Would the ACLU help?


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seaboss
December 29, 2012, 11:48 AM
Crazy question, but would the ACLU step in to stop these left wing, freedom-hating government control freaks from stripping our 2nd Amendment?

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Quiet
December 29, 2012, 12:07 PM
The national ACLU will not.

But, individual state ACLUs would and have done so ever since SCOTUS ruled the Second Amendment was an individual right.


Example...

ACLU of Nevada Supports Individual’s Right to Bear Arms (http://www.aclunv.org/aclu-nevada-supports-individual%E2%80%99s-right-bear-arms)

June 27, 2008

In light of the United States Supreme Court's decision concerning the D.C. handgun ban (District of Columbia v. Heller) the ACLU of Nevada considers it important to clearly state its position regarding the right to bear arms. The Nevada ACLU respects the individual's right to bear arms subject to constitutionally permissible regulations. The ACLU of Nevada will defend this right as it defends other constitutional rights. This policy was formulated by our afilliate Board in light of both the U.S. Constitution and the clearly-stated individual right to bear arms as set out in the Nevada Constitution's Declaration of Rights.

Tommygunn
December 29, 2012, 12:08 PM
Let's see....................................... NO!

seaboss
December 29, 2012, 12:14 PM
Thank you Quiet.
Thank hopefully looks encouraging. I'll do a search to see where the Florida ACLU stands.

Happy New Year to all!

KenW.
December 29, 2012, 12:14 PM
Protecting the Second Amendment does not fit thier agenda.

clem
December 29, 2012, 12:34 PM
The ACLU is part of the problem, because they will do NOTHING!

ToraBoraBlues
December 29, 2012, 07:19 PM
Let's see, the ACLU was founded by commie agitators who openly stated their goal was the destruction of the United States. Nope, can't see 'em helping.

That said, I know some members who are pretty close to libertarians in their own ideology. Wouldn't surprise me if local chapters occasionally helped, but I don't know how strict their hierarchy is.

goon
December 29, 2012, 08:20 PM
According to their site, they only have half a million members. If half a million NRA members suddenly joined their ranks it would shift their demographics and could possibly force a reappraisal of their stance on gun related issues.

I've thought the same thing myself with the Democratic party. I'm pretty libertarian by nature and some of the things democrats want to do - a lot of them actually - are OK with me. But I can't side with them or vote for their candidates, largely because of the anti-gun platform that we're seeing in effect now. But if we could get enough people to join their party and shift them more to the center through primary elections, maybe they wouldn't be so bad.

Pretty unlikely though. Probably easier to try and herd cats.

Green Lantern
December 29, 2012, 08:59 PM
According to their site, they only have half a million members. If half a million NRA members suddenly joined their ranks it would shift their demographics and could possibly force a reappraisal of their stance on gun related issues.

That's something I've given some thought to...the ACLU isn't an individual choosing to act, it's the MEMBERSHIP that drives it's decisions. Get enough pro-2A people in there, and (in theory) they'll have little choice but to actually recognize it along with the rest of the Bill of Rights...

As for the Democrat Party....I know several Democrats who are at least moderately pro-gun. The problem with it seems to be that the leadership positions always seem to go to some of the worst gun-haters out there!

4v50 Gary
December 29, 2012, 09:03 PM
it's the MEMBERSHIP that drives it's decisions.

Not quite. Generally leadership in any union, non-profit group receive foundation money. Pretty soon the foundation tells them what to do and how to think. Don't tow the line and that foundation funds dry up muy pronto. That's why rank and file police support the Second whereas chiefs and "fraternal police organizations" don't. That's why big organizations like AARP and big unions don't support the Second either. In the unions, the business agents push the agenda on the membership who like sheep follow.

5whiskey
December 29, 2012, 09:15 PM
Protecting the Second Amendment does not fit thier agenda.

UNLESS>>>

you're a convicted Felon, who shouldn't own a firearm in the first place, and the you get charged with possessing one after the police search your car. Of course, in that case narcotics were found as well... this makes it especially appealing to the ACLU.

Jim K
December 29, 2012, 09:27 PM
When it comes to guns, the ACLU is "left wing, freedom-hating government control freaks".

Next question.

Jim

freyasman
December 29, 2012, 10:59 PM
Once any organization grows beyond a certain number of members it becomes bureaucracy; google the "Iron Law of Bureaucracy"

splithoof
December 29, 2012, 11:41 PM
If I put on my cowboy boots, quick-draw rig, glasses with the small purple round lenses, and walked through the streets naked, they might be more inclined to help. Shades of Topanga Canyon!

1911 guy
December 29, 2012, 11:45 PM
I look at most of the cases the ACLU takes on and am disgusted at what they represent. They seem to gravitate toward representing whatever is in opposition to accepted norms and decrying societal norms as being "intolerant". They won't help an elderly veteran who wants to fly a flag deemed "too large", but they'll defend a guy who deliberately offends people by painting the Virgin Mary in elephant dung.

Dreamliner787
December 30, 2012, 09:40 AM
They are not what their name says that they are. Just look at the cases that they represent and have been involved with.

Slipknot_Slim
December 30, 2012, 09:55 AM
In reading the ACLU's own position on the 2nd Amendment and gun control, the answer that I get as to their willingness to help gun owners is.....probably not.

http://www.aclu.org/racial-justice_prisoners-rights_drug-law-reform_immigrants-rights/second-amendment

Derek Zeanah
December 30, 2012, 09:57 AM
The definitive answer is: maybe.

I'm one of those folks that gives to the NRA and the ACLU. Gun control is worth fighting, but it's not the only thing that's wrong with American Government today. Off the top of my head, congress just signed off on continued warrantless surveillance in the US of all electronic communications until 2017, and the president maintains a "kill list" that is used for targeted assassinations of folks (including US citizens) who are given no notice, no opportunity to confront their accuser, likely no substantive evidence is required, and the assassinations themselves will be covered up (in the name of national security).

I spoke with one of the directors at the ACLU while I was walking the aisles at the SHOT show last year, and they're warming up to the idea of firearms being a constitutional right worth protecting. It's taking time, and there's an old guard and some inertia, but it's getting there. Some state chapters are already there.

If you want to change the organization, join it and express your opinion.

Crashbox
December 30, 2012, 10:04 AM
ACLU: Absolutely Clueless Lawyers' Union (now I'll probably get sued for definition of character)-

Of the beaucoup number of cases I have seen them handle, I can count on one hand the number I agreed with their POV but I can't even remember the cases themselves. There was one case probably 10-15 years ago where gov't was clearly overstepping their bounds (nothin' new there) and IMO the ACLU actually took the right stand, but I truly think that was the exception to the rule.

ETA: My opinion is that in all likelihood they will NOT be supportive of ANY pro-2A issues. It would be a miracle if they prove me wrong, which I would love to see.

I'll shut up for now, need more caffeine for the cerebral thermionic valves...

rodinal220
December 30, 2012, 10:09 AM
aaahhhhaaaaaahhhhhaaaaaahhhhaaaaaahhhhaaaaahhhhaaahhhhaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


NO.

freyasman
December 30, 2012, 12:51 PM
[QUOTE][/QUOTEI'm one of those folks that gives to the NRA and the ACLU. Gun control is worth fighting, but it's not the only thing that's wrong with American Government today. Off the top of my head, congress just signed off on continued warrantless surveillance in the US of all electronic communications until 2017, and the president maintains a "kill list" that is used for targeted assassinations of folks (including US citizens) who are given no notice, no opportunity to confront their accuser, likely no substantive evidence is required, and the assassinations themselves will be covered up (in the name of national security).

I agree, Derek, those are issues we need to address. Whenever someone thanks me for my service, or for "fighting for our freedoms", I always feel a little uncomfortable... 'cause if I've been "fighting for our freedoms" for the last 20yrs, I sure am taking a beating.

ec4321
December 30, 2012, 10:48 PM
I look at most of the cases the ACLU takes on.... they'll defend a guy who deliberately offends people by painting the Virgin Mary in elephant dung.

Well that is his right/civil liberty.

If you want others to respect your 2A rights, even though they might be offended by guns, you may consider that if not all rights are respected - you cannot expect the ones you hold dear to be.

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