This shortage is caused by two things, hoarders and profit seekers.


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bugsbunny45
January 20, 2013, 01:48 PM
The shortage we are having in reloading supplies seems to be caused by well three things.
1) Fear of the unknown .
2)hoarders
3)profit seekers.

Lets be honest there are people buying stuff at regular prices causing the short supply then reselling to others at a huge profit because of the short supply. Primers are all over the place on gun broker just at crazy prices that people seem to want to pay.

Do you agree or disagree on my thinking.

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Fire_Moose
January 20, 2013, 01:54 PM
I think there is also some inbetweeners.

The ones who were going to restock after the holidays.
And the ones who buy small quantities (I'm sure they're out there).

I have yet to check out any of the stores around me since the panic started. I should be set til late March....hopefully ill be able to get my fair share then.

useless signiture

d-dogg
January 20, 2013, 02:02 PM
Bugs, what about the supposed 1.2 billion round government order thing we've heard lately?

I have to admit, though I am normally a 20-100 round per weapon purchaser (ok, 500 in the case of .22 LR), I have been buying a bit more than I need because of the spotty supplies.

For example, I was down to about 30 rounds of .38 Spl, and had been looking for a month with no luck. Gander Mountain have 250 rounds boxes of .38 target ammo the other day, with a discount on 3 boxes. I bought 3 as I don't know when I will see "normal" supplies back in stock.

That is more than a couple years supply of .38 for me, so I guess the frenzy has pushed me to hoarding a bit.

The upside if any, is I am shooting my cannons a bit more. Seriously, why not? If 9mm is going to cost nearly what .454 Casull does, I may as well enjoy the .454, right?

Fire_Moose
January 20, 2013, 02:11 PM
Bugs, what about the supposed 1.2 billion round government order thing we've heard lately?
?

Ha I was thinking about this the other day. Interestingly enough, I keep hearing about how everything but. .40 has been clears from shelves.


useless signiture

Cosmoline
January 20, 2013, 02:14 PM
It's hard to make any scientifically reliable observations, but based on what I've seen the established gun nuts like myself are not the ones doing the mass hoarding. Most of us balk at the prices. And most of us ALREADY have good back stocks. The ones rushing to buy are people who DID NOT buy back when the prices were low. And they don't have as sophisticated an awareness of the political situation.

As far as profit seekers, they exist BECAUSE of the shortages. They didn't cause the shortages. Demand has outstripped supply many times over, so prices go up. That's the way it works. That doesn't excuse panic mongering and price gouging, but any claim that the profit seekers caused the shortage misunderstands basic economics.

there are people buying stuff at regular prices causing the short suppl

I've seen nothing to support that theory. First of all "regular prices" are gone now, so there's no way to "buy at regular prices" and resell for a profit. Second if you did think ahead as many of us did and stockpile some basic arms and ammo, you're unlikely to sell off now. There are some who are, and because of the market forces they can charge higher prices. But again that's not causing the prices that's a reaction to the prices. Most of us are just going to wait it out until the supply chain catches up. If all of us were trying to sell off, that would bring prices back down again.

bugsbunny45
January 20, 2013, 02:20 PM
A lot of the buying is from 1st time people. They just wanna buy because they think in the future they won't be able to. I just never saw the shortage in reloading supplies. They are back ordered on dies, presses and reloading kits.
It's like the govt said no more reloading.

Cosmoline
January 20, 2013, 02:22 PM
The reloading supply crunch is a backflow from the main shortages. The shortages cause people to think "time to start reloading" and since the supply of reloading equipment is always pretty minimal it doesn't take much backflow of demand to clean out those shelves either. Thankfully Alaska went through a component shortage a few years ago where primers could not be found anywhere, and ever since I've kept thousands in back stock.

Personally I'm taking a holiday from the modern stuff and concentrating on black powder stuff. Good deals can still be found there for now, though I wouldn't be surprised to see demand go up. People don't want to waste centerfire ammo so there may well be a tendency to dust off the old ML'rs.

Some economist should do an analysis of how the gun market has reacted and shifted in the past months.

Texan Scott
January 20, 2013, 02:32 PM
Dontcha hate it when they give away the punchline in the title?

Yes. Well said, and evident. Fear and greed, two of humanity's great failings.
I understand both, but I'm more inclined to be understanding of fear.

sota
January 20, 2013, 02:37 PM
let's be fair.

if I'd had a clue STHF was going to happen in December, I would have bought substantially more cases of ammo, even at slightly above my normal price. some i would have kept some I would have sold at profit. it's just commodities trading. you can't rail against it without railing against then entire concept of commodities markets in general.

918v
January 20, 2013, 02:48 PM
I am disgusted by---deleted--- some of the posters in this thread.

fguffey
January 20, 2013, 02:56 PM
Then there are the doers and the talkers, walking down the street in Yonkers, NY I walked into a business that dealt in junk dissemination, I purchased 23,000 cases, all once fired by the pound, at about the same time I had the opportunity to purchase lead from an X-ray room, then came the opportunity to purchase lead sheets from plumbing complete with wax flux from beneath toilets, as luck would have it they had 50/50 tin/lead bars. Moving ahead, Pat’s reloading in Ohio had pull down LC and LC Match 30/06 cases, .08 cents each, I did not wait until Pat ran out, I am a case former, I need unfired/new cases, I purchased 30/06 cases from Pat, then there was an accident, I was asked if I was interested, rather than argue with the public they made me a deal on all of the reloading.

I set up at the last Dallas Market Hall Gun Show, I did not sell to dealers, dealing with dealers reminds me of the show ‘PAWN STARS’, their problem is not my problem.

F. Guffey

OptimusPrime
January 20, 2013, 03:00 PM
Question: are the ranges seeing an increase in number of shooters? We know all the ammo is going fast no matter the price; and I think the debit side of the equation is whether the firing lines are seeing more customers. I imagine not, therefore everybody's hoarding against future unavailability.
I'm stating the obvious but hoarding begins with survival then becomes profit-based when fears go away.

beatledog7
January 20, 2013, 03:07 PM
So many hoarder/gouger threads! They all pretty much translate to:

"I don't have enough ammo or components or the the right gun because I didn't see this coming and didn't prepare and now someone else has more than his fair share and he won't sell it at the price I want to pay." (sniff, sniff)

How familiar does that sound?

saltydog452
January 20, 2013, 03:26 PM
Is there a 'whine' smilie? Where is my hankie?

salty

hueyville
January 20, 2013, 03:32 PM
Beetledog, you hit the nail on the head. My rule is at current rate of consumption is to have 5 to 7 years of components stockpiled. I am even sitting on almost 1,000 pounds of wheel weights in case lead prices shoot up the way the scrap metal market has been surging. Primers are the most important part of the deal. If you didn't already have enough shame on you. Seems like two new whiner "where is x" threads a day. I could make a killing right now. If I did and a shortage really did happen, I would be the dumb one. Pulled a fresh 1,000 small rifle primers out of old stock last night marked 13.99. Be quite a while till I get to the ones marked in the 20 buck range but those are there too. I am selling some of the stockpile of cheesy Combloc guns and accessories had stockpiled for this day. Sold three SKS with ammo for 1,800 bucks. Had 90 bucks each in them. That is some return on the dollar.

GLOOB
January 20, 2013, 03:36 PM
It's no one's fault. Shortages just happen.

Here's a perfect example.

"Hoarder" has a couple thousand bullets. He has just enough powder to load 2k rounds. But he has only 1k primers. He only shoots 60 rds a month, so he has enough to last him over a year.

He notices that the shelves are bare at all the stores. But he does run across 1k of primers. So he buys it, knowing he will need it at some point. Even though he doesn't need it now. It woudln't have even been on his list if it weren't for the current shortage. So now, he's adding to the shortage when he was already stocked. But can you blame him?

To make matters worse, a lot of people buy reloading components with a hazmat. So people really start to tack on things they really don't need... but will use, someday.

788Ham
January 20, 2013, 03:38 PM
I didn't get caught with my pants down the last time, I wasn't shooting or reloading as much then. I had gotten some primers, powder ahead since then though, just didn't realize the situation would would steam roll like this go-round. I've learned this time around, when I see "any" powder I use, its going to be bought, same with primers or bullets, no matter cost. I'm not going to use the house payment to buy powder, but a couple lbs. here and there when its available.

BullfrogKen
January 20, 2013, 03:59 PM
The shortage is a result of demand outpacing supply.


That's all.

There's no need to try to find ways to assign blame people for buying up the components.

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