Desire to Dry Fire


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Zeked
February 17, 2013, 04:04 PM
Folks, I have a 58 Rem and am totally new to BP. I want to dry fire the pistol to learn the pull and break. I was told that if I did it would damage the nipples ( sounds right). So what do I do? Remove the nipples? Get a practice cylinder?
Just shoot caps?


Regards
Zeke Duge

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hawkeye74
February 17, 2013, 04:33 PM
I now use a beat up old BP revolver to practice my trigger squeeze.

Before this, I used a seperate set of nipples to practice with. I use a rubber boot made from faucet washers to protect the hammer. Just trim the faucet washer down until it fits in the slots.

J-Bar
February 17, 2013, 05:04 PM
Why not remove the cylinder? It will change the gun's weight of course, but should give you a good feel for the trigger.

I don't own a '58, but I ether remove the cylinder or pop caps in the garage on my open tops if I want the hammer to drop.

EljaySL
February 17, 2013, 05:35 PM
A lot of people use leather or some cut up aquarium airline tubing to protect the nipples. Personally I just take it to the range and shoot it... basically with any new gun I figure the first few rounds it's breaking in a bit, I'm getting used to the way it handles (including the trigger), all that kind of stuff. If any reliability problems crop up I'll try some different caps or whatever. With a cap and ball gun in particular I always shoot six caps before loading so I've pulled the trigger at least six times before loading it.

Mike OTDP
February 17, 2013, 10:22 PM
Aquarium tubing works fine...but nipples are a consumable.

whosyrdaddy
February 17, 2013, 11:25 PM
Remove material from the hammer until it no longer contacts the nipple.

Mictlanero
February 18, 2013, 03:56 AM
is there a picture online somewhere of how the tubing looks installed on the nipples? I did this once and it just seemed like there was either not enough tubing on them do protect it or too much - thanks

swathdiver
February 18, 2013, 09:25 AM
Why not buy some of those ring caps and use them?

Picked up some at Bass Pro Shops the other day and they worked great on our little Colt Pocket Police. They were made in Italy too btw.

Lunie
February 18, 2013, 01:39 PM
Why not remove the cylinder? It will change the gun's weight of course, but should give you a good feel for the trigger.

I don't own a '58, but I ether remove the cylinder or pop caps in the garage on my open tops if I want the hammer to drop.
Why not just remove the nipples, and leave the cylinder in place for weight? (If one was already going to dry fire without the cylinder in the first place.)

loose noose
February 18, 2013, 02:30 PM
whosydaddy, seriously you jest when you say "remove material from the hammer". I'm sure he intends to shoot the arm afterwards. I believe in using the aquarium tubing ove the nipples, it works for me. Just clip 'em close enough to the nipple where the cylinder will turn. After dry firing for a bit I would change the tubing which is really inexpensive.:)

mykeal
February 18, 2013, 03:54 PM
Sigh.

The hammer SHOULD NOT touch the nipple; it should be stopped by the frame at just less than the thickness of the cap material, about 0.010".

Of course, most of our Italian repicas aren't made to that standard. So, for those that are afflicted with this beating on the nipple disease, removing hammer material is a perfectly valid cure as long as you don't take off too much. The gun will still fire afterwards.

loose noose
February 18, 2013, 05:50 PM
Mykeal, I would think that by removing metal from the hammer on a replica, would result in misfires in most cases.

J-Bar
February 18, 2013, 05:56 PM
Why not just remove the nipples, and leave the cylinder in place for weight? (If one was already going to dry fire without the cylinder in the first place.)
I'm just lazy. I can pop the cylinder out, dry fire for a few minutes, then put the cylinder back in and it's ready to go. It would take more time to remove and replace the nipples every time I wanted to dry fire.

72coupe
February 18, 2013, 07:55 PM
I get the urge to dry fire mine also...but I don't.

splattergun
February 18, 2013, 08:19 PM
I use aquarium air line tubing. Haven't seen any damage to the nipples yet.
Just cut some small air tube about 3/16 long, just long enough to prevent the hammer from contacting the nipple.

hawkeye74
February 18, 2013, 09:37 PM
Without the cylinder, the Italian guns usually suffer frame damage:uhoh: from the hammer. That is how I got my beat up practice revolver after the owner asked me to fix it.:) Got him another better shape (used) of the same model. Other is not worth fixing.

J-Bar
February 18, 2013, 11:03 PM
Without the cylinder, the Italian guns usually suffer frame damage:uhoh: from the hammer. That is how I got my beat up practice revolver after the owner asked me to fix it.:) Got him another better shape (used) of the same model. Other is not worth fixing.
brassie?

4v50 Gary
February 18, 2013, 11:29 PM
Another vote for aquarium tubing. If you had access to a lathe, make some solid synthetic nipples.

hawkeye74
February 19, 2013, 12:03 AM
brassie?

Yep!:D

Though seen it, not as bad, on a steel.

mykeal
February 19, 2013, 12:00 PM
Mykeal, I would think that by removing metal from the hammer on a replica, would result in misfires in most cases.
MOST Italian replicas are built so that the hammer actually strikes the nipple; if one dry fires the gun that will eventually damage the nipple by 'mushrooming' the tip.

However, the gun DESIGN is for the frame to stop the hammer just short of actually hitting the nipple, but contacting the cap, driving the pyrotechnic material into the nipple and setting it off. IF this DESIGN has been properly executed on a c&b revolver, then dry firing it will not damage the nipples.

But, like I said, MOST Italian replicas are not built to that standard. In those cases, removing material from the hammer face can be beneficial as it 1) allows the gun to be dry fired, and 2) results in less wear on the nipples in the long run. One caveat - as has been noted, allowing the hammer to strike the frame on a brass framed gun is not necessarily a good thing.

And like anything else, removing TOO MUCH material from the hammer face is a bad thing, resulting in misfires as you suggest. How much material needs to be removed depends on the gun, so it's a trial and error thing. Doing this involves lots of disassembly, cutting/sanding, reassembly and trying it out. Lots of work. Aquarium tubing is a lot less work.

44 Dave
February 19, 2013, 12:55 PM
Might want to take material off nipples to get "the proper clearance" as they are a lot easier to replace than a hammer.

Noz
February 20, 2013, 11:00 AM
I get the urge to dry fire mine also...but I don't.
Yup!

StrawHat
February 20, 2013, 01:43 PM
Glue a piece of thick leather to the frame in the hammer channel. The leather will keep the hammer off the cones and soften the blow to the frame. When done, remove the leather and save for next time.

Caliper_RWVA
March 3, 2013, 10:07 AM
Might want to take material off nipples to get "the proper clearance" as they are a lot easier to replace than a hammer.

+1, I was thinking the same thing as I read down the thread.

Doing this should also extend the life of your nipples. Anyone have a good way to measure the gap on a Remmy?

72coupe
March 3, 2013, 12:35 PM
BlueEyes have you ever heard of Plasti Guage?

YumaKid
March 5, 2013, 09:24 AM
"BlueEyes have you ever heard of Plasti Guage?"

Oh, no! Not Plastiguage!!!:eek:

Sorry about that, still on my first cup of coffee this morning. On one of the "car forums" to which I belong (actually, a forum devoted to a particular ENGINE); a discussion arose as to the use of Plasti-guage as opposed to precision micrometers for measuring bearing clearances, etc. Turned into a verbal fist fight; with one of the "engine builder" members leaving the group entirely.

ON TOPIC: I've dry fired over a cylinder with the nipples out; but only a few times while stoning some 'grit' out of the hammer. I don't know if the hammer slaps the nipples on either of my (Pietta) Remingtons; never tried it. On the other hand, maybe a judiciously measured amount of "mushroom" on the nipples will cause Remington #11 caps fit securely on the Pietta nipples :rolleyes:

72coupe
March 5, 2013, 09:53 AM
Yumakid some people just take the internet and them selves too seriously.

Personnally I think if you don't like my opinion, don't use it. Of course some one may say things to you on a forum they would never say to your face. I try not to ever do that.

YumaKid
March 5, 2013, 05:24 PM
Oh, yeah; it's pretty much a matter of 'perspective'. If your livelihood depends upon people thinking that your $7-10 thousand "Stage II" engine built on a 40-year-old block ('cause "Ford don't make 'em no mo!") is worth every penny; you're gonna go the extra 12 miles and have PRECISE instruments for measuring! But the guy who just got his 40-year-old block from the local NAPA machine shop, to stuff in his '70 Mustang for cruise nights, that guy will be happy with Plasti-Guage.

From a shooter's point of view: Right now I'm just lacking the HF rock-tumbler to start making my own BP from brushippie's recipe, and I can hardly wait. However; I certainly hope the folks at IMR or Hodgdon are 'a little more PRECISE' in their component measurements when batching up more 2400, Unique, or even Pyrodex!

I seem to remember reading something to the effect of "Take sheet of typing paper and fold it over once. If it can just fit between the forcing cone and the face of the cylinder without any visible gaps; your spacing is correct". With THAT as a baseline, Plasti-Guage is alarmingly High-Tech! :p

ZVP
March 6, 2013, 02:59 AM
I use a CVA Police model that never went together right to pratice with, The revolver never had clearance for Caps! It clicks fast and is fun to shoot at the Bad Guys on TV!
ZVP

Jaymo
March 7, 2013, 09:08 PM
My Pietta 1858 NMA has a ring on the hammer face, even though it's never been dry fired.
I've thought about facing off the nipples.

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