Colorado gun control


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IlikeSA
February 5, 2013, 04:24 PM
You need to write your state reps because of the impending legislation: 10 rounds only, can sue gun makers, tougher training for CCW, and higher fees for background checks.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_22523196/colorado-democrats-roll-out-tougher-gun-proposals-tuesday

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hso
February 5, 2013, 04:30 PM
What exactly are the bills that are proposed?

IlikeSA
February 5, 2013, 04:37 PM
No one is saying. There was an article this morning in the paper, but the link summarizes most of the article. There is also a flyer out there somewhere that does not give specifics, just an overview.

Another article: http://denver.cbslocal.com/2013/02/05/colorado-democrats-gun-control/

Bentley4700
February 5, 2013, 04:56 PM
Thanks for the link. There were some encouraging parts. Good to see some dems that are at least skeptical. Good to hear Hickenlooper is willing to sit down privately with the NRA.

We can't rest on any news. We must remain vocal and vigilant.

.455_Hunter
February 5, 2013, 04:58 PM
Yup- we are facing the real deal here folks!

One of the critical dangers of letting one party run all three section of gov't.

The text of the bills is not out yet, but will be very interesting to see planned level of restrictions on sale/transfer/possession of > 10 rd mags, plus the new liability requirements for "assault weapons".

Doesn't the fed gov't prohibit lawsuits against lawful firearms manufactures / distributors?

Several rural/suburban D's have come out against said measures, plus the governor (D) has been suspiciously absent from these proclamations, only stating support for more background / metal health checks during his "State of the State" speech. He is also meeting with LaPierre on Thursday.

MErl
February 5, 2013, 05:02 PM
still waiting for the actual bills to show up.

nothing here yet
http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013a/csl.nsf/StatusAll?OpenFrameset

IlikeSA
February 5, 2013, 06:19 PM
My understanding is that the federal government through court cases prohibits the suing of gun manufacturers for the use of a firearm in a crime. This isn't the first time that Colorado potentially stuck up its nose against the federal government though. (not that I am a federalist)

More news with more info:
Full legal liability for anyone who makes, buys, sells or owns an assault weapon that is used in a shooting.

Background checks for all gun sales, even between private parties.

A ban on sale of magazines of more than 10 bullets.

A requirement for mental health workers to report potentially dangerous people to the Colorado Bureau of Investigation, for the purpose of gun-sale background checks.

A stronger ban on gun sales to people with a history of domestic violence.

A fee on background checks, paid by the buyer.

Required in-person training for concealed weapons permits.

A ban on concealed weapons in most parts of college campuses.

http://www.cortezjournal.com/article/20130205/NEWS01/130209934/Democrats-roll-out-gun-control-bills--

longknife12
February 5, 2013, 07:57 PM
My duely electeds have been contacted.
Dan

mokin
February 5, 2013, 08:46 PM
I let my representatives know how I feel about gun control and how I expect them to vote last night. Depending on how the week looks I may contact them again.

I haven't seen anything that indicates any bill other thatn HB1043 has been introduced which redefines a deadly weapon. There appears to be a lot of potiental for trouble from Rhonda Fields, Aurora. I'm guessing that the Denver Post picked up some of what she has proposed. Keep writing your state reps. and let them know how you feel. Like the above poster wrote, "This is the real deal." No do-overs.

IlikeSA
February 6, 2013, 11:06 AM
Update: http://www.nraila.org/legislation/state-legislation/2013/2/colorado-the-assault-on-the-second-amendment-commences-in-denver.aspx

Mayvik
February 6, 2013, 11:10 AM
Full legal liability for anyone who makes, buys, sells or owns an assault weapon that is used in a shooting.

Hrm, so aside from just owning something, if an individual makes an "assault weapon" for personal use (from a kit, 80% lower, etc), it's stolen, used in a crime, they are liable? That makes sense to me, count me! As much as I hate the car analogies, if someone steals my car and drives it through a bus stop I'm not liable, why would it be any different for any other piece of legally owned private property? Seems to me this would only encourage people to "anonymize" any arms they are making for their own use rather than serialize them "so they can be recovered" later. Alternately, making a trust/LLC for every personal firearm might bypass it?

Waiting for actual bill text however I must say I am kinda happy when the crazy bananas items show up because they just torpedo the entire bill. Hopefully...

coloradokevin
February 6, 2013, 04:18 PM
This is a big deal here in Colorado, since the Democrats now have control of both houses and the governorship at the state level. We need to hit this issue fast and hard.

I've already sent letters to all of my lawmakers once, and I intend to do so again as these bills start to advance through the legislature.

Colorado has had a rich gun history, and has always been a supportive state to shooters and gun owners. Many long-time residents of this state have commented for years on how we're becoming more like California, thanks in part to the influx of new residents from that west coast state, among other things.

We're at a pivotal point in our state's history right now. Unless we want to live under the goofy laws of places like NY and CA, we can't wait to act on this issue. Write, call, e-mail, stop by the offices... it doesn't matter how you do it, but be sure your voice is heard!

MErl
February 6, 2013, 04:58 PM
still no actual bills but is an official press release from senate majority
http://coloradosenate.org/home/press/colorado-legislators-work-together-to-pioneer-gun-safety-legislation

Mayvik
February 6, 2013, 08:28 PM
Banning "high" capacity mags does not infringe....who writes this crap??

64 jeep
February 7, 2013, 12:32 PM
Hi everyone.
Time to write your elected Congressman, and Senator. The squeaky wheel gets greased.
Copy and paste this letter.

I request you to pass legislation to Repeal the Lautenberg Amendment
(section section 658 of Public Law 104-208 ) that Bill Clinton signed into
law back in 1996. It serves no purpose other than to create very thin and
questionable criteria to permanently ban citizens from their "Right to
Keep and Bear Arms".
Soldiers, police officers, and anyone who has been judged to have
committed a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence has incurred a lifetime
ban to own or possess firearms.
As you know, a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence need not involved a
physical crime, but a mere verbal exchange, with the punishment sometimes
being only a $10 fine. In many metro areas, a second phone call to a
house over a family altercation will result in the standard police
procedure of automatically arresting the male occupant, regardless of who
is at fault or whether any threats were made.
Just as bad, this legislation associates gun owners with "wife beaters" as
if the two are some how linked, which they are not. It is an intentional
slander to law abiding citizens, a breach of Constitutional freedoms, and a
hindrance to our military and law enforcement services. Many soldiers and
police officers have lost their jobs over their legal ban on carrying
weapons because of this dishonest law.
And I won't even bother going into its unconstitutional ex-post-facto
characteristics. Next all Misdemeanor convictions will result in a lifetime gun ban.
If a Convicted Felon can have gun rights restore a person with a Misdemeanor conviction should have the same opportunity.

Please work to repeal the Lautenberg Amendment.

MErl
February 7, 2013, 07:55 PM
ok, actual house bills are up:
1224 - Prohibiting Large-capacity Ammunition Magazines (http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013a/csl.nsf/fsbillcont3/7E6713B015E62E6F87257B0100813CB5?Open&file=1224_01.pdf)
1226 - No Concealed Carry At Colleges (http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013a/csl.nsf/fsbillcont3/7A2AA2783B54E1CF87257AEE005704A0?Open&file=1226_01.pdf)
1228 - Payment For Background Checks For Gun Transfers (http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013a/csl.nsf/fsbillcont3/04005C2BDBC54E4087257AEE00585D19?Open&file=1228_01.pdf)
1229 - Background Checks For Gun Transfers (http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013a/csl.nsf/fsbillcont3/590C29B4C02AFC2F87257A8E0073C303?Open&file=1229_01.pdf)

Please write your state reps and ask them not to support these bills. You can get contact information here. (http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013A/cslFrontPages.nsf/HomeSplash?OpenForm) or there are plenty of other places listed n this site to easily contact your elected reps.


EDIT:
Non CO residents. The magazine bill would require magpul (located in Boulder CO) to add unique serial numbers and MFG date to every magazine they make. This section affects you as well.

BK
February 7, 2013, 08:38 PM
This is where it would be cool to see sheriffs declare that they will not enforce new gun control laws, state law or otherwise.

Trisha
February 7, 2013, 08:48 PM
Letters (hard copy) sent, and emails (not boilerplate).

And the residents of Colorado are voting with their pocketbooks.

Maybe we can stand and endure the distortions and slurs and turn this, once again.

We must!

SigSour
February 7, 2013, 09:06 PM
Email(s) sent.

MagnumWill
February 7, 2013, 09:57 PM
Apparently they believe the shooter at Virginia Tech shouldn't have to worry about students defending themselves. Are they TRYING to make it more dangerous? :fire:

And the magazine "ban"... it doesn't make any sense! You can't transfer a magazine or sell it - but you can keep it, or make one - just as long as it's engraved with the date and a serial number? And if you can buy components to make one - how the heck are they going to know?!? I hope the lawmakers see that these just plain don't make any sense, gun rights/control or not.

...and apparently all shotguns with tube magazines longer than 4 rounds are illegal.... they forgot to mention that one.... :confused:

Mayvik
February 8, 2013, 12:00 PM
And the magazine "ban"... it doesn't make any sense! You can't transfer a magazine or sell it - but you can keep it, or make one - just as long as it's engraved with the date and a serial number? And if you can buy components to make one - how the heck are they going to know?!? I hope the lawmakers see that these just plain don't make any sense, gun rights/control or not.

Slippery slope from "Mr DA, prove I acquired it after the ban" to "Mr Defendant, prove you had it before the ban"...

MErl
February 8, 2013, 02:16 PM
Slippery slope from "Mr DA, prove I acquired it after the ban" to "Mr Defendant, prove you had it before the ban"...
that proposed law at least specifically states the burden of proof is on the prosecution.

pty101
February 8, 2013, 02:23 PM
....

bnolsen
February 8, 2013, 04:01 PM
Sadly the east and west coasters have overwhelmed the state. Don't expect the electorate in CO to care much anymore. It's very very sad :(

mokin
February 8, 2013, 05:51 PM
Meanwhile back at the capital.....

H.B.1229 which requires background checks for private transfers, (we know what that means), has made its way to the House Judiciary Committee and is awaiting a hearing date. Now we can discuss bills yet to be named, or, we can contact our representatives and let them know specifically what we want them to do.

Here is the text I sent to my reps.

Please oppose H.B. 1229 which would require background checks for firearm transfers between private individuals. This will create a de facto registration in the state and cause an unmanageable backlog for licensed dealers as well as the CBI while inconveniencing law abiding citizens. Furthermore, it will do little to prevent crime as those individuals bent on crime will disregard this law anyway.
Thank you,


This will only take a few minutes, I promise.

Motega
February 9, 2013, 10:58 AM
Hi Colorado, and welcome to NJ!

Dr.Rob
February 10, 2013, 05:42 PM
Ok that magazine bill is FAR WORSE than I ever imagined. And confusing.

Old Fuff
February 10, 2013, 06:36 PM
Since you folks in Colorado are pushed for time, try this simple but effective tactic.

Look in your landline phone books for the phone number of local Democrat and Republican Party Headquarters. With luck they may even have an 800 number.

In any case call both, and you will likely get a nice lady on the line, so be polite and hold your tongue. You want to make a favorable impression.

They will ask what you are calling about, and you tell them which legislature (Colorado or U.S.) the bill number(s) and that you are strongly opposed!

They will log all this, along with your name, address and phone number; and then pass the information on to the concerned legislators and likely the Governor.

Very, very few of them will ignore what they hear from their respective party offices. What comes to them from Home Base will at least carry the weight of e-mail - but you should continue to do that too.

You don’t have to call on a landline - cell phones are fine. :evil:

Trent
February 10, 2013, 10:41 PM
Ok that magazine bill is FAR WORSE than I ever imagined. And confusing.

How so? It doesn't seem as bad as what Illinois tried to pass. That one would have made me a felon like 300 times over. It looks like Colorado is just misdemeanor charges.

coloradokevin
February 11, 2013, 02:29 AM
It is my understanding that a variety of gun ban bills will be heard in the Colorado State House Judiciary Committee this week. From what I understand, this committee has the power to kill the bills that may lead to far more restrictive gun laws in this state.

For those of you who are so inclined, here is the contact information for the members of this committee. The time to act is now.

Let them know how you feel about these proposals:

Rep. Daniel Kagan, Chair: 303-866-2921, repkagan@gmail.com
Rep. Pete Lee, Vice Chair: 303-866-2932, pete.lee.house@state.co.us
Rep. John Buckner: 303-866-2944, john.buckner.house@state.co.us
Rep. Lois Court: 303-866-2967, lois.court.house@state.co.us
Rep. Bob Gardner, 303-866-2191, bob.gardner.house@state.co.us
Rep. Polly Lawrence, 303-866-2935, polly.lawrence.house@state.co.us
Rep. Mike McLachlan, 303-866-2914, mike.mclachlan.house@state.co.us
Rep. Rep Carole Murray, 303-866-2948, murrayhouse45@gmail.com
Rep. Brittany Pettersen, 303-866-2939, brittany.pettersen.house@state.co.us
Rep. Joseph Salazar, 303-866-2918, joseph.salazar.house@state.co.us
Rep. Jared Wright, 303-866-2583, jared.wright.house@state.co.us

IlikeSA
February 11, 2013, 06:39 AM
Thanks for posting this; it makes it easy to cut and paste the e-mail addresses.

Fred Fuller
February 11, 2013, 09:07 AM
Magpul is threatening to leave the state over the magazine ban...

https://www.facebook.com/magpul/posts/428803833863947

cologuy
February 11, 2013, 02:50 PM
HB 13-1226 has gone to the Education Committee, and HB 13-1228 to the Finance Committee. Here are some e-mail addresses:

EDUCATION:
justin.everett.house@state.co.us
rhonda.fields.house@state.co.us
millie.hamner.house@state.co.us
cherylin.peniston.house@state.co.us
chris.holbert.house@state.co.us
lois.landgraf.house@state.co.us
kpriola@gmail.com
james.wilson.house@state.co.us
dave.young.house@state.co.us

FINANCE:
jeanne.labuda.house@state.co.us
brian@briandelgrosso.com
mike.foote.house@state.co.us
janak.joshi.house@state.co.us
jenise.may.house@state.co.us
jovan.melton.house@state.co.us
dan.pabon.house@state.co.us
lori.saine.house@state.co.us
spencer.swalm.house@state.co.us

I was too pissed and busy to get phone numbers, sorry.

There are other members on these committees, but the list that coloradokevin posted in #30 covers the rest of them. E-mail them today!

CoRoMo
February 11, 2013, 03:12 PM
Contacted.

Trent
February 11, 2013, 04:57 PM
Magpul is threatening to leave the state over the magazine ban...

https://www.facebook.com/magpul/posts/428803833863947

OOOOH crap now I see why it's so frigging bad.

The manufacturers are banned too.

Good grief that'd affect the entire country, albeit indirectly.

EDIT:

Anything out-of-staters can do to help you guys?

CoRoMo
February 11, 2013, 05:49 PM
Anything out-of-staters can do to help you guys?

ABSOLUTELY!!!

I beg this of all of you in every activism thread that I make: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=689238

The state of Colorado is utterly dependent on tourist dollars. This state would not exist if it weren't for the revenue brought in by skiers, hunters, campers, and all others who visit, vacate, and recreate in this state. This state would dry up and die if it weren't for tourism.

So now... you come out to visit/go skiing and you bring your daily carry piece... say a Glock 19... the magazine had better be older than the date of this legislation because car accidents happen. You don't want the responding LEO to find you in possession of a +10 magazine too new for this legislation.

Also... if you tote a carbine with you on road trips out here when you go camping/fly fishing for a week's vacation, if the magazines you bring are newer than the legislation, you are in violation of the law we see looming there.

And... if someone were to come hunt a Rocky Mountain elk with their AR10, deer/black bear with their 6.8mm, or prairie dogs with their AR15, etc. and the game warden were to check your firearm, you might be in a bit of trouble if his eyes land on one of those 20-round .308 mags or a 25-round 6.8 mag or the most evil of all, a spare 30-round .223 mag that travels with your rifle everywhere it goes.

Contact our governor by CLICKING HERE (http://www.colorado.gov/cs/Satellite/GovHickenlooper/CBON/1249674240317). Describe how different all of your vacation plans will be if he signs new gun legislation. You would not want to be treated like a criminal or worse, prosecuted as one, if you were to be in possession of something in Colorado that is perfectly legal where you live.

If you do have a history of vacationing here, look up a member of our state legislature where you would return to hunt, ski, camp, etc. and let the rep from that district know that you will not return to spend your money in their district. Contact a few members of our General Assembly by CLICKING HERE (http://www.leg.state.co.us/CLICS/CLICS2012B/csl.nsf/Directory?openFrameset).

MRH
February 11, 2013, 06:15 PM
I doubt that these will make it out of the committees, but CO SB 13-140 and HB 13-1187, sponsored by Republications tries to keep anyone in CO from enforcing the federal gun laws.

These are going before the state, veterans & military affairs committees.

longknife12
February 11, 2013, 06:36 PM
You might try the S&W site or email those listed. Trent, several of us attended a town hall meeting by one of the Col Reps on Saturday morning. One thing we mentioned was existing laws....the lady was unaware of a 4473 or what it contained....and she is going to be voting on this stuff! This is even more scarey than the bills themselves!
Dan
:eek:

Trent
February 11, 2013, 07:56 PM
Something like this?

http://i.imgur.com/byLmsZx.png

Trent
February 11, 2013, 07:59 PM
Or this:

http://i.imgur.com/GMTpz7W.jpg

Trent
February 11, 2013, 08:01 PM
The other issues I really don't have a say in, being out of state (Background checks).

longknife12
February 11, 2013, 08:18 PM
Yup.........the S&W also contacts feds.......thanks for the support! S&W addie is listed several threads down from this one.
Dan

IlikeSA
February 12, 2013, 08:08 AM
Here is the list that you can copy and paste into the "to" section of your e-mail.

irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us, david.balmer.senate@state.co.us, randy.baumgardner.senate@state.co.us, greg@gregbrophy.net, perrybuck49@gmail.com, john.buckner.house@state.co.us, bill.cadman.senate@state.co.us, morgan.carroll.senate@state.co.us, kathleen.conti.house@state.co.us, don.coram.house@state.co.us, lois.court.house@state.co.us, larry.crowder.senate@state.co.us, brian@briandelgrosso.com, tim.dore.house@state.co.us, crisanta.duran.house@state.co.us, justin.everett.house@state.co.us, thomas.exum.house@state.co.us, mferrandino@yahoo.com, rhonda.fields.house@state.co.us, randyfischer@frii.com, mike.foote.house@state.co.us, leroy.garcia.house@state.co.us, bob.gardner.house@state.co.us, cheri.gerou@gmail.com, joann.ginal.house@state.co.us, angela.giron.senate@state.co.us, kevin.grantham.senate@state.co.us, lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us, millie.hamner.house@state.co.us, ted.harvey.senate@state.co.us, rollie.heath.senate@state.co.us, owen.hill.senate@state.co.us, mary.hodge.senate@state.co.us, chris.holbert.house@state.co.us, senatorhudak@gmail.com, dl.hullinghorst.house@state.co.us, rephumphrey48@yahoo.com, cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us, mike.johnston.senate@state.co.us, senatormattjones@gmail.com, janak.joshi.house@state.co.us, repkagan@gmail.com, john.kefalas.senate@state.co.us, andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us, steve.king.senate@state.co.us, reptracy29@gmail.com, jeanne.labuda.house@state.co.us, senatorlambert@comcast.net, lois.landgraf.house@state.co.us, polly.lawrence.house@state.co.us, steve.lebsock.house@state.co.us, pete.lee.house@state.co.us, claire.levy.house@state.co.us, kevin@kevinlundberg.com, vicki.marble.senate@state.co.us, jenise.may.house@state.co.us, beth.mccann.house@state.co.us, mike.mclachlan.house@state.co.us, jovan.melton.house@state.co.us, diane.mitschbush.house@state.co.us, dominick.moreno.house@state.co.us, john.morse.senate@state.co.us, murrayhouse45@gmail.com, clarice.navarro.house@state.co.us, linda.newell.senate@gmail.com, jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us, dan.nordberg.house@state.co.us, dan.pabon.house@state.co.us, cherylin.peniston.house@state.co.us, brittany.pettersen.house@state.co.us, dianne.primavera.house@state.co.us, kpriola@gmail.com, bob.rankin.house@state.co.us, senatorrenfroe@gmail.com, ellen.roberts.senate@state.co.us, paul.rosenthal.house@state.co.us, su.ryden.house@state.co.us, lori.saine.house@state.co.us, joseph.salazar.house@state.co.us, sue.schafer.house@state.co.us, mark.scheffel.senate@state.co.us, gail.schwartz.senate@gmail.com, ray.scott.house@state.co.us, jonathan.singer.house@state.co.us, jerry@repsonnenberg.com, pat.steadman.senate@state.co.us, amy.stephens.house@state.co.us, spencer.swalm.house@state.co.us, libby.szabo.house@state.co.us, lotochtrop@aol.com, nancy.todd.senate@state.co.us, max@maxtyler.us, jessie.ulibarri.senate@state.co.us, edvigil1@gmail.com, mark.waller.house@state.co.us, angela.williams.house@state.co.us, james.wilson.house@state.co.us, jared.wright.house@state.co.us, dave.young.house@state.co.us

alsaqr
February 12, 2013, 08:29 AM
Gunowning citizens of CO must get their act together now to oppose serious gun control. Theres a good chance the CO legislature and governor will do a NY style blitz on gun control.

PedalBiker
February 12, 2013, 10:02 AM
Done.

It's important to point out unintended consequences to these folks. Many of them see only the criminal application of their bills.

One problem with the CO background check bill is that back country rescue could be impacted. Shooting on forest service land could be impacted (no hunting season, you can't lend a gun).


Make sure they understand --- They want to send someone to jail over nit picking details like the spring in a magazine compressed too far and let an extra bullet in.

CoRoMo
February 12, 2013, 11:30 AM
Trent that was great!!

I just sent him a note, asking if he would be happy about the prosecution of honest vacationers to our state simply because their brand new personal defense pistol is newer than the legislation; it comes with a standard magazine that is legal in their state, illegal here. Therefore those vacationers would be classified as criminals here.

Bravo governor, bravo.

cologuy
February 12, 2013, 01:46 PM
I received a couple of interesting replies to the committee members I e-mailed yesterday:

First one:
I would like to ask you to come to the state Capitol on Tuesday,
February 12 and Wednesday, February 13 to show your opposition and
speak against the following anti-gun bills:

- On Tuesday, February 12, House Bill 13-1224 and House Bill 13-1229
are scheduled to be heard in the House Judiciary Committee in the Old
Supreme Court Chamber in the Capitol upon adjournment of the House.
HB13-1224, sponsored by state Representative Rhonda Fields (D-42),
would ban magazines that hold more than ten rounds. HB13-1229,
sponsored by state Representatives Rhonda Fields and Beth McCann
(D-8), would prohibit and criminalize the private transfer of
firearms.

- On Wednesday, February 13 House Bill 13-1226 will be heard by the
House Education Committee upon adjournment in the Old Supreme Court
Chamber, and House Bill 13-1228 will be heard by the House Finance
Committee at 1:30 pm in the Old Supreme Court Chamber. HB13-1226,
sponsored by state Representative Clare Levy (D-13), would repeal the
current right to carry a concealed firearm for self-defense on a
college or university campus. HB13-1228, sponsored by state
Representative Lois Court (D-6), would require law-abiding citizens to
pay a fee (or gun tax) for a background check when purchasing a
firearm.

I encourage you to tell state legislators, especially those serving on
these committees, to vote NO on HB13-1224, HB13-1226, HB13-1228 and
HB13-1229. Without your direct help this next week, these anti-gun,
anti-constitution bills will have a much better chance of passing into
law. Please come to the state Capitol in Denver to respectfully
protect your rights.

Thank you,
Representative Spencer Swalm


And second:
I'll vote "No" on any/all gun control legislation.

The Second Amendment exists to protect us from tyranny and I will not
compromise on that issue.

If you'd like to learn about my efforts to defend the Second Amendment
rights of law-abiding citizens, then please take time to read this
recent article:

http://thecoloradoobserver.com/2013/01/gun-rights-backers-rally-at-state-capitol/

You might also enjoy listening to the speech that I offered during the
"Guns Across America" rally that was held at the Colorado Capitol on
January 19, 2013:

Chris Holbert At Gun Appreciation Day 1/19/2013, Denver CO

Respectfully yours,

- Chris

Representative Chris Holbert
District 44
Parker • Lone Tree
State Capitol Building
200 E Colfax Ave, #271
Denver, CO 80203
Capitol: (303) 866-2933

Neither of these guys represent my district, but they're the first and only replies that I've received that aren't obviously "canned" and computer generated, from state-level or federal-level reps.

Note that all of these bills will be heard in the next two days - it sounds like they're really pushing to get these through fast, before emotions cool down. I can't make it to the capitol today, but I'll try to be there for the hearings tomorrow.

mrvco
February 12, 2013, 02:23 PM
Thanks everyone for the out-of-state support. Tourism $$$'s are definitely important to Colorado.

Mosbyranger
February 12, 2013, 04:02 PM
Done. I'm pretty sure Jared Wright realizes that Mesa County is about as red as it gets. I'd be shocked if he committed political suicide by voting for any of the nonsense gun control measures proposed by the whack jobs representing the Peoples Republics of Denver and Boulder.
MR

IlikeSA
February 12, 2013, 08:28 PM
Representative Jared Wright was awesome in the hearing today. You have placed your confidence in the right man.

The universal background checks passed 7-4 on party lines though. There was still debate on the magazine capacity bill.

It is streaming live here: http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_22572461/major-battle-over-gun-bills-set-tuesday-at

longknife12
February 12, 2013, 08:49 PM
Well, we lost round one....both passed by 7-4.Straight party lines. This was only clearing committee...we still have a chance!
Dan

I stand corrected...so far...710pm, only background has passed committee....we can hope!
Dan


Mag capacity is in process of being amended to read 15rd capacity.

WhiteT
February 12, 2013, 10:00 PM
Wow, click that link to live feed and read the story in the denver post. The arapahoe county coroner Arapahoe County Coroner Michael Dobersen, whose office received the bodies of victims killed in the Aurora theater shooting , said in testimony that firearms with these appendages produce some of the most gruesome wounds he's ever seen.
"These rounds have a devastating effect on the body," Dobersen said. "Can you imagine seeing multiple wounds from this? Even one bullet wound is devastating, but those from high-capacity magazines are especially bad."

mrvco
February 12, 2013, 11:44 PM
This mag ban is positively absurd. It won't be any more effective than Denver's current ban has been and prosecution of it will be strictly arbitrary and prejudicial. I have a bunch of 15+ cap mags and absolutely no way of proving whether I purchased them pre-ban or post-ban ~2 hours away in Wyoming. Fortunately it doesn't sound like any of our Sheriffs will bother enforcing this silliness, of course it's not like the Denver Police have bothered to enforce their mag ban either.

Not to mention, this UBC legislation is almost equally absurd, as long as you purchased a gun prior to the ban, you can back-date an invoice and say you sold it for cash prior to the ban taking effect.

IlikeSA
February 13, 2013, 03:14 PM
I wonder if it would be worth it to speak about how these new law proposals promote racism, in the fact that it makes it harder for the poor and minorities that are generally poor to buy a weapon for self defense. If we then explored the history of gun control and thanked the democrats for coming full circle to the democrats of the South in the 1870s, they may be less inclined to push these laws. It would then leave them with "gun control, but a racist destroying the democrat party base" or "no gun control, leave the democrat base intact." Perhaps also speak about how these laws are going to effect homosexuals right to defend themselves, as well as minorities, from extremist groups.

mrvco
February 13, 2013, 09:11 PM
I sent an email asking our state congress-people what would happen in the event of my pre-ban magazines being discovered during a routine traffic stop since they have no serial# or mfg date stamped on them.

I have received a couple email responses addressing my concern.

State Representative Spencer Swaim (R) responded "... As you noted, proving "pre-ban" ownership would be highly difficult -- perhaps their intent".

State Senator Angela Giron (D) reassured me that "the burden of proof is on the prosecution to prove that they were illegally obtained, not on the defense to prove that they were legally obtained." However she did not (and has yet to) address the question of whether or not my magazines (and even my guns) could be confiscated and held while the prosecution completed their investigation.

I also sent another question asking how the Colorado Magazine Ban would deal with out of state folks (ie the tourism angle) from Gun-Friendly states traveling to or through Colorado... especially those from states with CCW Permit reciprocity and conceal-carry guns with "standard mag capacities" in excess of 15 rounds. I asked whether their intent was to turn Colorado into a "Drive Around State" rather than a "Drive Through or To State" for these folks.

almostfree
February 13, 2013, 09:15 PM
I see that the proposed fee for background checks through CBI made it out of committee. Why not just switch to NICS like most everyone else instead & avoid state expenditure?

mokin
February 15, 2013, 04:56 PM
Looks like just about everything is moving through the respective committees along party lines. I can't believe there is that much support for gun control in this state. Either folks aren't contacting thier reps or they aren't listening. When did we start electing representatives from the coasts?

browneu
February 15, 2013, 05:11 PM
I see that the proposed fee for background checks through CBI made it out of committee. Why not just switch to NICS like most everyone else instead & avoid state expenditure?

Isn't this fee similar to a poll tax? Among other things it seems unconstitutional.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

longknife12
February 15, 2013, 05:18 PM
Mokin.....contact with reps has been made......this bunch has a target in the sights and is listening to no one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
dan
:confused:

CoRoMo
February 15, 2013, 05:19 PM
Isn't this fee similar to a poll tax? Among other things it seems unconstitutional.
It's similar to a permit to carry, a FOID card, or California's DROS fees...

...it's all unconstitutional but I don't imagine that it will be struck down as such.

cologuy
February 16, 2013, 03:04 PM
I just got finished wasting my morning [U]trying[U] to attend a town hall meeting with Sen Giron. It was her regularly scheduled, monthly town hall meeting, which is usually an open forum type, but today they suddenly announced that they had a set agenda for this meeting, and the agenda did NOT include any 2A-type discussions. I'd guess there were about 65 pro-2A folks there, and at least Giron had the guts to come out and tell us herself that we wouldn't be allowed to speak. After about 20 minutes of listening to us in the hallway she agreed to hold another town hall meeting to discuss 2A matters specifically. She tentatively set it for next Saturday, the 23rd, and supposedly she'll have her staff e-mail and/or call several of us to confirm the time and location, in addition to posting it on her website. I'll post the info here as soon as I find out when/where.

If you live anywhere in this area, please plan on being there. Sixty-five was a terrible showing, and I know we can do better. She's got to know that we're serious and numerous.

longknife12
February 16, 2013, 03:34 PM
Same stuff that I ran into in Littleton last Saturday! Good luck.
Dan
:confused:

berettaprofessor
February 16, 2013, 03:49 PM
Looks like the magazine limit passed the Colorado House:

http://kdvr.com/2013/02/15/rep-opposition-likely-to-slow-not-prevent-passage-of-new-gun-laws/

Is there a Colorado Senate and will they stop it?

s9601694
February 16, 2013, 03:53 PM
Looks like the magazine limit passed the Colorado House:

http://kdvr.com/2013/02/15/rep-opposition-likely-to-slow-not-prevent-passage-of-new-gun-laws/

Is there a Colorado Senate and will they stop it?
Its so retarded.. 15 round limit. And existing higher capacity mags will be grandfathered in. Who is going to stop anyone from driving an hour and a half to Cheyenne to buy 30 round mags and then claiming that they have owned them since pre ban??

Also, Magpul has announced to pull out of Colorado if it comes into law... Goodbye some 800 jobs in Colorado and thanks Dem idiots for pushing this one through

alsaqr
February 16, 2013, 06:10 PM
Is there a Colorado Senate and will they stop it?

Yes, there is a Colorado senate: They will rubber stamp it. Then its off to the governor for his signature.

MRH
February 16, 2013, 11:29 PM
Colo Guy. Nice of Sen Giron to schedule a meeting on the 23rd. All the bills will have been signed by the Governor by then.

mokin
February 17, 2013, 05:01 PM
Maybe the loss of jobs, tourism, and real estate dollars will speak to some of the politicians in Denver. I find it interesting that the Democrats have chosen this issue to blindly follow, lock step, to (hopefully) thier demise.

Zak Smith
February 18, 2013, 12:37 AM
The House will have the recorded vote tomorrow. Then it's on to the Senate.

All we need is 5 (D)'s from the former or 3 (D)'s from the Senate to back us on any bill to get it stopped. THIS IS NOT OVER. Get writing and calling now!!!

We already have one or two D's who have said they will oppose at least 1224.

ClangClang
February 19, 2013, 12:34 AM
Does anyone have a full list of all the CO State Senators? I'd like to e-mail them en masse.

MostlySurly
February 19, 2013, 02:32 PM
Senator,
As I read about yesterday’s house vote on H1224, 1226, 1228, and 1229, I was, frankly, embarrassed to be from Colorado. Political posturing, ‘feel-good’ legislation, and overall ignorance of the real issues we face as Americans has got me real down.

40 years I lived in Colorado, and I still keep property in Summit County, and I’m afraid my upcoming trip in May might be the last vacation I visit CO. I can’t stand the thought of spending all that money, paying taxes, and supporting an area that no longer respects the rights of law-aiding citizens. Our once proud heritage of firearms ownership in CO has been tossed under the bus.

What, exactly, makes the legislature feel is going to compel a criminal to follow these new, superfluous laws proposed? Are criminals not, by nature, going to do whatever they want. Willfully, maliciously shooting someone is a crime, is it not? That’s what it boils down to. The ridiculous ideas in these bills will do absolutely nothing to deter the criminals. The campus carry one actually invites ne’er do wells to a place they know will show no resistance.

Please don’t let these get through the Senate. Rather than letting emotion rule, please take the time to educate your fellow congress members about the truth. Turning CO into NY and CA is not the answer. I don’t spend any money in those states, and I encourage everyone I know to also avoid them.

<redacted>
Boise, ID / Breckenridge, CO

I'm sorry about what has happened to my former home state, folks. I really am embarrassed for the folks who have allowed it to become so bad.

MErl
February 19, 2013, 02:44 PM
http://www.ar-15.co/threads/89701-Last-Stand-Against-Gun-Bills-The-Senate

first post there is contact info for all the state senators, their affiliation and how narrowly they were elected.

mokin
February 19, 2013, 10:32 PM
Thanks, MErl. I like the way the lists are broken down by party affiliation and election data.

MikeG
February 21, 2013, 04:21 PM
I have just sent this to the Governor and a similar e-mail to my state Senator.

Governor Hickenlooper 21 February 2013




I am writing to ask you to vote against the gun control bills that may come out of the State Senate this coming Monday. These bills clearly stem from a rush of emotions after a couple of terrible crimes, and not from facts and law. Unfortunately, the causes of violence in our society are multiple and complex, and these bills would do little to nothing to resolve the problem.

As H. L. Mencken said:
“For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong.”

What these bills will do is infringe on the Constitutional rights of many law abiding firearms owners like myself. I am aware that sometimes our rights must be limited by law. For example, the right to free speech does not entitle someone to yell 'fire' in a crowded theater. But in keeping with the principle of innocent until proven guilty, we can't presume anyone capable of yelling fire and duct tape their mouths as they present their tickets and enter the theater.

Furthermore, knee-jerk reactions such as these bills are distract us and divert attention from solving the real causes of societal violence such as the dissolution of families, violent entertainment, and psychotropic medications. We need to address these real causes, rather than simply attempting to ban the implements that the criminals used. That solution won't work, because anything that can be used can be misused. Instead, we need to focus on identifying and addressing the troubled individuals who would do wrong.

Lastly, it has been proven that gun control does not stem violence. Locations like Chicago, Illinois and California have extreme gun control laws. They have not made the residents any safer. But the multiplicity of flawed laws have made those places difficult to live and do business in. As a result, people and businesses are fleeing to better places, and those states are nearly bankrupt. Please don't start that process here in Colorado.

Me

Grunt
February 21, 2013, 06:12 PM
Done here too. Thanks for the link, Trent. I did inform him that since I live in Wyoming, my vote will mean nothing to his political career. However, I also did promise him that should these bills become law, my tourism money will be spent at home here in Wyoming, South Dakota, North Dakota, and Montana to name a few. I also will not buy products made in Colorado if there is a similar item made in a gun-friendly state. Might not make a difference in his decision but at least he knows your Northern neighbors got Colorado gun owner's back!!!

Wolfebyte
February 22, 2013, 10:15 AM
Done from out of state.. contacted the Gov and explained my out of state status and the future of vacation and travel to Colorado where Texas currently shares reciprocity.

Good luck Guys

longknife12
February 22, 2013, 02:52 PM
Finally recieved reply from Sen Jeanne Nicholson. She is hard line on House version. " 80% of those in pen bought from private sales" The fact that a large number of these were felon to felon underground sales. No concept of real street life!!!
We keep trying.
Dan

CoRoMo
February 22, 2013, 03:45 PM
done from out of state.
Thank You!!!

csspecs
February 22, 2013, 05:40 PM
Sent one expressing concern that it will negatively affect my business in FL as some of my suppliers of magazine parts processing have facilities in CO for testing.

Now to figure out who in FL could help with this interstate commerce problem :)

The law is to unclear to be able to safely order blanks or stampings from CO based suppliers.

Larry Ashcraft
February 23, 2013, 03:18 PM
If you live anywhere in this area, please plan on being there. Sixty-five was a terrible showing, and I know we can do better. She's got to know that we're serious and numerous.
AWESOME turnout today! The meeting room was packed to capacity. In fact , the entire fourth floor was packed, probably at least 400 people there.

I'm not sure how much good it did, because of a couple of her comments that were passed back to us; "I admire President Obama." and "These laws will keep guns out of the hands of criminals".

Anybody who was actually in the meeting room, how did things go in there?

mokin
February 24, 2013, 10:32 PM
It doesn't look like there are any anti-gun freedom bills scheduled to be heard by the senate for the next month. The schedule opens up the farther out you look though. Just a heads up. Everybody keep writing your senators and the governer and keep your eyes open in case something comes up.

Zak Smith
February 24, 2013, 10:38 PM
The "first week in March" is what some articles said.

cologuy
February 25, 2013, 01:51 PM
Larry Ashcraft - Couldn't get into the room on Saturday to talk to Giron (the paper said there were 750 people there!), but you'll never guess whose range she was at on Sunday, shooting with some old ladies from the town hall. I was really impressed UNTIL the face-to-face conversation that we had with her afterwards. She spent about an hour and a half trying to convince US that WE were wrong about the four bills! She even brought out the Biden statement, almost verbatim, about the Constitution allowing the government to regulate what kind of weapons civilians could have (no tanks, nukes, etc.), so they basically could regulate whatever they want. I don't think we can count on Giron to back us up on any of these bills.

Oh, she also mentioned that the state Senate planned on introducing four NEW bills, addressing the mental health and drug-induced aspects of violent crime, sometime in this session, but I bet we never see them.

Looks like we've got to work on someone else's Senator, cuz ours is useless.

longknife12
February 26, 2013, 02:25 PM
We might try Sen Andy Kerr.........I am undecided on him.

senatorandykerr@gmail.com

He is fom Dist 22.
Dan

Zak Smith
February 26, 2013, 02:50 PM
I was recently forwarded this response from an (R) CO State Representative,

"I have been fighting the good fight for our 2nd Amendment rights in the House along with my fellow Republicans. However, the Dems have been outvoting us at every turn. The fight on the House floor is over for now, but the battle will go on. The Senate has to hear the bills and the Governor will have to sign them. Keep working on our opponents!

According to my Republican Senate colleagues, the Senators that might be persuaded by sending e-mails and letters or making calls would be: Senators Mary Hodge, Cheri Jahn, Andy Kerr, Jeanne Nicholson, Gail Schwartz, and Lois Tochtrop.

Below are their email addresses, phone numbers, and Capitol address. Please contact them.
mary.hodge.senate@state.co.us Phone: 303-866-4855
cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us Phone: 303-866-4856
andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us Phone: 303-866-4859
jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us Phone: 303-866-4873
gail.schwartz.senate@state.co.us Phone: 303-866-4871
lotochtrop@aol.com Phone: 303-866-4863
"

If you contact them, please be POLITE. Remember, the objective is to persuade them to vote against these bills.

It might not be a bad idea to mention that Colorado is not NY or CA and the people who voted for them were not thinking about gun control at the time. "Please think rationally about these proposals: they will fail to stop further mass killings and the fact that you supported them instead of finding real solutions will be a future source of political embarrassment."

mokin
February 26, 2013, 11:23 PM
Thanks for a short list.

Anybody have a lead on fax numbers?

cologuy
February 27, 2013, 03:35 PM
I don't think I've ever seen a fax number for any of our legislators. For whatever it's worth, e-mails and regular old letters seem to get to the CO reps pretty reliably and fast.

MErl
February 27, 2013, 04:09 PM
I found 303-866-2218 as the general capitol fax number.

The address of the capitol is:
<Senator or Rep name>
State Capitol
200 E Colfax
Denver CO 80203


btw, there was yet another bill introduced in the senate. This one is a good one. Everyone will especially love how broadly an assault weapon is defined and how the law states that they are highly desired by criminals...

SB13-196 Assault Weapon Responsibility Act (http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013a/csl.nsf/fsbillcont3/28EB8FECB7D3F79387257B03007B8F72?Open&file=196_01.pdf)

DAP90
February 28, 2013, 08:43 PM
There are three Denver area town halls this Saturday, 2/2/13. I hope to see some of you at one or all of them.

More info at: http://www.rmgo.org/

Sen. Cheri Jahn & Sen. Andy Kerr
9:30am-11:00am
Lakewood Cultural Center
470 S. Allison Parkway
Lakewood, CO 80226

Sen. Morgan Carroll
11:00am-12:00pm
Smoky Hill Library
5430 S. Biscay Circle
Centennial, CO 80015

Sen. Jeanne Nicholson
2:00pm-4:00pm
Columbine Library
7706 W. Bowles Avenue
Littleton, CO 80123

Zak Smith
February 28, 2013, 10:34 PM
From Senator Ted Harvey

Thank you for your email. I can't express how deeply I appreciate you
taking your time to contact me regarding the Democrats' unprecedented attack
on our right to self-protection.

This nationwide effort, being pushed and financed by New York Mayor Michael
Bloomberg, must be stopped. The fact that the White House is having Vice
President Joe Bidden personally calling Colorado Democrat legislators and
pressuring them to vote for these radical bills is unacceptable!!!

Like you, I am saddened by the tragic events here in Aurora and Newtown,
Connecticut, but we are Coloradoans and we can take care of our own. I have
personally spent time with Aurora community to support them during this
horrific healing process. My family and I pray for them and all the victims
of these tragic murders. Like Governor Hickenlooper said after the Aurora
shooting, however, there is no law that we could pass that would have
stopped this sick and evil person from acting out on his evil intentions.
Certainly putting more feel good, legal red tape on law abiding citizens
will do nothing to stop the evils of gun violence.

ALL of the gun bills in the Senate will be heard in TWO committees on
MONDAY, March 4 at 1:30.

Judiciary Committee (Old Supreme Court Chambers, second floor of the
Capitol)
SB 195--CCW training
SB 196--Assault Weapons ban
HB 1224--Limiting the size of magazines
SB ?--Prohibition of gun possession while under a restraining order

State Affairs Committee (Senate Committee RM 356, third floor of the
Capitol)
HB 1226 Prohibiting Concealed Carry on college campus.
HB 1228 Background fees (Poll Tax)
HB 1229 Universal Background Checks

Each witness in each committee will be given a number indicating the order
in which they will testify (think Deli Counter numbered tickets). Each
witness will be given THREE (3) minutes TOTAL to speak on any/all of the
bills being heard before the that specific committee. This will hopefully
allow all interested citizens the ability to testify before both committees
with the knowledge that they will not lose their place in line in either of
the two committees.

Please have your comments well prepared and practiced to ensure that they
are within the allowed three minute time period.

If you are unable to attend on Monday afternoon please feel free to call or
email any of the members of the two committee and let them know your
position on the bills.

Judiciary
Chairman Guzman--303-866-4862 lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us
Vice Chairman Ulibarri--303-866-4857 Jessie.ulibarri.senate@state.co.us
Senator Aguilar--303-866-4852 Irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us
Senator King--303-866-3077 steve.king.senate@state.co.us
Senator Lundberg--303-866-4853 kevin@kevinlundberg.com

State, Veterans and Military Affairs
Chairman Giron--303-866-4878 angela.giron.senate@state.co.us
Vice Chairman Jones--303-866-5291 senatormattjones@gmail.com
Senator Crowder--303-866-4875 larry.crowder.senate@state.co.us
Senator Harvey--303-866-4881 ted.harvey.senate@state.co.us
Senator Hudak--303-866-4840 senatorhudak@gmail.com

SEE YOU ON MONDAY!!!
Sincerely,

Ted Harvey
Colorado Senator
(SD-30, Douglas County)

Cranky CJ
February 28, 2013, 11:13 PM
I got this today from the Governor, doesn't really say much other than he himself didn't read what I wrote him.

Dear Doug:

Thank you for writing regarding gun control in Colorado. This is an important
subject, and we appreciate the time you took to share your thoughts and
concerns.

Over the past year in Colorado and across the nation, we have experienced an
unprecedented level of tragedy due to gun violence. The shooting that occurred
in Aurora on the night of July 20, 2012, is an event that will remain in our
hearts and minds forever. And while our lives will never be the same again,
these experiences showed the strength and resilience of individuals to come
together as a community. Now, as a community, we must come together to find ways
we can prevent similar tragedies in the future.

Your letter is one of thousands we have received offering thoughts on everything
from banning assault weapons, to increasing mental health availability, to the
rights of citizens to carry concealed weapons. The diversity of opinions on how
best to address this issue is proof positive that we should not shy away from
this discussion. We are confident that through thoughtful and mindful debate we
can find reasonable solutions that respect the rights of law-abiding Coloradans
to own firearms while maintaining the health and safety of our communities.

In Colorado, individuals purchasing firearms at firearms dealerships and gun
shows undergo background checks, and we believe that universal background checks
will help ensure that guns don’t fall into the hands of those who would use them
to harm themselves or others. This is a multifaceted issue and part of this
dialogue should focus on mental health access. In addition to addressing
firearms, we have also asked the Colorado General Assembly to support a
comprehensive overhaul of our state’s mental health system so we can better
deliver support and services to people sooner rather than later, and provide
appropriate interventions.

This is a conversation that will continue throughout the course of this
legislative session, so we also encourage you to share your thoughts with your
legislators. To contact the House of Representatives, please call 303-866-2904.
To contact the Senate, please call 303-866-2316. These contacts will direct your
call to the appropriate office. Or, you can find your legislators online at
http://www.colorado.gov/esri/webmaps/my-hood.html?webmap-id=a4838d49acca478e82f453d209bc81d9


Once again, thank you for your input, and for taking the time to contact our
office. We will keep your thoughts in mind as we move forward.

Sincerely,


Office of Governor John W. Hickenlooper

mokin
March 1, 2013, 06:17 PM
At least one of the hearings has been moved up to 10:30. If you are planning on being there, I'd double check the schedule.....

Zak Smith
March 1, 2013, 06:23 PM
Talked to several Senators today. It was productive..

It looks like we have 2 Dem Senators who will vote against 1224. We only need 3 to defeat any bill.

We spoke to another 6 or 7 and I think there is a pretty good chance we can get at least 1 or 2 to vote with us on 1224. I can't say who those are but the lists of Senators a couple pages back is a good one to use:

linda.newell.senate@gmail.com
nancy.todd.senate@state.co.us
senatorhudak@gmail.com
Irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us
angela.giron.senate@state.co.us
lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us
cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us
john.morse.senate@state.co.us
Gail.Schwartz.senate@state.co.us
Jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us
lois.tochtrop.senate@state.co.us
Andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us
senatormattjones@gmail.com

The key will be sending POLITE messages from mainly constituents of their districts, or anyone.

The Campus Concealed Carry bill has odds about the same as 1224.

We will almost certainly lose UBC's. I am not giving up but the odds are much worse on that one.

There is a lot of criticism at the Capitol about the Senate Bill on "Assault Weapon Liability." I don't know where the votes will stand on it.

Sen Ulibarri will almost certainly vote for them all. He complained to us about getting death threats.

If someone involved in the recalls could contact me via email ASAP I have a House Rep contact to give you.

Zak Smith
March 1, 2013, 11:47 PM
I had omitted one or two important ones.

UPDATE DEM LIST:

linda.newell.senate@gmail.com
nancy.todd.senate@state.co.us
senatorhudak@gmail.com
Irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us
angela.giron.senate@state.co.us
lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us
cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us
john.morse.senate@state.co.us
Gail.Schwartz.senate@state.co.us
Jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us
lois.tochtrop.senate@state.co.us
Andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us
senatormattjones@gmail.com

PedalBiker
March 2, 2013, 09:42 AM
Greater Denver Ministerial Alliance.
http://www.colorado.edu/odece/downloads/GreaterMetroDenverMinisterialAllianceJun05.pdf

This group is supporting Rep Fields in her personal vendetta against gun owners.
If you go to one of these churches you may want to have a word with your pastor and let them know that while you do not condone those who make personal threats against a state legislator you also do not condone a state legislator taking personal issues into the state legislative process.

Fields has admitted publicly that her son's death has made her biased against lawful gun owners - this is not about the law for her, it's retribution for her son's death. That is a serious breech of ethics in my opinion. She is harassing me and my family to satisfy a personal crusade.

longknife12
March 2, 2013, 10:50 PM
I might remind the alliance that a off duty Denver Cop had to take out one of there own a couple of months back on the church parking lot!!! Should we give him back and refer to the legislature?
Dan

Jitterbug
March 3, 2013, 11:13 AM
A copy of my most recent letter to state Senator's with one response back so far.

Also there is a decent article about Guns in Southern Colorado in today's Denver Post, that I thought some of you guy's may appreciate.

http://www.denverpost.com/frontpage/ci_22706454/guns-become-way-life-rural-colorado?source=rss_igoogle

Thank you for participating in the legislative process, I value your input.
I am in the process of reviewing these bills and the legal opinions and research around the policies they propose. I will look at all sides before I make any decisions.
Please feel free to contact me again with any further concerns.

Sincerely,

Senator Irene Aguilar
www.aguilarfor32.com


Sent from my iPad

Dear Senator,

Please protect my Second Amendment rights and vote NO on the current crop of confusing, senseless and abusive gun laws.

I urge you instead to support the Second Amendment and the Colorado Constitution, and seek solutions that will provide us with sound law that is based on logic and reason rather than emotionalism and a decade’s long agenda by extremists to take away and infringe upon the rights of law abiding citizens.

Keeping repeat offenders locked up, enforcement of our current laws, promoting lawful concealed carry and taking a serious look at the current sad state of our mental health system is a much better solution to reducing violent crime than punishing law abiding firearms owners.

Some of these proposed laws may even endanger law abiding citizens, not to mention costing Colorado thousands of jobs. When the hunting community is factored in, the loss to our economy could be staggering. Hunting in Colorado is a $1 billion industry and many hunters are already saying they will no longer travel to, and hunt in Colorado due to the confusing and abusive nature of these laws that are being proposed.

Our background check system could be upgraded to allow those with CCW permits to purchase a firearm without a background check, helping to reduce the load and offset costs on our current system.

I would strongly urge all Colorado lawmakers to take a big step back and work on some cohesive and intelligent laws that will actually reduce crime and protect the citizens of this state rather than infringe upon the rights of the law abiding citizens

If abusive, ineffective gun laws work so well, will you please explain to me why Chicago, New York City and Washington D.C are some of the most dangerous cities in our nation?

My neighbors, friends, family and co-workers are paying attention and we will vote and support those who support our Second Amendment rights in the next election cycle.

Sincerely,

Jitterbug

Rimfaxe
March 5, 2013, 09:49 AM
sent to with 'special 2A sauce' all the way from Virginia.

linda.newell.senate@gmail.com
nancy.todd.senate@state.co.us
senatorhudak@gmail.com
Irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us
angela.giron.senate@state.co.us
lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us
cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us
john.morse.senate@state.co.us
Gail.Schwartz.senate@state.co.us
Jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us
lois.tochtrop.senate@state.co.us
Andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us
senatormattjones@gmail.com

greg@gregbrophy.net, kevin.grantham.senate@state.co.us, mark.scheffel.senate@state.co.us, ellen.roberts.senate@state.co.us, steve.king.senate@state.co.us, randy.baumgardner.senate@state.co.us, senatorlambert@comcast.net, owen.hill.senate@state.co.us, bill.cadman.senate@state.co.us, senatorrenfroe@gmail.com, kevin@kevinlundberg.com, vicki.marble.senate@state.co.us, david.balmer.senate@state.co.us, ted.harvey.senate@state.co.us, larry.crowder.senate@state.co.us, david@davidbalmer.com

swalton1943
March 5, 2013, 10:01 AM
I would ignore these laws. "I sold all my guns before the law passed, and those mags; I didn't ever load more than 5 rounds in them." If the law is ignored it is probally uninforceable. Just my guess?

s9601694
March 5, 2013, 10:26 AM
I would ignore these laws. "I sold all my guns before the law passed, and those mags; I didn't ever load more than 5 rounds in them." If the law is ignored it is probally uninforceable. Just my guess?
exactly what will happen. "I don't own any firearms and no, you may not come into my house to check"

Averageman
March 5, 2013, 06:32 PM
Colorado Liberals grill a Student who was raped.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgXsCnrYZGY&feature=player_embedded
Look at the lies they spout!
It doesn't have to be true, it just has to fit the liberal agenda!

Jitterbug
March 5, 2013, 06:43 PM
That Senator's opponent stood in my living room last fall and asked me to help him, he is a great guy, regretfully I told him I was happy to vote for him but I was too busy with work to get out and help him...he lost to that liberal windbag by 109 votes...

Never again.

The 2014 election cycle starts now.

Arbo
March 5, 2013, 07:46 PM
I had omitted one or two important ones.

UPDATE DEM LIST:

linda.newell.senate@gmail.com
nancy.todd.senate@state.co.us
senatorhudak@gmail.com
Irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us
angela.giron.senate@state.co.us
lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us
cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us
john.morse.senate@state.co.us
Gail.Schwartz.senate@state.co.us
Jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us
lois.tochtrop.senate@state.co.us
Andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us
senatormattjones@gmail.com
Sent to all of those listed:



I am writing to you because I am concerned about several of the current 'gun legislation' bills that have passed the house and are now in the senate.

To cover my concerns:

HB 1226 - Campus Carry Ban: It is unproven that 'gun free zones' stop violent offenders, to the contrary most mass shootings occur in such areas. Why should college students be unable to defend themselves just because they are in college? They can do it in just about any other location legally. It seems that part of 'protecting our kids' is allowing them to protect themselves.

HB 1229 - Background checks for private sales: While it is understandable that people don't want others selling guns to 'bad' people, I'm pretty sure this legislation is not going to actually do any good. It actually makes it harder for citizens to afford guns, thus acts as a sort of 'poll tax' keeping them from practicing their 2nd amendment rights. Private citizens must go to a FFL dealer in order to conduct a private sale, which the dealer get's to charge a fee, seems like a government give away to dealers, allowing them to make more money. As I'm sure you are aware, there are many times more murders committed with knives and blunt objects than there are committed by firearms, so singling out the private sale of firearms while not requiring special licensing, registration and background checks for other inert objects that cause even more injury and death does not really make sense, it's easy to see it as an agenda driven item, rather than actually caring about cutting back crime. In addition, this legislation appears to make colorado go beyond our normal CBI background check, and use the federal system. I see no need in using the federal system, it is known to be slow and ineffective, thus potentially putting an undue restriction on law abiding citizens in terms of waiting times.

HB 1224 - High Capacity Magazine Ban: Why 10 rounds? What is this arbitrary number? First off, many guns are designed with magazines that hold more than 10 rounds... they are not 'high capacity' they are 'standard' capacity. I realize the driving force behind this legislation is the desire to 'get rid of' 30 round AR-15 magazines, but as hopefully you have heard, that wouldn't reduce much of anything. Of the numerous murders that happen with guns in this nation (still far less than with knives and bats), a small fraction occur with rifles, and of that, a fraction of a fraction occur with what the media terms 'assault weapons' which is what this legislation is aimed at. Think about it, even if you could remove ever 'assault weapon' from American society, you might have stopped a dozen or so deaths out of thousands. You'd get better results if you banned knives.

Yes, it is said by those that support such legislation that this would cause less deaths because psychopaths that go on shooting sprees would have 'less bullets'. I'll draw your attention to the VA tech shooter that didn't have an AR-15 or 30 round magazines, he had many handguns and many more loaded magazines and quickly and effectively changed magazines and continued to shoot people. The time it takes to swap out 10 round magazines is negligible, and will not decrease deaths by mass shooters. From what I understand the Aurora shooter had a 100 round magazine, and as anybody familiar with firearms knows, big magazines have more of a tendency to jam, and the Aurora shooters did jam. Let's take a trip of the path of reality and pretend he was a law abiding psychopath and there was a 10 round max magazine limit already in place.... considering the split seconds it takes to drop a mag and load another, and that everyone in the theater was in shock, he probably would have killed even more people as a 10 round mag is far less likely to jam than what he used.

There are several issues with the other bills being proposed as well, but I'm hoping by now you kinda get the point of this letter. I want you to protect the Second Amendment rights of me and every other citizen of Colorado and vote NO on all of these bills which will not stop mass shootings or reduce crime. I welcome a real conversation about mental health and how to spot and stop those that might commit such crimes in the future, but these bills are the wrong path to take.

My friends, family, neighbors and co-workers are all paying attention to what is going on in Denver with these proposed bills, and we will work very hard to support those that support our Second Amendment rights and work to unseat those that do not, in the next election cycle.

razorback2003
March 5, 2013, 07:51 PM
What freedom to smoke pot but no freedom to carry a gun or to own what gun you choose?

Mosbyranger
March 8, 2013, 06:24 PM
Rollie Heath, the state senator from the Peoples Republic of Boulder may pull his bill banning CCW on college campus. The Denver Post is reporting that he does not want it to go to a floor debate because he does not have the votes to get it passed. The Dems have a 20-15 advantage in the Senate of Colorado, but need 18 votes to get anything passed. 2 rural Dems and at least one other have come out against this bill, that coupled with some less than polite treatment of a rape victim by a Senator (female senator no less!) during a hearing seems to have turned the tide on this one. Keep banging away at them boys and girls, this aint over yet.
MR

steelerdude99
March 8, 2013, 07:07 PM
Rollie Heath, the state senator from the Peoples Republic of Boulder may pull his bill banning CCW on college campus. The Denver Post is reporting that he does not want it to go to a floor debate because he does not have the votes to get it passed. ...

It's not that he thinks it's a wrong headed bill; it's that he does not want the press having to say that the pro-gun side won a vote.

chuck

MErl
March 8, 2013, 07:26 PM
the flagship magazine ban is still alive and well.

Mosbyranger
March 8, 2013, 07:36 PM
The mag limit ban is still in play....but... 2 Dems -Jahn and Tochtrop will vote against it. This gives the Dems 18 votes. 3 Dems-Giron of Pueblo, Jones of Louisville and Newell of Littleton are undecided. If any one of those 3 vote against it, it dies. Pueblo is a pretty reddish purple district, so there is a good chance this goes the way of the dodo. Maybe magpul can stay! Keep pounding your state senators boys and girls, lets stop the madness.
MR

longknife12
March 8, 2013, 07:42 PM
Several of us have a Town Hall meeting with Sen Newell in the AM. She sounds a little wavey on the subject.
Dan

9AM at Blueberry Cafe on Littleton Blvd.........anyone care to join us?

threefortyduster
March 8, 2013, 07:43 PM
The mag limit ban is still in play....but... 2 Dems -Jahn and Tochtrop will vote against it. This gives the Dems 18 votes. 3 Dems-Giron of Pueblo, Jones of Louisville and Newell of Littleton are undecided. If any one of those 3 vote against it, it dies. Pueblo is a pretty reddish purple district, so there is a good chance this goes the way of the dodo. Maybe magpul can stay! Keep pounding your state senators boys and girls, lets stop the madness.
MR
Sounds like a lot of pro-firearm tourists need to write letters to these three Senators and let them know that if their vote were to be the one that led to this being passed, said tourist will never spend a dime in their state. People get hung up on the fact that yes, they listen to their constituents, but at the same time, tourism is a big money maker, and funds a lot of taxes that the locals don't pay (hotel tax, rental car taxes, etc).

Jake L
March 8, 2013, 09:29 PM
I wrote some to the point and courteous emails. I hope a few more follow suit.

hotajax
March 8, 2013, 09:37 PM
What can people from other states do to help out? Alot of people think CO is run by lefties, and it won't happen other places. I don't like the thought of a snowball rolling downhill, out of control.

MErl
March 8, 2013, 10:06 PM
at this point, not much anyone can do. Send your last email and watch the show.

DAP90
March 8, 2013, 11:51 PM
9AM at Blueberry Cafe on Littleton Blvd.........anyone care to join us?

See you there.

hso
March 9, 2013, 08:03 AM
Sounds like a lot of pro-firearm tourists need to write letters to these three Senators and let them know that if their vote were to be the one that led to this being passed, said tourist will never spend a dime in their state.

That's a good idea, but I'd focus more on their districts (assuming they have any tourist industry in their districts).

Mosbyranger
March 9, 2013, 09:44 AM
Colorado Senate President John Morse killed his own bill last night. Senate bill 196 would have held firearm sellers liable for the behaviors of the downstream buyer. He blasted the usual suspects (THE GUN LOBBY) for his bill being a non starter once it got to the Senate floor. Keep it up boys and girls, the pressure is starting to take effect, lets keep derailing the other feel good do nothing bills being debated. I doubt we will win on every one, but it's a good start! Banning CCW on campus is in trouble, and the blowback from the magazine ban issue is also having a positive effect. Emails. Letters. Rallies. Personal visits. Keep the pressure on!
MR

almostfree
March 9, 2013, 09:50 AM
While I think 1229 is potentially the most harmful bill in the long run, 1224 is the one that has to be squashed at all costs. I'm afraid that if 1224 passes it will drive too many pro-liberty people and businesses from Colorado and negatively impact future elections.

Mosbyranger
March 9, 2013, 09:55 AM
State Senator Rollie Heath from the Peoples Republic of Boulder killed his bill banning CCW on college campus. Geez- the Denver Post is just chock full of good news this morning. Every co-ed in Colorado should be doing a victory dance. KEEP THE PRESSURE ON! It's having an effect.
MR

Ryanxia
March 9, 2013, 11:28 AM
Great news, keep up the good fight!

DAP90
March 9, 2013, 11:44 AM
Well that’s some good news. I just drove over to the town hall meeting only to find out it had been canceled. I left feeling discouraged that we weren’t having any effect whatsoever.

This stuff works after all.

longknife12
March 9, 2013, 12:37 PM
About 30 of us showed up...no Senator....seems she cancelleled meeting.
I am unable to find any listing of this cancelation....
The 30 of us had a strategy meeting on the bills in play.
Some of you worked all night and still came, my thanks.Truly govenment with out representation!
Dan
:mad:

PedalBiker
March 9, 2013, 01:08 PM
I got exact, word for word duplicate responses from two of my Democrat representatives (both women). They are not even reading our correspondence.

I didn't move to California, California moved to me. It's like a termite infestation.

Bentley4700
March 9, 2013, 02:50 PM
No dems voted against anything. Party lines on all of them.

Mosbyranger
March 9, 2013, 03:04 PM
The committee votes to get the bills to the floor of the Senate were all on party lines. Once the rest of the votes were counted informally and the results were assured, two very bad bills went away. Make no mistake, pressure counts. Dems will vote against these bills if what they are hearing from their districts is overwhelmingly against. It takes 18 Senate votes to get a measure passed, two Dems are against most of the proposals, several from redder districts are leaning towards keeping their seats even if it means not toeing the party line. Pressure works and pressure counts, keep pouring it on.
MR

ghostdncr
March 9, 2013, 03:31 PM
At the urging of a friend who lives there, I've emailed my thoughts on the gun debate to each of Colorado's state legislators. While I'm not a resident of Colorado, my family and I often vacationed there before all the anti-gun foolishness erupted. I wanted to pass along to the legislators that something akin to hell freezing over or the complete cessation of attacks on our 2nd Amendment rights would occur before we ever set foot on Colorado soil again.

I have compiled the email addresses of all listed legislators if you'd like to do the same. Merely copy and paste the following into the address field of your email, compose a short message (perhaps detailing your refusal to visit the state or knowingly purchase goods and/or services originating from there), then send it along so that your feelings will be made known:


"irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us" <irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us>,
"david.balmer.senate@state.co.us" <david.balmer.senate@state.co.us>,
"randy.baumgardner.senate@state.co.us" <randy.baumgardner.senate@state.co.us>,
"greg@gregbrophy.net" <greg@gregbrophy.net>,
"perrybuck49@gmail.com" <perrybuck49@gmail.com>,
"john.buckner.house@state.co.us" <john.buckner.house@state.co.us>,
"bill.cadman.senate@state.co.us" <bill.cadman.senate@state.co.us>,
"morgan.carroll.senate@state.co.us" <morgan.carroll.senate@state.co.us>,
"don.coram.house@state.co.us" <don.coram.house@state.co.us>,
"lois.court.house@state.co.us" <lois.court.house@state.co.us>,
"kathleen.conti.house@state.co.us" <kathleen.conti.house@state.co.us>,
"larry.crowder.senate@state.co.us" <larry.crowder.senate@state.co.us>,
"brian@briandelgrosso.com" <brian@briandelgrosso.com>,
"tim.dore.house@state.co.us" <tim.dore.house@state.co.us>,
"crisanta.duran.house@state.co.us" <crisanta.duran.house@state.co.us>,
"justin.everett.house@state.co.us" <justin.everett.house@state.co.us>,
"thomas.exum.house@state.co.us" <thomas.exum.house@state.co.us>,
"mferrandino@yahoo.com" <mferrandino@yahoo.com>,
"rhonda.fields.house@state.co.us" <rhonda.fields.house@state.co.us>,
"randyfischer@frii.com" <randyfischer@frii.com>,
"mike.foote.house@state.co.us" <mike.foote.house@state.co.us>,
"leroy.garcia.house@state.co.us" <leroy.garcia.house@state.co.us>,
"bob.gardner.house@state.co.us" <bob.gardner.house@state.co.us>,
"cheri.gerou@gmail.com" <cheri.gerou@gmail.com>,
"joann.ginal.house@state.co.us" <joann.ginal.house@state.co.us>,
"angela.giron.senate@state.co.us" <angela.giron.senate@state.co.us>,
"kevin.grantham.senate@state.co.us" <kevin.grantham.senate@state.co.us>,
"lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us" <lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us>,
"lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us" <lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us>,
"millie.hamner.house@state.co.us" <millie.hamner.house@state.co.us>,
"ted.harvey.senate@state.co.us" <ted.harvey.senate@state.co.us>,
"rollie.heath.senate@state.co.us" <rollie.heath.senate@state.co.us>,
"owen.hill.senate@state.co.us" <owen.hill.senate@state.co.us>,
"mary.hodge.senate@state.co.us" <mary.hodge.senate@state.co.us>,
"chris.holbert.house@state.co.us" <chris.holbert.house@state.co.us>,
"senatorhudak@gmail.com" <senatorhudak@gmail.com>,
"dl.hullinghorst.house@state.co.us" <dl.hullinghorst.house@state.co.us>,
"rephumphrey48@yahoo.com" <rephumphrey48@yahoo.com>,
"cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us" <cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us>,
"mike.johnston.senate@state.co.us" <mike.johnston.senate@state.co.us>,
"senatormattjones@gmail.com" <senatormattjones@gmail.com>,
"janak.joshi.house@state.co.us" <janak.joshi.house@state.co.us>,
"repkagan@gmail.com" <repkagan@gmail.com>,
"john.kefalas.senate@state.co.us" <john.kefalas.senate@state.co.us>,
"andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us" <andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us>,
"steve.king.senate@state.co.us" <steve.king.senate@state.co.us>,
"reptracy29@gmail.com" <reptracy29@gmail.com>,
"jeanne.labuda.house@state.co.us" <jeanne.labuda.house@state.co.us>,
"senatorlambert@comcast.net" <senatorlambert@comcast.net>,
"lois.landgraf.house@state.co.us" <lois.landgraf.house@state.co.us>,
"polly.lawrence.house@state.co.us" <polly.lawrence.house@state.co.us>,
"steve.lebsock.house@state.co.us" <steve.lebsock.house@state.co.us>,
"pete.lee.house@state.co.us" <pete.lee.house@state.co.us>,
"claire.levy.house@state.co.us" <claire.levy.house@state.co.us>,
"kevin@kevinlundberg.com" <kevin@kevinlundberg.com>,
"vicki.marble.senate@state.co.us" <vicki.marble.senate@state.co.us>,
"jenise.may.house@state.co.us" <jenise.may.house@state.co.us>,
"beth.mccann.house@state.co.us" <beth.mccann.house@state.co.us>,
"mike.mclachlan.house@state.co.us" <mike.mclachlan.house@state.co.us>,
"jovan.melton.house@state.co.us" <jovan.melton.house@state.co.us>,
"diane.mitschbush.house@state.co.us" <diane.mitschbush.house@state.co.us>,
"dominick.moreno.house@state.co.us" <dominick.moreno.house@state.co.us>,
"john.morse.senate@state.co.us" <john.morse.senate@state.co.us>,
"murrayhouse45@gmail.com" <murrayhouse45@gmail.com>,
"clarice.navarro.house@state.co.us" <clarice.navarro.house@state.co.us>,
"linda.newell.senate@gmail.com" <linda.newell.senate@gmail.com>,
"jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us" <jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us>,
"dan.nordberg.house@state.co.us" <dan.nordberg.house@state.co.us>,
"dan.pabon.house@state.co.us" <dan.pabon.house@state.co.us>,
"cherylin.peniston.house@state.co.us" <cherylin.peniston.house@state.co.us>,
"brittany.pettersen.house@state.co.us" <brittany.pettersen.house@state.co.us>,
"dianne.primavera.house@state.co.us" <dianne.primavera.house@state.co.us>,
"kpriola@gmail.com" <kpriola@gmail.com>,
"bob.rankin.house@state.co.us" <bob.rankin.house@state.co.us>,
"senatorrenfroe@gmail.com" <senatorrenfroe@gmail.com>,
"ellen.roberts.senate@state.co.us" <ellen.roberts.senate@state.co.us>,
"paul.rosenthal.house@state.co.us" <paul.rosenthal.house@state.co.us>,
"su.ryden.house@state.co.us" <su.ryden.house@state.co.us>,
"lori.saine.house@state.co.us" <lori.saine.house@state.co.us>,
"joseph.salazar.house@state.co.us" <joseph.salazar.house@state.co.us>,
"sue.schafer.house@state.co.us" <sue.schafer.house@state.co.us>,
"mark.scheffel.senate@state.co.us" <mark.scheffel.senate@state.co.us>,
"gail.schwartz.senate@gmail.com" <gail.schwartz.senate@gmail.com>,
"ray.scott.house@state.co.us" <ray.scott.house@state.co.us>,
"jonathan.singer.house@state.co.us" <jonathan.singer.house@state.co.us>,
"jerry@repsonnenberg.com" <jerry@repsonnenberg.com>,
"pat.steadman.senate@state.co.us" <pat.steadman.senate@state.co.us>,
"amy.stephens.house@state.co.us" <amy.stephens.house@state.co.us>,
"spencer.swalm.house@state.co.us" <spencer.swalm.house@state.co.us>,
"libby.szabo.house@state.co.us" <libby.szabo.house@state.co.us>,
"lotochtrop@aol.com" <lotochtrop@aol.com>,
"nancy.todd.senate@state.co.us" <nancy.todd.senate@state.co.us>,
"max@maxtyler.us" <max@maxtyler.us>,
"jessie.ulibarri.senate@state.co.us" <jessie.ulibarri.senate@state.co.us>,
"edvigil1@gmail.com" <edvigil1@gmail.com>,
"mark.waller.house@state.co.us" <mark.waller.house@state.co.us>

michaelbsc
March 9, 2013, 03:37 PM
... Make no mistake, pressure counts. Dems will vote against these bills if what they are hearing from their districts is overwhelmingly against. It takes 18 Senate votes to get a measure passed, two Dems are against most of the proposals, several from redder districts are leaning towards keeping their seats even if it means not toeing the party line. Pressure works and pressure counts, keep pouring it on.
MR

To some degree it matters who's in office, but it matters more how much pressure they're under from the public. -- Noam Chomsky

Bentley4700
March 9, 2013, 04:33 PM
Mosbyranger
Member


Join Date: February 13, 2012
Location: Western Colorado
Posts: 65
The committee votes to get the bills to the floor of the Senate were all on party lines. Once the rest of the votes were counted informally and the results were assured, two very bad bills went away. Make no mistake, pressure counts. Dems will vote against these bills if what they are hearing from their districts is overwhelmingly against. It takes 18 Senate votes to get a measure passed, two Dems are against most of the proposals, several from redder districts are leaning towards keeping their seats even if it means not toeing the party line. Pressure works and pressure counts, keep pouring it on.
MR

You are only partly correct. Yes, they passed the house committee, house and senate committee on partly lines. There was much speculation that 2 dems were against a majority of the legislation. However, THEY FLIPPED. It has been reported and witnessed by people I know that were there yesterday, that the votes were right down party lines. 19 dems to 16 repubs. The two bills that didn't make it, we're killed by their own sponsors. Not by vote. You are right, the pressure is getting to them. The pressure from their own party, Bloomberg and his lobbyists, and Washington DC. And now they are even threatening the 23 county sheriffs that testified against the bills! I'm not saying give up the fight. But I am saying that there is some serious behind the scenes shenanigans going on! The deck is stacked against us. Obummer and Biden want to make an example out of us.

BullfrogKen
March 9, 2013, 05:03 PM
Exciting times out there in CO, huh?

hi-tower
March 9, 2013, 10:56 PM
don't give up and remember the ones who came up with these bills in the first place and who voted for them even if they do not become law. The next step is to get them out of office so they can do no harm again. Seems we wil have to keep up the pressure on them until 2014 and hoepfully get them out.

Zak Smith
March 10, 2013, 01:46 AM
There was much speculation that 2 dems were against a majority of the legislation. However, THEY FLIPPED. It has been reported and witnessed by people I know that were there yesterday, that the votes were right down party lines. 19 dems to 16 repubs.
There are 20 Democrats and 15 Republicans in the Colorado Senate. From the eyewitness accounts I got it was 18-17 as expected.

I suspect that the bills that were tabled were tabled because they knew they didn't have the vote. Sen Kefalas was against 1226.

mokin
March 11, 2013, 12:14 AM
So what is this about an amendment in the senate requiring HB 1224 go back to the house where we'll get another crack at it if need be? Says here that Mclaughlin (D) may change his mind, or try to get the capacity increased to 30 rounds. This is the first I've heard of this.

http://www.durangoherald.com/article/20130309/NEWS01/130309602//article/20130309/NEWS01/130309602/Dems-push-gun-measures-give-up-some--

Zak Smith
March 11, 2013, 12:17 AM
There HAS BEEN at least one amendment to HB-1224 since it left the House, so I would expect that it has to go back there.

mrvco
March 11, 2013, 01:27 PM
They absolutely don't want a losing vote... that would be a nightmare in the upcoming election. They couldn't campaign on passing the bills (rallying their base) and the vulnerable senators and reps that voted in favor would still get hammered by their opposition in 2014 (even though they are sacrificial lambs either way, they vote no and they'll have a strong Bloomberg-funded primary challenger, vote yes and they'll have a strong Republican challenger).

Reading that DH article, I find it interesting that their Democrat Representative who voted for the mag ban now wants to raise the mag limit to 30-rounds... there is definitely some serious pressure being felt by these guys.

I am glad the campus carry ban didn't pass... that is the one bill that would have the most immediate and direct effect on individual safety.

CoRoMo
March 11, 2013, 01:31 PM
...one amendment to HB-1224 since it left the House...
What is this amendment?

Zak Smith
March 11, 2013, 01:43 PM
Shotgun mag tubes limited to 28" instead of "8 rounds"

CoRoMo
March 11, 2013, 01:52 PM
Weird.

So, this goes back to the House. If Rep. Mike McLachlan then amends it in the House to bump it up to 30 rounds, does it have to make a trip back through the Senate for their approval of the new House amendment?

Arbo
March 11, 2013, 02:06 PM
I'd imagine so. But I'm guessing there is NO WAY IN HELL, even though he is a (D) that he would get an amendment passed to it that makes the limit 30 rounds... it's more likely they won't pass such a thing and perhaps he changes his vote on the bill.

mrvco
March 11, 2013, 02:13 PM
If they did manage to change it to 30-rounds... I'm certainly not looking forward to the discussions over whether "we" could rightfully declare it as a victory :cuss:

Regardless, I don't think the fire-breathing antis would acquiesce to a 30-round limit just to get something passed. 20 -maybe-, but the 30-round mag is way too symbolic.


edit - BGC's passed

michaelbsc
March 11, 2013, 04:47 PM
I don't think you could call any arbitrary number, including those round drums that I happen to think are stupid, a victory for our side.

While I might not want one, a 250 round magazine is no more deadly than a bolt action rifle or a pocket knife. The user is the weapon.

That said, political reality might turn out different.

joepmo
March 11, 2013, 07:25 PM
1224 passes 18-17. :banghead: Line up the trucks Magpul.

I am saddened to say the least. Especially by the tripe dribbling out of the Democrats about bipartisanship. Wow what a lack of courage. Hope the voters make them pay. Way to make a much of new criminals out of law abiding citizens.

Valiant effort to the Senators that stood up for our rights.

Dr.Rob
March 11, 2013, 07:47 PM
Passed with much arm twisting and outright ignoring the will of the people.

mrvco
March 11, 2013, 08:19 PM
Get ready to VOTE in 2014!

Trisha
March 11, 2013, 08:24 PM
They have an agenda and a very narrow window. The large picture seems to show that to be a worldwide process as the printing machines destroy economies and we are criminalized.

The next months will be for the hardy.

Texshooter
March 11, 2013, 09:32 PM
To the decent people of CO. - stand strong. Many are praying for you.

Try to dissuade any ************ immigrants. Be rude to them if they are of non-free mentality. Try to win them over, but remember you are in a war for Freedom.

Good luck.

Bentley4700
March 11, 2013, 09:49 PM
Please don't forget IT'S NOT OVER! All but 1228 were amended which means back to the house. KEEP THE HEAT UP! Never give up.

BK
March 11, 2013, 09:53 PM
News coverage of the Senate passage is going to shake just a few more gun owners out of their activist slumber. Have them join you to hit the house hard with emails. Let the law makers hear the roar of discontent. It's not over guys. Good luck. If this is the end, make it such an end worthy of remembrance.

bowfin
March 11, 2013, 10:46 PM
If any of these are signed into law, it gives me a reason not to visit the in-laws in Colorado Springs any more...

...I wish Coors would move out of Colorado as well.

Arbo
March 11, 2013, 10:48 PM
Those of us that live in CO wish coors would move out as well.

mokin
March 11, 2013, 11:53 PM
Don't count us out yet. So far the fat lady (cough -Aurora) hasn't sung yet. I've heard there is lots of pressure on McLachlan these days.

We need to not only keep writing our representatives but also show support for the sheriffs who opposed these bills.

mrvco
March 12, 2013, 12:36 AM
Keep on fighting, turn the House and Senate in 2014 and the Governor in 2016... Meanwhile, hopefully we'll have some opportunities to fight in the courts.

Mosbyranger
March 12, 2013, 11:02 AM
Well, a bitter disappointment. Thanks to Dem. Senators Tochtrop and Jahn for voting against the mag ban. Too bad we couldn't get one more (are you listening Giron of Pueblo?) Senate President Morse thinks that he has represented the will of the "vast majority" of Colorado. I guess we will find out in 2014. I'm afraid it will be very difficult to undo the mischief caused by these bills. Goodbye Magpul, and your jobs. Hope Wyoming enjoys the new revenue.
MR

On the + side, at least the "Campus rapist protection act" and the downstream liability bills were spiked. Scant consolation.

CoRoMo
March 12, 2013, 11:32 AM
Thanks to Dem. Senators Tochtrop and Jahn for voting against the mag ban.
Did they vote FOR the other bills?

I'd like to send them Thank You emails for voting against the mag ban, but if they voted for the other bills, I want to also tell them that I'm disappointed about that.

cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us; lotochtrop@aol.com; lois.tochtrop.senate@state.co.us; senloistochtrop@aol.com

If anyone else wants to join me in thanking them, their addresses are above. Tochtrop has a few, one of which might not be correct.

Mosbyranger
March 12, 2013, 11:48 AM
The domestic Violence vote (no firearms for those with DV restraining orders) was approved 20-15 on a straight party line vote. The bill banning online CCW certification was passed 22-13. Universal Background checks passes 19-16, Tochtrop voted against it. Background check fees passes 19-16, Kerr (Lakewood) was the only Dem. to vote against it. Magazine size limits, well we know that score.
MR

cor_man257
March 12, 2013, 01:31 PM
If you live in Colorado don't think your alone. I'm from NY and we have been railroaded the same way you have. Don't listen when folks try to tell ytou this is your own fault. Just email, petition, protest, and speak out.

We may be getting an injunction against our new maddness (not the old. Yet.) because of our constant pressure on politicians. Email, Call, Protest, Petition, and get your counties to pass legislation in protest. Your civil rights lawyers will be looking to make a name for themselves in no time.

Keep fighting. Your not alone.

cologuy
March 12, 2013, 01:51 PM
McLaughlin might be rethinking his stand on these bills because the folks in his district filed a recall petition with the CO Sec of State a couple of days ago. The recall for Morse (Senate Pres) should be in the Sec of State's office today, if my source is correct. For those of you in Pueblo, the local Republican party is having a meeting TONIGHT at 6 pm at Montgomery and Stewart downtown to discuss a recall petition for Giron. Scott Gessler (the Sec of State) will be there to discuss the legal and technical aspects of a recall, and some reps from Co Springs and Durango who initiated the other two recalls are supposed to be there for advice, also. Be there if you can.

Black Butte
March 12, 2013, 01:52 PM
If you check the 2008 and 2012 data, only half of Colorado residents even bothered to vote. This 50% split is projected across gun owners as well. That means half the people now whining about the gun bans didn't even bother to vote in the last two elections for Senators, Representatives, Governor, etc..

This shows how important it is to vote. Gun owners lost by a single vote.

Bentley4700
March 12, 2013, 06:41 PM
Lets stand with the Senators that are fighting hard and stated publicly that they will not comply with these new laws! If you are on FB, please like this page!
http://www.facebook.com/home.php#!/pages/I-Stand-with-Senator-Brophy/500772346656698

hso
March 13, 2013, 10:58 AM
Let's stay focused on what can be done to stop these before they get to the signing stage and what can be done to fight them if that fails.

The recall idea is a very valuable one. McLaughlin, Morse, Gessler recall efforts were already mentioned. Is this a coordinated effort or is this just random groups within the districts? Is there one key politician that all the effort should be focused upon like knocking a keystone out of a wall to weaken and collapse it?

CoRoMo
March 13, 2013, 11:14 AM
Recalling Hudak and Salazar seem like the easiest targets as they were the ones caught up in remarks that had to be walked back. They've got a black eye in public and can be thrown out based on insensitivity.

Zak Smith
March 13, 2013, 12:26 PM
I won't go into too much detail but there are some factors to take into consideration when deciding who to recall: how many signatures would be required and by what margin they won by.

mrvco
March 13, 2013, 01:46 PM
Based on McLachlan's comments, it's at least worth beating the drum in advance of the two bills going back to the house.

almostfree
March 13, 2013, 03:46 PM
1229 went back to committee. Good, bad, or neither?

MRH
March 13, 2013, 06:22 PM
Please tell the CO Governor and the legislature about your plans to not come to the state if the gun bills are signed. HB1224 on magazine limits is on the way to him. HB1229 on background checks was sent back to committee for rework, but may still make it through the legislature.

Here is the Governor's address:

http://www.colorado.gov/govhdir

Here is the list of all CO state Representatives and Senators:

irene.aguilar.senate@state.co.us, david.balmer.senate@state.co.us, randy.baumgardner.senate@state.co.us, greg@gregbrophy.net, perrybuck49@gmail.com, john.buckner.house@state.co.us, bill.cadman.senate@state.co.us, morgan.carroll.senate@state.co.us, kathleen.conti.house@state.co.us, don.coram.house@state.co.us, lois.court.house@state.co.us, larry.crowder.senate@state.co.us, brian@briandelgrosso.com, tim.dore.house@state.co.us, crisanta.duran.house@state.co.us, justin.everett.house@state.co.us, thomas.exum.house@state.co.us, mferrandino@yahoo.com, rhonda.fields.house@state.co.us, randyfischer@frii.com, mike.foote.house@state.co.us, leroy.garcia.house@state.co.us, bob.gardner.house@state.co.us, cheri.gerou@gmail.com, joann.ginal.house@state.co.us, angela.giron.senate@state.co.us, kevin.grantham.senate@state.co.us, lucia.guzman.senate@state.co.us, millie.hamner.house@state.co.us, ted.harvey.senate@state.co.us, rollie.heath.senate@state.co.us, owen.hill.senate@state.co.us, mary.hodge.senate@state.co.us, chris.holbert.house@state.co.us, senatorhudak@gmail.com, dl.hullinghorst.house@state.co.us, rephumphrey48@yahoo.com, cheri.jahn.senate@state.co.us, mike.johnston.senate@state.co.us, senatormattjones@gmail.com, janak.joshi.house@state.co.us, repkagan@gmail.com, john.kefalas.senate@state.co.us, andy.kerr.senate@state.co.us, steve.king.senate@state.co.us, reptracy29@gmail.com, jeanne.labuda.house@state.co.us, senatorlambert@comcast.net, lois.landgraf.house@state.co.us, polly.lawrence.house@state.co.us, steve.lebsock.house@state.co.us, pete.lee.house@state.co.us, claire.levy.house@state.co.us, kevin@kevinlundberg.com, vicki.marble.senate@state.co.us, jenise.may.house@state.co.us, beth.mccann.house@state.co.us, mike.mclachlan.house@state.co.us, jovan.melton.house@state.co.us, diane.mitschbush.house@state.co.us, dominick.moreno.house@state.co.us, john.morse.senate@state.co.us, murrayhouse45@gmail.com, clarice.navarro.house@state.co.us, linda.newell.senate@gmail.com, jeanne.nicholson.senate@state.co.us, dan.nordberg.house@state.co.us, dan.pabon.house@state.co.us, cherylin.peniston.house@state.co.us, brittany.pettersen.house@state.co.us, dianne.primavera.house@state.co.us, kpriola@gmail.com, bob.rankin.house@state.co.us, senatorrenfroe@gmail.com, ellen.roberts.senate@state.co.us, paul.rosenthal.house@state.co.us, su.ryden.house@state.co.us, lori.saine.house@state.co.us, joseph.salazar.house@state.co.us, sue.schafer.house@state.co.us, mark.scheffel.senate@state.co.us, gail.schwartz.senate@gmail.com, ray.scott.house@state.co.us, jonathan.singer.house@state.co.us, jerry@repsonnenberg.com, pat.steadman.senate@state.co.us, amy.stephens.house@state.co.us, spencer.swalm.house@state.co.us, libby.szabo.house@state.co.us, lotochtrop@aol.com, nancy.todd.senate@state.co.us, max@maxtyler.us, jessie.ulibarri.senate@state.co.us, edvigil1@gmail.com, mark.waller.house@state.co.us, angela.williams.house@state.co.us, james.wilson.house@state.co.us, jared.wright.house@state.co.us, dave.young.house@state.co.us


Mike

Jitterbug
March 13, 2013, 06:43 PM
Does the new magazine ban effectively ban most ALL magazine fed firearms....see this quick video from KHOW

http://www.khow.com/cc-common/news/sections/newsarticle.html?feed=467632&article=11061231

s9601694
March 13, 2013, 06:47 PM
Sent him a "please please listen to Coloradans" email.. I doubt it will make any impact though. WHEN (not if) he gets voted out of office I'm sure uncle Joe in DC or uncle Mike in NY will have a nice BS job for his obedient servant from CO.

Trisha
March 13, 2013, 06:53 PM
The Governor sounded so nervous on the radio today.

He really should go back to being just a barkeep.

Prophet
March 13, 2013, 09:15 PM
From Magpul's FB page today;

The Governor's office is still tallying emails for and against the gun bills that have been passed, in order to inform Governor Hickenlooper of public opinion on whether they should be signed into law or not. Let him know that they should not!

Use the contact form at http://www.colorado.gov/govhdir/requests/opinion-leg.html to register your disagreement with HB1224 and the other gun bills. Please keep your message brief, polite, and to the point that you oppose HB1224 and all other anti-gun legislation, and urge the governor to VETO these bills.

I wrote even though I'm from PA, and advise every member to do the same regardless of state.

Zak Smith
March 13, 2013, 11:10 PM
Everyone in colorado contact hickenlooper now.

Sample messages

i am a small business owner in colorado.

Please veto hb 1224.

Research has shown that this legislation will not reduce crime.

But we know that it will hurt colorado's economy.

My own business interests may have to move out of state if this passes.



i am a small business owner in colorado.

Please veto hb 1229.

This bill is so poorly worded that it's not even clear that you can relinquish control of a firearm to an airline while flying out of or in to dia.

My own business interests may have to move out of state if this passes.

hankforker
March 14, 2013, 02:43 AM
Just let the governor know that if he signs Hb1224 that I will never set foot in Colorado.
-some guy in Ohio

MRH
March 14, 2013, 01:44 PM
Jitterbug: Essentially YES. Any that can be modified or extended, which covers nearly all of them.

csspecs
March 14, 2013, 04:27 PM
While its said the proposed law is to reduce mass shootings like sandy hook, has any testing been done to confirm this will actually help? It seems that school security is lacking if a 20 year old can force the door in, I don't see the death toll being lower with a pump shotgun, or even a single shot.

If schools had actual security doors installed, that "attack" would be a page 4 story about a guy shooting at the front door and then killing himself as police arrived.

The whole gun ban is a cover for the governments liability for failing to secure schools.

Akita1
March 15, 2013, 03:18 PM
Dear Gov. Hickenlooper,

As ski enthusiasts, my family and I frequent CO (various resorts/mountains) annually to ski and have thoroughly enjoyed our experiences over the years.

Having said that, we also are very intentional with how and where we commit our resources. Given the recent legislation, we will no longer visit Colorado for our vacations (and will be sure to convince all of our friends to do the same) if these draconian bills are signed into law.

Candidly, I hope that Magpul (and others) also vote with their resources and relocate their business to another state. Sometimes it is necessary for actions, versus words, to demonstrate how truly serious we are about our rights.

Drafting, passing and enacting laws based on emotion versus factual/logical impact is simply unacceptable and is contrary to effective governance. "See what I did to protect you?" is not a valid platform upon which legislators should campaign. Sadly, career politics have poisoned the well.

We sincerely hope you will consider these circumstances when you weigh whether or not to sign these "gun control" bills into law. As drafted, and in my humble opinion, none will have a significant impact on the intent and infringe on rights granted to us by the Bill of Rights.

Respectfully,

XXXXXX
Orlando, FL

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