This might be the last decade for the 2nd Amendment


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sharpshooter74
January 5, 2013, 11:15 PM
I'm a racial minority in America, and I know that it's mostly conservative Whites, and maybe a few moderate to liberal Whites who vote for those who are willing to stand up for the 2nd Amendment.

As I see it now, most of these racial minorities will never vote for those whom will stand up for the 2nd Amendment. They are Liberal to the core. I have members in my family, and even neighbors who hate guns. They literally blame the guns for the violence in minority communities. They never blame the criminals. They've been so brainwashed by the Liberal media. With the changing demographics in America, I fear that this will be the last decade for the 2nd Amendment. It's obvious in the last election how the demographic shifts has altered the political landscape, with the re-election of Obama, and the Democrats gaining seats in the House and the Senate. I believe that within the 2 to 6 years, the Democrats will regain their Super Majority in both the House and the Senate. The Supreme Court will tilt to the left as one moderate and one conservative Justices retire.

The political landscape does not bode so well for the 2nd Amendment. It's obvious a full scale gun registration scheme will gain full fruition within this decade. Those in power will further limit access to new gun purchases, and ammo purchases. I believe the next AWB will really be a real ban on semiautomatic AR / AK style rifles, and similar. This time it won't just be a ban on features. Next with their super-majority, these semi-auto rifles, and high cap handguns probably won't be grandfathered in. It will be a full scale ban. Whatever that is left will all be required to register with NFA. Then maybe within the next 15 to 20 years, as the White conservative population decline, and racial minorities combined to make up 50% of the population in America, it will be the perfect time to gut the 2nd Amendment altogether with full scale confiscation.

I'm a realist. I'm willing to die for my 2nd Amendment rights. But the truth is that I believe most gun owners in America will willingly give up their guns without a fight. I don't expect most minorities or White Liberals to stand up for the 2nd Amendment.

In the future, States like Texas, Georgia, Florida, Virginia, North Carolina, Colorado, and etc.. will fall heavily into the anti-gun column as the White population in these States will no longer be more than 50% of the State. Minorities like Hispanics, Blacks, and Asians will make up the majority.

In the future the Democrats and Liberals will have their 2/3rd votes in the Congress and the States, to fully enact the doing away of the 2nd Amendment. I'm a realist. That's what I believe will happen.

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hso
January 5, 2013, 11:22 PM
I'm a realist.

Then why are you stating what the future will bring as if it has already come to pass? A realist knows that the future can't be seen unless it is right upon us.

None of us have a crystal ball or a time machine so that we know what shall come to pass. We can see the storm, but we only know how bad it might be and not whether we'll be washed away in a flood.

Don't give up and don't abandon the struggle because you don't know how to win. If you can't think of how to lead the fight, follow those that still have the will to strive.

1911 guy
January 5, 2013, 11:32 PM
Fighting now, in the ballot box and on the soap box, are far preferable to going to the cartridge box.

Don't give up the ship yet. Your best tool might be educating your family, friends and neighbors about the racist origins of gun control. JPFO has a lot of material on the subject.

I'm a realist, too. That's why I see civil unrest as a very bad thing. The American revolution was an anomoly, the only time in human history civil war has brought about a stable government. Let's win this now, before we lose the chance to win it for the long term.

KTXdm9
January 5, 2013, 11:36 PM
This type of hand wringing and sweeping generalizations do nothing to support our cause. What have you done to try to bring some of these folks into our ranks?

Contrary to what the media tries to spoon feed you, minorities do not vote as some monolithic block. Texas just elected Ted Cruz to the Senate. Marco Rubio of Florida has a strong following. There are probably countless others in the wings waiting for the opportunity. Maybe our side of the fence needs to do a better job of promoting exciting candidates pro-2a, regardless of color?

SharpsDressedMan
January 5, 2013, 11:49 PM
A Japanese admiral philosophized thsat they might be waking a sleeping giant when they bombed Pearl Harbor. I think the anti-gun people might be doing the same when they anger the largest armed populace in the history of the world.

Ms_Dragon
January 5, 2013, 11:56 PM
@Sharpdressedman:

Misattributed

"I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant and fill him with a terrible resolve."
Statement made after the attack on Pearl Harbor by Yamamoto as portrayed in the film Tora! Tora! Tora!, this is one of the most quoted remarks attributed to him. Though it is thought that it summarizes his sentiments well, a definite source for this quote has never been provided. William Safire wrote that there is no printed evidence to support this quote. Safire's Political Dictionary, page 666. For more information see the Wikipedia article "Isoroku Yamamoto's sleeping giant quote".

Alaska444
January 6, 2013, 12:08 AM
A Japanese admiral philosophized thsat they might be waking a sleeping giant when they bombed Pearl Harbor. I think the anti-gun people might be doing the same when they anger the largest armed populace in the history of the world.
Sadly, we are likely the last generation with the 2A, not sure if it will be the last decade, but certainly, they have dumbed down American kids to the point that they have any clue to what it means to keep and protect our freedoms. After all, I am probably one of the last few folks that learned about our American values in my public school since I am in my mid 50's.

School curriculums no longer teach Americans our true history. Kids come out of school today with a lottery mentality along with a welfare work ethic. In other words, they are already accepting of the European style of government that they are throwing at us. They are easily swayed and do not have the same principles that we support and understand. No, the next generation coming behind us rejects these old fashioned principles. We are in a death spiral when you consider who is coming up behind us.

Sorry to be so pessimistic, but I just don't see folks with a desire to work hard, a desire to support the ideals of liberty and freedom. Many support the idea of getting rid of the constitution. We are in definite trouble but I do not have any crystal ball on how long obviously, no one does, but it doesn't look good from my perspective.

Archangel14
January 6, 2013, 12:10 AM
Sharpshooter: Thanks for you thoughtful comments. I think, thankfully, that you are incorrect. When I see guys like Ice T on TV saying he'll never give up his guns, I have hope. When I hear a good friend of mine, who is a very liberal Hispanic, state that he'll never give up his guns, I have hope. When I see all those hard working, religious, socially conservative Hispanics going to church on Sunday, I have hope (I live in SoCal).

I agree that we are up against a monster that has been slowly growing for 60 years. The far left knew they couldn't talk their talk and win at the ballot box, so they talked moderate and gained power. They smartly went after the thing that matters: our culture. They own the schools, the media, and entertainment. And that's why a train wreck like Obama was able to get second term.

But when they strike at the heart of what people want and believe in, then they'll over play their hand. Let them attack our faith and our churches, it will cost them millions of votes. Let them come for our guns....it will ruin them. This really isn't about race at all. This is about people who "cling to their bibles and guns". There's a reason Obama pretends to be a Christian. The time will never come when a man for president can say, "I'm a proud atheist!". Nor will any president or congress fully embrace what is being tossed around now as a gun ban. It will ruin them....and they know it.

powderx
January 6, 2013, 12:14 AM
Keep in mind that what you see in your immediate vicinity is not indicative of the whole. Technology and faster news cycles make cities, states and continents seem much smaller and cohesive than they really are.

Keep your wits. Don't waffle.

OilyPablo
January 6, 2013, 12:15 AM
Not all Hispanics/African-Americans/Asians are leftists. It's just not so.

The worst problems for the right currently are: The lack of a articulate coherent leader with a real backbone and the communist sycophant Obama crazed media.

I have some hope the leftists will overstep their bounds and the hardworking folks in the above old fashioned groups will rapidly realize a freeloading nation is not something to aspire to.

sharpshooter74
January 6, 2013, 12:17 AM
I've done all I can by joining the NRA. The more I try to educate other minorities about the 2nd Amendment, the more I am hit with a wall of ignorance. They just don't want to listen.

Contrary to what the media tries to spoon feed you, minorities do not vote as some monolithic block. Texas just elected Ted Cruz to the Senate. Marco Rubio of Florida has a strong following. There are probably countless others in the wings waiting for the opportunity. Maybe our side of the fence needs to do a better job of promoting exciting candidates pro-2a, regardless of color?

Are you kidding me? So when 95% + of Blacks vote for Obama, you don't think that's monolithic? So when minority areas like Philly, LA, and Detroit vote almost 90%+ for Obama, and the Democrats, you don't think that's monolithic? You might be colorblind when it comes to politics, but the Liberals and Dems use race baiting politics every chance they get. When you have Black, Hispanic, and Asian buying into the Liberal mantra, that guns are bad, and that the NRA, and the Tea Partiers are racists, it's just harder for our side to break through the wall of ignorance. I guarantee you that if the Hispanic voting population increases in Texas, a Republican like Ted Cruz won't have a chance in the world to win in TX again. The same will be for Rubio once the White population goes below 50% in Florida. These conservative and moderate States will go the way of California.

sharpshooter74
January 6, 2013, 12:27 AM
Alaska444 I totally agree. I have the same pessimism about America.

nathan
January 6, 2013, 12:33 AM
there s so much guns in America i dont think it will ever happen. With these recent rise in sales, that means more gun owners. We need to reach out to non gun owners to our side, and work on our political wing the NRA . Share knowledges and enthusiasm with non gunowners like inviting them for a range time. Explain in simple terms the benefits of gun ownership, etc.

2ifbyC
January 6, 2013, 01:24 AM
Two major reasons that Obama won the election were his pledge of redistribution of wealth to nurture the poor/middle class with continued federal assistance and the compassion/respect, perceived or real, for the minority races.

The poor state of the economy, which was overlooked by his campaign and the media, helped his cause. Rather than creating a job market that was robust and allowed for self-sufficiency, he extended the safety net to make people more dependent on government. When you have a family to feed, what is more important to you, your 2A rights or your food stamps? Overthrow by a tyrannical government is one of the least concerns in your mind.

We need to create an environment that fosters self-sufficiency, pride of accomplishment, and job opportunities for all. The safety net should be available to only those that are truly in need.

It will take god leadership for the tide to be reversed. I believe we have a good base of candidates that can revive that natural work instinct in all races in America.

buckeye8
January 6, 2013, 01:44 AM
I teach Government in an "inner city" high school, and while you are right about the mentality that has taken hold in minority communities in America, I can assure you that when properly taught the history and meaning of the Constitution of the United States, including the 2nd Amendment, those minority students "get it" just as well as anyone else. The message of liberty resonates across languages and cultures, but can only do so if it is spoken. I can promise you that no student of mine, no matter how poor or what color, has ever left my classroom confused about the meaning of the 2nd Amendment.

Don't complain about others' ignorance. Teach them. The truth is on your side.

Quick Shot xMLx
January 6, 2013, 01:46 AM
As a Hispanic I fear you are right. I'm an avid gun owner and I didn't vote for Pres Zero or any CommieCrats. I'm afraid to inform you that I'm a minority within a minority. Most young people in general just don't care about guns. They've let the media and the schools indoctrinate them. On top of that most are still hypnotized by the Hopey Changey crap.

The 2A culture is spreading but I don't think it'll be enough. The urban black/hispanic communities continue to blame guns for the violence, not realizing half the places they live in have incredibly strict gun laws which prevent the lawful people from protecting themselves and also not realizing its their own corrupt culture that creates the violence. The liberal emasculation and victim mentality has also spread among the white youth. "Why own a gun when I can call 911"...and get raped/robbed/killed meanwhile. They also don't understand the historical significance of the 2A.

At this point the only way is secession.

hso
January 6, 2013, 01:47 AM
they have dumbed down American kids to the point that they have any clue to what it means to keep and protect our freedoms. After all, I am probably one of the last few folks that learned about our American values in my public school since I am in my mid 50's.

I keep hearing this negativism but my 14 year old daughter and her friends have been taught about this since they were in 5th grade in the public schools here. I don't know what sort of places your kids are going to, but we've not seen evidence of these claims here.

kwguy
January 6, 2013, 01:47 AM
Sharpshooter, I see your point, but like those have mentioned, you have to keep in it and not give up. I only just joined this forum last month, but have been an NRA member for quite some time. I've burned up my keyboard with email's to my reps, and donated what I could.

Here is a very good link that I'm sure surprised some people, and angered others for not adhering to that "monolithic block" way of thinking. And this is out of california, which makes it even sweeter:

http://www.urbancure.org/mbarticle.asp?id=267&t=Blacks-should-embrace-NRA-gun-proposal

Archangel14
January 6, 2013, 01:51 AM
Are you kidding me? So when 95% + of Blacks vote for Obama, you don't think that's monolithic?

That figure means nothing. Blacks vote democrat by HUGE numbers all the time. Didn't Kerry get something like 87% of the Black vote in 2004? Anyway, Obama is black and that means something special to good black folk. Man, this country has been very hard on the black man, and while we have come a very, very long way, it's still relatively recent history.

The point is that when it comes to guns it's really a cultural thing. Andrew Breitbart was so right when he said that the fight should be for the culture. Guns are cultural. You can be a left wing guy who just loves guns (I know some). I have three close friends who voted for Obama who are scrambling to buy guns. They do not have this in the bag!

Mauserguy
January 6, 2013, 02:00 AM
Wow, I totally dissagree with your implication that minorities are liberal and anti-gun. Having grown up and gone to college in California I've known lots of minorities, some very closely. That they are all liberal is dead wrong. Frankly, some of the minorities I know are far more conservative, and gun loving, than many of the wishy-washy whites in my circle.

I do agree that the socialist cycle of dependancy that has taken hold in our country is a cancer and does not bode well for liberty, whether guns or free speech, but that is not at all racial.

All I can say is vote the right way, and be an example of good behavior in your community.
Mauserguy

Alaska444
January 6, 2013, 02:00 AM
I teach Government in an "inner city" high school, and while you are right about the mentality that has taken hold in minority communities in America, I can assure you that when properly taught the history and meaning of the Constitution of the United States, including the 2nd Amendment, those minority students "get it" just as well as anyone else. The message of liberty resonates across languages and cultures, but can only do so if it is spoken. I can promise you that no student of mine, no matter how poor or what color, has ever left my classroom confused about the meaning of the 2nd Amendment.

Don't complain about others' ignorance. Teach them. The truth is on your side.
Thank you for your service to our youth. We need more of you.

God bless

Quick Shot xMLx
January 6, 2013, 02:03 AM
You can be a left wing guy who just loves guns (I know some). I have three close friends who voted for Obama who are scrambling to buy guns.
I know people like that and what does it matter? Liberals who are pro-gun are useless when they continue to vote for people who advocate more gun control.

OilyPablo
January 6, 2013, 09:14 AM
The vast majority are. Do some research. Check the stats. Regardless what commie they vote for, they traditionally vote for a leftie.

Read what I wrote again.

Not all Hispanics/African-Americans/Asians are leftists

Asians voted a majority for Bush, Asians until Oblama came along tended centrist conservative. Half my family by marriage is of Asian descent. I know how they voted. So there is hope there if we stick with the core message of hard work, independence, not relying on .gov.

Hispanics can be and are family centric. Texas Hispanics vote conservative, but I tell you the ignorant Republicans need to get it together and reach out, talk the right message AND show up.

Black people have some great conservative spokespeople. Some people get it. They just need to be made aware that not every black politician is a guy a that gives you something and the whole "giving you a free phone" is a silly gag that doesn't work. Almost hopeless, but there is a chance.

scaatylobo
January 6, 2013, 11:10 AM
I am a Jew,and SADLY too few own a gun = as UNBELIEVABLE as that is considering the WW II slaughter of millions of Jew's.

I see any that want to take my gun RIGHTS as one that wish to control me and the rest of the unarmed populace.

they will not be giving up their guns [ Bloomberg and Obama et al will be surrounded by HEAVILY ARMED men for the rest of their lives ].

I see that the first 'gun control' was aimed at all 'minoritys' and that is not what I see American being about.

I will not start yelling that the sky if falling ,till I hear the fat lady sing.

glennv
January 6, 2013, 11:27 AM
I'm leaning towards the positive here. Back in the early 90's I thought shooting and the general interest in firearms was dying, but i think the Internet played a huge role in the boom that started in the late 90's. It's still raging now. There are far more gun owners in areas were guns were never a part of the culture. This gives us far more leverage than we had back when the 94 ban hit. I'm not taking this lightly but if we work hard enough we can win this one.

And for your comment about the Dems gaining seats in the Senate, it's not in the cards. Statistically the chances the Dems hold onto the senate is slim to none. A third of the seats are up and two thirds of that third is made up of Dems....very vulnerable Dems. Contrary to what the media has to say about the issue, gun control will be devastating to the Democrats.

xfyrfiter
January 6, 2013, 11:30 AM
Sadly, most of the minority voters who voted for Obama and his ilk, did not vote so much for him as they voted for the free phone, fifth generation welfare, unemployment etc. We as 2nd amendment supporters could not supply all the giveaway programs that our tax dollars are stolen for.

bikerdoc
January 6, 2013, 11:34 AM
Third generation ethnic minority here.
Family full of anti's and neutrals who rightly believe that hard work will improve their life. Conversely they wrongly believe .gov with protect them. Yet all three generation have fought this countries wars in WW1, WW2, Korea, Viet Nam Desert Storm, and OIF.
Hard to understand that mindset, let alone argue with them.
But I keep trying. Finally got my 60 yr old younger brother to buy his first gun since leaving the Army in 72

Archangel14
January 6, 2013, 11:43 AM
Sorry, you're wrong too. You need to check national statistics. Not all minorities are enemies of guns, but the vast majority repeatedly vote for gun grabbers. And, just because you lived in california doesn't mean you've interacted with all members of minorities. You interacted with some, but can't make a blanket observation. You need to look at national stats re these people.

Listen friend, google "Orange, NJ". That's where I grew up. It's something like 90% black. Then google "Indio, CA", because that's where I've lived the last 15 years. I believe it's 50% Hispanic....and recent Hispanic, I may add. I've interacted with more "members of minorities" by the time I was 5 than most have in their entire lives. If we stick to this "minorities will only vote for leftists" garbage, then we're doomed. Hispanics are the most conservative people I know. And they love their freakin' guns. If you were in my neighborhood this past New Years Eve you would have thought you were in Beirut! They have a tradition of going outside at the stroke of midnight and firing off there firearms. It was like the Battle of the Bulge!

Romney is a nice guy. But he got out flim-flammed. One thing I give Team Obama is that they know how to win. That's our problem. You may not like him, but he's a freakin' winner. This past election was razor thin (when you figure in fraud that went the Dems way). Had a guy like Reagan been on the ticket, the Repubs would have the white house right now. But before I get too far of course, you need to re-think what I said: guns are cultural and it's very difficult to attack a cultural core without suffering hard. The dems know this!

22-rimfire
January 6, 2013, 11:47 AM
This may be a bit snarky, but the minority folks that I come in contact with and have a discussion about firearms and ownership... the 2A. For the most part they are totally un-informed as to the purpose of the 2A. A good percentage have not even finished high school. What do you expect?

Second, a common belief and statement is that they will get their guns anyway regardless of any law, hence they don't really care about new laws. A lot of these people live their whole lives doing technically illegal things and that won't change with any big changes in gun control laws in the USA. The majority of these people seldom even watch the news and then only at a local level (because it affects "the folks"). They will not even be aware of any changes in the law until a policeman tells them or one of their friends provides them with mostly incorrect information. Sorry if my generalizations hurt any feelings or stepped on any toes.

That is precisely what happens in Chicago and violence within the minority community. The laws make no difference. Do you actually think many of these people would participate in a national registry? Hence, gun control laws are simply about controlling "honest folks" who try to abide by the letter of the law as best they can. The only way to get the guns is house to house searches and that won't work either. They will claim racial discrimination and probably will be right.

Sacajawea
January 6, 2013, 11:49 AM
And the current estimate of women shooters went up in the last year... from (not 100% sure of exact numbers) 3.x million to around 5 million.

I'm also new here and I'd guess being female still makes me a "minority" in the political sense, at least. It has occurred to me, that instead of keeping Congress focused on gun laws... we should be changing the subject and demanding a budget (4 years w/o one isn't healthy for any country)... improvements to our roads & bridges... better schools... government bureaucracy streamlining & reform... fiscal responsibility...

I'm tired of letting the .gov control the conversation and deflect people's attention away from how irresponsible those governing, really are. I'm tired of playing their game - letting "outrage" and "disbelief" - position me squarely in their trap... making me a perfect target & example for even more propaganda. We the people, need to demand answers and accountability... not play victim over our 2nd Amendment rights and assume it's all over except for the signing of the bill.

They CAN'T do this... unless we permit it.

Archangel14
January 6, 2013, 11:50 AM
I'm leaning towards the positive here

Agreed! Our Second Amendment rights have never been stronger! We just had a series of favorable Supreme Court decisions that we would have never been able to nail down in the conservative 80's! How many households owned an AR in '85? In '95? There are more proud owners of firearms now than ever. If we get some ban, it will be a watered down version of the '94 ban, enacted with the help of a few Repubs just to fool the public that the vast grouping of self-concerns idiots in Washington are actually doing something. No one is taking away our guns, as long as we stay vigilant!

autospike
January 6, 2013, 12:24 PM
The political landscape does not bode so well for the 2nd Amendment.


Unfortunately, the only thing I think you're wrong about in your entire post is the timing. I'm afraid this will happen much sooner than any of us can imagine. They're relying on that speed to get this done.

OilyPablo
January 6, 2013, 12:34 PM
This is why we need to keep it up and keep talking and working. Pronto.

BearGriz
January 6, 2013, 12:59 PM
I've done all I can by joining the NRA.

That is awesome! But, as I found out the other day, joining the NRA doesn't provide lobbying funds:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=692411

So if you are interested in supporting the efforts to actually block bad legislation, then you might want to put some money toward the NRA-ILA.

Water-Man
January 6, 2013, 01:03 PM
Read my signature line.

beatledog7
January 6, 2013, 01:12 PM
If we all believe our efforts to save RKBA will fail, then they will fail. The surest path to failure has always been resignation.

Believing we can win doesn't guarantee that we can, but believing we can't guarantees we can't.

poboy6
January 6, 2013, 01:13 PM
A moderate-leftist buddy just bought his first pistol (thank you Dems. for demonizing guns and thus helping us increase our ranks). So we went out to the range together and had a nice discussion. His wife is excited and now wants one of her own.

This is what we all should to trying to accomplish. Bringing others into the gun culture, regardless of skin color or political leanings. These people will connect the dots eventually.

I understand the premise of the original post and it very well may be true, but just keep in mind that minorities from Texas are a hell of a lot more conservative than minorities from New York. What many seem to be forgetting is that a huge number of registered Democrats own firearms. People typically vote Democrat because they believe (thanks to the media) that Dems. are for "the little guy". These people will vote Democrat but still go hunting or to the range. Again, I think eventually they will figure things out and also keep in mind there are some very nervous pro-gun Democrats right now in Washington. They know if they vote for more gun-control then they likely will not be reelected.

readyeddy
January 6, 2013, 01:15 PM
As fellow minority, I'm offended by the OP's post. Not a big deal, just don't think non-whites can reasonably be categorized as being mostly anti 2A. It's like saying most non-whites are idiots. Not cool.

22-rimfire
January 6, 2013, 01:16 PM
Regardless of what the President, VP, and supporters of strigent gun control laws, I doubt that much will happen for months (but it is possible that this could be wrong with proper pressure applied). I hope that Boehner refuses to even bring the bill up for House consideration. He needs to take a lesson from dirty Harry in the Senate.

feedthehogs
January 6, 2013, 01:29 PM
The future is never written until it becomes the present.

Do the rest of us a favor who feel no matter the odds against or difficult the battle we will never quit till the last man is standing, go away. You are dead weight on our backs.

Now you can take this two ways.

Whine and cry like much of the last few generations that your being picked on, or get up and remember the colonial troops in dead of winter with little clothing , shoes or food continued on against unsurmountable odds and wipped the British to give us the opportunity to enjoy our rights and freedoms and the warnings that went along with it to keep them.

The fight isn't over till the last Patriot is dead.

xXxplosive
January 6, 2013, 01:33 PM
Diane, Nancy, Barack, Harry, Joe, Hillery............"The Freak Show".......this is who's gonna tell us how we and our families are to live ?

RX-178
January 6, 2013, 01:40 PM
I don't see how even bringing race into the question is productive for us. The categorization of voters and politics by race belongs, at best, exclusively on the leftist anti-gun side of the argument, since it benefits them.

It does not benefit us. I submit that it falls to us to treat people simply as individuals, since the other side refuses to do so.

KTXdm9
January 6, 2013, 02:00 PM
I did not say that and you need to learn to read more carefully. I contend the vast majority of minorities vote for communists.

A word of advice. You need to tone down your rhetoric, "I've known more minorities..." There are tens of millions of minorities in America. For you to suggest you've interacted with enough of these to formulate an opinion is silly.

Here's the first article that popped up when I googled, "minorities voted obama."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2229225/Presidential-election-2012-Record-number-Hispanic-voters-head-polls.html



I repeat, the vast majority of minorities vote for the commies.
Voted, as in past tense, in the most recent election. This isn't something set in stone for all of eternity.

Not all Hispanics think the same. Mexicans think differently than Puerto Ricans, who think differently than Cubans, etc. Rural blacks (and whites) have different perspectives than urban blacks and whites. If we all sit around and feel sorry for ourselves, then nothing will change. Dismissive attitudes such as "all blacks will do this or that" will do nothing to support our cause and protect our rights.

IBEWBULL
January 6, 2013, 02:00 PM
I an a mutt, many of us are. Canadian Indian , French, Irish, Polish, Italian, German and who knows.
My Sicilician Grandfather would not teach the kids Italian. You are American speak English.
We are all in this mess together.
The elite believe removing the gubns from the "masses aka peasants" will make them more controlable.
Actually they are not anti gun. They just think the chosen few should heve them.
Rosie Odonald has her body guards armed. Feinstein has referenced her gun in the long ago past. SSSSSHHHH we are supposed to froget this.
We all know that safety is a buzz word as well as the mis used term assault weapon. which is a selective fire intermediate military arm. Not a look alike as we once called it.
We need to begin using the proper terms also or we are also a part of the problen of mis information.

http://www.waragainsttheweak.com/

We are not saints in history. Check the above site.

Our fore fathers were no slackers. They knew the evil and power hungry would attempt th subvert the Constitution. This is why we have the Second Amendment to ba a check and balance.


http://constitutionus.com/

PS
Unfortunately the right wing ultras alienated much of the labor market by deamonizing the unions. There are millions of union members who voted their pockets in fear of loosing workers rights. This was a deversion which was not needed at all. It seems both parties have their buzz words and own agenda.
The guy in the middle has to agonize on the issues since we have no longer a middle of the road.
I walk the line right down the center and hope someday a third party will arise with some clout.
The confusion of the end times is in Revelations and sure is here.

autospike
January 6, 2013, 03:38 PM
Voted, as in past tense, in the most recent election. This isn't something set in stone for all of eternity.

Not all Hispanics think the same. Mexicans think differently than Puerto Ricans, who think differently than Cubans, etc. Rural blacks (and whites) have different perspectives than urban blacks and whites. If we all sit around and feel sorry for ourselves, then nothing will change. Dismissive attitudes such as "all blacks will do this or that" will do nothing to support our cause and protect our rights.
It's not just the last election. It's odd to me that everyone's favorite punching bag (Bush 43) did better with the Hispanic vote than anyone else.

http://www.pewhispanic.org/files/2012/11/hispanic-2012-11-07-latino-vote-00-01.png

SharpsDressedMan
January 6, 2013, 03:50 PM
I have often advocated that the NRA make a public announcement during previous attacks on the 2nd amendment that they are conceding, and will support a gun ban only if is a COMPLETE gun ban. All guns: including shotguns, single shots, air guns, blank guns, toy guns, blackpowder, etc. Maybe even throw in a clause that the police keep their guns locked at the police department (like England used to do, when the Bobbies went unarmed). This will, at last, and unilaterally, tick off EVERY gun owner, and finally drive them to support each other. Maybe even the cops would get on board, although the police have come to believe that they are a different class of citizen (thanks much to Congress putting them above the citizen with regards to being armed, with "privileged" recognition for CCW, etc). It it must come, let's get everyone's head in the right place, right quick.

txgunsuscg
January 6, 2013, 04:01 PM
That figure means nothing. Blacks vote democrat by HUGE numbers all the time. Didn't Kerry get something like 87% of the Black vote in 2004? Anyway, Obama is black and that means something special to good black folk. Man, this country has been very hard on the black man, and while we have come a very, very long way, it's still relatively recent history.

The point is that when it comes to guns it's really a cultural thing. Andrew Breitbart was so right when he said that the fight should be for the culture. Guns are cultural. You can be a left wing guy who just loves guns (I know some). I have three close friends who voted for Obama who are scrambling to buy guns. They do not have this in the bag!
I have a black friend at work and my white brother-in-law, both borderline raging liberals, and both documented Obama voters. I don't agree with either of them on anything political other than guns. Both of them fully support the 2nd Amendment just as much as I do, so I disagree with totally lumping liberals, or minorities, into the anti-gun camp unless they have demonstrated such a tendency.

Sol
January 6, 2013, 04:32 PM
The OP is right for the wrong reason. It will be another 2 decades (max) of 2A. It's not the blacks, Hispanics, Asians or Arabs that will vote down the 2A it's our children that will. This countries core beliefs and freedoms will get killed by our future generations. Years of indoctrination school and television tend to wear on ones psyche. a
After all of our children are grown and have the power vote, they will vote for whatever law to create the "utopia" promised to them by their teachers, government, musicians, actors and peers.

SharpsDressedMan
January 6, 2013, 07:02 PM
^^^^Sad, but true. That is why things have to get drastic right now. Either we force the fight into a total one now, or get eaten away incrementally by what Sol has described above.

Alaska444
January 6, 2013, 07:03 PM
The OP is right for the wrong reason. It will be another 2 decades (max) of 2A. It's not the blacks, Hispanics, Asians or Arabs that will vote down the 2A it's our children that will. This countries core beliefs and freedoms will get killed by our future generations. Years of indoctrination school and television tend to wear on ones psyche. a
After all of our children are grown and have the power vote, they will vote for whatever law to create the "utopia" promised to them by their teachers, government, musicians, actors and peers.
+1, despite what we taught them as parents, these kids have been brain washed by the system. They DO NOT understand what true freedom really is. Yes, it will be our kids in the upcoming generation. They already helped elect Obama twice.

JohnBT
January 6, 2013, 07:11 PM
I could have beaten Romney. Anybody could have. Romney? C'mon. And they ran a bad campaign.

Meanwhile, the 2nd Amendment will survive...

...if people don't throw in the towel and quit.

It was like that leading up to the GCA of '68, and so on through every attack on the 2nd ever since.

I forget that everyone hasn't been through this multiple times.

John

Claymore1500
January 6, 2013, 08:26 PM
If we all believe our efforts to save RKBA will fail, then they will fail. The surest path to failure has always been resignation.

Believing we can win doesn't guarantee that we can, but believing we can't guarantees we can't.

Truer words have never been spoken, The quickest way to lose any fight is to give up and let the beating continue.

Those who fear registration, take a lesson from our northern neighbors. didn't they just defeat a reg. scheme by pretty much ignoring it?

Alaska444
January 6, 2013, 08:43 PM
Truer words have never been spoken, The quickest way to lose any fight is to give up and let the beating continue.

Those who fear registration, take a lesson from our northern neighbors. didn't they just defeat a reg. scheme by pretty much ignoring it?
Even though I am pessimistic about our long term gun rights, who said anything about giving up? The reality is that there is a huge generation gap becoming evident even though my generation did try to education our kids on the good old fashioned values. i taught them to shoot pellet guns then went to 20 ga shotguns. I taught them to drive in the deserts when they were only 12 or 13 just like my dad did for me.

Yet, they are different with much different values. No, they don't appreciate what freedom is nor what it costs and I doubt that they will be willing to pay that price as the generations before us have. Just my opinion, but if I had given up, I would not have got my own concealed carry a back in 2010. No fight on, but don't put blinders on either.

Alaska444
January 6, 2013, 08:48 PM
Duplicate

joeschmoe
January 6, 2013, 09:21 PM
This might be the last decade for the 2nd Amendment

No.

FrankieJames7
January 6, 2013, 10:16 PM
Sadly, we are likely the last generation with the 2A, not sure if it will be the last decade, but certainly, they have dumbed down American kids to the point that they have any clue to what it means to keep and protect our freedoms. After all, I am probably one of the last few folks that learned about our American values in my public school since I am in my mid 50's.

School curriculums no longer teach Americans our true history. Kids come out of school today with a lottery mentality along with a welfare work ethic. In other words, they are already accepting of the European style of government that they are throwing at us. They are easily swayed and do not have the same principles that we support and understand. No, the next generation coming behind us rejects these old fashioned principles. We are in a death spiral when you consider who is coming up behind us.

Sorry to be so pessimistic, but I just don't see folks with a desire to work hard, a desire to support the ideals of liberty and freedom. Many support the idea of getting rid of the constitution. We are in definite trouble but I do not have any crystal ball on how long obviously, no one does, but it doesn't look good from my perspective.


dude, it's time to forget other places, this country, europe, and almost everywhere else is screwed, worry about Alaska, after all, you are an Alaskan...right?

FrankieJames7
January 6, 2013, 10:18 PM
I keep hearing this negativism but my 14 year old daughter and her friends have been taught about this since they were in 5th grade in the public schools here. I don't know what sort of places your kids are going to, but we've not seen evidence of these claims here.


go anywhere, and i mean anywhere on the internet, im sure you will find something special somewhere :banghead:

Alaska444
January 6, 2013, 10:24 PM
dude, it's time to forget other places, this country, europe, and almost everywhere else is screwed, worry about Alaska, after all, you are an Alaskan...right?
Thank you, but I live in Northern Idaho now, but I grew up in Moose Pass, Rabbit Creek and Nome.

If we fall in the lower 48, Alaska will go with it as well. We are ALL in this mess together.

Alaska444
January 6, 2013, 10:28 PM
go anywhere, and i mean anywhere on the internet, im sure you will find something special somewhere :banghead:
Alaska isn't really subject to all of the liberal influences that the rest of us are. You are still the last frontier. Come down to the lower 48 and it is a different world unfortunately.

FrankieJames7
January 6, 2013, 10:34 PM
Alaska isn't really subject to all of the liberal influences that the rest of us are. You are still the last frontier. Come down to the lower 48 and it is a different world unfortunately.


I thought you were an Alaskan yourself??? oh well

Jim NE
January 6, 2013, 10:36 PM
scaatylobo said: "I am a Jew,and SADLY too few own a gun = as UNBELIEVABLE as that is considering the WW II slaughter of millions of Jew's.

I see any that want to take my gun RIGHTS as one that wish to control me and the rest of the unarmed populace."

I've never understood why Europe has been so pro government when they've suffered like no other continent at the hands of government - Mussolini, Franco, Robespierre, Napoleon, Hitler, half a century of Soviet rule under murderers like Stalin and Lenin, degenerate emperors like Nero and Caligula and an almost endless list of absolute monarchs (some worse than others, a few very good) and petty tyrants that goes back fifteen hundred years.

They put their trust in that which has, in it's worst incarnation, killed them by the tens of millions. We CAN'T have the spirit of self governance through individual liberty die in the US. We're the last hope.

kwguy
January 6, 2013, 10:56 PM
Europe has NEVER gotten it right. Throughout history, it's been monarchs and what-not, and look where they are now. We ARE the last, only hope. We in the U.S. were able to make that "clean break" and start fresh during our revolution. Europe never really was able to do that.

SigSour
January 6, 2013, 11:11 PM
Christ what am I reading? I really hope the discussion doesn't turn into some kind of "witchhunt" - "blacks voted for Obama! so they're not going to help us"

I actually thought we were starting to get ahead of this (for the record, I'm a "minority", born/raised in Harlem, NY moved out west three years ago)

Why are we discussing "95% of Blacks vote for Obama" angle. And? (I was actually pulling for Dr. Ron Paul and was very disappointed) Anyways, as for the politics of it all:

"So on the one hand, black voters say Obama's race makes no difference to them, and on the other hand, about 9 out of 10 blacks say they will vote for Obama. But the high percentage of the black vote going to Obama is not unusual. Gallup polling estimated that John Kerry received 93% of the black vote in 2004, and Al Gore received 95% in 2000. So it may be that black voters are making the (correct) self-observation that they would be voting for the Democratic candidate regardless of his or her race, meaning that Obama's particular race is not a deciding factor for them."

Source: http://www.gallup.com/poll/107770/most-say-race-will-factor-their-presidential-vote.aspx

Now, I myself really like Jindal and what he has to say and he said it best when he said: "If We Want People To Like Us, We Have To Like Them First" - done.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/11/18/jindal_if_we_want_people_to_like_us_we_have_to_like_them_first.html

It can be said that "minorities" vote for Liberal because to be honest, some republicans are pretty damn scary. Read news online, some of the tea party (yes I know they don't represent all Republicans but they are identified by many as "Republican") interviews are friggin nuts. Outright saying "I won't vote for Obama because I don't want a black man to be president" or "I hate Mexicans because they are dirty stinking animals" {I apologize to any Mexican for writing that, it's BS and I know it, I was just stating what was said} SOURCE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXaILy3GE7U) - that's hardcore and resonates with people no matter who the media outlet is that airs it. Very hard to attract minorities to a political party if they think THAT is what the party stands for. That make sense?

- why am I saying this? Because one can't (or shouldn't) go on the attack with the "blacks and minorities usually vote liberal" without first thinking "well, WHY do minorities usually vote liberal?" - goes back to, "If we want people to like us, we have to like them first"

I guess I said that to say, let's not submarine this 2A fight by pointing fingers and casting blame. We gotta get rid of that, in the end it will do none of us any good.

Watch that Jindal clip, very interesting.

Alaska444
January 6, 2013, 11:23 PM
I thought you were an Alaskan yourself??? oh well
Still in heart, but not in residence my friend. Northern Idaho is as far north as I can get my Pacific Island girl. Just the way it is. I grew up Alaskan and that is still what motivates me and that is why I chose my avatar. I have noted that on many other threads.

gunNoob
January 6, 2013, 11:40 PM
I'm not sure I would turn to violence to defend my gun rights but I definitely wouldn't turn over my guns for any reason.

bldsmith
January 7, 2013, 01:04 AM
I do not see the second amendment going away any time soon. To change add or repeal an amendment requires first a 2/3 majority in the house to propose the action. Then it requires a 2/3 majority vote in each state and 75% of the states must ratify it. Then it goes back to congress and senate for final ratification.

I do not see the %75 of the states carrying a 2/3rd majority. No way. Even during the toughest times. If they try to weaken it, then SCOTUS should get involved.

d2wing
January 7, 2013, 01:26 AM
Unfortunately several presidents and each branch of government has over time extended it's power and overstepped the constitution. Power begets power.
Homeland security laws overstep the constitution in ways not possible just a few years ago. Obamacare eliminates first amendment protect for all of us. Much of the constitutions powers have become blurred and compromised so much that they no longer govern our country. Once government gets away with a law being too expediate to strike down or an interpretation to beneficial or popular to do the same, the bricks in the wall fall away. If part of the law is safely ignored all of it is. I agree wit Sol, minorities play a roll but liberalism has taken over our schools and society as a whole. I doubt it will take 10 years.

anchorman
January 7, 2013, 02:18 AM
Not all Hispanics/African-Americans/Asians are leftists. It's just not so.



Not all "leftists" are anti gun. shocking as that may seem. try to imagine something beyond the box you put yourself into.

Appetite for gun bans amongst the american people is at an all time low. 74% of the population is AGAINST handgun bans. that's a good start. now we need to figure out how to convince people on the fence and otherwise that magazine capacity bans are ill-concieved. Please stop seeing this in the mindset of a right/left dichotomy, and start making friends and teaching friends how to shoot. talk in terms that won't alienate them, even if you think (or know) that you are correct. If a bunch of you guys didn't constantly disparage the "left" in public so much, actually took a moment to talk with people on "the left" you might see that they already are on your side on this issue, or easily swayed. All this talk of leftist idiots and welfare queen despots, does nothing to win people over to the cause of promoting the 2A.

jim243
January 7, 2013, 02:24 AM
Well the Jack A$$e$ have us fighting amoung ourselves. And I can smell the fear. And so can they.

Tell me how much of the Gross National Product is from firearms? How many jobs will be lost. How many more police officers will be needed if a ban goes into effect? How do they plan on stopping any blackmarket from taking hold of the gun industry just as it did to the booze industry? Where do they plan on getting the army's ammo from if the private market stops buying ammo and there is no war? (yes the troops will be coming home.)

If hunters no longer shoot deer, who is going to pay for the additional crop damage? Will the cities be safer, NO. Will crime go down, NO. Where will the volunteers for the army come from if firearms are banned. How will we defend our country if invaded with an army of less then 2,000,000 when China has 3.5 Billion available for their army. Will the drug lords in Mexico go away just because the residents of AZ, CO, TX and other border states no longer have guns?

Solve all these problems and I would gladly turn in my guns, otherwise they can just go and kiss my big fat butt.

Jim

David White
January 7, 2013, 02:39 AM
"Fear the Government that fears your guns"

It was true then and it is still true now.
WE the PEOPLE are that sleeping giant.
There are so many more of us than you might think. All coming to the same conclusion that this is going to be the last fight for our rights.
We have more allies in both the military and law enforcement than you think!
It will be the government that drops the hammer first. How we respond will be a testimony for all the world.
It seems to me that everyone is "wringing their hands" crying "what can I do against so powerful a foe?".
Our numbers are in the millions. It will come to pass that once this sleeping giant awakens that it will be a reckoning that will not be forgotten.
Continue to fight in the ballot boxes but know this, we will be called upon one day to fulfill our oaths to our children. To leave them a better world than was left us.
Be patient but be ready.

kwguy
January 7, 2013, 02:45 AM
Yeah, liberal vs. conservative politics have no place in this. The reality is, there is a group of politicians that want to usurp the Constitution and take away our 2nd amendment rights. If they get their way, there will be no "liberal vs. conservative" politics, only THEIR fascist existence.

michaelbsc
January 7, 2013, 03:55 AM
http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20130105/news/701059819/

And here is a perspective from Chicago, which should be close to the mindset of he White House.

The strategy to "get a national conversation" is delineated. Clearly this is a reporter's view, not a game plan from Washington. But it seems coherent enough.

OilyPablo
January 7, 2013, 07:52 AM
Not all "leftists" are anti gun. shocking as that may seem. try to imagine something beyond the box you put yourself into.

I never said they are. Thanks. The discussion was about voting blocks. My allegation as others have backed is that not all man made silly racial or whatever groups vote the same.

Ragnar Danneskjold
January 7, 2013, 08:03 AM
It's not just that antis that will contribute to the demise of the Second Amendment. Reading a lot of the posts and threads on THR has greatly discouraged me. The sheer number of gun owners who are willing to throw other gun owners under the bus is staggering. There is a HUGE attitude of "I don't care if you ban or take what others like, just let me keep what I like" among far too many gun owners, even some on THR. People who are more than willing to allow a ban of high capacity magazines, or even semi-autos in general as long as they can keep their wood stock shotguns and revolvers. We're one of our own worst enemies. It's sad and pathetic.

Carl N. Brown
January 7, 2013, 08:34 AM
"This might be the last decade for the 2nd Amendment"....
....or the last decade of the anti-gun crusade that started with the Sullivan Act.

If there truly is a national dialogue on guns, it would be a welcome change: I recall when I researched the issue in 1960s using the Readers Guide to Periodical Literature and the public library's archives of magazines going back to the 1920s, the anti-gun position dominated. I believe that generations have been brainwashed to believe guns=bad guncontrol=good no questioning or reasoning allowed. Honest dialog and debate could only help our side.

wow6599
January 7, 2013, 08:48 AM
Reading a lot of the posts and threads on THR has greatly discouraged me.

+1. Like the GOP who can't seem to agree on much either.......

hang fire
January 7, 2013, 10:10 AM
Being three score and 12, I have observed a few things in life.

And one of those things I have observed to always hold true, is that when it comes down to the bare bones wire of put up or shut up on critical issues with consequences. Those persons who openly bragged bravely as to what they were going to do, were the first ones to capitulate, then cut and run.

kwguy
January 7, 2013, 10:14 AM
Seeing THIS article brightened up the day a little. Even some Senate Democrats (well, at least one) aren't too happy about what is going on:

http://news.yahoo.com/sen-heidi-heitkamp-reported-obama-gun-proposals-way-155205126--abc-news-politics.html

skwab
January 7, 2013, 11:55 AM
I didn't read every response so forgive me if this is redundant, but I see where the OP is coming from and don't 100% disagree with him or Alaska. Since the AWB and the damage it did to the Dem majority, only the most fervent of antis in congress were willing to discuss the issue of gun control, and for 8 years we had a Republican in the WH and Obama's first term he avoided it like the plague because he knew he had one more campaign to run. Until now, new regulations involving guns were laughable.

Now, we have a second term Liberal Pres with nothing to lose, we have a fractured Republican Party who is trying to redefine itself and is not cohesive on much of anything right now. We do have a growing minority populace who traditionally leans left, and a media who is incessant with painting firearms in a negative light, unless it's in the realm of pumping up box office numbers - then it's okay - but yeah, it's a rough time for 2A rights.

Pessimism is not, IMO giving up, but I can see where the pessimism is derived from. As long as the masses have their iphones and unlimited data plans and their food stamp cards, they're not going to give a flip what happens to the 2A. Everyday more and more boomers are getting on to social security, medicare. More people than ever are relying on the government to have their daily needs met than at any other time in our history (this is an assumption so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) - but if forced to choose between 2A rights and a decrease in their medicare benefits, what do you think they're going to choose? Fiscal responsibility? Who cares as long as my SS check clears and doesn't shrink.

No it's a scary time for 2A rights and conservatism as a whole. But I still have hope that this is not the case, that we're entering a time where our rights are systematically eroded. We were at a rodeo this weekend, and here is a group of people who still have pride in our nation, pride in celebrating our flag, where "God" is not treated like a four letter word, where respect still means something, and freedom is pretty damn important. Seeing all the kids and families there - still gives me hope, and that's what I cling to.

asia331
January 7, 2013, 11:45 PM
I've tired of the pessimism. Pessimists stand aside. If they come for our rights why not let let the opposition fear our reaction instead? Civil rights is a 2-way street brothers and sisters! Civil disobedience has been a traditional and effective course of action. If that doesn't work, un-civil is always an alternative. Example? Try 1964 American history.

michaelbsc
January 8, 2013, 12:43 AM
I've tired of the pessimism. Pessimists stand aside. If they come for our rights why not let let the opposition fear our reaction instead? Civil rights is a 2-way street brothers and sisters! Civil disobedience has been a traditional and effective course of action. If that doesn't work, un-civil is always an alternative. Example? Try 1964 American history.

Because this is the kind of speech that will get you singled out and picked up as an isolated case.

In 1964 there were 1st Amendment rights, too. Those are slowly being eroded just as surly as 2nd Amendment rights. But that's not germane to this board.

justice06rr
January 8, 2013, 01:25 AM
The last decade for 2A? I think not.

I will make sure my future children will inherit my firearms and have the means to exercise that freedom to own them. Not all minority groups or people of color (yes, I'm non-White) vote Democrat. With Obama's last run, the next election will almost be guaranteed to be a Republican president again (same as after Clinton and his AWB).

My entire family did not vote for BO, so did the rest of my church congregation which are non-white.

Onward Allusion
January 8, 2013, 01:28 AM
sharpshooter74
This might be the last decade for the 2nd Amendment
I'm a racial minority in America, and I know that it's mostly conservative Whites, and maybe a few moderate to liberal Whites who vote for those who are willing to stand up for the 2nd Amendment.

I will have to disagree with you 110%. Do you really think that only conservative Whites and maybe a few moderate to liberal Whites....are willing to stand up for the 2nd Amendment??? Do you really think that black folks after being "oppressed by the man" for centuries want to give up their guns? Do you think Asians who immigrated from hellish countries don't know what the price of freedom is? Do you think our Israeli friends in this country don't know about history? I could go on for another couple of dozen examples with racial attributes.

You are coming across as a defeatist not a realist. Just remember the old adage, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Except in this case, it's us who need to be loud and clear. No freakin' compromise. No AWB. Believe it or not, we outnumber the anti's. They just have a louder voice and we have to shout 'em down through our reps, senators, media representatives...etc..etc.

Prophet
January 8, 2013, 02:03 AM
I teach Government in an "inner city" high school, and while you are right about the mentality that has taken hold in minority communities in America, I can assure you that when properly taught the history and meaning of the Constitution of the United States, including the 2nd Amendment, those minority students "get it" just as well as anyone else. The message of liberty resonates across languages and cultures, but can only do so if it is spoken. I can promise you that no student of mine, no matter how poor or what color, has ever left my classroom confused about the meaning of the 2nd Amendment.

Don't complain about others' ignorance. Teach them. The truth is on your side.

Thank you, your service is invaluable. I wish more of our teachers would follow your example. My public school district is in utter shambles because sensible people like yourself who try to make it in are demonized. Thank God we elect the school board.

1911 guy
January 8, 2013, 02:30 AM
Regarding this tangent of the discussion, I have to agree with Onward Allusion. To claim a racial motivation for pro or anti gun (or any other freedom) is a bit short-sighted. It's an education issue. When people are told what the stakes are, told they have a stake in the game and can be reasoned with well enough to convince them of it, they suddenly find a libertarian streak, regardless of race. Or political affiliation.

Given the proportion of people on this board who have identified themselves in various conversations as non-white, non-middle aged and non-male, it seems a little silly to say there is a monopoly for one view or the other in a certain group, based solely on ethnicity. As the demographic of the nation changes, so does the demographic of the average gun owner. I'm one one board, definately gun related, where just over half the membership is female.

I recently made a few posts in some threads regarding ethnicity. They were contrasting the "liberal" view of non-whites as supposed statistics and victims versus the "conservative" view of everyone standing on their own merits. Of course i got blasted by the left leaning for being racist. They missed the point. Educate people and they will respond, not as your statistics say they will, but as people who have gained a new knowlege and therefore a new power to exercise. Right alongside the people who are shocked to see them there because "statistically, they should be X"

Writing off a whole group(s) of people just because we see them as "not for us" is folly. Instead, reach out to them. Imagine that young scruffy looking kid from the "wrong side of the tracks" was your neighbors kid. What would you tell him if you thought he was being led astray? You'd try to tell him the truth. How many here have made the mistake of teaching their sons to shoot while their daughters are forced to sit at home and bake cookies with Grandma? If you do that job well enough and the lightbulb goes on inside another head, we've gained another ally. Far better that than another alienated bystander.

autospike
January 8, 2013, 12:41 PM
Not so fast.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/01/08/white-house-ramps-up-talks-on-gun-control-measures/

Ragnar Danneskjold
January 8, 2013, 07:01 PM
I'm not sure many people are saying anything about racial motivation.

Everyone just stop and think for a second about whether you firmly grasp the difference between "correlation" and "causation".

Got it? Ok. The OP is not saying that racial minorities are anti-gun because they're minorities. But the fact remains, most minorities vote Democrat. Most Democrat politicians are anti-gun. So using the old Transitive Property, most minorities do support anti-gun politicians. No, not all. But voting records are plain. Most do. Whatever their reasoning is is going to be different from person to person. Maybe one votes Democrat because they're in favor of amnesty. Maybe another votes Democrat because they want to see the welfare state increased. Maybe yet another votes Democrat just because their parents did, or because the first minority President is a Democrat. There's a thousand reason. But the reasons aren't really relevant. The fact is, they just do. Voting records are clear. Most racial minorities in the United States for for Democrat candidates. The party that has gun-control as a stated platform belief. Those are just facts. And with that being known, the OP does make a decent point.

The_Armed_Therapist
January 8, 2013, 07:51 PM
I don't think minorities are solidly "liberal to the core." A strong majority of voters simply vote for the one issue they perceive as important, without always knowing all of the consequences or understanding other important issues. My neck of the woods is predominantly black/African. Most vote for the one side because they perceive that the one side supports programs to help them. This, of course, is only partially true. Most don't know the consequences of this, nor do they realize there are more important things at play regarding their situations in which they feel they need help.

But it's not just minorities, of course... In my previous place of residence, it was predominantly white/European. There were JUST as many clueless voters there as there are here. They would vote for the one side because of some cock-eyed reason, such as that side's opposition to recognizing gay marriage. Again, they voted with partial information and gave it more value than more important issues at play.

The idea that someone votes for a candidate/party in full support of their platform is simply false. That's easily a minority of voters. I know hardcore pro-2A people who usually vote Democrat, and I know anti-2A people who vote Republican. I have yet to find a candidate/party with whom I agree on everything, and I know where to look. Most don't even know where to look.

I realize this thread is very long, and I'm not even sure if these things are relevant. Just thought I'd chime in. LOL

Alaska444
January 8, 2013, 08:00 PM
I don't think minorities are solidly "liberal to the core." A strong majority of voters simply vote for the one issue they perceive as important, without always knowing all of the consequences or understanding other important issues. My neck of the woods is predominantly black/African. Most vote for the one side because they perceive that the one side supports programs to help them. This, of course, is only partially true. Most don't know the consequences of this, nor do they realize there are more important things at play regarding their situations in which they feel they need help.

But it's not just minorities, of course... In my previous place of residence, it was predominantly white/European. There were JUST as many clueless voters there as there are here. They would vote for the one side because of some cock-eyed reason, such as that side's opposition to recognizing gay marriage. Again, they voted with partial information and gave it more value than more important issues at play.

The idea that someone votes for a candidate/party in full support of their platform is simply false. That's easily a minority of voters. I know hardcore pro-2A people who usually vote Democrat, and I know anti-2A people who vote Republican. I have yet to find a candidate/party with whom I agree on everything, and I know where to look. Most don't even know where to look.

I realize this thread is very long, and I'm not even sure if these things are relevant. Just thought I'd chime in. LOL
Demographics cannot predict individual choices, but they are instructive of where a certain group will likely vote. Advertisers understand this as well as politicians and pay a great deal of money for demographic research. Once again, that does not delineate how any individual will or won't vote on any given issue.

David White
January 9, 2013, 06:55 PM
Never mind..

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