Questions raised by New York's New Magazine Restrictions


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bushmaster1313
January 21, 2013, 01:17 AM
How bad must it get before someone is justified in loading that extra round?

Will the jury be asked if it was a "Righteous Load"?

Can a defendant charged with defending his family with 8 rounds in a 10 round magazine be permitted to ask the jury for "Magazine Nullification?"

Will there be a "Magazine Doctrine" akin to the "Castle Doctrine"?

Will "Load Your Magazine" be harder or easier to prove than "Stand Your Ground"?

How long will it take till the courts work out the elements of a "Justifiable Loading"?

If you have 7 rounds in a 10 round magazine and are attacked by 8 bad guys, do you have to shoot one of them first before you can put another round in the magazine?

If a resident in his home mistakenly miscounts and loads an eighth round under the stress caused when confronted by an intruder, will there be a "Duty to Unload"?

Is having more than 7 rounds in a magazine a strict liability offense, or will defendants who did poorly in math be able to plead "Diminished Capacity"?

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BHP FAN
January 21, 2013, 01:26 AM
http://westernrifleshooters.wordpress.com/2013/01/20/bracken-seven-and-thirty/

JohnsXDM
January 21, 2013, 02:39 AM
What about 7 in the mag and 1 in the pipe? Does that make it 8?

buckeye8
January 21, 2013, 02:52 AM
Let this be a lesson for those of you who think they're only after 100, 30 or 10 round magazines. They're playing the long-game.

joeschmoe
January 21, 2013, 03:03 AM
Breaking news;


New York and New Jersey have voted to return to mother England as colonies and apologize for the revolution.
They look forward to bowing in submission to the queen and pray for her protection.

Walkalong
January 21, 2013, 08:34 AM
You follow the law or risk prosecution.

CDW4ME
January 21, 2013, 09:28 AM
Law abiding will follow that absurd law.
Criminals, they are going to follow that law to avoid a fine? :rolleyes:

Bank robber #1: You ready to rob this bank?
Bank robber #2: Yea, got my 7 round magazine.
Bank robber #1: Crap! Mine is a illegal "high capacity" 10 rounder. We gonna have to wait till I get a legal "clip". :p

:rolleyes:

MikeJackmin
January 21, 2013, 10:27 AM
> You follow the law or risk prosecution.

Yep.

The law says that you can have seven in the mag and one in the chamber. Carry another mag or two if you want. Help change the law by supporting the various legal challenges already working their way through the courts.

tarakian
January 21, 2013, 11:33 AM
If you end up in a firefight, just make sure the number of holes in the intruder(s) is less than or equal to the number of empty mags at your feet times 7 plus the one in the pipe. Expressed mathematically:

H<=(Mx7)+1

Unless the firefight happens at an incorporated range or NRA sanctioned competition, then the formula is:

H<=(Mx10)+1

goldie
January 21, 2013, 12:13 PM
Heres an interesting point; if you load 10, & used the whole mag on 2 intruders, you now have an empty mag;when police arrive, there is no ammo in the mag;law says if your COUGHT with more than 7 IN the mag :confused:

mvorbrodt
January 21, 2013, 12:26 PM
Goldie,
perhaps this is another unintended consequence: a person defending him/her self will "unload" the extra ammo into the offender, to avoid prosecution, possibly causing more deaths ;-)

jard
January 21, 2013, 12:28 PM
Right - you had a few loose rounds in your pocket. You re-loaded the mag :neener:

goldie
January 21, 2013, 12:33 PM
Dont we all wish this was just a bad dream that we can wake up from ?:banghead:

Upstater
January 21, 2013, 12:37 PM
^^^ you hit nail on thead with that one!

rugmar
January 21, 2013, 12:44 PM
Just put all shots through the same hole. Makes it hard for someone to count.

ScottieG59
January 21, 2013, 01:16 PM
The law passed in a desperate rush is a creation of Gov. Cuomo to help build his liberal credentials for a run at the presidency. The 7 round figure was created by Cuomo himself, as stated in the NY state assembly. :thumbdown:

It is purely political theater rushed though in the evening to avoid discussion and debate. :banghead:

In fact, NY supposedly forgot to exempt law enforcement in the original signed bill. This might be a lie told after police complained loudly. After all, NY police used 6 shot revolvers for many years. :confused:

Also, the bill gave criminals 60 days before gun violence faced stiffer charges, presumably for currently planned crimes to be completed first. :eek:

ScottieG59
January 21, 2013, 01:29 PM
> You follow the law or risk prosecution.

Yep.

The law says that you can have seven in the mag and one in the chamber. Carry another mag or two if you want. Help change the law by supporting the various legal challenges already working their way through the courts.

I thought the law only allowed one 7 round spare magazine.

bushmaster1313
January 21, 2013, 01:40 PM
If a person has a pre ban magazine that looks like it holds only 10 rounds but the owner wants to be sure that an 11th round cannot be crammed in, can he first load it with 10 rounds to see if an 11th will fit, or must he drive over the state line to check, thereby increasing his greenhouse gas emissions and destroying the planet.

Captain33036
January 21, 2013, 01:57 PM
Not to detract from how pathetic this new law is, however, I am surprised that the discussion is not going in the direction of NYkers all switching to .45acp from any lower caliber gun they might have.

Mousegun
January 21, 2013, 02:10 PM
In fact, NY supposedly forgot to exempt law enforcement in the original signed bill. This might be a lie told after police complained loudly. After all, NY police used 6 shot revolvers for many years.

Just shows to go ya how little these clowns know about firearms and how fast they are to pass legislation without thinking of the unintended.

BHP FAN
January 21, 2013, 02:45 PM
people that don't know a damn thing about guns should not be allowed to write laws about them it's like having a waitress, or a bank manager write our building codes.

browneu
January 21, 2013, 02:48 PM
people that don't know a damn thing about guns should not be allowed to write laws about them it's like having a waitress, or a bank manager write our building codes.

Excellent point.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

jerkface11
January 21, 2013, 02:55 PM
people that don't know a damn thing about guns should not be allowed to write laws about them it's like having a waitress, or a bank manager write our building codes.

These same people want doctors to give gun safety advice.

G.barnes
January 21, 2013, 03:43 PM
just keep an extra empty mag on you. after you shoot him just throw the empty on the ground and claim you reloaded.

BHP FAN
January 21, 2013, 03:51 PM
I prefer seven round Mecgar magazines in my RIA G.I. .45. I sure don't think I should be able to limit 9mm Glock users to seven rounds. Diversity is beautiful. So is freedom of choice.

joe_security
January 21, 2013, 04:33 PM
My fear is that the citizens of NY state may switch to long guns with excess penetration when they feel undergunned with 7 round pistols. Examples may include something like a 30-30 lever gun or slug loaded shotgun. The good news is that theres no limit on the number of 7 round mags that NY state residents may own.

jerkface11
January 21, 2013, 04:37 PM
^^ yet

joeschmoe
January 21, 2013, 04:42 PM
I believe this law will be struck down, but NY'ers still need to take control of your government and restore your rights.
You should be discussing how to reverse this law, not comply with it.

MikeJackmin
January 21, 2013, 05:14 PM
Here's a quote from the Wiki page for NY State:

"New York City and its eight suburban counties (excluding those in New Jersey, Connecticut, and Pennsylvania) have a combined population of 13,209,006 people, or 68.42% of the state's population."

Yeah, we'll just rush right out and vote all the democrats out of office.

goon
January 21, 2013, 05:17 PM
Looks like the market for semi-auto belt fed rifles will increase in NY.

joe_security
January 21, 2013, 05:19 PM
I would love to see this draconian measure reversed by the courts. Until that occurs, see post #6.

alana
January 21, 2013, 05:46 PM
So when El Presidente visits NY, does that mean his guards have to downgrade or get popped for illegal carry? Just wondering how that's going to play out...

larryh1108
January 21, 2013, 05:53 PM
I believe you can't have more than 7 rounds in the mag when they see it. So, if you have 10 in the mag, make sure you shoot a minimum of 3 rounds to get to the 7. I don't believe that the spent rounds count as being in the mag at the time of confiscation. 7 is 7. You can always claim you reloaded the extra 3 in case of more trouble if it comes up.

joeschmoe
January 21, 2013, 06:11 PM
Here's a quote from the Wiki page for NY State:

"New York City and its eight suburban counties (excluding those in New Jersey, Connecticut, and Pennsylvania) have a combined population of 13,209,006 people, or 68.42% of the state's population."

Yeah, we'll just rush right out and vote all the democrats out of office.
It was a republican controlled legislature with overwhelming bipartisan support. This isn't a repub/dem thing. It's pro/anti 2nd Amendment.

NYC is not all anti gun either (The oldest gun store in American is in Manhattan). You must work to take back your state, including NYC.

We can help, but you must do the heavy liffting. It's your state, it's your rights.

joeschmoe
January 21, 2013, 06:13 PM
I believe you can't have more than 7 rounds in the mag when they see it. So, if you have 10 in the mag, make sure you shoot a minimum of 3 rounds to get to the 7. I don't believe that the spent rounds count as being in the mag at the time of confiscation. 7 is 7. You can always claim you reloaded the extra 3 in case of more trouble if it comes up.
Wait... what?

http://reason.com/assets/mc/mwelch/2010_08/Daffy_Screwball.gif

clutch
January 21, 2013, 06:23 PM
My fear is that the citizens of NY state may switch to long guns with excess penetration when they feel undergunned with 7 round pistols. Examples may include something like a 30-30 lever gun or slug loaded shotgun. The good news is that theres no limit on the number of 7 round mags that NY state residents may own.

Speaking of rifles, if your rifle can employ stripper clips, do you have to keep the round count at 7 even though it is a 10 round stripper?

I wonder how you modify a Garand enblock clip to only hold 7?

larryh1108
January 21, 2013, 06:38 PM
Does anyone honestly believe that anybody will load only 7 rounds in a 10 round mag for home defense? If you live in NYS, are you going to only put 7 rounds in your 10 round mag? Seriously? Is the magazine round counting police coming to check up and make sure there is compliance? Didn't Biden say they didn't have the resources to prosecute people who lied on form 4473 so you think they will enforce this absurd law? The only time I see it coming into play is if you carry and/or if you have to call the police to your residence for a shooting or break in. Other than that it will be on the honor system. Also, it's only a misdemeanor so no loss of rights are involved if caught with 8 rounds in your mag. It is about as silly of a law as I've ever seen passed in modern times. Make sure you have your Big Gulp next to your mag if you have to call the police. Maybe the Big Gulp will make them forget about the mag. LoL, what a bunch of idiot politicians. I feel so sorry for the citizens of NY.

Captain33036
January 21, 2013, 06:40 PM
Sorry for the dumb question, but does the law extend to built in capacity, such that a .357 mag lever that could hold 9/10 round would be illegal??

joe_security
January 21, 2013, 08:24 PM
I have not have read this NY law but I thought it applied to detachable magazines only.

friscolatchi
January 21, 2013, 08:45 PM
Detatchables only. Pre bans ok but have to be permanently neutered for 10 rounds, sold out of state or destroyed. Current 10 rounders ok but have to be loaded with 7. I am not sure if new mags sold will have to be 7rounds only. This info form NYSP firearms specialist, Troop F , Middletown NY.

Upstater
January 21, 2013, 08:57 PM
The way I read the law is after April 2013 only 7 round magazines will be allowed, and to the question of internal mags - they cannot hold more than 10 except a .22 rimfire with a tubular magazine, lever guns as far as I can tell are not affected as well as bolt guns. THIS WEEK!:banghead:

birddog
January 21, 2013, 09:13 PM
You're an embarrassment to the nation.

No, we're not. We voted correctly. We protested correctly.

We were outnumbered. Read the numbers in the above posts.

Wait until the national version of this law hits you. Will YOU be an embarrassment to the nation -- because it can happen to you, too.

NY bashing is getting out of hand. It's insulting to me, my friends, and my family.

bushmaster1313
January 21, 2013, 09:41 PM
NY bashing is getting out of hand. It's insulting to me, my friends, and my family.

I used to envy New York State.
No permit to purchase and many upstate counties allowed concealed carry.

Now New York State is almost as bad as New York City.

goldie
January 21, 2013, 09:42 PM
Hey, in a worst case scenerio, you shoot an intruder in your home,& its discovered there were 10 rds in your mag,to me its worth the 200.00 fine to save your life.

joeschmoe
January 21, 2013, 09:58 PM
No, we're not. We voted correctly. We protested correctly.

We were outnumbered. Read the numbers in the above posts.

Wait until the national version of this law hits you. Will YOU be an embarrassment to the nation -- because it can happen to you, too.

NY bashing is getting out of hand. It's insulting to me, my friends, and my family.
Yes you are. NYer's should be ashamed. This is your government.
The state senate is not based on population but districts. A republican controlled state state overwhelming voted for this. They could have stopped it, but didn't.
Your government overwhelming voted for this. I'm sick of hearing these excuses.

Vote these traitors out or live in shame.

If it happens federally, then we should all be ashamed and work to get rid of the traitors, not look for excuses and blame the cities while we keep voting for gun grabbers.

Stop voting for gun grabbers.

joe_security
January 21, 2013, 11:42 PM
I guess the NY reload is the way to go until rights can be restored by court action. Have the BUG at the ready in case of multiple home invaders, etc.

meanmrmustard
January 22, 2013, 12:11 AM
Yes you are. NYer's should be ashamed. This is your government.
The state senate is not based on population but districts. A republican controlled state state overwhelming voted for this. They could have stopped it, but didn't.
Your government overwhelming voted for this. I'm sick of hearing these excuses.

Vote these traitors out or live in shame.

If it happens federally, then we should all be ashamed and work to get rid of the traitors, not look for excuses and blame the cities while we keep voting for gun grabbers.

Stop voting for gun grabbers.
I sure didn't, and yet one still, what sits on his throne, in D.C.? A blasphemer clown with a pointy crown that promised upholding the Constitution, that which he looks to pick apart at his leisure.

joeschmoe
January 22, 2013, 01:39 AM
Blasphemer?

jerkface11
January 23, 2013, 01:00 AM
Lying with your hand on a stack of bibles is frowned upon.

toivo
January 23, 2013, 02:45 AM
Sorry for the dumb question, but does the law extend to built in capacity, such that a .357 mag lever that could hold 9/10 round would be illegal??
Sad to say yes, it would.

There are two separate issues: assault weapon, which means semi-auto with detachable mag and one "bad feature," and large capacity ammunition feeding device, which means ANY magazine that holds more than seven, even if not detachable. There's an exemption for .22 LR, but all other tube magazines over 7 capacity are kaput. You can keep the ones you own, but no in-state transfer or sale, and no buying new ones.

Nobody has figured out if it applies to 8-round revolvers: is a cylinder a "feeding device"?

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