How crazy was it?


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tarosean
January 7, 2013, 10:10 AM
FBI NICS stats are out...

By state. (PDF)

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/reports/20130102_1998_2012_state_monthly_totals.pdf

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kreidel
January 7, 2013, 10:24 AM
Well, any country (or government) wanting to invade ours better march quietly around Kentucky.

Bubbles
January 7, 2013, 10:30 AM
While interesting there are several facts that skew the numbers.

First, in states like TX purchasers with a concealed carry permit are not run through NICS.

Second, the number for KY is skewed because while concealed carry permit holders do not get run through NICS when they purchase a firearm, the state runs every permit holder through NICS automatically once a month to ensure that a permit holder did not become a prohibited person.

pendennis
January 7, 2013, 10:51 AM
At one time, Kentucky was known as the "Class III Capital of The U.S." After attending the shoot at Knob Creek for a number of years, I'm inclined to agree.

303tom
January 7, 2013, 11:07 AM
Our guns is actually why Japan never invaded the United States..........

raddiver
January 7, 2013, 11:14 AM
it's good to be home. :)

1911fan
January 7, 2013, 11:19 AM
Those numbers are skewed. In this economy, many weapons were pawned to provide the money to purchase Christmas presents, then redeemed (which requires a Brady check) with Christmas $$$ or maybe a Christmas bonus.

Point here being that ANY firearm redeemed from pawn requires a Brady. I have a couple of handguns that I keep JUST to pawn (I am a casualty of the economy and haven't officially worked since July '09 and am, therefore, ineligible for loans).

In any given year, I might have guns in and out of the pawnshop five or six times, each redemption requiring a Brady. Pulling up my name would acknowledge this. Do I get five or six new guns a year? Not freakin' likely-- I haven't bought a new gun in five years.

There is a built in facility for breaking out the new gun purchases from the pawn redemptions but nobody seems to use it.

Besides, in many states, having a CCW eliminates the need for any Brady check at all.

A statistic, true, but not one of much use.

ed

Buck Kramer
January 7, 2013, 11:19 AM
Nice work KY, IA could learn a thing or two from you.

berettaprofessor
January 7, 2013, 11:32 AM
Second, the number for KY is skewed because while concealed carry permit holders do not get run through NICS when they purchase a firearm, the state runs every permit holder through NICS automatically once a month to ensure that a permit holder did not become a prohibited person.


Never heard about that before. Actually, that makes some sense. Once a month seems a bit over-kill, but once a year or once every few months? I'll have to think it over but that may be one "sensible gun control" idea that I might be able to concede on if it hits Kansas.

3twelves
January 7, 2013, 12:08 PM
Wow KY keeping it real.

Jlr2267
January 7, 2013, 12:13 PM
haven't officially worked since July '09



What does that mean? Is there "unofficial" work?

Elkins45
January 7, 2013, 12:42 PM
Bud's is in KY. I wonder if they run a check on the buyer before they ship to the local FFL just to make sure they aren't wasting money on the shipping?

If you go back to 2005 you can see the numbers are similar to other states and begins to climb steadily if the following years. I suspect that's about when Bud really started moving big volumes of guns.

pendennis
January 7, 2013, 01:01 PM
CPL (Concealed Pistol License) holders in Michigan are not required to use the NICS background check, although some dealers do it anyway. So, Michigan's numbers may be skewed a bit as well.

MachIVshooter
January 7, 2013, 01:03 PM
While not an accurate representation of new firearms out into the world (used guns, pawn/consignment reclaims on one end, multiple purchases and CCW bypass on the other), it does certainly indicate an increase in buying over the last few years. Just glancing, the numer of checks is double what it was 6 years ago.

There is a table showing how many firearms were manufactured and imported for domestic sale year to year. That gives a better picture of how many new firearms are out there. No 2012 data yet, though.

25cschaefer
January 7, 2013, 01:04 PM
MT doesn't require checks for CWP either.

NavyLCDR
January 7, 2013, 01:10 PM
Never heard about that before. Actually, that makes some sense. Once a month seems a bit over-kill, but once a year or once every few months? I'll have to think it over but that may be one "sensible gun control" idea that I might be able to concede on if it hits Kansas.

Makes sense?!? Really? Let me ask you this... why limit the monthly or even yearly background check to Concealed Weapons Permit holders? So we are going to do the background checks on the same people who have taken so much time, effort and spent money to obtain a permit? The vast majority of people who own and possess guns have no permits at all. So, why not do a monthly background check on them as well? And, heck..... since we looking to investigate people who have not done anything ammounting to reasonable suspicion of committing a crime, why not just run the criminal background check on everyone once a month?

Does it still make sense to you?

Monthly or annual background checks on people who have went the extra mile to register themselves with government is a total waste of scarce resourses and money which could be used to conduct real investigations of real suspicious behavior.

wgaynor
January 7, 2013, 02:16 PM
Way to go Hillbilly State! We may not have teeth, we may not have shoes, but we definitely have some guns!

Bubbles
January 7, 2013, 04:52 PM
Bud's is in KY. I wonder if they run a check on the buyer before they ship to the local FFL just to make sure they aren't wasting money on the shipping?

If you go back to 2005 you can see the numbers are similar to other states and begins to climb steadily if the following years. I suspect that's about when Bud really started moving big volumes of guns.
1) What you suggested would be illegal, 2) Bud's doesn't have enough info on the buyer to run NICS, and 3) up until April of last year they were drop-shipping from Sports South so they wouldn't have the firearm info for the 4473 either.

K1500
January 7, 2013, 09:04 PM
Did anyone read the post that clearly states KY runs each permit holder once per month? This renders the KY numbers totally meaningless. As others have stated, many states don't run a check when a permit holder purchases, which skew their numbers the other way.

Warp
January 7, 2013, 09:14 PM
While interesting there are several facts that skew the numbers.

First, in states like TX purchasers with a concealed carry permit are not run through NICS.

Second, the number for KY is skewed because while concealed carry permit holders do not get run through NICS when they purchase a firearm, the state runs every permit holder through NICS automatically once a month to ensure that a permit holder did not become a prohibited person.

This person...they know what they are talking about.

Jeff H
January 7, 2013, 09:31 PM
While interesting there are several facts that skew the numbers.

There are no facts that skew the numbers. You are trying to get something out of the data that the data wasn't intended to represent. This is only a list of how many background checks were done per year by state. Nothing more. It isn't saying anything about how many guns were purchased each year.

On another note, way to go Calif. #3 this year despite all those draconian laws you have.

Trent
January 7, 2013, 09:40 PM
Holy crap, Illinois placed *4th*??????

We broke 1 million!

Hahaha!

Trent
January 7, 2013, 09:48 PM
Summary of new gun sales in Illinois:

1999: 484,848
2000: 449,771
2001: 462,702
2002: 446,138
2003: 515,917
2004: 590,417
2005: 527,134
2006: 527,698
2007: 536,975
2008: 615,941
2009: 752,071
2010: 695,300
2011: 828,962
2012: 1,036,061

(Multiple guns are possible PER background check, so these are MINIMUM numbers. Also, does NOT include face to face transactions, or guns sold / purchased out of state.)

Total over 14 years: 8,469,935.

That's a lot of guns sold.

Enough to arm 65% of the entire current population.

Elkins45
January 7, 2013, 09:56 PM
I did a little searching and it turns out that Bubbles is 100% correct. KY checks permit holders every month.

Care to guess when it started? If you said 2006 you would be right. Guess these numbers are just another example of Mark Twain's "lies, damn lies, and statistics."

I learned something new today.

HILLBILLY-06
January 7, 2013, 10:04 PM
Way to go Hillbilly State! We may not have teeth, we may not have shoes, but we definitely have some guns!
Sounds like some people I know... LOL

jdex
January 8, 2013, 12:43 AM
Proof of the KY monthly checks? I think there are more permit holders than that.

NavyLCDR
January 8, 2013, 12:23 PM
Proof of the KY monthly checks? I think there are more permit holders than that.

http://kentuckystatepolice.org/pdf/KSP_ANREP_06.pdf

Page 42:
"Carry Concealed Deadly Weapons (CCDW) Section
Started processing the Law Enforcement Officer’s Safety Act licenses.
All employees in the CCDW Section received training from FBI NICS on performing background
checks.
Began performing all seven background checks each month on all licensees."

and check out this report:
http://www.kentuckystatepolice.org/ccdw/pdf/AOC_2010_CCDW_Report.pdf

apparantly the State of Kentucky has a severe lack of trust of CCDW holders....can you imagine if they took all these resources and used them to investigate criminals?!?

TimeRegained
January 8, 2013, 02:44 PM
Awesome. Panic pandemonium. What a joke. I do love however how people don't think that California buys guns when it ranks # 3 and probably leads the market in some sectors.

NavyLCDR
January 8, 2013, 03:58 PM
Awesome. Panic pandemonium. What a joke. I do love however how people don't think that California buys guns when it ranks # 3 and probably leads the market in some sectors.
You also have to consider the # of gun purchases v. the population, however.

10 people buying guns in one year is a pretty big deal when the total population you are talking about is 11....

California: 1,132,603 NICS checks per population of 37,691,912 is 3%
Wyoming: 63,356 NICS checks per population of 568,158 is 11%

and another thing you have to remember...even private sales of firearms require a NICS check in California, whereas in Wyoming private sales do not.

Given those facts, it doesn't seem like there is a big new gun sales market, per capita, in California just a whole lot more population and a whole lot more actions that require a NICS check.

K1500
January 8, 2013, 06:51 PM
^This. Wyoming is essentially 4 times the rate if California. Of course, for multiple reasons mentioned, number of NICS checks is better thought of as an indicator of activity, rather than a measure of the number of guns sold.

Trent
January 9, 2013, 12:41 PM
Does that put Illinois at #1 per capita? :)

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