Priming woes


PDA






Walkalong
January 27, 2013, 05:23 PM
I found these at the range today. No wonder they left them behind. They should have put them in the steel pipe for such things, but they just left them laying on the ground. I picked up three or four hundred brass as well. A good day for brass around here.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=178532&stc=1&d=1359321797
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=178533&stc=1&d=1359321797

If you enjoyed reading about "Priming woes" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Mike 27
January 27, 2013, 05:28 PM
All I can say is WOW.....

tightgroup tiger
January 27, 2013, 05:33 PM
someone needs to clean up their act, or their press. Good score on the other brass.

billybob44
January 27, 2013, 05:38 PM
Take them apart + reload..Bill

beatledog7
January 27, 2013, 06:00 PM
I'd leave those intact for teaching purposes.

JimKirk
January 27, 2013, 06:41 PM
Is that one of them new Biden primers on the left?

I had a Federal shotshell that looked like that right one ... cost me a shot in the dove field ... lost it somehow during a move...

What really scares me is ... you may be standing right besides one of "them" reloaders at the range !!!

BUT ...he was cranking out a thousand an hour !!!

SlamFire1
January 27, 2013, 07:37 PM
Must have been loaded on a progressive. Crushing primers is very dangerous as a primer may go off. The gentleman who posted this picture said he was seating Federal primers in a Hornady LNL and he forced one:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/SlamFire/Reloading/FederalPrimersHornadyLNLtubeexplosi.jpg

I am aware, but I don't have the pictures, of a Dillion 1000 that was totally frag'd when the reloader tried to seat a large pistol primer in small primer 45 ACP brass. People who described the picture told me the press was totally destoryed and they were surprised the reloader was not injured/killed.

leadchucker
January 27, 2013, 07:39 PM
I bet that guy regularly pops primers when loading.

bds
January 27, 2013, 07:47 PM
Wow, you mean not all reloaders do the Quality Control check by loading the finished rounds into ammo trays and visually inspect/run finger tip over the primers for high primers/proper seating depth? :eek::D

floydster
January 27, 2013, 07:56 PM
Amazing!!!

Smokeyloads

BYJO4
January 27, 2013, 09:42 PM
Some people should not be allowed to reload for their own safety.

blarby
January 27, 2013, 09:50 PM
And this weeks demonstration on "Amateur Hour" is courtesy of.....

Nalgi
January 27, 2013, 10:00 PM
You mean thats not how they are supposed to look? Oh Man, Im in trouble...

:banghead:

Fire_Moose
January 27, 2013, 10:09 PM
The one on the left is just Backwards. Woot free primer!

Sent from my CZ85 Combat

Bush Pilot
January 27, 2013, 10:37 PM
Must have been loaded on a progressive. Crushing primers is very dangerous as a primer may go off. The gentleman who posted this picture said he was seating Federal primers in a Hornady LNL and he forced one:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/SlamFire/Reloading/FederalPrimersHornadyLNLtubeexplosi.jpg

I am aware, but I don't have the pictures, of a Dillion 1000 that was totally frag'd when the reloader tried to seat a large pistol primer in small primer 45 ACP brass. People who described the picture told me the press was totally destoryed and they were surprised the reloader was not injured/killed.
There's no way someone trying to seat a large primer in a small primer pocket would destroy a Dillon press. What's a Dillon 1000 anyway? Maybe thinking of a 1050?

targetshooter22
January 27, 2013, 10:43 PM
I had a progressive that would do that to primers from time to time. I think the primer tray needed a lot of futzing to keep everything fitting together well. Ended up selling it for cheap to someone more willing to do the futzing necessary to run the darned thing. :cuss::banghead:

SlamFire1
January 27, 2013, 11:01 PM
There's no way someone trying to seat a large primer in a small primer pocket would destroy a Dillon press. What's a Dillon 1000 anyway? Maybe thinking of a 1050?

Probably a 1050.

Hey, I wish I had the pictures, the people who told me about it had deleted them. But I am not going to downplay the explosive power that a stack of primers will give when they go off.

gspn
January 27, 2013, 11:10 PM
That's funny...thanks for posting. I especially like the one on the left with the primer installed the wrong way...it reminds me of seeing a car going down the road with the gas pump handle hanging out of it.

Ole'Joe
January 28, 2013, 12:56 AM
Get used to it! Since the rush on guns / ammo, more and more are going to "reload".
~Not a Clue, but, they'll do it anyway, and I mean ANYWAY, and then~~ all the anti's will want to out-law re-loading too!

izhevsk
January 28, 2013, 01:27 AM
I second that wow - both those cartridges and that tube lodged in the ceiling are pretty frightening. I think I'll stick to my single stage press and hand priming tool.

Trent
January 28, 2013, 01:41 AM
Heh nice pics Walkalong.

Every once in awhile (3 out of 1000 in the last batch), I get a primer that "flips" in the tube in my Dillon and goes in upside down. Don't even notice anything's different or wrong until I go to pack the ammo in to boxes.

I've also had primers flip sideways in the RCBS hand primer before, if I'm not paying attention they've gone in that way. It always gets my attention when it happens; feels totally different. I've had to crush them in sideways enough to be able to get the brass off the shellholder before. On the rare occasion that happens I take the tray off and point it AWAY from me! :)

ArchAngelCD
January 28, 2013, 01:44 AM
That is one person I would not want to be near when they shoot. That is a dangerous reloader! don't get me wrong, everyone makes mistakes but those rounds should never have made it to the range. It makes you wonder what other mistakes were made and not discovered until the trigger was pulled!

savanahsdad
January 28, 2013, 01:56 AM
Get used to it! Since the rush on guns / ammo, more and more are going to "reload".
~Not a Clue, but, they'll do it anyway, and I mean ANYWAY, and then~~ all the anti's will want to out-law re-loading too!
yep, and in 9 months or so there will be a ton of stuff for us on E-bay , like in 2009,

I use to get a few primers like that before I built a new bench and bolted it to the wall ,no more wiggle, no more fliping primers

sellersm
January 28, 2013, 02:13 AM
Probably loaded on a Lee LM or 1K. :D :)

savanahsdad
January 28, 2013, 02:21 AM
Probably loaded on a Lee LM or 1K. :D :)
or a dillon ,, read post #21

16in50calNavalRifle
January 28, 2013, 02:28 AM
Silly question - but how do you salvage/de-prime a primer inserted upside-down like that? I've had no problem carefully pushing out a few unfired primers (FTFs, or other situations, I forget), just a very slow version of the normal de-capping (Lee turret, always have eye protection when primers are present).

But it is more interesting than I would care for to push out a live reversed primer with the de-capping pin. How does one do it?

izhevsk
January 28, 2013, 02:56 AM
If I loaded a flipped primer, I'd probably just toss it - brass and primers for a single round are relatively inexpensive. I've read you could possibly deactivate the primer (WD40?) and save the case, but I've never done it personally.

bds
January 28, 2013, 02:57 AM
Get used to it! Since the rush on guns / ammo, more and more are going to "reload". ~Not a Clue, but, they'll do it anyway
We'll probably see more "Funny thing happened at the range today" threads ... :D

FROGO207
January 28, 2013, 08:16 AM
I am thinking that those were loaded on a press mounted priming system as my Lee hand press would not allow the brass to be removed until the primer is just about flush. It is sad that some of those that are most likely just learning to reload are not cautious and observant when working with something that could harm them so badly. My bet is that reloader is going to say that reloading does not work and go into a story of how they ruined a (whatever 45) trying it.:D Are you going to take apart the ammo and see if the charges are near to correct if you can ID the propellent as well?

hueyville
January 28, 2013, 09:22 AM
Once the ammo shortage levels out and all these guys realize reloading isn't instant and easy, they will be putting all their equipment on eBay or in a box. Helps the industry, then folks like us will score some deals on the flip side. It's how I have at least six or seven rock chuckers. People buy an RCBS combo kit, go to the range and 30% of their ammo either doesn't fit in the chamber or fire and they quit. Reloading gets a bad rap from them like it is the process that's wrong and natural selection keeps the buffoons out of the hobby.

leadchucker
January 28, 2013, 10:10 AM
Depriming procedure:
Notify everyone within earshot that there may be fireworks.
Put on full face shield.
Put on hearing protection.
Use your depriming tool of choice, have at it, and d@#n the torpedoes.

I can't sleep at night if I know that there are live primers in any trash or scrap piles. If the cases are not salvageable, I take them outside, grip them with pliers, and cook them off with a propane torch. (wearing appropriate protection of course.)

targetshooter22
January 28, 2013, 10:18 AM
HHHmmmmm I've deprimed live cartridges before. This has worked well: put on eye protection, pull bullet using kinetic puller or bullet puller collet (as the case may be), dump powder from brass or kinetic puller, use sizing/depriming die to punch out primer. Go slow, but even if a single primer only goes off, there's not that much energy in them.

Walkalong
January 28, 2013, 10:33 AM
I've also had primers flip sideways in the RCBS hand primer before,Since getting some age on it, my RCBS will occasionally flip a small primer sideways, but it is very hard to "seat", which you must do to get the case out. I simply tap it out with a small hammer and decapping pin (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=173010&d=1349568075) and re-prime. No way one can miss it happening if one is paying any kind of attention, at least with a hand primer anyway. I suspect there is a feel difference on most progressives as well.

The upside down one. Just decap as usual. Looks like a Federal, but who knows.

The lesson is to pay attention to what one is doing. The first rule of reloading is no distractions and 100% concentration on the task at hand.

Yes, I hand prime while half watching TV sometimes, so sue me. ;)

Anything else is alone and attentive, or in teaching mode with one other person. :)

NeuseRvrRat
January 28, 2013, 10:45 AM
if you're using one of the hand primers that uses regular shellholders (like the RCBS round tray version) then you can remove the case and shellholder from the tool together, place it in your press with a decapping die, and push out the smooshed primer. however, i haven't had this happen with my RCBS hand primer.

donkee
January 28, 2013, 11:05 AM
It is for this reason, and a few more, that I load everything on a single stage using the batch technique.

I haven't had a bogus round since I started about 8 years ago.

higgite
January 28, 2013, 11:09 AM
Quality control??!! We don't need no steenkin' quality control!

Trent
January 28, 2013, 11:11 AM
Since getting some age on it, my RCBS will occasionally flip a small primer sideways, but it is very hard to "seat", which you must do to get the case out. I simply tap it out with a small hammer and decapping pin (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=173010&d=1349568075) and re-prime. No way one can miss it happening if one is paying any kind of attention, at least with a hand primer anyway. I suspect there is a feel difference on most progressives as well.

The upside down one. Just decap as usual. Looks like a Federal, but who knows.

The lesson is to pay attention to what one is doing. The first rule of reloading is no distractions and 100% concentration on the task at hand.

Yes, I hand prime while half watching TV sometimes, so sue me. ;)

Anything else is alone and attentive, or in teaching mode with one other person. :)

Yeah I find I make a LOT more mistakes if I'm distracted. Not necessarily "watching TV" level of distracted, just ... distracted. Trying to do extra steps while powder is being poured in the electric hopper; making labels, deburring case necks, counting something, whatever.

As an experiment on extreme distraction, I put my Surface tablet up on the reloading bench to watch some Star Trek (e.g. I'm a nerd) while loading 300 Win Mag the other day. I actually DROPPED a tray full of powder on my lap. I grabbed it, wasn't paying attention, and knocked the little metal tray against something as I went to pour it. Ended up with close to 70 grains of H4831SC in my lap, on the floor, everywhere. After a second incident, when the powder bridged in the funnel I was using and I didn't notice until I lifted the funnel off the casing, spilling a ton more powder, I was "done done done" with the video.

Shut the tablet off and turned on my radio.

There are certain things I can do a midst distraction. Evidently, making ammo is not one of them. And, I've been doing this almost 20 years.

It's not an "I'm experienced enough so I can get away with it" sort of thing.

It's a "don't matter how experienced you are, when the powder/primer/bullet goes in the casing you best give it your full attention" sort of thing.

rdhood
January 28, 2013, 11:20 AM
I occasionally get some sideways like that... the little primer holder on the Lee classic turret press will sometimes catch the top of the shell holder while pivoting in and flip the primer on its side.

I have never put one in completely backwards, but I was wondering just this weekend if that was possible.


As for flush primers... I prime hundreds of cases in one sitting even though on a turret press....and I feel each cartridge for high primers as I pull it out of the shell holder.

italy176
January 28, 2013, 11:25 AM
My Loadmaster has made cartridges just like the ones illustrated. There is a new primer trough that is supposed to take care of the Loadmaster priming woes.

Jenrick
January 28, 2013, 11:35 AM
I don't bother trying to salvage the primer, just the case. Simply pull the bullet, dump the powder, and flood the case with water. If it's a sideways or upside down primer, let it set in water. I give it 24 hours, at which point I usually have very oddly colored water due to the compounds in the priming mix. At that point the primers are quiet dead, just deprime as normal.

-Jenrick

JSmith
January 28, 2013, 06:25 PM
Just... wow. What happened with the one on the right? It looks like it was stuffed in there sideways.

Fire_Moose
January 28, 2013, 09:49 PM
Its happened to me, on a Lee breech lock.

The transfer from primer arm to primer seater can stick a bit and make the primer sideways in the seater.

How someone doesn't notice, then procedes to add powder and a bullet it beyond me.


I'm glad I don't shoot enough to need a progressive.

Sent from my CZ85 Combat

beatledog7
January 28, 2013, 09:57 PM
If a primer gets sideways in my LNL hand primer it won't feed onto the ram. An upside down one will feed, of course, but when I hand prime I raise the next primer high enough on the ram to see it so I know it's set right. Then I put the case into the shelholder and seat the primer. That way I can't get one in wrong unless I do it on purpose.

280shooter
January 28, 2013, 10:46 PM
yep they look like some my Lee 1000 would put out.. 44 mag,, thats why it sits under my bench and not on it.

murf
January 29, 2013, 01:39 AM
makes you want to quit buying reloaded ammo. can't see a reloader doing that and just leaving them.

murf

Reefinmike
January 29, 2013, 02:07 AM
I so far have found primers to be very forgiving. I have about ten out of the ~20k primers ive loaded so far. most are just crushed sideways but ive never managed to seat one upside down. when im out collecting brass I'll also grab any loaded rounds that have been dropped to possibly add a new caliber to my cartridge collection/fill up the one gallon glass jar I almost have topped off. Before I started reloading and wasnt nearly as knowledgeable about firearms and the potential danger I was at the range with my brother and during cease fire we found some loaded 9mm on the ground. I was aware of potential problems shooting ammo found on the ground due to the possibility of some arse dropping KB loaded rounds with evil intent. Anyways we found some tula and blazer aluminum and figured no way there would be a problem. they went boom, boom, click. he didn't notice the click and just racked the slide and then called me over when the round wouldn't fully go into battery. I quickly found out there was a bullet stuck in the barrel and found that the powder got wet. It could have ended badly but now I know better and colllect every loaded round I find to prevent that from happening to someone else.

Fire_Moose
January 29, 2013, 05:38 AM
Lucky, boom boom click>boom click boom

Sent from my CZ85 Combat

mljdeckard
January 29, 2013, 10:11 AM
I guess thaty answers the question of whether I am being too anal about hand and eye checking every single primed case.

Bush Pilot
January 30, 2013, 12:08 AM
My Loadmaster has made cartridges just like the ones illustrated. There is a new primer trough that is supposed to take care of the Loadmaster priming woes.
One problem possibly fixed and dozens to go with the LM.

If you enjoyed reading about "Priming woes" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!