 PM
My two cents: This was about ego.

David's team had to consider a live shot or recorded VSOT with a reporter in a free state holding a 30-round magazine to set up the discussion with LaPiere. In addition, given the felonious intent, the idea had to be run past senior management and counsel, who provide pre-pub review. They evidently thought it more impactful for David to intentionally break the law on "national TV" to prove the subjective point the team was using public air time to make. It backfired, big time.

Was the point:

That David is above the law? "I can own this because my purposes are above other purposes."

That such laws don't work, because David (and others in his organization) obtained the "contraband" despite the law? "See how meaningless magazine bans are? Even I can buy one at my corner grocery store."

That DC cops don't enforce the laws already on the books? "See, look at me, people. I'm holding up this "illegal" magazine on national television, and I will never be charged. Local laws are not enough. Sure, it is a felony for me to do this. But my employer has sway over these DC cops, who will never, ever charge me. Ha ha ha. We need congress to act to stop me before I break the law again!"

David should be charged and he should be prosecuted. Or everyone else in DC should be allowed to violate the same law for their own unique purposes.

hso
December 27, 2012, 12:37 PM
"Eliminate armed guards for the President, Vice-President, and their families, and establish Gun Free Zones around them"

That's as wrong headed as the suggestion we should be petty and vengeful in supporting a "petition" to have charges pressed over a magazine being used as a visual aid. Very low road as well as being pointless thereby making us look idiotic.

Mp7
December 27, 2012, 01:36 PM
HSO +1

This is childish and low road.

Warp
December 27, 2012, 01:40 PM
I don't see anything childish in wanting laws to be applied consistently, rather than only being applied when those in positions of power feel like it

Mp7
December 27, 2012, 02:00 PM
Imagine not being involved in it.
Take 4 steps backwards and look at it.

cbrgator
December 27, 2012, 02:18 PM
Why is the white house being petitioned to enforce DC's local laws? Did I miss something?

ghitch75
December 27, 2012, 02:50 PM
i'll sign it.....only because if you or me was caught with it we would be in jail end of story.....that law was put in place for EVERYONE!!!

backbencher
December 27, 2012, 03:27 PM
I hope he's convicted & sent to DC's gaol - perhaps in Mayor Berry's former cell... And then we'll all support his appeal on the grounds that the DC magazine ban contravenes the 2nd Amendment. And when he moves to a free state so he won't have to go through that hastle again, I'll give him an AR he can use his magazine in.

k_dawg
December 27, 2012, 05:00 PM
Some do not seem to understand how such laws work. You and I can not simply sue the DC Govt over this bad law. A lawful citizen in DC can not.

You need to be charged with the crime, and then defend it in a court of law under the Second AMendment.

The ideal case is this:

Gregory is charged with a crime and he does not plea bargin out of it.
The case goes to court.
The NRA, GOA or someone defends Gregory on the basis of the Second Amendment.
A court throws out the law as unconstitutional.

Warp
December 27, 2012, 05:02 PM
Some do not seem to understand how such laws work. You and I can not simply sue the DC Govt over this bad law. A lawful citizen in DC can not.

You need to be charged with the crime, and then defend it in a court of law under the Second AMendment.

The ideal case is this:

Gregory is charged with a crime and he does not plea bargin out of it.
The case goes to court.
The NRA, GOA or someone defends Gregory on the basis of the Second Amendment.
A court throws out the law as unconstitutional.

Yup.

And with a "big name" individual, and not some random Joe nobody cares about, this seems more likely.

Unfortunately law and politics are joined at the hip

PavePusher
December 27, 2012, 09:23 PM
@Warp: Do you disagree that we have a right to possess 30-round magazines?

Having strict but fairly enforced laws is a far worse option vs. having and actually standing up to defend all of our rights.

I don't particularly like Gregory's use of his 1st amendment rights either, but I would stand up to stop the government from harassing him because of something he said. Same principle.
If you or I waved a 30-round magazine in public in D.C., we'd be in jail. Gregory can take his chances with the same fate. Being a T.V. personality should not be a shield against laws that are used to hammer the common man.

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