M&P 9c vs J frame


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jacob2745
February 13, 2013, 08:12 PM
My edc is a M&P 9c, and have been contemplating getting a j frame. I carry iwb, and I was curious how the revolver would compare to the M&P in that form of carry. I'm assuming the revolver may be a bit wider, but I'm not sure. It just seems the shape of the revolver is very different. So in short, how will a j frame revolver compare to a M&P 9c carrying iwb?

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jon_in_wv
February 13, 2013, 08:25 PM
The revolver will feel slightly, only slightly smaller due to the much thinner frame and barrel. I think you will very disappointed when you find just how close they are in overall size yet you sacrifice a lot in ammo capacity, reloading ease, sights, shootability, trigger, and just about every other factor. You didn't mention what you carry your M&P in but I carry mine in a Peter's Custom Holster. Its really thin and stable and I find it perfect for carry. I've used mine for about 4 years now. I did glue a thin later of suede on the side towards my body. You may find having the right holster would make much more difference than switching to the revolver.

If you are just looking for something smaller the size I would highly recommend you look at a S&W Shield or the like. Recently I've started carrying a S&W 3913. Its a bit slimmer than the M&P and I find it an awesome shooter. When I need something really small I carry a BG380 in my pocket holster. If I'm going out with the wife I'll carry it on my weak side opposite my M&P. I would rather have a back up weapon to arm the wife than another 12 rounds.

FLA2760
February 13, 2013, 08:46 PM
The J frame revolvers carry very well IWB.

jon_in_wv
February 13, 2013, 09:10 PM
Uumm, so do a lot of weapons including the M&P9C. I've carried mine for years. And I've carried a snubby too. I think the issue at hand is whether there is anything to be gained by switching from the M&P to the snubby. A lightweight snubby would carry like a dream but holding a candle to the M&P as a shooter? Not even close. In fact pick a slim holster and lighten your M&P by only loading it with five rounds and I would say the advantage of the snubby is nil. The M&P would still have a better trigger, sights, and reload much easier.
That being said, the snubby would be good for times when you want to pocket carry BUT I find the smaller 380s like the BG380 to fill that role much better too. If you can only have one gun the snubby is hard to beat for its versatility but to supplement an already fine carry gun I think it is too close in size to offer any real advantage while giving up too much in the trade.

jacob2745
February 13, 2013, 10:44 PM
I'm not looking to replace the M&P. It will remain my primary edc. I just don't own a revolver. I thought about adding one to the safe, and maybe occasionally carry it. I was just curious about how it would carry.

jon_in_wv
February 13, 2013, 11:10 PM
In that case by all means get one. If I may make a suggestion I recently bought a vintage Charter Arms Bulldog. I can't even say how much I like that little 44. A 38 may be easier to find ammo for though. If you ask me stay away from any revolver less than 14 oz and stay away from ANY alloy framed 357. I don't care what any many man on here says they are MISERABLE to shoot. I had a scandium frame S&W 38 that hurt like hell to shoot and shooting it quickly or very well was must way too much effort. Years ago I had a S&W 442 that was a pretty good carry gun. If I were to buy another today, other than another bulldog, I would get one of the 6 shot K frame snubs or a Ruger SP101. I haven't tried the new breed of polymer revolvers but that may be a real option too. Polymer has a way of mitigating a little bit of that nasty recoil.

PabloJ
February 14, 2013, 02:11 AM
Learn from my mistake. Keep your pistol and forget about the five-shot revolver. Remember if you want lighter carry weapon you can always load fewer then 12 cartridges into your pistol magazine.

ArchAngelCD
February 14, 2013, 09:09 AM
Learn from my mistake. Keep your pistol and forget about the five-shot revolver. Remember if you want lighter carry weapon you can always load fewer then 12 cartridges into your pistol magazine.
On the other hand I carry a J frame daily and fell it's no mistake at all. I like revolvers and they shoot well if you practice. Carry a good SD ammo like Speer Short Barrel 135gr .38 Spl +P and you are well armed. (in most SD situations)

jacob2745
February 14, 2013, 04:27 PM
I also thought that becoming proficient with the dao trigger of a revolver would most likely help my trigger control overall.

jon_in_wv
February 14, 2013, 11:29 PM
Trigger control is trigger control. Any practice is good. If you really want to improve your shooting spend that time with your EDC and buy a 22 pistol. My shooting improved the most when I bought my SIG Trailside and fired an extra 50-100 rounds each session with it. The SAO trigger is totally different than my M&P but the principles are the same. If you will shoot more because you have the revolver your shooting will improve. If you are going to split the difference between the two then you won't see much improvement.

KenW.
February 15, 2013, 12:05 AM
There are a couple of guns every gunowner should possess, one of which is a J-Frame .38.

ArchAngelCD
February 15, 2013, 12:05 AM
There are a couple of guns every gunowner should possess, one of which is a J-Frame .38.
I hear that and I agree so much I have quite a bit more than just one! lol

needmorecowbell
February 15, 2013, 09:07 AM
I use the j frame for those times when my t shirts aren't quite baggy enough to hide the grip on my Kahr CW9 or when I want to throw it in a pocket. Great to have as one of your CCW options.

Hapworth
February 15, 2013, 09:23 AM
J-frame snubby, especially if it's an Airweight in a decent IWB holster -- you're likely to forget you're wearing it half the time.

Do you ever forget you're carrying your M&Pc?

surferdaddy
February 15, 2013, 11:40 AM
I edc a m&p 40c and also own a 638. No comparison in ease of carry...hiwever,no comparison in power either. Get you a j frame, as said, everyone really should have one. I don't iwb my airweight, it is my pocket gun for times when i can't have a gun or want to back up my m&p. It's a great "round the house" gun. I am a bigger guy, but find the revo fits a front pocket about as well as a 380 and there is no comparison between 380 and 38 +p; regardless of what people say.

jacob2745
February 15, 2013, 12:13 PM
I do forget I'm carrying the M&P. It is a great carry gun. I was just thinking if adding a revolver to the collection.

jon_in_wv
February 15, 2013, 12:38 PM
In a proper holster the M&P 9C is very comfortable. What exactly is the purpose of "forgetting" you are carrying? I could carry my BG380 or nothing at all if that is the goal. The goal is to carry an effective means of defending myself and those I love. I won't sacrifice effectiveness for a little bit of perceived comfort. I've moved lately to carrying my 3913. It is a little thinner than the M&P and is even more comfortable to carry while being equally as accurate and easy to shoot. In all honesty the size and weight of the snubby to the M&P 9C or Glock 26 are really not enough to make the switch worth it unless you carry one of the extremely light weight revolvers. People will say they can shoot them well but I guarantee an average shooter of equal skill can out shoot you with that pistol all day long and still have twice as much ammo to do it too. My first priority in a carry weapon is that it is a good weapon and a good choice for self defense. The snubby is very limited in both function and caliber compared to so many other good choices out there. Revolvers are cool and fun to shoot and I don't think choosing it for your carry weapon is a bad thing necessarily but if I have to carry something to defend the most important things in my life, which would be the life of my family and my own, I'm going to carry the weapon I can use most effectively to defend it. A revolver just isn't it.

PabloJ
February 15, 2013, 12:56 PM
The light weight five-shot revolver is a pointless weapon. The only ones that could see benefit from them are people that are not used to firearms where simplicity of operation is paramount and those folks could not handle recoil generated by such weapon anyway.

jon_in_wv
February 15, 2013, 01:34 PM
I was trying not to be blunt Pablo but that pretty much sums up my feelings too except for the person who can only have ONE pistol a small revolver is a pretty good choice if only for its versatility. It carries well on the waist or in the pocket. But if you can have two there are far better choices for either mode of carry.

If my EDC carry was a revolver IWB I see no advantage at all of the J Frame over a K-Frame 6 shot 357 in either a 2 or 3 inch barrel. In fact I would see the J frame as the lesser option.

jacob2745
February 15, 2013, 03:09 PM
The "point" of forgetting you are carrying something is purely a reference to how comfortable it is. While the M&P will remain my primary edc, after a little while with a revolver I wouldn't feel "outgunned" only having five shots.

Hapworth
February 15, 2013, 03:15 PM
In a proper holster the M&P 9C is very comfortable. What exactly is the purpose of "forgetting" you are carrying?OP's question concerns how the M&Pc carries IWB versus the J-frame. The "purpose" isn't to forget one's carrying; however, forgetting your piece is there has value as a metric of ease and comfort in carrying.

The goal is to carry an effective means of defending myself and those I love. I won't sacrifice effectiveness for a little bit of perceived comfort. I've moved lately to carrying my 3913. It is a little thinner than the M&P and is even more comfortable to carry while being equally as accurate and easy to shoot. In all honesty the size and weight of the snubby to the M&P 9C or Glock 26 are really not enough to make the switch worth it unless you carry one of the extremely light weight revolvers. People will say they can shoot them well but I guarantee an average shooter of equal skill can out shoot you with that pistol all day long and still have twice as much ammo to do it too. My first priority in a carry weapon is that it is a good weapon and a good choice for self defense. The snubby is very limited in both function and caliber compared to so many other good choices out there. Revolvers are cool and fun to shoot and I don't think choosing it for your carry weapon is a bad thing necessarily but if I have to carry something to defend the most important things in my life, which would be the life of my family and my own, I'm going to carry the weapon I can use most effectively to defend it. A revolver just isn't it.Good points all and good, too, that you know what works for you. In danger, though, of turning this into a revolver versus semi-auto thread, which as the OP has already noted once isn't his question.

Skribs
February 15, 2013, 04:14 PM
J-frame will conceal a bit better...curves hide easier than a block, and while they are roughly the same dimensions on paper (LxWxH), the majority of the revolver is half the width and the profile is smaller if you stand them on grip+muzzle.

However, I personally will not carry less than 10 rounds unless it is a pocket pistol and I'm wearing clothes that will not support a bigger weapon (i.e. running shorts). I look at the recent story of the woman who shot a home invader 5 times in the face, and he ran away from the scene. If he'd had the fortitude to continue the attack and/or had backup, those 5 shots would not have been enough.

Hapworth
February 16, 2013, 09:32 AM
...after a little while with a revolver I wouldn't feel "outgunned" only having five shots.Love the J-frames myself. Consider the 442 Moon Clip and you won't feel like you only have five shots; ejection and reload times on par with semi-auto -- they're fantastic.

jon_in_wv
February 16, 2013, 03:36 PM
OP's question concerns how the M&Pc carries IWB versus the J-frame. The "purpose" isn't to forget one's carrying; however, forgetting your piece is there has value as a metric of ease and comfort in carrying.

Yup, and you didn't read where I addressed both of those issues? Having owned and carried both, which I would wager many who offer their opinions haven't, I already offered my opinion. Like I said, the difference in size and comfort between the two is minimal. A slim pistol like the M&P Shield or my 3913 is more comfortable than either of them if you only gauge of a carry piece is comfort. Another factor to consider is carrying spare ammo. A reload of a single stack 9mm is much more comfortable and reliable to carry than a speed loader. I don't know how to sum my opinion up any better than that. I guess people who don't agree with it won't accept it for what it is. The answer for you is to offer a diverging opinion rather than attack mine or question my ability to understand the question. The information is supposed to be for the OP and for the sake of discussion. We don't have to all agree on the answer.

Hapworth
February 16, 2013, 05:48 PM
Yup, and you didn't read where I addressed both of those issues? Having owned and carried both, which I would wager many who offer their opinions haven't, I already offered my opinion. Like I said, the difference in size and comfort between the two is minimal. A slim pistol like the M&P Shield or my 3913 is more comfortable than either of them if you only gauge of a carry piece is comfort. Another factor to consider is carrying spare ammo. A reload of a single stack 9mm is much more comfortable and reliable to carry than a speed loader. I don't know how to sum my opinion up any better than that. I guess people who don't agree with it won't accept it for what it is. The answer for you is to offer a diverging opinion rather than attack mine or question my ability to understand the question. The information is supposed to be for the OP and for the sake of discussion. We don't have to all agree on the answer.Please explain where my saying all your points were good ones, and commending you for having done your homework and knowing experientially what worked for you, was an attack?

You strayed off topic on why you prefer semi-auto to revolver for carry; your reasoning was good but not what the original poster asked about, and also a topic that gets, shall we say, passionate pretty fast for some, so I reiterated the thread topic. Never suggested you didn't understand the original question; never attacked your opinion; quite the opposite, in fact.

Finally, I answered the question you asked: what's the "purpose" of forgetting you're carrying? You interpreted forgetting to be some kind of goal when that wasn't my point so I -- at your prompting -- clarified that it's simply a metric of comfort.

The topic remains: IBW carry of a J-frame versus an M&Pc.

Fleetman
February 16, 2013, 07:48 PM
J-frames have their place. My wife is unable to RELIABLY work a slide on any centerfire auto thus her choice of carry is a S&W 360.

She even tried a Tomcat and the tip-up barrel was "ok"....her words but she preferred a beefier caliber.

I agree with most in here....even though it is chambered for .357, it is foolish to fire it with them....38's are plenty.

jon_in_wv
February 16, 2013, 08:29 PM
So in your opinion I should have only directed my response at the comfort level he originally asked for and not offered any input at all as to any other aspect of it. I see. So I did that. Anyone who shares your opinion can ignore the rest since I guess the thought police have spoken. For the rest my point wasn't revolver vs auto it was the difference between the M&P and the J frame revolver which IS the topic at hand and my point, for those who couldn't understand it, was that the size difference and presence on the the hip are very close and there is little to be gained in comfort but there is something to be lost in capability of the two weapons that makes any slight difference in size non profitable. Rather than a revolver vs auto issue it is a revolver vs M&P issue, just as the OP suggested.

Cricoid
February 17, 2013, 12:02 AM
I have both....the true beauty of the little J frame lies in its ease of pocket carry. There is just no excuse not to stick it in your pocket. I have a lot of CCW pieces, but I have my 642 on me the most. Very comforting to pump gas in a winter coat with your hand on the gun!

easyg
February 17, 2013, 04:32 PM
I also thought that becoming proficient with the dao trigger of a revolver would most likely help my trigger control overall.
It might, but it will cost you lots of $$$ in ammo and range time.
Snubbies are not so easily mastered.

As for how a revolver carries inside the waistband...it's "okay" but really no better than an autoloader.
The grip will not rest flat against your side because of the cylinder bulge.

After trying to like them for years, I have gotten rid of all my snub-nose revolvers.
I simply have no use for them.
Plus, the .38 special isn't really that special when it comes out of a 2" barrel.

jhco50
February 18, 2013, 02:26 AM
J-Frames carry pretty well openly too. I know.

Hammerdown77
February 18, 2013, 01:05 PM
Plus, the .38 special isn't really that special when it comes out of a 2" barrel.

Neither is most 9mm when it comes out of a subcompact.

Both are compromises for SD. I like the idea of the semi-auto holding 10+ rounds and another 10 with a quick mag change when faced with the possibility of multiple attackers (which seems to be common in my area). I carry a J frame probably more often than any of my other options during the Summer, though. I think I'd probably feel better having two on me.

mooner
February 18, 2013, 01:35 PM
I have both and wouldn't give up either. As mentioned, pocket carry is where the J frame is strong. The M&P is easier to shoot and holds more rounds, but I think the J frame is easier to carry and gets carried more often. Besides, snubby revolvers are cool.

ASCTLC
February 18, 2013, 06:10 PM
A revolver IWB can be as comfortable, if not more comfortable, than an autoloader IWB if you have a good holster and not just one of those dime-a-dozen cheapie holsters. The shape of the revolver makes a difference for the reason Skribs points out.

I carry an old Rossi 971 2 1/2" .357 mag IWB and it is much more comfortable than my Block 19. That old Rossi is significantly larger than my J frame 642 being my Rossi is a K frame clone.

Heck I even carry a 4" 686 IWB just fine. The barrel length is at the max limit but the cylinder diameter is not any more issue than the K frame cylinder diameter.

A J frame to me is just too small to even try to make an IWB for. It fits in pockets but not all pockets. I wear blue jeans 95% of the time and there's no way I'm getting a J frame in those pockets without discomfort or the grip sticking out. Dockers and dress pants tend to hold the J frame fine for me.

Having said all that, I'm only pointing out relative comfort. The G19 is comfortable for me and I wear it when I'm all day in and out of Mastercraft suspension seats when four wheeling. I still daily my G19 but that's a round count decision, not a comfort decision. If I need more comfort or easier to conceal, the 971 definitely meets that requirement.

The issue for a decent size revolver IWB is finding a company that will build one. Seems to be too much bias against the revolver cylinder simply due to width without consideration for all the other dimensions that also count.

Andy

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