Do these bullets look right? (30-30 experts)


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lharrell79
December 29, 2012, 01:33 PM
Let me preface this with saying that i've never reloaded 30-30 before, so these flat points are new to me. I recently purchased 2 boxes of speer deep curl 170gr FP #2042. This is what I received:

http://s9.postimage.org/rc6qu47nz/DSCN2685.jpg
http://s9.postimage.org/rc6qu47nz/DSCN2685.jpg
http://s2.postimage.org/8df28q7ix/DSCN2703.jpg
http://s2.postimage.org/8df28q7ix/DSCN2703.jpg
http://s2.postimage.org/phwdbeffd/DSCN2692.jpg
http://s2.postimage.org/phwdbeffd/DSCN2692.jpg
http://s7.postimage.org/s0msu5jgr/DSCN2707.jpg
http://s7.postimage.org/s0msu5jgr/DSCN2707.jpg

Basically, there is lead everywhere. I've loaded soft points in pistol before, but not rifle. My experience with pistol soft points has been better uniformity than this. So, do these look right? Lead smeared all over, and hanging off.

In the third picture, the bullet on the far right is one that I cleaned up. After wiping off all the lead, it looks a little better. However, even the copper jacket isn't uniform. At the tip of the bullet, the copper jacket rides up higher on one side than the other. So, basically at the tip of the bullet, there is more exposed lead on one side than the other.

My concerns are reduced accuracy, and lack of controlled expansion. What are your thoughts?

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ArchAngelCD
December 29, 2012, 01:37 PM
I'm a little surprised Speer let those bullets out of the factory looking like that. Commercial manufacturers usually tumble bullets and ammo to clean them up before they package them. Those look like they missed that step but will probably shoot just fine.

243winxb
December 29, 2012, 01:42 PM
Loaded with a Lee Classic "hammer" loader?? OOPs, not loaded yet. U can tell i am no expert. :D

bds
December 29, 2012, 01:44 PM
Loaded with a Lee Classic "hammer" loader??
They haven't been loaded yet. ;)

bhhacker
December 29, 2012, 02:01 PM
They look a bit rough but will probably shoot just fine. I would maybe clean up the lead on the tips. the stuff that shouldnt be there should flake off if that makes sense.

jcwit
December 29, 2012, 02:01 PM
Loaded with a Lee Classic "hammer" loader?? OOPs, not loaded yet. U can tell i am no expert.


Not really, I've used a Lee Loader "hammer" for both 30-30 and 32 Win. Spec. and never had bullets look like that. In fact I even reload with cast bullets.

rcmodel
December 29, 2012, 02:04 PM
If I paid $28 bucks a box for Speer bullets and they looked like that??

I'd be on the phone with Speer monday morning.

Or send them an email with those pictures today.

That right there just ain't right from any manufacture.

And I wouldn't load them or shoot them.
Speer owes you some new bullets that got made right.

rc

DeadFlies
December 29, 2012, 02:20 PM
Yow! Those are ugly.

I agree with rc, I wouldn't tolerate that kind of slop for that kind of money. Not when there are so many other bullets manufacturers competing for my dollars.

MSgtEgress
December 29, 2012, 03:35 PM
I agree with RC I'm sure Speer QC would want to know about that lot # and recall them. Call Speer

lharrell79
December 29, 2012, 03:56 PM
Anyone have speer's number or email? I went to their website, and they've taken down their info because of all the ammo panic inquiries.

joed
December 29, 2012, 04:03 PM
That is pretty bad. About all you'll be able to do is send a letter if they won't accept phone calls or email. I'd never buy their bullets again though, and I'm pretty good at holding a grudge.

I'm surprised we're not seeing a lot move of this, because they figure they can get away with it.

jcwit
December 29, 2012, 04:13 PM
Here you go

ATK AMMUNITION-CCI/SPEER
2299 SNAKE RIVER AVE
LEWISTON, ID 83501-9685 | view map
(208) 746-2351

Buy Detailed Profile $5.00 | view a sample www.atk.com

jcwit
December 29, 2012, 04:15 PM
That is pretty bad. About all you'll be able to do is send a letter if they won't accept phone calls or email. I'd never buy their bullets again though, and I'm pretty good at holding a grudge.



If I felt that way about things I've bought over the last 69 years there would be very little left to buy.

Every business has their slip-ups.

lharrell79
December 29, 2012, 04:19 PM
Okay, back to the original questions. Does everyone agree that these are not normal? Does anyone have any loading experience with these, and can confirm that their bullets looked different?

45lcshooter
December 29, 2012, 04:24 PM
They should shoot fine. If it was me I would use a heavier sandpaper or emery cloth and just clean them up a little bit.

lharrell79
December 29, 2012, 04:31 PM
I'll try contacting speer 1st to see what they say. I'm mostly disappointed with speer. I've always found them to have top notch quality.

These will be used for hunting, so my biggest concern is their accuracy, and ability to expand uniformly.

Ditchtiger
December 29, 2012, 04:34 PM
Okay, back to the original questions. Does everyone agree that these are not normal? Does anyone have any loading experience with these, and can confirm that their bullets looked different?
Yep, those are poor quality bullets.
They will work OK but I would be worried the lead may flake off and get into the rifle's mechanics or moving parts.

lharrell79
December 29, 2012, 04:39 PM
That's another thing i'm worried about, is the lead gumming up the rifle over time. I can literally pick it off with my fingernails, and it just falls off.

JLDickmon
December 29, 2012, 04:39 PM
scrape the lead off with a knife, load 'em up and shoot 'em.

they look fine, other than the QC guy took the day off..

floydster
December 29, 2012, 04:45 PM
Terrible bullets, where is the QC, I can't imagine a bullet of that quality leaving the factory,
someone slipped up letting those go thru the line.

Smokeyloads

joed
December 29, 2012, 04:52 PM
I'll try contacting speer 1st to see what they say. I'm mostly disappointed with speer. I've always found them to have top notch quality.

These will be used for hunting, so my biggest concern is their accuracy, and ability to expand uniformly.
Sure they look bad but will work fine. They're ugly yes, but should be just fine for whatever use you have in mind.

You can mess up the tip of a bullet and it will still work fine, but mess up the base and it won't work.

kingmt
December 29, 2012, 07:55 PM
I don't like Speer that well but I'd shoot them. They don't look that bad to me. I've seen a lot worse in load ammo with tips bent, ends smashed, & all kinds of crazy stuff. Only times I've refused to shoot any was one I found a split jacket on & another time a guy asked me to figure out why he couldn't shoot his rifle in so I shoot a 303 for my first time & wasn't much harder then a 22 but the next shoot hurt then the third round was a 270. I wouldn't shoot anymore. The box of Remington was sealed & there want even a 270 on the range.

Walkalong
December 29, 2012, 10:06 PM
Call Speer. They will replace them, and probably be glad you called. That is just sloppy.

That said.
scrape the lead off with a knife, load 'em up and shoot 'em.I would not have a problem doing this. I bet you will never see the difference on target. Tips don't matter much until you get into really long range shots.

I just bought some 130 and 150 Gr Speer Hot Core bullets to try, and the tips are near perfect.

ArchAngelCD
December 29, 2012, 10:12 PM
Okay, back to the original questions. Does everyone agree that these are not normal? Does anyone have any loading experience with these, and can confirm that their bullets looked different?
No, they are not normal but it's only cosmetic from what I can see. Like I said in Post #2, it looks like those bullet skipped the tumbling step before they packaged them. I also agree it's unacceptable, and at any price from any maker.

lharrell79
December 29, 2012, 10:30 PM
Thank you all for the input. I think the consensus is that these bullets are not the norm. Therefore, I will be contacting Speer and asking for an exchange.

Reefinmike
December 29, 2012, 10:38 PM
make sure to tell them you haphazardly loaded them before noticing the funky tips and only have 5 that you can send back in for analysis :)

ArchAngelCD
December 29, 2012, 10:39 PM
Thank you all for the input. I think the consensus is that these bullets are not the norm. Therefore, I will be contacting Speer and asking for an exchange.
I think you are 100% justified. Please keep us updated on what they do.

W.E.G.
December 29, 2012, 10:42 PM
They aren't pretty.

Your rifle won't care.

Flick the loose stuff off if you think it might fall off in the innards of the rifle.

We're talking 30-30's here.

GP100man
December 29, 2012, 10:49 PM
Yrs. back I had a Contender to play/hunt/shoot & recieved the most accurate barrel ever in 7-30 waters !!

Fireformed brass from 30-30 with some bullets pulled from 7Mag with pliers, can`t begin to tell ya how mangled they were !! hey I was just fireforming rite ???:cool:

Anyways a target was set at 25yds - - - 5 shots 1 hole - - OK I went to 50yds - - -5 shots a little bigger, but a 1 hole group.

Not one person I called was close enuff to come witness this:banghead:

100 yds 1 1/4" outside to outside group !!!

Man I loved that barrel & that 4x loopy

Sport45
December 29, 2012, 11:10 PM
make sure to tell them you haphazardly loaded them before noticing the funky tips and only have 5 that you can send back in for analysis :)

I think you've forgotten where you are. This is The High Road.

I'd let the manufacturer know what they'd sent out and probably just scrape the loose lead of and shoot them. You might get a coupon for some more. I doubt they'll want them back.

col.lemat
December 29, 2012, 11:13 PM
If looks could kill, them's some deadly bullets there!

Alferd Packer
December 30, 2012, 03:11 AM
I feel the same as some of you in that the bullets look terrible.I would put them back in the box and go back where I got them with the receipt. Was the seal broken on the box? I have used Speer bullets and Vernon Speer, May he rest in peace, would NEVER let those out the door, not even for free giveaways. The boxes may have been crushed in shipping and bullets damaged. Sorted thru and the worst ones tossed, the ones the retailer thought weren't too bad, were lumped together and counted to make up full boxes. The crushed boxes tossed, and boxes from ammo shot at the range, were saved for the repackaging. At $28 plus tax, its worth the trouble. It does no good to ask to have other boxes at the store opened for inspection.They will say they can't open a box unless you are buying it. That printed tape that says"SEALED FOR YOUR PROTECTION" is usually holding the top and bottom closed. Was your bullet box sealed and opened in your presence? I can buy that tape from business office suppliers.Calling SPEER is your best bet. When you call, have the name, address and phone number of the store where you purchased those ugly bullets. Have the Lot number on the boxes ready.I would have the ammo at my elbow when I called SPEER as well as the store receipt. Please try. Respectfully yours, A.P.

x_wrench
December 30, 2012, 09:04 AM
i think someone played baseball with that box, and hit it with the bat at least 50 times. does the box look as bad as the bullets? if not, then speer really missed the boat on those. their inspector must have taken the day off. i think they will shoot ok, and i would not worry about expansion. they will still do that. the thing to remember is that the base of the bullet is 10 times more sensitive than the nose. those might open up your groups a bit, but they should still be acceptable. if the base of the bullets are damaged, speer or the retailer owes you a box of bullets.

lharrell79
December 30, 2012, 12:23 PM
Just to answer a few questions:

These were bought online and shipped to me.
Both boxes were sealed, and show no signs of being roughed up at all.
The bullets are packed very tightly in the box, and cannot move. So this most likely didn't happen in transit.
I emailed the online retailer yesterday, and will be calling Speer tomorrow.

After reading all the comments and thinking this over, i've come to the conclusion that i'm probably overreacting about these bullets. However, when you pay for premium bullets, there should be no need to "scrape and clean" each bullet to get them suitable to your liking. After all, I could have easily went with Sierra, Hornady, Nosler, etc. if I would have known that these bullets would look like this. I'm confident that these bullets should not have left Speer in this condition, and i'm also confident that they will agree. I highly doubt they want their consumers receiving bulllets such as these, and then showing them on the internet.

Once I hear back from the online retailer and Speer, I will let you guys know what they say.

Walkalong
December 30, 2012, 01:38 PM
Do these bullets look right?No, they should look more like this.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=176873&stc=1&d=1356891324

lharrell79
December 30, 2012, 03:57 PM
Walkalong, what bullet is that?

blarby
December 30, 2012, 04:18 PM
I use a lot of speer.

That is most certainly not right.

Call them tomorrow, and explain. The speer line is expensive enough- thats not acceptable.

Walkalong
December 30, 2012, 04:48 PM
Walkalong, what bullet is that?Speer 130 Gr Hot Core (http://www.midwayusa.com/product/311507/speer-hot-cor-bullets-30-caliber-308-diameter-130-grain-flat-nose-box-of-100)

The Bushmaster
December 31, 2012, 10:26 AM
W.E.G. Are you saying that .30-30 ammunition and the rifles they are shot from are inaccurate? Shame...!!

I have owned a Winchester Mod 94 .30 WCF sense I was 18 (just turned 70. Walkalong yer fallin' behind). It is 64 years old and will place 3 three bullets within 1 5/8" spread at 100 yards using 170 grain Speer FN Hot Cores.

ByTheWay...Speer Hot Cores don't look like yours, lharrell79...

rich636
January 3, 2013, 06:34 AM
I've had issues with bullet components from Speer, they treated me very well. No BS, just shipped out a replacement box that day.

bshepherd
January 3, 2013, 11:25 AM
Midway was selling boatloads of blemished bullets a few months ago, could you have gotten some of those?

ironworkerwill
January 3, 2013, 12:16 PM
right, midway did hava a blem sale!

anyway NO they are NOT cosmetically correct.

Id give speer a ring and hear what they have to say, that is if you didn't accidentally buy blems from midway. besides that I know for a fact that the base of the bullet has more to do with accuracy than the tip- go figure. they should shoot fine out to normal 30-30 ranges. as others said I also would recommend taking a hard plastic edge and scraping that flaky lead off so it wouldn't get in the reciever.

ironworkerwill
January 3, 2013, 12:22 PM
walkalong thats a .35 rem lol

lharrell79
January 3, 2013, 05:34 PM
I finally got a hold of somebody at Speer today, and he was very understanding and polite. He asked me to email him pics and lot numbers, and he would get back to me on Monday. He did say that they do put seconds out their in the market, but they should have been sold as seconds.

I'll update when I here back from Speer.

lharrell79
January 10, 2013, 04:47 PM
Ok, Speer called me back today, and the gentleman that i've been speaking with said they're going to put a production hold on the 170 deep curl. He said they pulled a couple of boxes from their warehouse, opened them up, and they looked exactly like the ones I have. He said that is definitly not the quality of bullet they put out, and not what they want the customers to receive. He also assured me that they should function like they're supposed to, and that this is strictly a cosmetic issue. He told me to keep the bullets, clean them up some, and he's going to send me some 170 hot cor's for my troubles.

hueyville
January 10, 2013, 06:33 PM
Load em and shoot em. It is a 30-30 right? Might have second thoughts before loading them in an F class rifle for 1,000 yards. For the vererable 30-30 lever gun. Let em fly.

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