Colorado Senator to Join Magpul in Abandoning the State if Gun Control Passes


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CmdrSlander
February 18, 2013, 07:27 PM
I sent a mass message to all Colorado law makers telling them to oppose gun control, I got this back from one of them:
http://s4.postimage.org/bfyxjwlcd/ratsfromasinkingship.png
:what:

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Zak Smith
February 18, 2013, 08:07 PM
Ha ha, nice.

I mean, we'll all have to eventually.

Hardtarget
February 18, 2013, 08:11 PM
This is all going to get ugly befor its over.
We have fools in elected positions...all over this country.

Mark

HammerheadSSN663
February 18, 2013, 10:12 PM
funny how union thugs can firebomb your house, threaten your wife and children, but somehow that's OK.

Now if a 2A supporter(s) did the same thing to those passing the votes, somehow we're terrorists.

just say'n.

BK
February 18, 2013, 10:35 PM
http://tiny.cc/5reqsw

CLP
February 18, 2013, 10:37 PM
Think I would rather my representatives stay and fight this legislation than facetiously talk about leaving to another state...

Caliper_RWVA
February 18, 2013, 10:43 PM
Think I would rather my representatives stay and fight this legislation than facetiously talk about leaving to another state...

Representatives are citizens too, and they must live under the same laws as everyone else in the state. Sounds like he will be fighting the law, but if it passes would you stay in that state?

Texan Scott
February 18, 2013, 11:35 PM
I am NOT moving to Kansas. ;)

MachIVshooter
February 18, 2013, 11:36 PM
Think I would rather my representatives stay and fight this legislation than facetiously talk about leaving to another state...

He's fighting it tooth and nail, but he's getting clobbered just like the rest of us. I have had correspondence with Greg, and I have spoken to him in person at the Capitol. He's a good guy, very down to earth, and he's definitely on our side (in this district, it's not a choice anyway). He's just saying how we all feel.

It's not hard to become despondent in these circumstances. I'm sticking it out for the next two elections, but if things don't start looking up by four years from now, I'll be headed North as soon as I can sell my house.

This is going to cost someone; the only question is whether it will be the democrats or the entire state.

ole farmerbuck
February 18, 2013, 11:59 PM
I am NOT moving to Kansas. ;)
You know something we dont?

MachIVshooter
February 19, 2013, 12:01 AM
You know something we dont?

I've been through Kansas many times. I've seen both trees and the hill ;)

CmdrSlander
February 19, 2013, 12:07 AM
I've been through Kansas many times. I've seen both trees and the hill ;)
Them's fighting words...
http://bullrunnings.files.wordpress.com/2006/11/tragic-prelude.gif

nevadabob
February 19, 2013, 12:09 AM
Nevada would welcome them with open arms!

Texan Scott
February 19, 2013, 12:11 AM
Did you see their stoplight too? :neener:

Nothing wrong with Kansas. Lots of nice people live happy, peaceable lives with a good mix of rights, privacy, and good friendly neighbors half a mile up the road. God's country, and I wish more DC politicians understood the love of places like these, and how much of America is nothing like their big nasty noisy East Coast cities.

That said, my beautiful place is the Texas Hill Country.

CmdrSlander
February 19, 2013, 12:13 AM
Did you see their stoplight too? :neener:

Nothing wrong with Kansas. Lots of nice people live happy, peaceable lives with a good mix of rights, privacy, and good friendly neighbors half a mile up the road. God's country, and I wish more DC politicians understood the love of places like these, and how much of America is nothing like their big nasty noisy East Coast cities.

That said, my beautiful place is the Texas Hill Country.
Amen to that underlined bit

To the first bit, I counsel you to remember that Sprint, Garmin, Cessna, CZ-USA, and others are based in Kansas.

We are not a backwater.

Shadow 7D
February 19, 2013, 12:16 AM
Them's fighting words...
http://bullrunnings.files.wordpress.com/2006/11/tragic-prelude.gif
Yaeh, It's a shame to call that little bump a hill... make decent hills mad
as for the Rep, good for him (doubt he wants to move)

CmdrSlander
February 19, 2013, 12:17 AM
I'm more referring to the angry guy with the Sharps Carbine and the fact that we have what is probably the most militant state capital mural in the country :)

MachIVshooter
February 19, 2013, 12:18 AM
We are not a backwater.

Still fun to poke :D







In all seriousness, I basically live in Kansas West. Elbert county is sparse, flat and heavily agricultural. It's just less humid and colder.

r1derbike
February 19, 2013, 12:57 AM
Come to Northwest Arkansas. We have mainframes so large, even the military uses them, for backup.

Oh, we are also a firearm friendly state. Don't suffer metro, out of control crime, and actually appreciate entrepreneurs.

MachIVshooter
February 19, 2013, 01:07 AM
Guys, we appreciate the sentiments of "come join us in a free state", but most of us aren't going to cut and run just yet. Remember, CO was one of those free states until last week, and it ain't a done deal yet.

We're in jeopardy, but it's not a lost cause at this point. If two more election seasons don't show a dramatic reversal, then yes, it's time to consider abandoning ship. But until the people have had a chance to oust the enemies and fail to do so, we're going to stay and fight.

TimboKhan
February 19, 2013, 01:09 AM
If it passes, I will be unhappy, but I will stay here.

It's easy to talk about moving, but when I look at the challenge of finding a new job, selling my house, uprooting my immediate family, leaving my friends and other family, and basically turning my life upside down, what choice do I really have.

It's easy to bluster on about moving, but if you think for a minute that all those people that work for Magpul are going to head home and pack their bags, you're delusional. Sure, some will. Many, if not most, won't. Disagree with me or whatever you want, but this is my home. I don't like everything about it, but I am not leaving it. If I have to cache guns or break a law to defend my family I will cross that bridge when I get to it, but we aren't leaving, and that's that.

Edit to add: I absoluty support Magpuls stance, and I think it's admirable. I am in no way arguing otherwise.


sent from my Galaxy Note II.

Zak Smith
February 19, 2013, 01:16 AM
With regard to Magpul, I can easily see the principals and the design side move.

The manufacturing jobs will leave. People don't have to follow them.

TimboKhan
February 19, 2013, 01:25 AM
I am not saying they won't follow through, because I believe they will, and as a business decision, should. However, The person that works in manufacturing, with bills to pay and a family to care for is unlikely to uproot on principle. Some will, most won't.

sent from my Galaxy Note II.

Zak Smith
February 19, 2013, 01:32 AM
That's considerably harder when your job just moved, the injection molding market falls out, and it's hard to find another manufacturing job.

Ignition Override
February 19, 2013, 01:38 AM
CmdrSlander:

Those depicted aren't Quantrill's Raiders? Very unlikely, but had to ask.

wyohome
February 19, 2013, 01:47 AM
If it passes, I will be unhappy, but I will stay here.

It's easy to talk about moving, but when I look at the challenge of finding a new job, selling my house, uprooting my immediate family, leaving my friends and other family, and basically turning my life upside down, what choice do I really have.

It's easy to bluster on about moving, but if you think for a minute that all those people that work for Magpul are going to head home and pack their bags, you're delusional. Sure, some will. Many, if not most, won't. Disagree with me or whatever you want, but this is my home. I don't like everything about it, but I am not leaving it. If I have to cache guns or break a law to defend my family I will cross that bridge when I get to it, but we aren't leaving, and that's that.
That is exactly the attitude the government counts on.

JohnBiltz
February 19, 2013, 02:16 AM
When I left the service I was up in Wyoming and had a solid job offer in Colorado but I could see the way Colorado was going California blue. Frankly, I thought it would happen sooner.

MachIVshooter
February 19, 2013, 02:40 AM
That is exactly the attitude the government counts on.

No, it's not. They would like nothing more than for us red-blooded, freedom loving Americans to jump ship so that they can erect their construct with minimal interference.

They are still a long, LONG way from having a majority population in this state that will accept the progressive manifesto. We've tipped left the last couple elections, but as I've said elsewhere, there are contributing factors that led to these democrat victories; it's not necessarily a solid change. I expect they're going to find that out in 2014 & 2016. Coloradoans just didn't feel that RKBA was threatened, especially after what Hickenlooper publicly stated in the wake of the Aurora tragedy. I'll admit, even I was somewhat assuaged (and surprised) by his seemingly genuine comments. It was strategic. That is clear now.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice..........uh, yeah, not gonna happen.

Colorado gun owners are on fire now. There will be no placating after this.

CmdrSlander
February 19, 2013, 04:07 AM
CmdrSlander:

Those depicted aren't Quantrill's Raiders? Very unlikely, but had to ask.
Quantrill's raiders attempting to cross the border on the left, Kansas militiamen and citizens fending them off on the right, and John Brown in the middle, wielding a Sharps Carbine and the old testament.

In the background we have Kansas farmers moving into the state lawfully and then Tornadoes, etc.

Girodin
February 19, 2013, 04:33 AM
Nevada would welcome them with open arms!

Do they really want to move to another once red state that is slowly turning blue? I'd look for a place that was very pro business and very pro gun. Utah would offer them a similar setting in terms of mountains and the like and is about as pro gun as it gets, pretty pro business and rather conservative. It has republican super majorities in both houses and a republican governor. It is also pretty close. I don't know what Magpul is looking for. However, sadly Nevada is drifting left just like CO.

It's easy to bluster on about moving, but if you think for a minute that all those people that work for Magpul are going to head home and pack their bags, you're delusional.

Magpul can take or leave a good chunk of their 600 people. Other states don't want that and CO wouldn't miss them that much. What CO doesn't want is a big chunk of 600 unemployed people. What CO will miss is the tax base of the company and that is what any other state will be happy to have, along with any new jobs they provide.

At the end of the day CO will keep on going. It will be a slow steady death until they mismanage themselves into being like CA et al and people with the means really do start flooding out of there.

That said, good by magpul to leave and refuse to be a part of such nonsense anymore. I've long thought some gun makers should pull out of the north east and take their jobs and revenue to the places that actually support them. I magpul would take the next step of not selling to CO govt. agencies as well.

It makes me happy to own so much magpul stuff and resolved to buy more.

It will be interesting to see what magpul announces in the near future if this goes through the senate. According to their face book posts they already have plans to move Pmag production rapidly if it passes.

Grunt
February 19, 2013, 04:44 AM
It's easy to talk about moving, but when I look at the challenge of finding a new job, selling my house, uprooting my immediate family, leaving my friends and other family, and basically turning my life upside down, what choice do I really have.


We do it in the military all the time. Granted we don't have to worry about finding a new job unless you or your spouse is non-military civilian but the rest of this is an old hat to us. No, not really any fun but you can do it.

MikeS.
February 19, 2013, 05:05 AM
Idaho would be a good fit for Magpul as well as Utah.

ccsniper
February 19, 2013, 05:32 AM
I've been through Kansas many times. I've seen both trees and the hill

I read that and nearly fell over laughing. I did some concrete work up in Colby and when you are used to seeing the Ozark mountains, you begin praying to God to see anything other than corn.

Hacker15E
February 19, 2013, 08:29 AM
We do it in the military all the time. Granted we don't have to worry about finding a new job unless you or your spouse is non-military civilian but the rest of this is an old hat to us. No, not really any fun but you can do it.

This.

I have never understood how so many people see relocating a family for a new job as some sort of impossible or insanely difficult task physically, emotionally, or financially.

It is actually quite easy, all things considered.

sota
February 19, 2013, 08:47 AM
We do it in the military all the time. Granted we don't have to worry about finding a new job unless you or your spouse is non-military civilian but the rest of this is an old hat to us. No, not really any fun but you can do it.

yea. did that as a kid...
Hawai'i -> Missouri -> Massachusetts -> Alabama -> New Jersey
that last one was a killer, being just in my teens, coming to a "Yankee" state with a massive southern drawl and an unfathomable (to everyone else) love for plaid and flannel.
Moving is rough on the adults, but it's tougher on the kids, especially if they're coming of age.

the problem with "voting with your feet" is, you need a LARGE number of people to do it all at once. unless you could get 10,000 familes to all in a single day uproot and leave, politicos will never notice.

what we all REALLY need is a non-firearms business of some note to join the cause and deny sales to local/state/federal enforcement offices.

radiotom
February 19, 2013, 09:40 AM
Think I would rather my representatives stay and fight this legislation than facetiously talk about leaving to another state...
Lemme guess, if the ban passes too, it's 100% his fault??? Just as ridiculous as your message.

Girodin
February 19, 2013, 02:51 PM
This.

I have never understood how so many people see relocating a family for a new job as some sort of impossible or insanely difficult task physically, emotionally, or financially.

I'll just say when I worked with a lot of military folks, plenty of them complained about moving too. I also saw the very real toll it took on some of their families. I have a number of friends who grew up in military families who have told me how it was very hard for them as children to be moving all the time. I have also seen the exact opposite, those who rather enjoy it.

I think its safe to say that different people approach it differently and have different views. depending on your wants desires and particular situation it can be hard thing. I do not think it is fair to tell someone else how they should feel about it.

HankR
February 19, 2013, 03:53 PM
When I left the service I was up in Wyoming and had a solid job offer in Colorado but I could see the way Colorado was going California blue. Frankly, I thought it would happen sooner.

This. I had been working towards moving back to Colorado since the early 80s. When I finally got the gumption to flee a really blue state 10 years ago, Colorado had already been Californicated, so I moved elsewhere. Worse winters, no mountains to speak of, but a free state and likely to stay that way, at least for my lifetime. Not sure where my kids are going to have to flee to though.

SoCalNoMore
February 19, 2013, 04:15 PM
No, it's not. They would like nothing more than for us red-blooded, freedom loving Americans to jump ship so that they can erect their construct with minimal interference.

They are still a long, LONG way from having a majority population in this state that will accept the progressive manifesto. We've tipped left the last couple elections, but as I've said elsewhere, there are contributing factors that led to these democrat victories; it's not necessarily a solid change. I expect they're going to find that out in 2014 & 2016. Coloradoans just didn't feel that RKBA was threatened, especially after what Hickenlooper publicly stated in the wake of the Aurora tragedy. I'll admit, even I was somewhat assuaged (and surprised) by his seemingly genuine comments. It was strategic. That is clear now.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice..........uh, yeah, not gonna happen.

Colorado gun owners are on fire now. There will be no placating after this.
I hope for the sake of the good folks that work for Magpul, they do stay and effect legislative change in the next election cycle. Which is only next year. If this does pass, yes it will not bode well for the time it is effective. But you never know what may happen, it could get repealed. I would suggest that Magpul stay, do not sell to CO LEO etc and start a non-profit PAC and begin a grassroots effort to oust everyone one of those poli's that voted for the bill. I would even allow people to "round up" when they buy from Magpul to donate to the PAC.

Grunt
February 19, 2013, 04:20 PM
Oh, I'm not saying that moving every time was a pleasant experience with trying to find out what you have will fit where in the new house and of course there was always the fun game of "what will the movers destroy this time" with every move that came along. But the thing is that while moving isn't pleasant, staying where your kind isn't welcome is far more unpleasant! I think the residents of the People's Republic of Colorado will have to ask themseleves "which is the worse of two evils and which one is the better option for me."

Grunt
February 19, 2013, 04:57 PM
I hope for the sake of the good folks that work for Magpul, they do stay and effect legislative change in the next election cycle. Which is only next year. If this does pass, yes it will not bode well for the time it is effective. But you never know what may happen, it could get repealed. I would suggest that Magpul stay, do not sell to CO LEO etc and start a non-profit PAC and begin a grassroots effort to oust everyone one of those poli's that voted for the bill. I would even allow people to "round up" when they buy from Magpul to donate to the PAC.

Not gonna happen. The gauntlet has been cast and now it becomes an integrity issue. If the laws are passed in the senate and the govonor signs off on it, Magpul has no other choice but to leave or shut their doors for good. If they move to a free state, many of their customers will see this as a sign of resolve and be far more willing to buy their products. If however they stay, in fact going back on their word, well, who wants to buy anything from a double-talking con man? Nope, they have no choice but to follow through on their promise of leaving should these bills become law or they will be shutting their doors for good inside of a year! Personally though, I have no doubt about their integrity and fully believe that they will move if these laws are passed.

rondog
February 19, 2013, 05:05 PM
I'd rather stay here and drive the Liberals back to California.

Mauserguy
February 19, 2013, 06:43 PM
They should move out here to California...


Mauserguy

CmdrSlander
February 19, 2013, 06:54 PM
They should move out here to California...


Mauserguy
You cannot be serious, friend.

Grunt
February 19, 2013, 07:11 PM
Kinda like moving from Auchwitz to Dachau, ain't it? Scenery may change but the level of suffering stays the same.:rolleyes:

MachIVshooter
February 19, 2013, 07:27 PM
I would suggest that Magpul stay, do not sell to CO LEO

I think they should refuse to sell to LEAs that supported this crapola, but our sheriffs were squarely in our corner and fought these bills furiously right along side us. I'd rather they continue to sell to the sheriffs, and tell the police chiefs to pound sand.

Mauserguy
February 19, 2013, 09:00 PM
No, I wasn't serious, though the truth is that we need companies to move here. California is dieing.

There is no growth here. The state government is continuing down the path of economic destruction. We're building a high speed rail from a desert to a garlic festival, wasting billions, knowing that the project will never actually be completed.

Our demographics are rapidly becoming third world, with English being replaced by Spanish in large cities. Yes, we need companies like Magpull to move here, but it will just never make sense for them. We need help!
Mauserguy

oneounceload
February 19, 2013, 10:20 PM
But until the people have had a chance to oust the enemies and fail to do so, we're going to stay and fight.

You have had a few elections, yet nothing has changed.........

Our demographics are rapidly becoming third world, with English being replaced by Spanish in large cities. Yes, we need companies like Magpull to move here, but it will just never make sense for them. We need help!
Mauserguy

The problem is those folks move out to NV, CO and other places, to escape what they turned their state into, then want to do it again in their new state - look at St. George, UT.

One thing to beware - these folks VOTE (early and often ;)) and always get involved until they screw it up, then they want to move on

Grunt
February 19, 2013, 11:13 PM
I have always wondered why folks in these places allow them in there in the first place? Now I know with equal housing laws, discrimination against religion, sex, race, etc. are a big time no-go, and it should be. However, the last I knew, not renting a house to someone based on their political views was not covered under that law. "Hey, Alan Keyes, you want to rent a place here? No problem at all." :) "Hey, tofu-munching hippie with the Obama t-shirt on, how about you get back in your car, turn around and go back to wherever it is you came from. Get off my property!!!!":fire: "Hey, Senator Ted Cruz, welcome to my resurant! I'll be happy to take your order." :) "Hey, Micheal Moore, get your whale carcass out of my resurant right freakin' now and don't ever come back!!!":fire: I would think after a while, liberals would maybe get the hint that they are not welcomed in your community.

Zak Smith
February 19, 2013, 11:16 PM
Hey, tofu-munching hippie with the Obama t-shirt on, how about you get back in your car, turn around and go back to wherever it is you came from. Get off my property!!!!"
Unfortunately, it's more like, "Hey, engineer-man who just moved to town to work for Big Company Corporation that employs a lot of highly skilled people who may have come from around the country (but do not necessarily share any political view), umm, hi? Nice Subaru you've got there.

Grunt
February 19, 2013, 11:19 PM
Mr. Engineer-man still doesn't have enough money to rent a house from me as long as he's a liberal!

Zak Smith
February 19, 2013, 11:20 PM
Yeah but he looks exactly the same as me.

Derek Zeanah
February 19, 2013, 11:22 PM
Yeah but he looks exactly the same as me.
He might have more hair.....

:evil:

Zak Smith
February 19, 2013, 11:29 PM
I won the hair lottery vs. my brother
;)

Grunt
February 19, 2013, 11:32 PM
Didn't I see something like this in an original Star Trek episode??? Does he have a goatee instead? :D

MachIVshooter
February 19, 2013, 11:35 PM
You have had a few elections, yet nothing has changed.........

Uh....we're talking about Colorado. The Colorado that Bush carried both times, the Colorado that had a Republican governor from '99-'07, who won the largest majority in our history in 2002. We had Republican state senators for a very long time, 4 of our 7 house reps are currently GOP. The state house just went Democrat this year.

I can point to very valid reasons that Hickenlooper got elected, as well as why Obama carried us this year. Ken Buck only lost the senate race by 1 point in 2010 because the Democrats ran an excellent smear campaign right at the end.

I've said it before, people here just didn't feel that RKBA was threatened. I'll be shocked if things don't shift dramatically in 2014 & 2016. We've been blue several times in our history, including '92, but went back red after the '94 ban. The state's history in presidential elections has been 12 times Democrat, 22 times Republican and 1 time Independent.

Times are changing, but Colorado has always been unique. Usually a right-of-center state, but it depends on the candidate and the issues at hand.

Girodin
February 20, 2013, 01:39 AM
Nope, they have no choice but to follow through on their promise of leaving should these bills become law or they will be shutting their doors for good inside of a year!

I really doubt that. However, the would lose a lot of respect from a lot of people and some folks probably would refuse to buy from them at that point.

The problem is those folks move out to NV, CO and other places, to escape what they turned their state into, then want to do it again in their new state - look at St. George, UT.

St George UT and Washington County UT is predominantly conservative. Their elected state and local reps are conservatives. A better example, Park City UT.

I agree that what you are saying happens. This is why a whole lot of people in UT, ID, MT, etc really don't like Californians moving in.

the truth is that we need companies to move here. California is dieing.

And it really isn't very hard to figure out why that is the case now is it? Well I guess not hard for everyone save CA politicians and the folks electing them.

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