Documenting ownership "as of date"


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Keb
February 15, 2013, 01:13 PM
Some of these states are comtemplating grandfathering clauses for items such as hi-cap magazines.

What are some methods to document your prior to date ownership?

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Art Eatman
February 15, 2013, 01:33 PM
Sales receipt from an established business, showing the date of sale.

Photograph of the mags on the front page of a newspaper, with the date showing.

skiking
February 15, 2013, 02:07 PM
photograph items, ship photos to yourself signature required. Print proof of delivery and don't open package.

kanook
February 15, 2013, 02:11 PM
Photograph of the mags on the front page of a newspaper, with the date showing. cause we know nobody keeps old newspapers :banghead:

ediogenes
February 15, 2013, 02:17 PM
I would think the government would have to prove that the magazines were purchased after the ban came into effect. But I guess such precautions would effectively preclude prosecution. Like having an alibi.

kanook
February 15, 2013, 02:19 PM
just because I can't prove Im innocent, :they" still have to prove guilt

HankR
February 15, 2013, 02:43 PM
Real (printed) photograph in real (snail) mail w/ postmark and unopened?

Real (printed) photograph with a description paragraph, signed (by you) and notarized as of a certain date?

just because I can't prove Im innocent, :they" still have to prove guilt

Used to be. Not so much anymore. They only need to prove guilt if it actually goes to court. Even if they don't burn you to death during the search, they could just "confiscate" your property and force you to prove legal ownership to get it/them back. In my previous state of residence the police were known for confiscating (legal) guns, then forcing the owner to get a lawyer and jump through (figurative) hoops to get it back. When the owner failed to pay hundreds in legal fees to recover an inexpensive gun the police used this example of a "crime gun" that was "taken off the streets".

chipcom
February 15, 2013, 03:19 PM
Some of these states are comtemplating grandfathering clauses for items such as hi-cap magazines.

What are some methods to document your prior to date ownership?
It's quite simple really...to establish your ownership pre-ban all you gotta do is register and pay a fee. The registration is what they are after, banning your stuff is a means to that end.

joeschmoe
February 15, 2013, 10:44 PM
Wave them around on national tv.

http://thisistwitchy.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/davidgregory.jpg?w=320&h=240

Ohio Gun Guy
February 15, 2013, 10:47 PM
The Federal Government did it for you.....

They should be good if purchased after December 15, 1791.




(Hint: Bill of Rights, Ratified)

medalguy
February 16, 2013, 02:06 AM
This is a very pertinent question given the direction a number of states are heading these days. I for one would really hate to have the police confiscate my standard capacity :neener: magazines for my ARs, then have to prove that I purchased them back in 1985 from some guy at a gun show. Anyone got any good ideas?

On, I have a picture of my standard capacity mags sitting on a December 7, 1941 newspaper just to show how long ago I really bought them. :scrutiny:

HSPC
February 16, 2013, 04:06 AM
Have them notarized? Lol

MagnumWill
February 16, 2013, 01:53 PM
I think there's a little confusion here. I'm under the impression that they would need to prove you bought your magazines AFTER the date - not prove the ones you owned BEFORE the date. Am I right?

In that thinking, what if I break a feed lip and order a replacement body from Magpul? Is it now "past the date" since one piece of the mag says so?

medalguy
February 16, 2013, 10:10 PM
Depends on how the law is written.

MErl
February 16, 2013, 10:28 PM
I think there's a little confusion here. I'm under the impression that they would need to prove you bought your magazines AFTER the date - not prove the ones you owned BEFORE the date. Am I right?

In that thinking, what if I break a feed lip and order a replacement body from Magpul? Is it now "past the date" since one piece of the mag says so?
since you are in CO, I'm assuming you are asking about HB13-1224.

Here is the text of that fiasco:
http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013a/csl.nsf/fsbillcont3/7E6713B015E62E6F87257B0100813CB5?Open&file=1224_01.pdf
and the amendments
http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/clics2013a/csl.nsf/billcontainers/7E6713B015E62E6F87257B0100813CB5/$FILE/HB1224_C_001.pdf


4 PART 3
5 LARGE-CAPACITY AMMUNITION MAGAZINES
6 18-12-301. Definitions.AS USED IN THIS PART 3,UNLESS THE
7 CONTEXT OTHERWISE REQUIRES:
8 (1) "BUREAU"MEANS THE COLORADO BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION
9 CREATED AND EXISTING PURSUANT TO SECTION 24-33.5-401, C.R.S.
10 (2) (a) "LARGE-CAPACITY MAGAZINE"MEANS A FIXED OR
11 DETACHABLE MAGAZINE,BOX,DRUM,FEED STRIP,OR SIMILAR DEVICE
12 CAPABLE OF ACCEPTING,OR THAT CAN BE READILY CONVERTED TO
13 ACCEPT,MORE THAN TEN ROUNDS OF AMMUNITION OR MORE THAN FIVE
14 SHOTGUN SHELLS.
15 (b) "LARGE-CAPACITY MAGAZINE"DOES NOT MEAN:
16 (I) AFEEDING DEVICE THAT HAS BEEN PERMANENTLY ALTERED SO

1 THAT IT CANNOT ACCOMMODATE MORE THAN TEN ROUNDS OF
2 AMMUNITION; 2
3 (II) A .22CALIBER TUBE AMMUNITION FEEDING DEVICE;OR
4 (III) ATUBULAR MAGAZINE THAT IS CONTAINED IN A
5 LEVER-ACTION FIREARM.


In response to your question, the readily converted section of that definition (which conflicts with the permanently reduced phrase later on) would rule out replacing mag bodies.

BearGriz
February 16, 2013, 10:34 PM
Wave them around on national tv.

http://thisistwitchy.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/davidgregory.jpg?w=320&h=240

Made me laugh.

henschman
February 18, 2013, 04:35 PM
A better question would be how would the state go about proving that you didn't buy the mag before the implementation of the law, as they have the burden of proof. Still, anyone prosecuted under one of these laws would be smart to offer evidence in their defense, as well. Simple testimony by you saying you bought it before the law would be the simplest way. If the State has nothing to rebut or discredit the testimony, I find it hard to see how someone could get convicted under one of these laws.

Bovice
February 19, 2013, 11:07 AM
just because I can't prove Im innocent, :they" still have to prove guilt
I'm guessing you haven't dealt with the police in any capacity in the last 10 years.

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