[Bartholomew Roberts]

According to the Boston Herald (http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_coverage/2013/01/menino_veep_promised_him_fast_action_gun_control), Joe Biden told Thomas Menino (one of the mayors in Bloomberg's anti-gun group) that they would pass legislation by the end of January "guaranteed."

A magazine ban bill has been introduced in the House; but is unlikely to leave the Judiciary committee without active assistance from the GOP. In the Senate, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid has said he will extend the first session's legislative day to January 22 - meaning no new legislation introduced in the Senate until then.

That gives 9 days to get a gun control bill through the House and Senate for Joe Biden's guarantee to be true. Now I know that Biden is about as sharp as round post; but he has been in the Senate forever. Even he has to realize that what he "guaranteed" would be extremely difficult even with a relatively uncontroversial bill. With gun control, such a thing has literally never happened.

Part of it makes me wonder if they are deliberately trying to use a panic to create scarcity since they know they are unlikely to achieve one through legislation?

Either way, contact your Congressman and save a box of ammo's worth of cash for your favorite RKBA group. Not only can you protect your rights until more reasonable prices resume, you can make Joe Biden look like an idiot once again.

[ZeSpectre]

ZeSpectre Promises to Fight Biden Every Step of the Way

"Thorn in the side" online activist Zespectre vows that Joe Biden will be forced to eat his "guarantee" without salt."

[guzzi]

Why would a politician want criminals to have the upper hand on the voters?

[Stargazer65]

Part of it makes me wonder if they are deliberately trying to use a panic to create scarcity since they know they are unlikely to achieve one through legislation?

What would that accomplish? It's not really a true scarcity, there are as many guns and mags now as before, it's just that they are with owners instead of sitting in the stores.

[Bartholomew Roberts]

It is true scarcity all right - try buying or even ordering an AR from a manufacturer. Many dealers are being told they don't know when orders will be filled - which is part of why dealers are marking up rifles to insane prices. If you had no idea when you would get your next AR and your next AR has to yield enough profit to keep you in business until you receive more, that can be very uncertain.

There are a lot of opportunities to end a business there. Order too few and go out of business while you wait for more. Order too many and go out of business if the demand (which is driven primarily by threats from government) suddenly drops and you are stuck with inventory you overpaid for.

[Stargazer65]

I guess it's more complicated than I assumed. I always thought if people were buying faster than you could stock something, business was good.

[beatledog7]

I guess it's more complicated than I assumed. I always thought if people were buying faster than you could stock something, business was good.

If demand is so high for a product that the manufacturer(s) can't keep up, eventually the market gives up on waiting for one and finds a substitute, meaning that by the time the thing is once again available, the market has dried up.

[bikerdoc]

"Mumbles" Menino is a simple tool being used to spread disinformation as part of bigger strategy. What that strategy is should be our focus.

[Stargazer65]

If demand is so high for a product that the manufacturer(s) can't keep up, eventually the market gives up on waiting for one and finds a substitute, meaning that by the time the thing is once again available, the market has dried up.

I would think that would be cyclical. If the stores end uip with a glut of AR-15s, then they mark the prices down, then people would start buying them again, eventually it would balance out again.

I guess in the short run, I could see that fluctuation driving a small gun shop out of business.

[KDS]

The problem is that in this economy, very few gun shops can afford to buy high and sell low, at least for long.

[Sav .250]

That`s just Joe being Joe. It makes for good reading. That being said,
rest assured, there will be some sort/type of legislation ref: the gun control/large mag issue. That`s a given.

[Bartholomew Roberts]

A bill will be introduced. That is a given. There is no way it will become a law if we do our part in contacting our elected leaders, writing letters to the editor, give well-reasoned responses on Facebook, etc.

[mister_murphy]

I wonder if there are any restrictions proposed, if they will create incredibly stronger sentances, perferably mandentory, for criminals who use firearms in a violent crime?

[Hypnogator]

they will create incredibly stronger sentances, perferably mandentory, for criminals who use firearms in a violent crime?,

Nooooo, but you can bet they'll create incredibly stronger mandatory sentences for all of us "potential mass murderers" who own firearms. :uhoh::cuss::cuss::cuss::banghead::banghead::banghead:

[mister_murphy]

Hypnogator,

Your probably right. Found the below from NY about their possible new AWB after I posted my previous message.


http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/n...A5bNtmL6jpDeCO

Efforts by Cuomo to reach an agreement with the Legislature on a package of gun-control laws has, so far, gone nowhere.

Senate Republicans, who will retain enormous power in January, have made it clear they don’t support confiscation of assault weapons or any new severe restrictions on their ownership.

Assembly Democrats back the most severe restrictions but, sources said, have repeatedly refused to agree to sharp increases in penalties for illegal gun possession or for the use of guns in violent crimes.

Seems they want to ban guns, but not increase punishment, let alone start prosecuting firearm offenses already on the books...I get it. We ban "this" type of firearm, and since the punishment wasnt changed, there was no effect of violent crimes, so they ban "another type" next, and so forth, all the while claiming they are tough on crime, but in reality they just want to take firearms away from the law abiding person, while continuing to let criminals breeze through the revolving door with little to no punishment for violent crimes....

Im sure Biden and Crew will follow along in lockstep, claiming to get tough on crime, but in reality, they dont even try to actually punish those who commit violent crimes, and if they do, its only a basic slap on the wrist.

[TennJed]

I did not see this posted alread, If it has I apologize. I will admit I do not know as much about how laws are passed as I should. could it really happen that fast?

Boston Mayor: Biden ‘Guaranteed’ Me Obama Will Pass Gun Control Legislation By End Of January

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/01/04/boston-mayor-biden-guaranteed-me-obama-will-pass-gun-control-legislation-by-end-of-january/

Biden) said, ‘Tommy, I guarantee you, we’ll get it done by the end of January,’” Menino told the Herald. “They’re going to get it done.”

[Jim NE]

This may be the source for for another thread where a member said that AR's would be banned by 2/1.

For Biden to tell the mayor this, and then for that same mayor to broadcast it to the world exposes the arrogance, singlemindedness and undemocratic nature of some of our leaders.

Last time I checked, I believe the American people and their representatives have a say in this.

Last time I checked. Things might've changed since then, I guess.

[2ifbyC]

Biden's guarantee and $1 will get you a senior coffee at McDonald's (prices may vary).

This "news flash" is nothing more than a ploy to get additional media coverage to stoke their fantasied outcome.

[Skribs]

Jim NE, I hope you're right, and this doesn't become an executive order.

I hope we're right in assuming that our reps will actually support our rights. I know one of my senators won't. I'm waiting a bit and I'm going to send out another string of emails, hopefully I'll be able to reach the new folks as well as the old.

What's the term for my approach to this situation? Where I hope it doesn't happen, I do what I can to make it not happen, but I make plans for if it does happen. Or is there a term for this approach? "Prepare" doesn't seem to feet because that sounds like I've made the assumption it will, and I've made no assumptions at this point. I hope and work for one goal, but I'm planning in case of the other as well.

[TarDevil]

Menino added that it’s time for Obama to go after gun legislation since he doesn’t need to pander to pro-gun voters since he’s in his last term.

Makes no sense. Throw the whole Democratic party under the bus just 'cause one person isn't coming back?

Keep up the pressure. Those people don't want to loose any ground with or without Obama.

[Deanimator]

I wonder if Menino believes everything somebody with Alzheimer's tells him...

[Deanimator]

I've got two words in response:

"recovery summer"

[5711-Marine]

Why would a politician want criminals to have the upper hand on the voters?

Pandering to their base...


Of every one hundred men in battle, ten should not even be there. Eighty, are nothing but targets. Nine are the real fighters, we are lucky to have them since they make the battle. Ah, but the one

[Loc n Load]

There are hundreds of gun laws in effect in this country, both state and federal. Some of these carry mandatory sentences upon conviction. The operative term is:CONVICTION. The gun charges will be the FIRST charge that will be plea bargained away, because the thug knows if he/she is convicted - goodbye.
LEO's can charge the offender with what they see as violations, but it is the prosecutor, defense and legal system that "strips" away these mandatory sentences before they go to trial.... real frustrating.

[Zeke/PA]

Joe Biden was chosen to be the spokesperson for the nonsense that's coming simply because he is washed up politically and the voting booth is no longer a concern of his.

[Bob2222]

Do we believe everything that Boston mayors tell us?

[Sgt.Murtaugh]

thank god we only have to be afraid of mass murder for only 3.5 more weeks!

I think I can just hide in my storm shelter until 2/1 and all will be ok!

[ZeSpectre]

5711-Marine
Originally Posted by guzzi View Post
Why would a politician want criminals to have the upper hand on the voters?
Pandering to their base...

Laughed so hard I now have a headache and my throat is sore.

[Kino74]

That gives 9 days to get a gun control bill through the House and Senate for Joe Biden's guarantee to be true. Now I know that Biden is about as sharp as round post; but he has been in the Senate forever. Even he has to realize that what he "guaranteed" would be extremely difficult even with a relatively uncontroversial bill. With gun control, such a thing has literally never happened.

Part of it makes me wonder if they are deliberately trying to use a panic to create scarcity since they know they are unlikely to achieve one through legislation?


Lets make no mistake if they can pass it they will; however, they are politically astute and will no doubt complain of "republican obstructionism" as the reason for any failure. I see these efforts as testing the waters and I would expect to see some executive orders passed against imported magazines and weapons. Now if the republicans cave......

[d2wing]

Why would a politician want criminals to have the upper hand on the voters?
When they are one on he same.

[fxstchewy]

thank god we only have to be afraid of mass murder for only 3.5 more weeks!

That is funny......:) there may or may not bee a ban coming but one thing you can take to the bank is joe biden will never miss a chance to run his mouth, he may be the VP in title but not in character.

[legaleagle_45]

Joe Biden told Thomas Menino (one of the mayors in Bloomberg's anti-gun group) that they would pass legislation by the end of January "guaranteed."

Bart, as a lawyer you should quickly discern that Biden did not guarantee passage of gun control legislation by the end of January 2013.

[Bartholomew Roberts]

An excellent point legal...see what too much dealing with good, normal people will do to your legal skills ;). I hope to make that promise unfufilled in any January though.

[Zundfolge]

Frankly I feel better now. Joe Biden's "promises" are worth jack squat :p

[gc70]

Look at the actual quote from the original article (http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion/local_coverage/2013/01/menino_veep_promised_him_fast_action_gun_control):

“He said, ‘Tommy, I guarantee you, we’ll get it done by the end of January,’” Menino said at City Hall today.

Even though the journalist interpreted the quote as being about "passing" reforms, it is not apparent that was what Biden meant. However, I would guarantee that Biden and his chorus of gun control advocates will complete their wish list by the end of January, as instructed by Obama.

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Here is an article from Talking Points Memo indicating that the White House hopes to get gun control through by pushing it fast before pro-RKBA groups can respond: http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2013/01/white-house-nra-gun-victory.php

Have you contacted your Congressmen yet?

[OldMac]

If joe was refering to executive orders, they dont need the congress and can get it done by february. How do we combat that? Several broadcast news readers have been parroting the eo option so we are certainly being prepared so there shouldnt be a shock later.

[glennv]

What are the limits of an executive order and can they be undone?

[Sam1911]

What are the limits of an executive order and can they be undone?We've had quite a few threads which explored that question lately, but the answer is that an executive order is a directive from the President to the law enforcement folks under his command as leader of the executive branch of government. In it he tells them how he wants them to enforce EXISTING laws. He cannot make new laws via E.O., just define how tightly, loosely, or in what specific way he wants his federal LEO agencies to apply the text Congress wrote in a given law.

He also can make treaties with other countries that may restrict or set parameters for various foreign trade issues. (Hence why we get no military type firearms from China these days.)

[TrickyDick]

despite whatever may happen, how many people here are willing to register or give up their arms willfully?

[Sam1911]

how many people here are willing to register or give up their arms willfully?You expect factual answers to that? :scrutiny:

"Willing?" None.

But will do so if the law is passed? ... a whole lot more.

Number who will refuse and make a stand? A few. Probably a very few.

Number who will try to hide their guns or just ignore the law hoping they won't get caught? Probably many.

[R.W.Dale]

despite whatever may happen, how many people here are willing to register or give up their arms willfully?

Look at your young children and picture them living in govt housing and growing up in that enviroment entails while you sit in prision because you wanted to play the patriot bit.

Somethings are more important than a 30rd mag or a 10/22 you pick your battles and raise another generation to cherish what you believe in that will delay the inevitable.

Playing like Richmond in 1862 will just hasten things and make the inevitable ending that much more unpleasant for all.




posted via that mobile app with the sig lines everyone complains about

[PowderMonkey]

Look at your young children and picture them living in govt housing and growing up in that enviroment entails while you sit in prision because you wanted to play the patriot bit.

Somethings are more important than a 30rd mag or a 10/22 you pick your battles and raise another generation to cherish what you believe in that will delay the inevitable.

You alredy believe that a gun ban is inevitable, but see value in dragging out the misery another generation instead of fighting for your rights.

This I believe is the single worst post I've ever seen on THR.

[rswartsell]

double post

[rswartsell]

You are entitled to your opinion.

In my opinion the worst posts are the hysterical "call to arms, cold dead hands" type. It has never been more importand than now for the gun community to present a calm, rational and well reasoned face to the undecideds.

I have seen posts recently advocating all kinds of extremism incluiding armed insurrection. In my mind nothing hurts the RKBA cause more than giving the committed antis a hyper excitable, violent, intolerant image of the gun community to present to undecided populus to help stoke fear.

Fear mongering is the game of the antis, and the more you howl about blood in the streets before any specific legislation is even presented, the more rational uncommitted voters not intimately familiar with the "gun culture" will see their point.

Please try to remain calm and reasonable when you deign to represent the cause.;)

[Tommygunn]

...In my opinion the worst posts are the hysterical "call to arms, cold dead hands" type. It has never been more importand than now for the gun community to present a calm, rational and well reasoned face to the undecideds.

I have seen posts recently advocating all kinds of extremism incluiding armed insurrection. In my mind nothing hurts the RKBA cause more than giving the committed antis a hyper excitable, violent, intolerant image of the gun community to present to undecided populus to help stoke fear.


Just to play the "Devil's Advocate;"
Is there necessarily anything really wrong in pointing out to those who would take away our guns and our freedoms that we will not go quietly into that abyss? That there WILL be consequences? And they WON'T be fun?


I don't particularly enjoy reading those "call to arms" posts myself. However when I log onto the 'net I don't do so expecting to read faerie tales and other children's stories, either.

In fairness the antis put out a lot of stuff that makes them look a few fries short of a happy meal, too.

[R.W.Dale]

Go study the American civil war and its cost to this nation. This nation has risen and like EVERY OTHER NATION, STATE OR EMPIRE in human history there will come a day when it will fall.

Then come back here and say that setting a nation back a century through the spilt blood of hundreds of thousands of your fellow citizens all for the vindictive pursuit of a lost cause is something you're eager to engauge in?

I must also point out that what we have is referred to as SMALL ARMS! The military/police have rockets, tanks, helicopters. Lets dispense with the "cold dead hands" bull°=

[R.W.Dale]

You alredy believe that a gun ban is inevitable, but see value in dragging out the misery another generation instead of fighting for your rights.

This I believe is the single worst post I've ever seen on THR.

Sooner or later yes.

As part of a larger shift in values this nation well on its way either headed to becoming a facist police state or a European style socialist welfare state.

Neither of wich is especially in line with freedom and liberty.

I'm not saying I wont fight the upcoming legislation. But I'm not going to run around like chicken little when it happens either acting like the world is ending and do something STUPID




posted via that mobile app with the sig lines everyone complains about

[rswartsell]

Again,

Jumping the gun on pulling the gun is a powerful argument in the hands of the antis that you shouldn't be allowed to have them. Yes, there are wingnuts everywhere and on both sides. We are the ones that should demonstrate that the majority of the lawful gun owners under current law are not an imminent threat for wholesale violence.

I agree that being willing to stand for the priciples of freedom and democracy in extremis is a good thing, however seeing TEOTWAWKI behind every turn in current events simply makes you appear to be a dangerous paranoid rather than a committed patriot.

[Tcruse]

The way to stop more gun control is to win the minds of the middle. This is really only one of the issues that seriously divide out nation. We must not give the anti side any proof that we are "finge/radical" in our beliefs. So, every message that goes out should be phased in "adult" language and not overthe top threats.
My thoughts are that we need to win support from our friends and co-workers. Invite your coworkers to go to the range with you or to join your shooting league.
Talk about the useful information from your CCW class. Encourage first shooter programs by local groups and ranges. Support ranges that are family/new shooter friendly. One example close to me is shootsmarttx.com.

[22-rimfire]

They hope to accomplish controls through executive orders, ObamaCare, and the US EPA and avoid the legislative process. And this is what the American People re-affirmed and elected in November?

[Frank Ettin]

The way to stop more gun control is to win the minds of the middle...Good post and very true.

As I posted in another thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=693450):What we can all do all the time --

[1] Bring new people into guns, shooting and the shooting sports and help inculcate them in our culture of responsible gun ownership. (As a coach and instructor I have, without compensation, in the last ten years introduced hundreds of people to guns and shooting.)

[2] Be ourselves good ambassadors for shooting and gun ownership -- dispelling the negative stereotypes many members of the public have of gun owners.

It's fashionable to blame politicians for restrictive gun laws. But politicians are interested in getting elected and re-elected. So what it really comes down to is our neighbors, the people in our communities, the people in our towns, the people we work with, the people we see at the mall, etc. If enough of our neighbors, enough of the people in our communities, enough of the people in our towns, enough of the people we work with, enough of the people we see at the mall, etc., don't like guns, and don't trust the rest of us with them, politicians who take anti-gun stands can get elected and re-elected (and bureaucrats who take anti-gun stands can keep their jobs).

So we need to remember that part of the battle to keep our guns needs to start with our neighbors, the people in our communities, the people in our towns, the people we work with, the people we see at the mall, etc.

They hope to accomplish controls through executive orders,...Please stop spreading this sort of uninformed nonsense. As Sam1911 noted in post 39:We've had quite a few threads which explored that question lately, but the answer is that an executive order is a directive from the President to the law enforcement folks under his command as leader of the executive branch of government. In it he tells them how he wants them to enforce EXISTING laws. He cannot make new laws via E.O.,...

We've also discussed the limitations on Executive Orders here (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=690391) and here (http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=8579075&postcount=64).

[jon_in_wv]

Good to see he is taking his role of investigating what can be done about gun violence seriously when he already has a conclusion in mind before he even starts. Its yet another farce commission created by obama to push his own agenda.

[xfyrfiter]

The jails in this country are already full to overflow, and I for one do not think that the pols will make a whole class of people ie. gunowners, into criminals. The antis want to, but face it folks, the government is nearly broke and don't have the capital, either financially or politically to get a lot done. This my fervent hope anyway.

[doom]

We also need to contact stores like Wal-Mart and inform them we don't want them playing along with Obama and Co. on the gun-control issue