The Main Event - Obama @ 11:55 ET.


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Trent
January 16, 2013, 10:13 AM
Well, just under 2 hours until Obama is on every TV channel.

Anyone wake up with their crystal ball in good functional order who wants to take a stab at what he's going to say?

I'm thinking inside the volume of his Executive Order barrage will be one or two particularly nasty ones. It just makes tactical sense. Every attack has a strong point, and he could do a lot of damage on the "movement" of arms and ammunition without involving congress.

I also think that following his speech we'll see the fabled Feinstein bill and other legislation hit the press (finally).

Anyway my projection is he's going to make such a broad, all encompassing attack, pro-gun advocates are going to have a hard time responding to it all.

I'm afraid of the NRA at this point; I'm afraid they will make the mistake of going after the pieces which they feel they can stop easily, instead of going after the pieces that are doing the most harm to legal gun owners.

Any other takers?

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Queen_of_Thunder
January 16, 2013, 10:34 AM
Yes he is going to gather the children around him for the emontional impact as he guts our Bill of Rights.

radiotom
January 16, 2013, 10:38 AM
Since it's, you know, for the children, how can you disagree? :barf:

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 10:41 AM
I'll try---Dog and pony. He will execute 19 EO's, NONE of which will include bans on high capacity or weapons. He WILL propose a ban on high capacity mags and "assault" rifles---however he will pass it on to Congress(so it is worthless). He can then say(with kids around him)---I did EVERYTHING in my power(19 EO's) and under the law I can only propose to Congress these other changes. These will be voted down. After the next incident he will then point to Congress and say, see they voted this down and I did all in my power---so blame them. He wants to paint them in a corner for when it happens again before midterms.

Airbrush Artist
January 16, 2013, 10:42 AM
Gonna be hard to watch without getting Angry

Silent Bob
January 16, 2013, 10:45 AM
I think you are pretty much on the money with your assesements.

The media is preparing to barrage and saturate the airwaves with images of the dead children until gun control legislation is passed.

Ryanxia
January 16, 2013, 10:50 AM
Maybe he's having the children around to discourage someone from taking him out. Just an observation.

PRM
January 16, 2013, 10:52 AM
History repeats itself time and time again! Here we go again. Just wait until tomorrow when the "king" goes on TV with a group of kids and wants to take your rights away. It's all part of a plan...

Its all about Obama's vision for transformation. We all know that little document called the Constitution is a major obstacle to achieving that political end. Especially that 2nd part about armed citizens. Lot of smoke and mirrors about common sense?

Obama's choreographed Biden led task force was a check the box. School safety was not even a topic. The goal is two fold.

1. Strike hard and diminish the 2nd Amendment as much as possible, and set the stage for future action.

2. Through media support and showmanship (using children) paint conservatives and Republicans in a manner that shows them as not caring for little kids. It's as much a political jab at Congress as anything else.


One radio host this morning was talking about the current flu epidemic. As of today, 20 school age kids have died from the flu in the US. The same number that was killed at Sandy Hook. This is only the second week in January and flu season has just started. Your child is more likely to die of the flu than from a school shooting. Where is the flu task force? What legislation and EOs are being proposed to protect children from that likelihood.

InkEd
January 16, 2013, 10:52 AM
I think he will try to suspend, regulate and strip away as many of our rights by (New World) Order as possible. He will try to use children to further his agenda. Obama wishes to be DICTATOR of the United States.

WardenWolf
January 16, 2013, 10:55 AM
I predict the following possible executive orders:

1. Ban the importation of ammunition.

2. Ban the importation of all semi-automatic firearms.

3. Order the destruction of military brass.

Possible legislation may ban the production of replacement parts for certain weapons even while grandfathering them, which will result in their eventual extinction.

Halal Pork
January 16, 2013, 11:10 AM
His lips will move but I will only hear the psychic message he will send me:

"You should have gotten an FFL 6 years ago and gone into business for yourself!"

gfanikf
January 16, 2013, 11:23 AM
One radio host this morning was talking about the current flu epidemic. As of today, 20 school age kids have died from the flu in the US. The same number that was killed at Sandy Hook. This is only the second week in January and flu season has just started. Your child is more likely to die of the flu than from a school shooting. Where is the flu task force? What legislation and EOs are being proposed to protect children from that likelihood.
http://www.flu.gov/

That's just the main one. CDC has lots of good info and steps on its site.

Look we may not be happy with Obama, but let's not be delusion and think nothing the government does is good or helpful.

PRM
January 16, 2013, 11:28 AM
Look we may not be happy with Obama, but let's not be delusion and think nothing the government does is good or helpful.

Their moto has been from the start, "never waste a crisis." It really is all about an agenda. Sorry, but I quit drinking kool-aid around puberty.

gfanikf
January 16, 2013, 11:33 AM
Their moto has been from the start, "never waste a crisis." It really is all about an agenda. Sorry, but I quit drinking kool-aid around puberty.
In regards to the Flu?

Skribs
January 16, 2013, 11:35 AM
Banning the importation of all semi-automatic firearms...wow that would be a blow to most companies abroad and would probably incite civil unrest at the least. Beretta, Glock, Sig, HK, Caracal, Taurus...and that's just off the top of my head and just pistols.

I don't own any of those, but Glock and Sig...really?

Silent Bob
January 16, 2013, 11:37 AM
deleted

gfanikf
January 16, 2013, 11:42 AM
Glock would just switch to Georgia, they already have produced some slides that say US vs Austria. Beretta has it's facilities to make the M9.

Skribs
January 16, 2013, 11:42 AM
Trent, for those of us on slow internet connections at work, will you be doing a blow-by-blow like you did with the NY legislation?

kwguy
January 16, 2013, 11:46 AM
Not that it matters, but is the the signing of EO's today, or just announcing what he wants to do? It's bad enough to do this dog and pony show, but to actually sign them during that would make me just vomit, or make my head explode or something.

Trent
January 16, 2013, 11:46 AM
On the air now:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/live

radiotom
January 16, 2013, 11:47 AM
Drudge says its 23 Executive actions

kwguy
January 16, 2013, 11:48 AM
Another thing just occurred to me. The House Republicans really have nothing to lose by standing up for the 2nd Amendment. What votes could they possibly lose? The left? They never had those votes to begin with. Doing the right thing, in this case standing up for the 2A, would cost them nothing .

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 11:50 AM
Here come the pawns....

Jorg Nysgerrig
January 16, 2013, 11:51 AM
Hey look, there's a desk with a pen ready to go. Looks like we'll be seeing a bit of signing today.

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 11:52 AM
Yeah i saw that too!

AnonymousReef
January 16, 2013, 11:52 AM
This is disgusting..already using the corpses of these innocents as political capital barely minutes in.

Trent
January 16, 2013, 11:53 AM
http://i.imgur.com/yb4o4.png

Yup.

herkyguy
January 16, 2013, 11:55 AM
Stand by for online gun websites to crash......

The people will be speaking....and buying.

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 11:56 AM
"Do as much as we can as quickly as we can" HUH!!

gfanikf
January 16, 2013, 11:56 AM
Stand by for online gun websites to crash......

The people will be speaking....and buying.
Polymer lowers to reach $500!

I say that in jest, but who the hell knows.

Trent
January 16, 2013, 11:56 AM
Big O up.

donniegood
January 16, 2013, 11:57 AM
Polymer lowers to reach $500!

I say that in jest, but who the hell knows.
i can see that happening

Silent Bob
January 16, 2013, 11:57 AM
What is there else to buy? I guess there will be a run now on HKS speedloaders for revolvers and Glock "Gunny" T-shirts.

Xyr
January 16, 2013, 11:59 AM
I'm sorry, I don't want kids crafting gun control legislation.

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:00 PM
Excuse typos, going fast

* Thanks Joe Biden
* Protecting children shouldn't be a divisive issue
* Honor memories of children by preventing this from happening again
* Kids sent letters in, four with him today, representative of messages he got.
* Reads excerpts from children's letters
* We should be thinking about responsibility to shield children from harm
* This is our first task as a society, keeping children safe, this is how we will be judged.

donniegood
January 16, 2013, 12:00 PM
I'm sorry, I don't want kids crafting gun control legislation.
100% agree since when do children decide we need change.

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 12:00 PM
He will definitely be signing something today!!

Hoppy
January 16, 2013, 12:01 PM
There are so many people that really want this and feel that one man, their man, should be able to just make things happen. I've heard it many times.
They just do not believe in the original processes our republic was founded on.

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:02 PM
* Asked cabinet to come up with concrete steps to take right now to prevent mass shootings
* to reduce broader epidemic of gun violence
* can't put this off any longer
* last thursday, another school shooting in California
* In the month since 20 precious children were taken more than 900 of our fellow americans have reportedly died at the end of a gun
* every day we wait that number will keep growing
* so I'm putting forward a specific set of proposals based on Joe's task force
* Intend to use whatever weight the office holds to make them a reality
* no law or set of laws can prevent any act completely, if there is even ONE thing we can do to reduce violence, ONE life that can be saved, we have an obligation to try

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:03 PM
* Asked cabinet to come up with concrete steps to take right now to prevent mass shootings
* to reduce broader epidemic of gun violence
* can't put this off any longer
* last thursday, another school shooting in California
* In the month since 20 precious children were taken more than 900 of our fellow americans have reportedly died at the end of a gun
* every day we wait that number will keep growing
* so I'm putting forward a specific set of proposals based on Joe's task force
* Intend to use whatever weight the office holds to make them a reality
* no law or set of laws can prevent any act completely, if there is even ONE thing we can do to reduce violence, ONE life that can be saved, we have an obligation to try
How many of those 900 were in Chicago and Washington, DC- 2 of the most restrictive places in the US for gun laws?

Greenmachin3
January 16, 2013, 12:03 PM
The details are emerging... and it sounds like his hands are tied. He's doing exactly what LaPiere suggested. haha.

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 12:03 PM
23 executive actions!

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:04 PM
As soon as I'm finished speaking here I'm signing a directive giving law enforcement / etc some of the tools they need to reduce gun violence.
We'll make it easier to .. strengthing background checks
more schools to hire resource officers
mental health reporting easier
while year after year those who oppose gun control agenda I will direct the centers for disease control to study the best way to reduce it,
congress to fund violent video game research
we don't benefit from ignorance, not knowing, this epidemic of violence
these are a few of the 23 executive actions I'm announcing today
no substitute for legislation
to make a real and lasting diference, congress must act, and act soon. and I'm calling on cnogress to pas very speciic proposals right away

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:04 PM
Also, guns are the problem but he still wants to direct the CDC to "study the issue"?

nitesite
January 16, 2013, 12:04 PM
He just stated that he is signing 23 Executive Orders or directives today alone.

gun addict
January 16, 2013, 12:04 PM
great, universal background check :banghead:

xjsnake
January 16, 2013, 12:04 PM
Proposal 1: Universal background checks

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:05 PM
* Universal background check for anyone buying a gun
* 1.5 million wrong people prohibited to date by background checks
* 40% of gun purases conducted without background check, no safe, or smart etc
* if you wantna buy a gun you should at least show you are not a felon or someon legally prohibited from buying one, this is common sense
* 70% of NRA members support stronger background checks

second

Congress should restore a ban on military weapons and a 10 round limit on magazines

AnonymousReef
January 16, 2013, 12:05 PM
There he goes spouting Brady/VPC talking points :rolleyes:

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 12:06 PM
Restore ban on assault weapons and have a 10 round limit.......

Greenmachin3
January 16, 2013, 12:06 PM
His congressional suggestions won't happen. His EOs are looking weak.

Jorg Nysgerrig
January 16, 2013, 12:06 PM
Let's be clear. The background check, the AWB, and magazine restrictions are legislation he is calling on Congress to enact, not via executive order.

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:06 PM
* type of rifle in auroroa with high capacity magazines is designed to pump out as many bullets as possible, with bullets designed to inflict maximum damage, allowed him to shoot 70 people, kiling 12
* weapons designed for the theatre of war have no place in a movie theatre
* Ronald Reagan agreed, who wrote in 1994 urging congress to listen to the american public and law enforcement to support a ban on the further manufacture of assault weapons

Swing
January 16, 2013, 12:06 PM
Anyone know about the Reagan letter he just referenced?

herkyguy
January 16, 2013, 12:06 PM
He's kicking the can to Congress.......

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 12:07 PM
Stop manufacture of assault weapons...

627PCFan
January 16, 2013, 12:07 PM
Who the hell is Tom Jones?

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:08 PM
"more cops on the street"

"I support the 2nd amendment, but......"

"If the '94 ban hadn't expired, there would be more people alive today...."

BluBob
January 16, 2013, 12:08 PM
$500 Mil package

Strengthen background checks
$$$ for school resource officers
CDC study to reduce gun violence
Congress study effects of violent video games
23 Executive actions

To congress:
Require universal background checks for anyone buying a gun
Restore AWB with 10-rd limit
Confirm Todd Jones to head BATF

Swing
January 16, 2013, 12:08 PM
Hmmm ... NRA site is 503-ing (temporary overload).

Greenmachin3
January 16, 2013, 12:08 PM
And what is an "assault weapon"? A made up word in the 1980s by politicians with no legal reference. Assault Rifle? Sure. Machine gun? Sure. But "Assault Weapon"?

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:08 PM
* get tougher on people buying guns who turn around and sell them to criinals
* severely punish anyone doing this
* congress hasn't confirmed BATF head, todd jones nominated
* budget cuts are forcing communities to reduce police force, add more cops to the streets
* i believe the second amendment guarantees an individual right ot bear arms, respect tradition, hunting, sport, protection, or collection. I also believe that most gun owners agree we can respect 2nd amendment while preventing a few from unleashing harm on a massive scale

* fewer atrocities like newtown, these reforms are designed to do, with support of the american people
* doesn't mean it wll be easy to enact or implement

Skribs
January 16, 2013, 12:10 PM
This is making me sick. "Think of the kids." I am. I want our kids to be actively protected by armed teachers, not passively protected by politicians without a clue of how many shooters follow the laws of gun free zones. I want our kids protected by parents who are armed instead of parents who will sacrifice themselves so their kids can escape. I want our kids to grow up in a culture that doesn't repress safe and responsible gun ownership and use. I want our kids to not have to worry about Daddy going to jail just because he owns a firearm. Yeah...who's thinking of the kids? And who's thinking of his own political career?

I also believe that most gun owners agree we can respect 2nd amendment while preventing a few from unleashing harm on a massive scale

Yeah. Keep them in prison. Because keeping guns out of their hands (not even realistically possible, but I like fantasy fiction) will not prevent them from using other devices for their goals. Why is it that the freedom of a violent criminal is more important than my constitutionally-(supposedly)-insured right?

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:11 PM
* this will be difficult blahblahblah
* people will warn of a tyrranical all out assault on liberty
* groups want revenue for themselves spouting this
* the only way we can change is if their audience, their members, says this time must be different, this time we must do something to protect our communities and kids
* I will put everything I got in to this and so will joe, but I tell ya, the only way we can change is if the american people demand it.
By the way that doesn't just mean certain parts of the country. we need voices in those areas where the tradition of gun ownershipo is strong, to speak up, and say this is important, it can't just be the usual suspects
we have to examine ourselves and our hearsts and ask ourselves whta i important
this will not happen unless the am. people demand it. parents, teachers, police officers, pastors, huntors and pastors, and americans of every background stand up and say "weve suffered too much pain, enough" then change will come
that's what it will take

herkyguy
January 16, 2013, 12:11 PM
this is BO's MO. He isn't doing anything. he's just spewing words.

Swing
January 16, 2013, 12:12 PM
Pretty vague on the 23 EOs so far ...

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:12 PM
* the most important changes we make depend on congress
* they need to bring them up for a vote
* get them on record, ask your member of congress if they support these proposals
* if they say no, ask them why not
* ask them what's more important, doing what ever it takes to get an a grade from the gun lobby or giving parents peace of mind when they drop their child off for first grade

gfanikf
January 16, 2013, 12:12 PM
Full plan in PDF format with all the EOs and measures.
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/01/16/us/politics/16white-house-gun-proposals-documents.html?smid=tw-nytimes

he wants to screw C&R holders too!

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:12 PM
Exactly what I said!

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 12:12 PM
Stop with the doing it for the kids already...

herkyguy
January 16, 2013, 12:13 PM
Where are the pro-gun protesters disrupting his press event with posters and screams??? oh yeah, that's right....i forgot. we act like adults.

sonick808
January 16, 2013, 12:13 PM
does this guy address his speeches to 5 year olds or what ?

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:13 PM
Essentially no weapons ban, no capacity ban either:D

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:14 PM
* this is hte land of the free and it always will be
* we're endowed by our creator with inalienable rights
* we recognize that with rights come responsibilities
* freedom to live our lives as we want comes with the obligaion to allow others to do the same
* we don't live in isolation, we live in a society, a governmnet of by and for the people, responsible for each other
* the right to worship freely was denied in WI, the right to assembel peacably was denied shoppers in Oregon and Auroroa, that most fundamental set of rights to life liberty / etc were denied at Virginia tech and Columbine and Newtown and kids on street corners in Chicago too frequent of basis to tolerate
* all the families who never imagined they'd lose a loved one to a bullet those rights are at stake and we are responsible

sonick808
January 16, 2013, 12:14 PM
I wonder if those executive actions have any gang-busting measures in there, you know, for the children in south Chicago ?

gfanikf
January 16, 2013, 12:14 PM
In case people missed it
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/01/16/us/politics/16white-house-gun-proposals-documents.html?smid=tw-nytimes

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:14 PM
Now he's pulling the "bill of rights is ok, but still need responsible restrictions" crap...

Cesiumsponge
January 16, 2013, 12:15 PM
I'm glad he addressed the founders' concern with shooting turkeys and clay pigeons.

herkyguy
January 16, 2013, 12:15 PM
I would be furious if my child was used as a pawn for some political gain.....

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:15 PM
(breather while he talks about the girl grace)

for the children
for the americans to keep them safe from harm
do the right thing
for this country we love so much

going to sign these orders.

Rockfish61
January 16, 2013, 12:16 PM
Sounds Like another Squib Load to me. Hire more Feds, Harass more Law abiding folks etc.etc. Congress is where the real battle will be fought. and God help us if the man gets to make any more SCOTUS appointments.

TenDriver
January 16, 2013, 12:16 PM
So... Not going to spell out the now 23 EO's he's going to enact?

sleepyone
January 16, 2013, 12:16 PM
so who gets the blame after the next mass shooting when high-cap mags and "assault" rifles have already been banned and instead of five empty 30 round mags and an AR the shooter was found with 15 empty 10 round mags on him on a "non-assault" rifle? Hmmmm. It won't be Obama.

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:17 PM
Phew my fingers hurt.

Time to go read some EO's.

mountainpharm
January 16, 2013, 12:17 PM
As a health care provider I find his use of the Affordable Care Act to be particularly insidious. That law is going to serve as a gateway into every aspect of our lives. This is just the beginning.

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:17 PM
What's this crap about "armor piercing bullets"? To protect cops....thought it was no longer an issue...

JBrady555
January 16, 2013, 12:17 PM
I guess we don't need to know what the 23 EOs are

gfanikf
January 16, 2013, 12:17 PM
Phew my fingers hurt.

Time to go read some EO's.
Full list and everything
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/01/16/us/politics/16white-house-gun-proposals-documents.html?smid=tw-nytimes

Including this crap
http://i.imgur.com/W2ctz.jpg

Archer
January 16, 2013, 12:17 PM
Never have I been so relieved at seeing a president so ineffective.

Jorg Nysgerrig
January 16, 2013, 12:18 PM
It appears they are the 23:

Gun Violence Reduction Executive Actions
Today, the President is announcing that he and the Administration will:
1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant
data available to the federal background check system.
2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance
Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making
information available to the background check system.
3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check
system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from
having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background
check on an individual before returning a seized gun.
6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on
how to run background checks for private sellers.
7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.
8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety
Commission).
9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns
recovered in criminal investigations.
10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it
widely available to law enforcement.
11. Nominate an ATF director.
12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper
training for active shooter situations.
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to
research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective
use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop
innovative technologies.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients
about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits
them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.EMBARGOED
19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and
institutions of higher education.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health
services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements
within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental
health

HOOfan_1
January 16, 2013, 12:18 PM
if there is even one thing we can do to reduce violence, one life that can be saved, we have an obligation to try

wrong wrong wrong wrong

sleepyone
January 16, 2013, 12:18 PM
I'm glad Obama conducts domestic policy based on the advice of first graders. I feel safer already

herkyguy
January 16, 2013, 12:19 PM
Never have I been so relieved at seeing a president so ineffective.
indeed. we just bought ourselves a few more months. but the panic and insanity will continue.

kwguy
January 16, 2013, 12:19 PM
Ok, so he signed three EO's right there. And said the stuff we expect. Any clue about the rest? MAN! I gotta board for an 18 hour flight in like, three minutes! This is killin' me!

morcey2
January 16, 2013, 12:19 PM
There isn't anything in the doc that was released about restricting imports through EO. I was glad to see that. I'm amazed at the amount of dishonesty in a single PDF.

gfanikf
January 16, 2013, 12:20 PM
Ok, so he signed three EO's right there. And said the stuff we expect. Any clue about the rest? MAN! I gotta board for an 18 hour flight in like, three minutes! This is killin' me!
It's in the PDF

ChromDome
January 16, 2013, 12:20 PM
23 EO's from Fox News

1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.
2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.
3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.
6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.
7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.
8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).
9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.
10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.
11. Nominate an ATF director.
12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations.
13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.
18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.
19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/01/16/list-executive-actions-obama-plans-to-take-as-part-anti-gun-violence-plan/#ixzz2I9xt748X

Grassman
January 16, 2013, 12:20 PM
This will also be an excuse for an evermore expanding government. How can it not be?

Skribs
January 16, 2013, 12:20 PM
"We need to be responsible." I call bravo sierra on that. If you were being responsible, you would have looked at ways to solve the root problem of violence in our society, instead of restricting my rights because of prejudice against me and those like me.

Go home. Do nothing for 4 years. And then let someone who's willing to look behind the fold of politics to see the real issue step up to the plate and actually fix the problem without making everything worse.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:20 PM
Why would the panic continue...there is no chance of the ban passing the House?!

Silent Bob
January 16, 2013, 12:20 PM
Those EOs are pretty weak sauce, though I am concerned about the part about "C&R assault weapons" (The crips just love doing drive-bys with M1 Garands, see) and one of the EOs that got my attention "Clarify that doctors are not prohibited under the ACA to ask patients about guns in the home"

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 12:20 PM
Here are the EOs...

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/01/16/us/politics/16white-house-gun-proposals-documents.html?smid=tw-nytimes

xXxplosive
January 16, 2013, 12:20 PM
Weak.........weak......commentary.....no executive orders......sending most to Congress......Blah, blah, blah.

ChromDome
January 16, 2013, 12:21 PM
This speech change nothing.

He called on congress to act and issued 23 EO's that didn't change a thing.

Everyone can relax.

DoubleTapDrew
January 16, 2013, 12:21 PM
What's this crap about "armor piercing bullets"? To protect cops....thought it was no longer an issue...

All handgun bullets with AP capability are already banned (not that there were ever really mass produced anyway aside from the 5.7).
Nearly all centerfire rifle bullets will defeat the armor cops wear. Maybe he wants to ban centerfires.

steveracer
January 16, 2013, 12:22 PM
So....as usual....nothing got accomplished.
NYS makes about 10 million citizens into criminals, and the POTUS can't even get ONE?
Good. I was actually worried for a few minutes.

heeler
January 16, 2013, 12:22 PM
So it appears our King has admitted HE must work through Congress to get his way.
Let the fight now really begin.

kwguy
January 16, 2013, 12:22 PM
Jorg! thanks for posting that! You rock! Keep up the fight guys!

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:22 PM
Too bad about the C&R proposals- now what data does the Pres or ATF have that suggest that a large amount of C&R firearms are used in crimes, converted to full auto, etc...?

Redlg155
January 16, 2013, 12:22 PM
Wow...I expected an foreign gun and ammo restriction by EO.

Also, he mentioned Chicago in his speech? Really? A place where restrictions are already in place. Go figure.

valnar
January 16, 2013, 12:22 PM
I just finished watching Obama's speech live, and waited for concrete evidence before writing this.

This may be an unpopular post, but where are the apologies from our OWN people on THR regarding panic buying? Turns out we were right. There was indeed a solid reason to gobble up as many PMags as possible. Where are those people now that said we had nothing to worry about?

armedaccountant
January 16, 2013, 12:22 PM
Double Tap Drew I was thinking the same thing about most centerfire rifles being able to defeat body armor.

KMatch
January 16, 2013, 12:23 PM
* bullets designed to inflict maximum damage, allowed him to shoot 70 people, kiling 12

The minute I heard that I wondered... If the bullets were so powerful, why weren't 70 dead?? 12 sucks, don't get me wrong, but according to the use of "bullets designed to inflict maximum damage", the death toll argues otherwise.

herkyguy
January 16, 2013, 12:23 PM
#12 - provide active shooter advice to schools??? What might that be?? Hide under a desk and hope for the best?? unbelievable.....and that crappy piece of advice will cost millions to promulgate.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:24 PM
valnar---what is your worry about pmags? He won't get this past the House---he simply called for it!

Skribs
January 16, 2013, 12:24 PM
Hmmm...these EOs don't really seem to do much at all. Some of them I agree with (especially because they look at threats of violence instead of threats of gun use). I do wish that he wouldn't spend so much tax dollars on studies that are looking at just one small symptom. It would be like going to the doctor's office with some crippling disease and he gives you a nasal decongestent. Then when your condition worsens, he increases the dosage.

Beach Nut
January 16, 2013, 12:24 PM
I was worried about the possible Executive Order regarding importation of firearms and
ammunition but I see that is not on the list. Now it's on to Congress to see what happens
there.

JBrady555
January 16, 2013, 12:25 PM
Seems like the importation of ammo didn't come under fire even though importations of guns may be effected. Am I correct in this assumption?

heeler
January 16, 2013, 12:27 PM
Isn't it nice to see our Emperor has no clothes.

Archer
January 16, 2013, 12:27 PM
Valmar, did I miss something? Exactly what did B. Hussein say that leads you to the conclusion that panic buying was justified?

gym
January 16, 2013, 12:27 PM
I think it's a win for us. He is letting congress decide, the lead attack from his mouth was Universal Background checks, that was his first statement. After that it looked to diminish to me. Assault weapons ban won't make it through, the ten ronder is iffy, the rest is more than likelly mental health issues and the attempt to block importation of military syle weapons, "whatever they are?", but he even said it's got to go through Congress. Maybe 10 round mags,but if we raise our voices now, th entire thing might be a bad memory in 6 months.
I didn't see any "hard line" in what he said, it sounded more like he was "asking" congress to act, not demanding that EO's be put into effect.

BluBob
January 16, 2013, 12:27 PM
Is any of this mandate? On page two of the main section of the .pdf is says:
"We should"
then the next line is:
"Require background checks for all gun sales"

I don't see how this changes existing law or the application of existing law.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:28 PM
Archer----nothing---in fact the opposite is true.

expatqatar04
January 16, 2013, 12:28 PM
Incompetence at its best.

Trent
January 16, 2013, 12:28 PM
Where are the Executive orders at? I don't want a summary, I want to read the actual things.

xjsnake
January 16, 2013, 12:29 PM
Never have I been so relieved at seeing a president so ineffective.

I'm a school teacher and I approved this message...

Archer
January 16, 2013, 12:29 PM
With all respect this will NEVER just "be a bad memory"- ever. We MUST remain ever vigilant against further incursions on our rights. Just wait for yet another false-flag shooting incident to ramp the clamor now that B. Hussein has us all relaxed.

SSN Vet
January 16, 2013, 12:29 PM
23 pounds of fluff designed to make the false messiah look like the real thing.... and to prime the fuel pump for the midterm ellection fight, when those whacky tea party types obstruct the new AWB (aka. the denial of your constitutional rights).

geekWithA.45
January 16, 2013, 12:30 PM
My Assessment:

Obama just blinked, kicked the can over to congress and the people, and reached for the hand washing bowl.

It was a stately, manful blinking, but a blinking nonetheless.

He's not done: he'll try to twist some arms and apply some pressure and propaganda to see what it gets him, but when it fails, he'll say he tried and move along.

We need to see that he fails.

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:30 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/01/16/us/politics/16white-house-gun-proposals-documents.html?smid=tw-nytimes

Last couple pages of that document.

Skribs
January 16, 2013, 12:30 PM
I also agree we need to have our teachers trained to respond in the situation of an active shooter. I just think I have a more effective response in mind than BO does.

jakk280rem
January 16, 2013, 12:30 PM
How does he propose to ensure universal back ground checks? Did private sales just become illegal?

wickedsprint
January 16, 2013, 12:31 PM
I just finished watching Obama's speech live, and waited for concrete evidence before writing this.

This may be an unpopular post, but where are the apologies from our OWN people on THR regarding panic buying? Turns out we were right. There was indeed a solid reason to gobble up as many PMags as possible. Where are those people now that said we had nothing to worry about?

What point are you trying to make? You could have bought Pmags for $13 per shipped from brownells as recently as a couple months ago.

kwguy
January 16, 2013, 12:31 PM
Redleg 155: Shhhhh. Shot out...

blarby
January 16, 2013, 12:31 PM
AP ammo is already well defnined- they are not re-defining it.......

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/guides/importation-verification/firearms-verification-gca-ammunition.html

I love that they finally have to appoint a director of the ATF, by EO.

"please step up and be flogged sir, we appoint you"

CraigC
January 16, 2013, 12:32 PM
Where are those people now that said we had nothing to worry about?
Not changing my story or apologizing for it. Grow up. :rolleyes:

valnar
January 16, 2013, 12:32 PM
Valmar, did I miss something? Exactly what did B. Hussein say that leads you to the conclusion that panic buying was justified?

That he will do "whatever it takes"? Even if Congress doesn't pass it, I doubt this will be the end of it. Surely you don't expect it all to fizzle away if the House doesn't pass those measures? We already had the fool-me-once mentality in 1994.

KMatch
January 16, 2013, 12:33 PM
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to
research the causes and prevention of gun violence.

Well, there's yer problem, right there! Find the cause of gun violence (through the CDC) and it's all fixed!

That's really the only thing that stuck out to me. The rest really can be called up as in our favor. Inconvenient, but still a positive light other than the sharing of medical information that may not be related at all.

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:33 PM
How does he propose to ensure universal back ground checks? Did private sales just become illegal?
NO- nothing like that was in the list of executive orders. Calm down, nothing has even been proposed in Congress yet...

Let's wait and see what comes out before we panic even more than we have been.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:33 PM
Valnar---he can't do any more then he did. He can only propose legislation regarding bans on guns and mags!!!!:banghead:

SSN Vet
January 16, 2013, 12:34 PM
Obama just blinked, kicked the can over to congress and the people, and reached for the hand washing bowl.

The man is a died in the wool socialist & statist, .... the silver lining in all of this?

He's also extremely incompetent.

Fortunately for us, we are still (largely at least) a nation under the rule of law.

HOOfan_1
January 16, 2013, 12:35 PM
Bottom line, there is NEVER ANY EXCUSE for treading upon individual liberty.

Archer
January 16, 2013, 12:35 PM
That he will do "whatever it takes"? Even if Congress doesn't pass it, I doubt this will be the end of it. Surely you don't expect it all to fizzle away if the House doesn't pass those measures? We already had the fool-me-once mentality in 1994.
Ah. Well, you see his statement one way and I see it as a weak admission of impotence on this matter. I suppose we will know soon enough.

You see, Valmar, foolish as I may be, I still expect our elected representatives in Congress to stand by their oath to the Constitution. Heck, I would even go so far as to point out that to a degree what we saw B. Hussein do today was to stiffly and shallowly bow to that oath- or at least the consequences of ignoring it.

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 12:35 PM
What happened to his "no negotiation" attitude that he had about the debt ceiling??

valnar
January 16, 2013, 12:35 PM
Valnar---he can't do any more then he did. He can only propose legislation regarding bans on guns and mags!!!

Well, everybody forgets about indirect pressure. Keep it in the news, keep it on the minds of the sheeple, and enough public pressure will outweigh our voices in regards to our representatives. I see it happen all the time.

SuperNaut
January 16, 2013, 12:36 PM
Okay folks, this gives us a small breather, then we have to Gandalf Up and hit our representatives hard to make sure that Congress does not pass this legislation.

Skribs
January 16, 2013, 12:36 PM
I'm not panicing, but I am developing two plans for what to do once I've saved money to buy a new toy. One is based on current law, one on potential law. I am hoping that the laws stay the same (or, after looking at how they've failed to reduce crime, go back in our direction), but planning for all possible outcomes.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:37 PM
The ONLY way it could happen is if the House passes it--------so not going to happen.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:38 PM
Your plan should be once the ban is denied by the House, gun prices will plummet.;)

steveracer
January 16, 2013, 12:38 PM
Nobody wants to hear this, but I'll say it:
Right before congress is done moving on the next anti-gun bill, there will be another mass shooting. It will be in a school or airport or church, and kids will get killed. There will be enormous inconsistency in the event, but it will boil down to this: One of "us" will be the fall guy.
Then they will get the votes.
Remember that I told you. I might know a thing or two.

Archer
January 16, 2013, 12:39 PM
Well, everybody forgets about indirect pressure. Keep it in the news, keep it on the minds of the sheeple, and enough public pressure will outweigh our voices in regards to our representatives. I see it happen all the time.
I certainly agree with you on this aspect of things. But I also think you are saying something a bit different than your original statement. Good on you.

BluBob
January 16, 2013, 12:40 PM
meh. Read the whole thing. Main point is his attempt to envigorate congress and mobilize the people to support further legislation.
Only immediate action I read was:

Increased funding for SROs and COP program

Directing the CDC to study gun violence.

DoJ report on lost and stolen guns. Wonder if that will include those lost by the DoJ in gunwalking programs. Probably not.

Consumer Product Safety Commisssion intends to review effectiveness of gun locks and improve standards.

Atty General to review existing and emerging gun safety technologies.

Did I miss something?

jakk280rem
January 16, 2013, 12:40 PM
I am calm. EO #6, the one sending a letter of instruction to FFL'S on how to conduct bgc for non dealer transfers was a bit confusing.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:40 PM
You might be right about another shooting---the House will still never pass it...political suicide.

Redlg155
January 16, 2013, 12:41 PM
TIME IS RUNNING OUT! GET ONE NOW WHILE YOU STILL CAN! The SCAR will surely be on the 2013 Assault Weapons Ban's most wanted list! Please check local laws before bidding. $50 shipping. Overnight shipping available but buyer pays actual shipping charge. Please add 3.5% for Paypal purchases. Payment must be made within 3 days of auction end. Good luck! Update: President to announce 19 gun control Executive Orders this week. One of which being banning importation of guns and parts from overseas. These are made in Belgium and by Executive order would be banned.

Gunbroker Add for the "Rare" Scar 17is in FDE. Buy Now for $
10,000

I'm thinking he won't get that today.

wickedsprint
January 16, 2013, 12:41 PM
I wonder if mil style weapons includes handguns..like an M9 with 10 rounders might be no bueno.

trauma
January 16, 2013, 12:41 PM
Trent
Thanks for the play by play. I am at work now and could not tune in.

desidog
January 16, 2013, 12:42 PM
Is that the same ATF director who oversaw the ATF during Operation Fast and Furious?

Don't fire...promote?

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:42 PM
Gun prices should fall as of today...for the well informed.

jakk280rem
January 16, 2013, 12:42 PM
I did find the part of the speech about how weapons designed for the theater of war have no place in a movie theater. except on the screen, making a profit.

Archer
January 16, 2013, 12:43 PM
In fact the strong possibility of yet another incident makes it imperative for all of us in a position to do something about it to increase our vigilance, and be ready when the flag flies. Nothing would stop this train in its tracks faster than an armed citizen intervening and foiling another of these operations - preferably before it starts.

WardenWolf
January 16, 2013, 12:46 PM
Well, this was certainly a major letdown. I know what he *could* have done, but what he actually did was rather spineless. Thank goodness for a President with no balls.

tulsamal
January 16, 2013, 12:49 PM
I am most definitely not a conspiracy type of guy. And I also don't buy the false flag stuff. But.... that doesn't mean there won't be "something else" happen. It's inevitable just based on the size of the country, the population level, and the diverse mix of the population. We have several "mass shootings" every year. There are over 300 million people in this country. And there will always be a few losers that want to be famous and can't find any other way. So even though my reasons are different, our plans need to include plans for such eventualities. We just need a few more incidents where a good guy really does use his CCW to stop the bad guy.

Gregg

sharpshooter74
January 16, 2013, 12:49 PM
People have a right to panic buy whatever they want.

The 3 most important things Obama stated is what I think we should all pay attention to. 1. Assault Weapons Ban 2. 10 round magazine limit 3. Banning of private sales without background checks

Even though he doesn't have the votes in the House now, that doesn't mean that he won't have it in 2014.

It's more than likely that the Democrats will gain back their majority in the House, and maybe their Super Majority in the Senate. Even without a Super Majority in the Senate, they still have enough Rinos to support all 3 initiatives.

If you care about your " Assault Weapons " and " High Capacity Mags ", I say people have a 2 year time span to stock up on as much of it as possible just in case.

Skribs
January 16, 2013, 12:49 PM
Yeah, in no way take my "I agree with one or two of these EOs" as a sign I agree with his speech. The speech (or the version I read from Trent's report) was so abhorrent it made my blood boil. Insert meme about how that speech gave me cancer.

As to prices...I don't think we're out of the woods until congress has had a chance to discuss the issue. We need to remain vigilant until this is behind us. "I contacted my reps in december" isn't enough. We need to be organizing events to raise awareness. We need to be sending money and actively participating in groups like the NRA-ILA. We need to be sending letters, emails, and phone calls to those in office saying flat-out that we do not support gun legislation, and will do what we legally can to help or hinder the political career of our politicians based on their choices. We need to spread our propoganda on social media sites and engage in intelligent debate to convince fence-sitters to join our side. We need to be doing what we can to make sure that congress doesn't do something stupid...again.

Swing
January 16, 2013, 12:50 PM
Where are the Executive orders at? I don't want a summary, I want to read the actual things.

+1. Anyone know where the actual text of the EOs can be read?

GlockFan
January 16, 2013, 12:50 PM
Gun prices should fall as of today...for the well informed.

I don't know about that. One of the first things he said was that he will push for a ban on mags more than 10 rounds and stopping the manufacture of assault weapons.

MErl
January 16, 2013, 12:50 PM
I am calm. EO #6, the one sending a letter of instruction to FFL'S on how to conduct bgc for non dealer transfers was a bit confusing.
perhaps rules on how to fill out paperwork transferring a gun not logged into your possession.

LubeckTech
January 16, 2013, 12:51 PM
The ONLY way it could happen is if the House passes it--------so not going to happen.
It is important not to get "cockey" - pride goeth before a fall!

To say at this point it is not going to happen is a setup for disaster - the opera ain't over until tha fat lady sings. It would be appropriate to say it is not likley to happen.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:52 PM
Even the NY Times agrees that the Democrats won't gain control of the House in 2014!

HarcyPervin
January 16, 2013, 12:53 PM
Gunbroker Add for the "Rare" Scar 17is in FDE. Buy Now for $
10,000

I'm thinking he won't get that today.

No kidding. I'm thinking there are going to be a lot of prices dropping soon. I just get a kick out of how many of these guys are tagging their items with bushmaster to take advantage of the guys who don't know what they're buying. Noveske et al, who in the past would like nothing better than to distance themselves from bushy's are now tagged bushmaster, AR, preban, etc...

I'm saving some pennies. I think by April or May things will calm down again

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:53 PM
Wanna bet? It's not my pride so it can't be my fall.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:54 PM
GlockFan------thru legislation so no ban!

Archer
January 16, 2013, 12:54 PM
It is important not to get "cockey" - pride goeth before a fall!

To say at this point it is not going to happen is a setup for disaster - the opera ain't over until tha fat lady sings. It would be appropriate to say it is not likley to happen.
I'm sure that if all of us pause to reflect on these matters we would find ourselves in total alignment with this attitude.

"After a victory, tighten your helmet strap". Tokugawa knew something about battle.

razorback2003
January 16, 2013, 12:54 PM
There is not much he can do with executive orders. He can't ban guns and mags with an EO.

This whole deal was for show.

The House should not do what NY did and honestly NY showed a lot of people in the gun community what 'compromise' will get you.

Shanghai McCoy
January 16, 2013, 12:55 PM
I took my dog for a walk and cleared brush at my back yard range. Better for my blood pressure and the dog needed excercise...
Now catching up on what went down... not as draconion as we thought but I believe it will be an incremental "first strike", so to speak, by the feds with more to come should these prove to be not effective to their liking.
Plus, this leaves states, like NY, to push through legislation that is more to the anti's agenda under the banner of "State's Right's"... savor the irony there folks.:rolleyes:
YMMV

Silent Bob
January 16, 2013, 12:56 PM
As far as prices coming down and things returning more or less to normal (or what passes for normal in the firearms/political community), the Orcs will be swarming the ramparts again next week when Feinstein introduces the onerous AWB 2.0 in the Senate (along with God knows what other anti-gun bills) so we still have a ways to go.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 12:58 PM
Silent Bob----that is why I said for the informed.;)

rdhood
January 16, 2013, 12:59 PM
Wow. It's all pretty weak. Some of it might even make a small difference (mental health aspects). NONE of the suggestions for AWB/Hi cap mags ban will pass Congress.

Since I have most of the stuff I want, I was particularly concerned about ammo. But there doesn't seem to be any new restrictions on ammo (no requirement for FFL, no ban of internet sales of ammo) and FTF transactions (A lot of folks have issues with this, but I wouldn't care about needing an FFL for FTF transactions... if it were FREE. Otherwise, it costs money to exercise a constitutional right.)

This should go a long way to returning the gun market to normalcy. So sorry for all of you that spent HUGELY inflated $$$ on mags/guns/ammo. Remember this lesson and get on board a bit earlier next time.

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 01:00 PM
+1. Anyone know where the actual text of the EOs can be read?
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/01/16/us/politics/16white-house-gun-proposals-documents.html?smid=tw-nytimes

Last 2 pages of the document.

Mayo
January 16, 2013, 01:00 PM
rdhood----Amen!

HarcyPervin
January 16, 2013, 01:01 PM
Silent Bob----that is why I said for the informed.

Ding ding ding. Let the masses overpay. Show the strength of the industry. THR may have a lot more knowledge per gun owner, but reflects a very small percentage of the purchasing power of the American gun-owning population.

TNBear
January 16, 2013, 01:02 PM
This is not over..
They still need to provide a specific definition of an "Assault Weapon".
I don't trust any of them..

blarby
January 16, 2013, 01:05 PM
A small seque...


The man is a died in the wool socialist

In all fairness, can we please stop bastardizing this word ?

If you are going to use it, at least please quantify it. Its like saying " WE BAN ALL GUN- BECAUSE GUN IS GUN"

( no offense to you vet- you didn't invent this travesty, just the most recent to bring it up, and I try and mock it much like we do "clips" eevery time I hear/see it)

Communism too, While we're at it.

He's nothing of the sort I personally assort with Socialsm- Usually Leninism, although vaguely associated. The way that most view deragotively "his" form of "socialism" advanced under this "banner" is Trotskyism IE- Vanguardism, and couldn't actually be further from its core tenets. About the best he claims to want to do is make the middle class bigger, and better protected....that would be about the extent of it, hence my classification of him as a Trotsky.

Its our version of "Assault Weapon" and "CLIPS" to "them" by the way.... It makes us look willingly un-informed about basic language and ideology. Just sayin......

HoosierQ
January 16, 2013, 01:05 PM
I suspect if you're taking Prozac, you're gonna have some issues. That's what item 2 (on the list I saw) seems to mean. And if some of our members are true to their words, they may be happy about that. See this post.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=695696

"Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system."

HIPAA makes it hard to get a hold of medical records without a darn good reason. I think this just made buying a gun, getting a CCP, or maybe even owning a gun "a darn good reason" to take a look at our medical records. They are full of diagnosis codes that are easy for computers to spot. There's one for "depression", there's one for "anxiety", there's one for just about every discrete disease...of the body or mind. So you gotta wonder how deep this goes. "depression" is OK, "psychosis" is NO-GO? Who knows.

rvanpelt
January 16, 2013, 01:06 PM
Did Obama mention regulating violence on TV or in kid's video games??

Rocketmedic
January 16, 2013, 01:09 PM
I actually wholeheartedly respect what President Obama is trying to do, although I do not support everything he does (namely, an AWB).

Then again, I just spent twelve hours cooped up in an ambulance with a right-wing nutjob who told me in no uncertain terms that "you soldier boys had better not come for my guns, because 1776 is going to happen again!" and who apparently believes Alex Jones is the fountain of truth.

Looks like an artful dodge- the next mass shooting will probably not have been affected at all by an EO (after all, if it were, we would never know) and the next little pile of innocent victims will be laid squarely at the feet of Congress, and a little more American freedom will be bartered away for the illusion of security.

Constitutional convention with all the Red States? We're always complaining how NY/CA pick the president, let's put our money where our mouth is and amplify the 2nd Amendment. Universal carry, a national shall-issue or constitutional-issue FOID, with constitutional protections against buybacks, seizures and the like except in the event of a crime or other heinous disqualifying act.

Pensfan
January 16, 2013, 01:10 PM
he did mention violence in video games, but it was more lip service than anything.

SuperNaut
January 16, 2013, 01:12 PM
, a national shall-issue or constitutional-issue FOID, with constitutional protections against buybacks, seizures and the like except in the event of a crime or other heinous disqualifying act.
No.

Rocketmedic
January 16, 2013, 01:12 PM
I suspect if you're taking Prozac, you're gonna have some issues. That's what item 2 (on the list I saw) seems to mean. And if some of our members are true to their words, they may be happy about that. See this post.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=695696

"Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system."

HIPAA makes it hard to get a hold of medical records without a darn good reason. I think this just made buying a gun, getting a CCP, or maybe even owning a gun "a darn good reason" to take a look at our medical records. They are full of diagnosis codes that are easy for computers to spot. There's one for "depression", there's one for "anxiety", there's one for just about every discrete disease...of the body or mind. So you gotta wonder how deep this goes. "depression" is OK, "psychosis" is NO-GO? Who knows.
Hoosier, I've seen hundreds of young vets trying to get a PTSD/anxiety diagnosis from the VA. I warned them that it may affect their rights in the future, but no one listened. Then again, if someone is truly mentally ill, I don't necessarily think that they should have the right to own a firearm without some sort of treatment or further examination. I don't think it's black-and-white.

sansone
January 16, 2013, 01:13 PM
IMHO-
he blinked but keep the pressure on your rep in congress..

it aint over but we can take a breath

sean326
January 16, 2013, 01:16 PM
This is not over..
They still need to provide a specific definition of an "Assault Weapon".
I don't trust any of them..
I think they'll just push for Feinsteins bill, i read it a couple weeks ago as i recall it was a semi auto rifle with one military characteristic.
The military characteristics were the usual suspects: Pistol grip, flash hider, handle, bayonet lug, vertical fore grip, detachable magazine, thumb-hole stock etc...
the previous law required 2 military characteristics, they said that was a loophole they now closed.

HarcyPervin
January 16, 2013, 01:20 PM
Hoosier, I've seen hundreds of young vets trying to get a PTSD/anxiety diagnosis from the VA. I warned them that it may affect their rights in the future, but no one listened. Then again, if someone is truly mentally ill, I don't necessarily think that they should have the right to own a firearm without some sort of treatment or further examination. I don't think it's black-and-white.

Scary to think about in both scenarios. I'd hate to see someone not getting treated out of fear of losing rights, or someone losing those rights just for being responsible. It's going to be really interesting where the line is drawn and how easy it is to move from one side to the other

cluck
January 16, 2013, 01:22 PM
I completely bypassed the garbage at the first part of the document (proposed legislation) and went straight to the EO's. What exactly does he REALLY have the power to do? At first, I was relieved. Then I was MAD! $500 million to encourage the federal government to do their *$&#^%* JOB?!?!! Hey BO, how about EO #24. Find out why the ATF gave thousands of firearms to criminals in Mexico!

-v-
January 16, 2013, 01:33 PM
The one I take greatest offense to is "No sale, manufacture or possession of armor piercing bullets" Ok...how do you define AP? Its well known that ANY rifle bullet is armor-piercing versus soft armor. Does that mean that its a round-about ban on any and all rifles?

Likewise, I'd be curious to hear some statistics about how many times honest-to-goodness AP ammo has been used in a crime. My guess is about as often as these dangerous .50 cal rifles that can be used to shoot down an airliner....:rolleyes:

Weakening HIPPA is going to be a tough sell and I also doubt its a positive way to go.

Swing
January 16, 2013, 01:33 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2...mid=tw-nytimes

Last 2 pages of the document.

Thanks for the note. I've read that, but that appears to be a summary and not the full text of the EO.

G21NE
January 16, 2013, 01:35 PM
Hmm, well, maybe the White House site will have the full document. Maybe the one the NY times has is just the preliminary summary, and even that they couldn't release until the Pres started speaking.

Deus Machina
January 16, 2013, 01:39 PM
Saving face. So far, that's just about all.

And setting up the ATF for his plan, without addressing the earlier issues with it. Congress should still be pressing on that one.

Overall, look back at #150 and #163 for my view on that.

ngnrd
January 16, 2013, 01:44 PM
1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.
2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.
4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.
14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.
16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.
17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.
20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.
21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.
22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.
23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.

As you can see... 10 of the 23 EO's are related to mental health; mostly related to data collection. This is a big deal, because it seems like this is the "something" that could be done, that would likely be accepted by the majority of the public.

The problem is, the health care bill, which the President just pushed so hard to pass, includes specific language that expressly prohibits the collection of any data, or the maintaining of any records, regarding the lawful possession, ownership, or use of firearms or ammunition. So... even if he wanted to push for gun restrictions based on mental health (although I'm not exactly confident that even that process wouldn't get abused - "Oh, you want to buy a gun? You must be unstable. Therefore, you are prohibited from buying a gun."), he has hobbled the health care industry in regards to collecting and reporting relevant data. Thus, the ... um... clarifying ... of the new health care law in EO #16, and more specifically, EO #2.

On a slight tangent, it must be frustrating to the President that the one thing that is surely the most politically safe (read: most acceptable to most people) response to gun violence, is something that his flagship legislation doesn't seem to allow him to do.

Here's a snippet from the PPACA:
(1) Wellness and prevention programs.--A wellness and health promotion activity implemented under subsection (a)(1)(D) may not require the disclosure or collection of any information relating to--
(A) the presence or storage of a lawfully-possessed firearm or ammunition in the residence or on the property of an individual; or
(B) the lawful use, possession, or storage of a firearm or ammunition by an individual.

There's other, similar language included as well, but I didn't want to paste the entire section. You can look it up here (http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-111publ148/html/PLAW-111publ148.htm) if you are so inclined. It's a big document. A word search for "gun rights" will get you to the appropriate section quickly.

John_galt
January 16, 2013, 01:49 PM
As a Dr. - I will never ask a pt about there guns except in 2 cases. Suicidal ideation to assess how realistic pts plan is (been doing that for years and will continue). Discussing mutual interest in firearms with a pt (been doing that for years and will continue).

Unfortunately a lot of Drs will. The new healthcare law require huge amounts of data to be collected for the Feds under what they call meaningful use. They haven't been very clear on what they plan to do with it. Some of it may actually be helpful, most of it is politically motivated. Many of the CMS certified office programs include "guns in the home" in a form that is ammenable to data mining. This one isn't new was already in the works, but I haven't seen that it is a reportable data point - yet. The reporting of imminent danger pts is a long well established thing. Nothing new in either of those respects but annoying that doctor-pt relationship is used to push an agenda based on a tradgedy.

This is just as much a privacy issue, cloaked in 2nd Ammendment. Similar to the Healthcare Law - huge violations of privacy based on the perception of a crisis in healthcare.

boatmanschneider
January 16, 2013, 01:53 PM
As a Vet rated with PTSD the mental health issue concerns me. Many vets, including my self were rated with PTSD because there was a 10% rating cap for Traumatic Brain Injury. The doctors said "they symptoms are similar ad this way you get a higher %, it is in your best interest". I contested the decision and even after the TBI rating cap was raised they said there would be no point in changing my rating.

And those I know with PTSD, just don't creep around on their property at night and they won't be a risk to anyone but themselves.

Most people with "Mental Health Issues" are non violent.

But then I don't think non violet felons should be restricted from gun ownership either.

SSN Vet
January 16, 2013, 01:54 PM
Even though he doesn't have the votes in the House now, that doesn't mean that he won't have it in 2014.

It's more than likely that the Democrats will gain back their majority in the House

like back in 2008? :neener:

Any one notice how all of a sudden it seems to be acceptable to dog pile on the Dems and Libs, now that their golden boy had taken his smiley face mask off.

gym
January 16, 2013, 01:54 PM
If this was the worse thing that happens, I will take a deep breath, so far actually nothing that relates to me has changed, as I believe the same is true for my fellow gun owners. It looks like "Obamma Light", to me.
In a week attention will be shifted to the possibility of the Govt defaulting and that should clear the way for an impass in Congress on all this crap.

thepumpfaction
January 16, 2013, 01:55 PM
I don't understand. What's the verdict? Any bans pass?

PRM
January 16, 2013, 01:55 PM
President Barack Obama signed 23 executive actions today with the goal of suppressing gun violence and researching the effects of violent media on young minds. The actions represent a $500 million program to curtail gun violence and include implementing a universal background check for gun buyers, restoring a ban on military-style assault weapons and limiting magazines to 10 rounds, and developing emergency preparedness plans.

http://www.joystiq.com/2013/01/16/obama-signs-executive-orders-to-curtail-research-gun-violence/



With the stroke of a pen. Guess that will be borrowed from China too.

xman1337
January 16, 2013, 01:58 PM
$500 million. Follow the money. It's always about the money. The rest is just a dog and pony show.

40x40
January 16, 2013, 02:04 PM
If this was the worse thing that happens, I will take a deep breath, so far actually nothing that relates to me has changed, as I believe the same is true for my fellow gun owners. It looks like "Obamma Light", to me.
In a week attention will be shifted to the possibility of the Govt defaulting and that should clear the way for an impass in Congress on all this crap.
My sentiments exactly, Now on to the next dog and pony show!

Krispy007
January 16, 2013, 02:05 PM
*subscribed.

The burden falls upon the legal gun owners to push their congress people to make decisions inline with the beliefs of those who they represent.

Let this be our call to action to make our voices heard.

gunsandreligion
January 16, 2013, 02:22 PM
Im beginning to believe that while he gives a free reign to his cronies, the issue of gun control probably isnt a huge priority to our president.

Ignition Override
January 16, 2013, 02:41 PM
gym:
People like you who have the bigger picture in mind will probably be ignored.
Huge numbers of people have believed since the '08 election that one of the President's highest priorities was/is gun control. They did not seem to notice that he needed all the support he could gather for Obamacare.

If gun control had been his ultimate, even secondary objective, he would not have waited for a massacre of children to spend some of his political capital on it.
If years ago, he had enacted measures to seriously reduce the federal deficit, he now might have had more 'political capital' to 'spend' on gun control.

Gun control has recently been partly just a distraction for the publics' demands for a response, and it keeps people from thinking less about our terrible federal debt levels, at least for those who are aware of the dangers. Most young people only care about Facebook, sex, drugs and rock & roll.

HoosierQ
January 16, 2013, 02:44 PM
Im beginning to believe that while he gives a free reign to his cronies, the issue of gun control probably isnt a huge priority to our president.
This is my belief as well frankly.

blarby
January 16, 2013, 03:17 PM
This is my belief as well frankly.

" You are not aloooooooooooooooooooooooone"

Lucifer_Sam
January 16, 2013, 03:59 PM
Im beginning to believe that while he gives a free reign to his cronies, the issue of gun control probably isnt a huge priority to our president.

Thats what I've thought for some time. Whenever he talk about it it seems more like blurbs playing to his base, and I think there are other things hes much more concerned about. Not that getting an AWB passed would bother him or anything, but I don't see him burning much political capital to do it, unless there is major pressure. He seems fairly indifferent to it, overall. I'm sure he'll lend some support for Fienstinens bill, but he wont be using his full weight to get it rammed through, like he did with something like Obamacare. Basically, its not like what would be happening if someone like Hillary Clinton, or that foul Cuomo, were President.

HOOfan_1
January 16, 2013, 09:29 PM
This is my belief as well frankly.

Probably because his only priorities are

1) Use US taxpayer money to go around and play golf
2) Use US taxpayer money to go on vacations
3) Collect a big fat paycheck for the rest of his life, courtesy of the US taxpayers.

Oh I am sure he really would like to see all of us disarmed, he just doesn't want to have to work particularly hard to do it.

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