Want to report an honest shop.....


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Hokkmike
December 26, 2012, 01:10 PM
LGS in New Albany, PA still has .223 and 7.62x39 ammo at fair prices.

Also they have a supply of AK- 30 round mags. (I have one for sale in the classifieds)

Point is, not everyone is taking advantage of today's panic.....

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gfpd707
December 26, 2012, 02:52 PM
I was going to call you out on the taking advantage part but your price on your mag is not too far out of line for the times we are in.

JohnnyK
December 26, 2012, 03:03 PM
do they sell online... I need some .223 thanks

Hokkmike
December 26, 2012, 03:12 PM
Sorry - they do not sell on line.

Sam1911
December 26, 2012, 03:23 PM
Gosh...I'd rather they were getting as much money as possible for their wares as it might be a long time before more product comes in to sell. If they run out selling at "honest" prices, what are they going to live on while they wait (maybe months) for more inventory? It's good to see stores putting a bit of extra cash aside while they can so they can keep the lights on through the lean times.

JustinJ
December 26, 2012, 03:59 PM
If they run out selling at "honest" prices, what are they going to live on while they wait (maybe months) for more inventory?

Capital earned from smashing all their previous sales records? They may be going into a dry spell but they're also likely coming out of a monsoon.

My LGS has not raised prices one dime. The next batch will likely go up some to reflect their increase in supplier costs but they won't be gouging. They are also limiting certain items, such as magazines, to five per type per month to help ensure more customers are able to get at least some of what they want.

Cee Zee
December 27, 2012, 06:40 PM
I would be ok with pricing based on what it would cost to replace ammo or firearms if they did the same thing when prices were going down. But how many companies buy ammo and sell it at a lower price than they expected because they know prices are going down? Not very many would be my guess. If they don't have the money to invest in ammo and then price it based on what they paid for it then most likely they don't have enough operating capital to stay in business anyway. I say they should sell what they have based on what they paid for it and if they have to pay more for the next shipment they can raise the price then. Raising prices on speculation is what the oil companies do and I don't think many people think the way they do things is fair.

Agsalaska
December 27, 2012, 06:44 PM
That is very disappointing. They should be charging much more for their items right now. I don't like seeing people not making sound business decisions. And I hate it even more when people don't understand market forces.

Sam1911
December 27, 2012, 09:10 PM
Companies that make money stay in business. Companies that stay in business are around to sell nice things to us tomorrow. A company that only makes *a little* money when they could make *more* money runs a greater chance of not living through lean times.

We should all be HAPPY for our gun stores that the market is being very good to them right now. We want our gun shops to do WELL, be profitable, and grow. We know things could be tougher in the next few months so we should be encouraging them to put aside any extra cash they can bring in.

Techsan
December 27, 2012, 09:38 PM
I love it, these stupid gun stores who haven't jacked up prices in the panic are a bunch of damn idiots who can't comprehend how the market works. Yes, let's call these idiots out while embracing the stores that raised prices sky high. I can't wait to spend my hard earned dollars at the stores that blew up their prices because they damn sure know how to run a business.

saenzrich
December 27, 2012, 11:10 PM
I love it, these stupid gun stores who haven't jacked up prices in the panic are a bunch of damn idiots who can't comprehend how the market works. Yes, let's call these idiots out while embracing the stores that raised prices sky high. I can't wait to spend my hard earned dollars at the stores that blew up their prices because they damn sure know how to run a business.

Thank you!!! The sarcasm was needed.

Agsalaska
December 28, 2012, 01:07 AM
Companies that make money stay in business. Companies that stay in business are around to sell nice things to us tomorrow. A company that only makes *a little* money when they could make *more* money runs a greater chance of not living through lean times.

We should all be HAPPY for our gun stores that the market is being very good to them right now. We want our gun shops to do WELL, be profitable, and grow. We know things could be tougher in the next few months so we should be encouraging them to put aside any extra cash they can bring in.
Dont always agree with your posts Sam. But amen to that one.

Sam1911
December 28, 2012, 09:08 AM
I'll add -- And instead of laughing at or pillorying the folks who will pay high prices right now, or telling them they've been CHEATED and SCREWED and RIPPED OFF, we should be thanking them for helping keep our shops and our hobby alive.

You're late to the party? Fine, there's a little donation required to help the community stay healthy but we welcome you with open arms and enjoy your new rifle!

Cee Zee
December 28, 2012, 04:11 PM
The last time this happened it was the companies that didn't jack up their prices needlessly that stayed in business. Several new stores popped up at that time and they're all gone now because they thought they could clean out their safes and get rich. It didn't work that way where I live.

I do want my LGS's to stay afloat. And they will do that by giving their customers an even break. No one expects them to lose money. I don't really expect them to get rich either. And it's the companies that operate on a narrow profit margin that grow exponentially in the long run. Companies like Buds. Their prices are as cheap as anyone's and they have expanded several times over the past few years (especially right after the last panic buying was over).

JustinJ
December 28, 2012, 04:23 PM
Companies that make money stay in business. Companies that stay in business are around to sell nice things to us tomorrow. A company that only makes *a little* money when they could make *more* money runs a greater chance of not living through lean times.

Companies that earn customer loyalty rather than making customers feel taken advantage make money and not just in the short term.

I'm skeptical of this argument that stores need to jack up prices to compensate for limited availability from their supplies. As has been mentioned before gun stores have also been selling out of the items which have been sitting around collecting dust for some time. I have to wonder if if many of these stores haven't sold more in a couple of weeks than they otherwise would have over the course of a few months. While they may not be able to get enough inventory to meet demand right now they may still have higher than normal sales as what they do get will be sold immediately as opposed to sitting around for a few weeks or months per usual. Failure to meet demand does not automatically equate to failure to make a profit.

JustinJ
December 28, 2012, 04:42 PM
repeat deleted

CraigC
December 28, 2012, 05:01 PM
Companies that make money stay in business. Companies that stay in business are around to sell nice things to us tomorrow. A company that only makes *a little* money when they could make *more* money runs a greater chance of not living through lean times.
Amen! IMHO, there's a lot of crap coming out of people who have absolutely no idea what it takes to run a successful business. If you have something that costs you $10 that you usually sell for $12 but you have the opportunity to sell it for $50, you're an idiot if you don't sell it for $50. Likewise, if you're a consumer and you take offense to your local shop selling a $12 item for $50, if you begrudge your local shop making a profit when and where he can, YOU are the one being disloyal, greedy and a few other things I'll refrain from saying on THR.

Greed is not exclusive to merchants and corporations. What we're seeing a lot of these days, particularly in silly threads like this, is ignorant consumer greed.

All of this is a direct result of liberalized thinking and living in a nanny state where everybody expects the government to protect them from the bad mens. :rolleyes:

JustinJ
December 28, 2012, 06:40 PM
All of this is a direct result of liberalized thinking and living in a nanny state where everybody expects the government to protect them from the bad mens.

Yes, because not wanting to pay a price one believes is fair obviously has not been a component of commerce since man began trading goods.
Damn communist Mesopotamians!

Likewise, if you're a consumer and you take offense to your local shop selling a $12 item for $50, if you begrudge your local shop making a profit when and where he can, YOU are the one being disloyal, greedy and a few other things I'll refrain from saying on THR.

Greed is not exclusive to merchants and corporations. What we're seeing a lot of these days, particularly in silly threads like this, is ignorant consumer greed.

If you think not wanting to pay a price that one deems unfair is "greed" i suggest checking out a dictionary. In the meantime, please contact me if you are ever in the market for a used car.

Sam1911
December 28, 2012, 10:28 PM
There's a difference here between not being willing to pay more than what you believe is a "fair" price, and being upset at your LGS and/or "panic buyers" who ARE willing to sell and buy for more than you think is "fair."

If you feel that a mid-range AR-15 shouldn't cost you more than $1,000, then you probably will have to wait a bit (or get pretty lucky at the moment) to find one in your price range. If you "NEED" one right this minute, you're probably going to have to loosen the purse strings.

That's fine and fair. Waiting for a more favorable "buyers' market" is part of the free market system, too.

Ill feeling (and worse statements) toward sellers and buyers who follow the market trends --wherever they may go-- is not.

Techsan
December 28, 2012, 10:58 PM
Amen! IMHO, there's a lot of crap coming out of people who have absolutely no idea what it takes to run a successful business. If you have something that costs you $10 that you usually sell for $12 but you have the opportunity to sell it for $50, you're an idiot if you don't sell it for $50. Likewise, if you're a consumer and you take offense to your local shop selling a $12 item for $50, if you begrudge your local shop making a profit when and where he can, YOU are the one being disloyal, greedy and a few other things I'll refrain from saying on THR.

Greed is not exclusive to merchants and corporations. What we're seeing a lot of these days, particularly in silly threads like this, is ignorant consumer greed.

All of this is a direct result of liberalized thinking and living in a nanny state where everybody expects the government to protect them from the bad mens.

To summarize, the gun store the OP started this thread to praise is run by idiots, and anyone who appreciates this gun store not jacking their prices up in the recent panic is a greedy socialist liberal. Got it, thanks for the perspective.

saenzrich
December 29, 2012, 12:09 AM
To summarize, the gun store the OP started this thread to praise is run by idiots, and anyone who appreciates this gun store not jacking their prices up in the recent panic is a greedy socialist liberal. Got it, thanks for the perspective.

Thank you...again...some how we are the bad apples? For being astute individuals.

Cee Zee
December 29, 2012, 03:10 AM
IMHO, there's a lot of crap coming out of people who have absolutely no idea what it takes to run a successful business.

Right. During the last panic a certain store that claimed to have prices cheaper than dirt (no specific names here ;) ) must have found some really freaking expensive dirt because they had ammo through the whole panic. The problem was it cost about 4 times what it should have cost. When I could find ammo elsewhere, and I always did, I could beat the prices of that one store like a drum. The ill will that store accumulated during that time was epic. People on every board around talked about how they would never buy from them again. And remember these are the hard core gun enthusiasts here. The panic buyers come and go quickly. The people who really like to shoot and spend thousands every year keeping those gun shops open really didn't like the way that company operated.

I just don't see how going for the quick buck is better than a long term approach to business. I just saw a special on the big capitalists of the 19th century and how their built their fortunes. They all planned decades ahead and they recognized the value of repeat business. Henry Ford pretty much set it in stone that the way to make money was to make your workers your customers. He didn't jack up prices at the drop of a hat. He actually cut prices when the economy dropped off during the depression. Ford is still with us. But where are the Packards and all the other companies that did business the "get rich quick" style? The Japanese beat us with these same tactics in the 1980's. But too many US companies are geared toward the bottom line of the next quarter. That's a big reason a lot of those companies are gone.

And since you're asking I have ran more than one business. There were times I went for the big bucks and I made them too. But those companies ran themselves in the ground in a couple of years. Other companies I started and ran lasted 10 years or more because I didn't try to make it all at once. My father built houses in the 1970's and 1980's. We worked as a 3 man crew and we could build about 8 houses a year. With 3 men doing 90% of the work. The year dad quit building houses he had 34 houses lined up to build. He got that successful by not gouging his customers. He (and I) paid my way through college like that.

There's more than one way to skin a cat friend. This isn't business class but what you said is way over the top and wrong in many ways. But pretty much every time you post you're way over the top I guess. I've avoided getting involved until now. I guess it was because my dad didn't do things the way you said it had to be done. I have run businesses. I've been around others. Sometimes a person can succeed by charging too much. Generally they charge the government which seems to not care what it pays. But for everyday folks they do have to pay attention to what they're paying and they demand an even break. And I've seen lots of businesses give them one and stay around for a very long time.

Hokkmike
December 29, 2012, 11:49 AM
I was going to call you out on the taking advantage part but your price on your mag is not too far out of line for the times we are in. gfpd707

Yeah, I reduce it just a bit (before I read this).....

CraigC
December 29, 2012, 01:01 PM
I am very sorry that you guys can't go out and buy the same things at the same prices you were paying a month ago. For the record, I don't like it either but I understand the reason behind it. I'd rather live in a free market where the laws of supply and demand dictate the price for a product than whatever you guys think should. Because many of you obviously seem to think that there should be some measure of control. Sorry but you can't have your cake and eat it too.

I'd love to know how many of you idealistic types would not raise your prices to match the market given similar circumstances. If you were selling your house that you paid $150,000 for, which was worth $175,000 when you listed it but due to a great increase in demand you now have an offer of $200,000, would you not sell it for $200k??? Or would you be "honest" and only take $175k??? I think I know the answer. All I see is a lot of idealistic BS when it comes to someone else's money and business. Very little perspective.

The parties to blame are our liberal politicians who wish to disarm us and your fellow shooter who thinks like Chicken Little. Not your local gun shop. I've been going to gun shops for 30yrs and have only ever met one owner who was what anyone would consider rich.

Sam1911
December 29, 2012, 01:23 PM
Right. During the last panic a certain store that claimed to have prices cheaper than dirt (no specific names here ) must have found some really freaking expensive dirt because they had ammo through the whole panic. The problem was it cost about 4 times what it should have cost. When I could find ammo elsewhere, and I always did, I could beat the prices of that one store like a drum. The ill will that store accumulated during that time was epic. People on every board around talked about how they would never buy from them again. And remember these are the hard core gun enthusiasts here. The panic buyers come and go quickly. The people who really like to shoot and spend thousands every year keeping those gun shops open really didn't like the way that company operated. And notice how ticking off loyal customers drove them right out of business? All those angry buyers sure turned out the lights and put them in the unemployment line, didn't it?

We all talk about how we'd be loyal to the LGS if they keep their prices "fair" and don't follow the market religiously. But how ever much our loyalty (to whatever extent...does that mean we WON'T go someplace else for a better price? Few could honestly say that...) means to them in theory, and however much of our own personal disposable income we might say goes right into their cash register, the few "loyal" customers do NOT keep the lights on at any business of size. The "regulars" are great and their business is appreciated, but the business lives on the far greater numbers of casual, occasional, walk-in traffic. Maybe your local shop can be loyal to YOU. Maybe you've given them so much business that they'll extend a favor and sell you a panic rifle at yesterday's cost. But if they do that for everyone they'll be out of business.

Shops don't have to hit the very top end of the market price during a panic, any more than they have to hit the very top end of the market price during more relaxed times. But they DO have to respond to the market, and buying low and selling high is the ESSENCE of any business. If you're not doing that, and socking away extra money when you can your business is a failure -- though your loyal pals may love you right to death.

ApacheCoTodd
December 29, 2012, 02:23 PM
So, by extension - the fella raising prices to the current market whether in response to desire for profit, offsetting high restock costs or noting the need for increased revenue due to a future perceived lull (lack of available inventory) or full stop in sales while still paying out in bills is what...

DISHONEST?

Just the kind of short thinking behind so much of the misdirection of government and voters these days. Most disappointing.

Sgt_R
December 29, 2012, 02:33 PM
Palmetto State Armory hasn't raised their prices.

Of course, that means that certain items are priced well below equilibrium price, and are, naturally, completely sold out. Observe:

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/12/12/30/utagenap.jpg

You can't cheat the laws of supply and demand.

R

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