[greyhound]

So here's the deal:

When I drop a mag after chambering a round (to add the +1) the round on top snags and actually pulls out of the mag and drops separately.

Been going on for a while now, and I have been playing with snap caps to try to figure out why and I have found that:

- happens with all 5 mags (all Ruger factory) that I have.

- I can rack that sucker as fast as I can, doesn't matter.

- full (8), half empty, 2 rounds in the mag, doesn't matter.

- the pistol cycles fine through a whole mag. Only if I eject the magazine before its empty does a round snag.

This never used to happen, and I clean the pistol religiously. My only supposition is that since it happens to every magazine in every situation something in the mag well is catching a round when I drop it, but I can't see it.

If I can make the MD shoot in Westminster on the 13th I might try to test the function with live rounds as opposed to snap caps, I don't think its too safe to be racking and decocking 100+ times with live ammo (though I first discovered the problem that way, of course).

Anyone ever had anything similar happen? This Ruger is generally a fine weapon, goes bang every time and all, but I have had just enough minor problems to regret getting rid of my Model 60 .357 in trade for it....

[Jim K]

It is not something in the mag well. When you chamber the top round, either it or the slide is catching the next round and pulling it forward. There is room to do this due to the way the gun is made.

Try using some layout blue or marker on the slide and the ammo and see if you can determine what is pulling on that second round. It could be the slide, but I think you will find the top round is what is pulling the second round forward.

When the round is forward, it is partly out of the magazine, so when you drop the magazine, the bullet point is dragged on the front of the mag well and pops out of the magazine. This is not only annoying, it is hard on the magazine feed lips as well, since it tends to spread them.

The problem is pretty common, and I honestly don't know what to do about it, except to suggest that if you use short bullets, switching to a longer bullet (closer to standard ball profile) might help.

FWIW, it also happens when firing, as recoil shoves the gun back, and the top round tries to stay where it is. But in firing, the slide tends to pull the top round back but then chambers it and you don't know it ever moved.

Jim

[Marshall]

I know it's not my gun. But hey Jim, that a great explanation sir!

:)

[P95Carry]

Indeed Jim ... nice job!

My P97 has been pretty well behaved and I hadn't noticed this as something in the ''problem'' category .

I will tho inspect closer next time I recharge and leave in condition #2.

[1911Tuner]

Jim said:

but I think you will find the top round is what is pulling the second round forward.

Yep yep...and the slide will drag it backward as it recoils, then the one under it will move forward as the slide goes to battery, etc. Solution:
Load the chamber from a separate magazine with just the one round,
then lock in the carry mag. Improvise! Adapt! Overcome! HOOAH!

As you were...I'll be in the area all day.

[greyhound]

Yep, that makes perfect sense. Didn't use to happen though, but I've hit 700 rounds and maybe as the pistol "breaks in" it might develop its own quirks?

I like the idea from 1911Tuner - it will work.

Still think I'll test it out since I haven't actually fired the pistol since I found the problem. If its all OK I guess I will just have to accept it or get rid of the gun (and given trade in values here I might as well keep it).

Been using Cor-Bon Pow-r-Ball so thats equivalent to FMJ ammo.

Thanks, folks, this has been bothering me for a couple weeks! Count on THR to provide some answers!:D

[1911Tuner]

Maybe it's developed a few, but more likely the mag spring has weakened a little, and the underside of the mag feed lips have gotten polished with
use. Coefficient of friction is the key to the mystery, I betcha.

Cheers!

Tuner

[Badger Arms]

This is an easy one!

Here's what's happening... I think. The slide is dragging the second round in the magazine slightly forward of where it would sit in the magazine. When you eject the mag, your bullet is catching on the magazine catch that sits inside the mag well a little. This is the only part which is allowed to hang into the mag well any. You are likely hitting the mag release and then releasing it while you pull the magazine out.

Solution? Hold the magazine release until the top bullet has cleared the mag catch. There is also another solution which makes alot more sense. When loading the chamber, I always load ONE round in the mag, insert, chamber, and eject an empty magazine. Then you load the rest of the mag. This also has the positive result of letting you load the first round in the mag twice rather than loading the last round in the mag twice, understand?

[greyhound]

You are likely hitting the mag release and then releasing it while you pull the magazine out.

Man, I was REALLY hoping this was it, as operator error is easy to fix:) , but alas, even if I held the mag release down till AFTER the mag was out it still happened.

Thanks for the "load a one round mag, then reload" tactic, looks like that's what I'll be doing.

Only time I could see this problem being bad is if trying to to a tactical reload on a half empty magazine, i.e. the mag wouldn't drop freely.

But, since this isn't my HD gun or a carry piece (Maryland, ya know), it should still be OK for the range and even as a second (back-up) HD pistol.

Thanks for all the help, as usual I learned something!

[orangeninja]

If it makes you feel any better....the chances of you using that gun are roughly about 1 in a million...and since you have another HD gun...multiply THAT times 2. Now consider that when a shooting happens...96 to 97% of the time neither shooter gets an opportunity to reload. It happens too fast. Then consider that of those less than 1% of all shootings will you actually fire ALL available rounds...(and this is for cops who carry 2 extra mags and have no right to retreat). So I guess that means this gun will probably be a problem in .0000000001% of shootings. Man...you should DUMP it.:D


(SARCASM GUYS):cool:

[1911Tuner]

alduro nailed it...If you haven't gotten your problem solved with the
rounds in the mag, it ain't likely that you will solve it without God's help.
Remember, your goal is to survive...not to make a stand. Shoot and scoot.
When you get well-scooted, you can reload at a more leisurely pace,
preferably from behind solid cover.

Also..ask yourself a hard question. Do you WANT to be standin' there with
a loaded gun in your hand when the cops come rollin' in to respond to a
"Shots fired. Man down" call? Not me, brother. I want to unass the AO
and call'em to give'em my version of what went down.

Just food for studyin' on...

Tuner

[greyhound]

Yup, just let me fire 150 rounds at the range to make sure some FTF/FTE/etc isn't going to pop up all of a sudden from this "back and forth" of the top round and I will put my mind at ease!

["yote"]

The problem is that the pistol is a Ruger "P series".
Trade it in for something good like a Glock!!!!!!!!!!

[BryanP]

The problem is that the pistol is a Ruger "P series".

So "yote", tell us what you really think. 16 posts and so far 25% of them have been "Ruger P-Series suck, Glocks Rule!" So, like, did Bill Ruger kick your puppy when you were a kid or something? :confused:

I mean really. I've heard people gripe about the Ruger P series pistols, but none of the gripes have been about reliability. Ugly? Check. Bulky? Check. Generally clunky in appearance and feel? Check. Rock solid reliable to the point of being boring? Check.

[orangeninja]

Am I weird for thinking some of the Rugers like the P94 and 93 actually look pretty cool in stainless? I also like the P95 and 97 in stainless. Decocker is flat and ugly, but the lines of the gun are smooth. I like them. But then as I said....I might be weird.

BTW....I have owned 2 Glocks. A 22 and a 23....they were both ammo picky, the 22 had reliability problems and I absolutely hated to shoot either of them during practice or quals. To each their own. The only Glocks I like are the .45's.

[P95Carry]

Not much to tell the P95 and P97 apart ... I might be wierd And I too might be wierd alduro!! But ... Bryan nailed it .. Ugly? Check. Bulky? Check. Generally clunky in appearance and feel? Check. Rock solid reliable to the point of being boring? Check.
http://www.bedford.net/design/cb_gun2/p95_s.jpg


http://www.bedford.net/design/cb_gun2/p97_s.jpg


I could tend to be disparaging about Glocks .. but usually hold my tongue!:p

[Lagadelphia]

I had a P-95 DC that was unreliable. It would fail to reset the trigger sometimes multiple times a mag. Other times it would run for awhile, then failure to reset. Happened with target loads and with defensive +p+ loads. You'd have to either smack the back of the slide or use the decocker to get it to rest the trigger.

I ended up getting rid of it after I got my Glock. All that said, I didn't mind the gun asthetically and it was a good shooter accuracy wise. After all I've read about them, it appears that I must have gotten a lemon.

[orangeninja]

I too recieved a lemmon P97 .45. The slide catch would pop out during shooting. It took 2 trips to the factory to fix. By that time I had been fed up with it so much I practically gave it away. My confidence was completely shot. I have since learned that mine was a unique case and that a few had gotten past their "quality control" with the hole being too large on the lockup notch. The frame had to be replaced, or maybe the slide...I can't remember. But every manufacturer has bad ones. I had a Glock 22 that was a total POS. Jammed all the time with anything. Even with NEW mags. Light hits on the primer was another headache caused by that gun. The Glock guys responses were to the effect of "it must be the ammo".

["yote"]

Had 2 P-series pistols. A P-89 and a P-95. Both were the most unreliable
guns that I have ever owned. They had to be SPOTLESS to function. The
P89 would only shoot FMJ and that not always a given. The P95 broke
2 firing pins and one spring and the P89 broke 3 extractors. Everybody
said send them back to Ruger. I shouldn't have to do that! So fix them
and get rid of them! Traded them off for Glocks and Sigs'. I have a new
policy when it comes to auto pistols: If the military doesn't use it, I don't
buy it!!!

That pretty leaves it to Glock, Sig, Baretta 92F and1911's

[Badger Arms]

Hmmmm, of the seven Ruger Autoloaders I can remember off the top of my head, each and every one was 100% reliable. Not that I doubt your story, Yote, but my experiences are 180 degrees different from yours. That's two P-85's, a P89, two P94's, a P95 and a P97. Those are just the ones I owned and shot, not indluding the Ruger Autoloaders I've sold without a single return.

When we examine the initial post, we will note that the gun is 100% reliable. Looking at my P95, I can't see how his gun is stripping rounds off the top, but that's a problem he's worked around.That pretty leaves it to Glock, Sig, Baretta 92F and1911'sPlease spell and grammar check your posts a bit better. It hurts my eyes!