We lack a Point Man


January 16, 2013, 03:50 PM
From the Pro Gun standpoint, I believe one of our biggest hurdles is we lack a Point Man or Point Person. Who is our torch bearer? Who is going on TV and presenting a comprehensive, cohesive, intelligently and calmly articulated Pro Gun message? I am anxious to see that person emerge with that message.

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January 16, 2013, 03:52 PM
No one. Everyone who gets a pulpit ends up sounding like a radical.

January 16, 2013, 03:56 PM
Check out MrColionNoir on youtube.com.... Man's got my vote. :D

January 16, 2013, 04:01 PM
So far the only people that have really come out and said anything has been Uncle Ted, Alex Jones, and Dave Mustaine... but very few else have been willing to stick their neck out. I think this is simply because they know as I do that any of them that speak out will become "targeted" by the Media as blood thirsty radical right wing nuts, or just turn it around and make them look foolish. (For any of them, talking to any liberal media about guns would be like= :banghead:

Kinda like this: (it's on the sarcastic side of the liberal media anyway.)

January 16, 2013, 04:03 PM
Ricky'll do it.


January 16, 2013, 04:13 PM
We're amateurs and hobbyists

They're pros with a clear "bottom line" in mind.

There's the NRA, GOA, and SAF, among others, who are semi-pro, and mainly reactive. Note I said "mainly," except for SAF, which is, through Gottlieb, pretty pro-active. The NRA is partially crippled by its Board of Directors, whose members range from glossy-wood-and-glossy-blueing Fudds to "The Second Amendment is my pistol permit" types.

Dave Kopel gives a pretty good account of himself, but has never to my knowledge faced one of those anti "interviewers" who usually won't let the interviewee get a lucid word in edgwise.

Aaaaand, aaaand, we're facing a generally anti press (bred and cultivated by "Journalism" schools) whose employers buy ink by the railroad tank car load.

So point men usually get shot down by the ever-present scouts and snipers diffused through the jungle.

Terry, 230RN

January 16, 2013, 04:17 PM
Alan Gura, Alan Gottleib, and Eugene Volokh are my point men.

January 16, 2013, 04:27 PM
That's what happens when the GOP Presidential nominee is a RINO and the true conservatives in the party who could lead either did not run or could not win for various reasons. I think our only hope is people like Ted Cruz and Mark Rubio who can appeal to the huge Latino voting block. I'm not Hispanic, but I am Texan, and in the Border States and FL the Hispanics will soon be a majority. Legal or not. It does not matter. They will all be voting.

And we have the media stacked against us. Decades back when young people were asked why they wanted to be journalists is was because they wanted to report the news w/o bias. Now when you ask young people why they want to be journalists it because they want to make a difference by promoting some agenda based on their worldview. Investigating and reporting the facts objectively are not even taught anymore based on the quality of reporting we have now.

January 16, 2013, 04:39 PM
Mabye we can talk Jeremy Clarkson to come to America and get it going again toe to toe with his rival Piers Morgan that way you got two British guy's going at it instead of P. Morgan attacking Americans! :D

January 16, 2013, 04:44 PM
This guy seems pretty good....


January 16, 2013, 04:46 PM
Just like with this issue, the right really needs to groom someone to be President if we don't want someone to come in next term and further the anti-gun agenda. The right is just too divided for that to happen, though.

In regards to this issue, what is going to get national press coverage is anti-gun sentiment. Pro-gun sentiment will be read by us, and filtered by the press to get out to the masses. Our arguments will be filtered as "crazy" with statistics analyzed with bias that we can't refute until after it hits the press.

We need to be vocal, we need to be heard. We don't need one point man. We need millions of people to say "get your heads out of your rectums and give me my rights back!"

January 16, 2013, 04:50 PM
U.S. Rep. Todd Rokita (R.-IND.), who is my representative and who also happens to be a college classmate of mine, just posted the following on his public Facebook account. Let's hope he remains true to his word.

President Obama’s gun control proposals are a radical overreach by a power-hungry executive branch that is committed to restricting the 2nd Amendment rights of law-abiding Americans, without any concern for either the constitution or how this plan would actually work in the real world.

More laws and regulations will not and cannot stop evil – only strong families and communities can. Instead of focusing on the real reasons for criminal and violent activity, the White House wants to restrict the rights of conscientious, patriotic and responsible gun owners who, quite often, deter violent criminals. I will pursue each and every constitutionally-available means to stop new gun control measures from taking effect and will help lead the conversation in the halls of Congress, where such debates ought to be held, on what should be done to protect our communities and our Constitution.

January 16, 2013, 05:02 PM
This guy seems pretty good....

Good interview... What I would like to know is where the idiot interviewer got his info. about what he calls "Assault" weapons have no place in our society and have never been used in self defense and have only been used to kill people? > huh... I heard that right... right? :barf:

January 16, 2013, 05:09 PM
Tom Selleck......?:rolleyes:

Silent Bob
January 16, 2013, 05:11 PM
Wow, one person to absorb the full brunt and fury and character assassination of the anti-gunners and their compadres in the 24/7 Mainstream Media Propaganda Machine. You would have to made of some stern stuff, Heston was, not sure who would be these days. Nugent, perhaps, but I don't think he is the right man for the job.

January 16, 2013, 05:11 PM
We always lynch and eat out point man. We are as far from unified as is possible.

January 16, 2013, 05:12 PM
I nominate this guy:


January 16, 2013, 05:15 PM
Draft Tom Selleck?

January 16, 2013, 05:22 PM
I think Wayne LaPierre does a good job." Alan Gura, Alan Gottleib, and Eugene Volokh." Who are these people? I've never heard of them!

January 16, 2013, 06:34 PM
Eugene Volokh is a UCLA law professor who has been influential in advancing the individual right interpretation of the Second Amendment. His work was cited by Justice Scalia in the Heller opinion. Volokh and other legal experts blog at The Volokh Conspiracy (http://www.volokh.com/).

Alan Gura is the attorney who argued our side in Heller.

Alan Gottlieb started the Second Amendment Foundation.

Old Dog
January 16, 2013, 06:36 PM
Saw (Lt. Col. [ret]) Oliver North on the NRA News (Sportman's Channel) yesterday. He summed things up rather well.

January 16, 2013, 06:39 PM
Sarah Palin?

January 16, 2013, 07:02 PM
I saw Sarah Palin it the NRA Convention in Charlotte and she would be at the bottom of my list. Not that she was bad but the rest of the speakers were so much better, Gingrich, Beck, Pence, Boltin, Barbour...

Gingrich's speech was like watching a movie of the true history of the US. His words made me proud to be an American. He would get my vote.

January 16, 2013, 07:10 PM
I don't agree with one person, I really think we need a core group that's vocal and getting press time. Sadly conservativism doesn't lend itself well to beating off a coordinated attack from the left. The left knows it which is why they so often win.

Its time for conservatives to get in faces or lose. Love them or hate them, Beck and Limbaugh would sure help in that department.

January 16, 2013, 07:24 PM
Alas, the pro-gun rights community seems to be fractured and niche-oriented, the Second Amendment has been relegated to a "special interest" represented by a "gun lobby" and there is no evidence whatsoever of any Militia doing its job to secure our free state.

January 16, 2013, 07:53 PM
You are all making my point for me. The more well known names like Nugent come with a healthy dose of extremism and abrasiveness. Most of the others you mentioned, Alan Gura, Alan Gottleib and Eugen Volokh, might have the credibility we need but Iíve personally never heard of them or seen them being interviewed on the recent events. While many here may be familiar with them I donít think my lack of recognition of these people is unique.

As for a clear, succinct, well articulated Pro Gun response, I have heard a few sound bites that I liked from various players; Hannity, Tim Griffin, Andrew Napolitano, Selleck when he has spoken on 2A rights in the past, Ollie North on occasion and plenty of the members here. However, since Sandy Hook and since the renewed witch hunt began, no clear message from our side has been articulated in a public forum. Where is our 23 point proposal? Where was our investigative committee? Yes, there is a tremendous media bias but even the mainstream media is cashing in on the ratings aspect of this contrived crisis and would be more than willing to bring someone from our side on air in an attempt to skewer our side. But all I am hearing from our side is Alex Jones losing his temper and this questionable NRA ad referring to the Obama children and their armed guards. This ad is controversial at best and possibly polarizing. I donít see this ad swaying anyone in the middle toward our side.

So lacking this Point Person, it looks like we are going to have to follow Skribsí advice and fight as individuals rather than a united force behind a strong leader with a clear, succinct message that will fit into a tweet, sound bite or headline. Hopefully that will be enough but I have my doubts. The walls of Jericho werenít brought down by an unfocused group of people strolling around out of step and playing dissimilar instruments to random tunes.

The Anti Gun crowd understands this, I don't think our side does.

January 16, 2013, 07:54 PM
Where's Tom?

January 16, 2013, 08:28 PM
IMO an approach from multi angles is best. 'Pointmen' are too easily targeted by media pushing an agenda. Also, different people will appeal to different audiences.

Each supporter of the 2A should take the time & effort to educate themselves on our history, the US Constitution, the Bill of Rights, and the nature of our Constitutional Republic (and the dangers that the American founders saw with democracies). Afterall, how can you defend what you don't really know ? IMO this foundation should be common among all of us, and a theme that is repeated.

And get out there face-to-face with people. Share what you know about these issues. Take new people out to do some shooting. Encourage some of the new gunowners that were part of the record number of background checks for guns sales. Work locally, county, and statewide.

Stop looking for a leader to tell you what to do. As fighter pilot John Boyd taught, coming at em from many different angles with different approaches works best.

January 16, 2013, 09:20 PM
This guy seems pretty good....


Follow the other thread on this: Turns out Keith is an active member here. I did not know that when I saw the video the first time, but i can't say I'm surprised. delighted, perhaps, but not surprised.


January 16, 2013, 11:06 PM
I've seen that video with Keith before. He does a great job. He's working to spread the word in his state and its getting out further. Many others are doing the same. We can use what they are doing in videos to inform the people we personally know. Thats what it'll take to win this.

January 17, 2013, 07:32 AM
I was giving thought to a group of point men/women who are perhaps wounded X military. Army, Navy, Marines, etc.

If Obama can dig out the children how about taking the obviously wounded warriors who belong to the NRA ,and perhaps are involved in the shooting sports, as spokespersons. (We are the NRA)

As a group they could present the fact that civilian AR's are not Military grade M16's (assualt rifles) , they could talk about how they are not trusted by the politicians who run the country they fought for . The countrry they gave so much to protect our freedoms and our constitution . Including the 2nd amendment.

A lot harder for the media to critisize our disabled war vets for their stance on the issues of gun control.

January 17, 2013, 07:43 AM
Paging John Connor, John Connor to the white courtesy phone...

1911 guy
January 17, 2013, 07:50 AM
We are discussing a point man, while we are one of the few associations that regularly eat our own young. Whenever someone steps up with a message that gets traction, they are either chastized for compromising or crucified by the left leaning among us for being too radical and unwilling to throw a group of us under the bus in the name of compromise.

And I'd elect Mr. Connor to any position he wanted. He'd also offer to beat some sense into you if you suggested compromise.

Loc n Load
January 17, 2013, 10:19 AM
It is true that we do not have one central figure to lead, but that has always been the case in this struggle. Having been active in this issue since the 60's when the anti's wanted to ban "Saturday night specials"...which was any revolver with a bl lgnth less than 6". It may be better that we do not have one person In charge.....as they would be targeted mercilessly and demonized. IMO it is much better that we have a myriad of voices who support our cause....I understand your intent of someone to unite us, but we are already united in that we have a cause.....WE are the "point men"....we are the ones who flood our legislators with communications, and we are the ones who hire and fire them. THis gun issue is "radio active" to politicians....the Dem's remember 94 all too well....they lost the house, senate and WH in 94 due to their push on the AWB....Bill Clinton even admitted that....the " foot soldiers" wins this battle....it is great to see support in the media....Lou Dobbs has been the most objective host I have watched so far. Support the pro gun groups with your money, and regularly contact ur legislators with short, concise ( rational) inputs.

January 17, 2013, 10:51 AM
I've been leaning on Adam Baldwin and Dana Loesch lately.

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