Times are tough, my friends...


PDA






1KPerDay
February 21, 2013, 06:48 PM
I just paid $52 for 1000 CCI small rifle primers. :rolleyes:

But they HAD some, gol-durnit. No .224 fmj pills or .223 dies, though. They were selling reman .223 for $350/500.

If you enjoyed reading about "Times are tough, my friends..." here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Walkalong
February 21, 2013, 06:59 PM
.223 for $350/500.
Meh, shoot something else for the time being. :)

gahunter12
February 21, 2013, 08:10 PM
I just paid $52 for 1000 CCI small rifle primers WOW!! That's crazy!! I picked up 3,000 SRP last Saturday for $38/k. I felt cheated paying that. I have a LGS that has been able to keep both Lrg, and sml rifle, and Lrg pistol primers in stock. Not so much on sml pistol though. He told me back in late Oct. he had well over 100,000 primers in stock, and 100,000 on order to be delivered in Nov. Jerry the owner learned after 2008.

ColtPythonElite
February 21, 2013, 08:22 PM
I wouldn't pay it for recreational shooting.

splattergun
February 21, 2013, 09:16 PM
Went to local Sportsman's Warehouse today. Things are looking better! They had some CCI LR primers and about 12 different powders and more bullets in stock.. The loaded ammo shelves are a little less nekkid, and they even had a few semi-auto pistols on the wall.

Over all, their prices are still about the same for ammo, primer and powder. Red dot was 17.99 1 lb. 1000 CCI primers were 35.99
Bagged lead shot is up to $49.00 for 25 lb, though. ugh, commodities

They did not have much in any of the popular calibers. Plenty of bullets for .38, but none at all for 9mm. We're still not anywhere near adequate levels, but there is improvement.

NO, I would not pay 52 bucks for primers. Not when they will soon be available at normal price.

leadchucker
February 21, 2013, 09:22 PM
I'm headed to a local gun show on Saturday, in search of primers and powder at something less than robbery prices. Maybe it'll be better than a month ago.

Lennyjoe
February 21, 2013, 09:51 PM
Our Sportsmanship warehouse's shelves are bare in regards to powder and primers. Even the place where I get my Winchester primers for $35 per thousand is getting slim.

parker51
February 21, 2013, 11:53 PM
Cabela's in Charleston had no primers or powder as of today. They had a few bullets but nothing for a 223. They had plenty of shotgun shells and 17 HMR but no 22's.

David E
February 22, 2013, 12:02 AM
NO, I would not pay 52 bucks for primers. Not when they will soon be available at normal price.

That's great news!

What facts lead you to that pronouncement?

Oh, and when, specifically, is "soon?"

Bush Pilot
February 22, 2013, 12:12 AM
I'm headed to a local gun show on Saturday, in search of primers and powder at something less than robbery prices. Maybe it'll be better than a month ago.
Let us know how that works out.

ColtPythonElite
February 22, 2013, 12:23 AM
My local dealer has plenty of powder at $20 a pound. He was selling primers at $32 per 1k until a coup of weeks ago, but recently raised them to $40.

gonefishin1
February 22, 2013, 12:35 AM
you guys are luckey i haven't found primers local in months i am down to less than 50 srp...

Kachok
February 22, 2013, 12:35 AM
Yeah it is highway robbery out there, only one place locally has anything resembling normal prices and they stay pretty well sold out of anything I use, but I did luck up and snag a pound of Big Game the other day for "only" $23, still a little high, but nothing like the $30 I had to pay for a pound of 4350, cannot find my 165gr Game Kings ANYWHERE at any price so I am working on some different bullets and the 180gr Game Kings I have left. I am stocked up on primers, good for at leased five years, this mess HAS to be settled down by then, laws of economics state that they either have to up production to keep up with demand or someone else will get in the business to fill that gap for them.

renomedia
February 22, 2013, 01:53 AM
The Sportsmen's Warehouse in Reno had a shipment of guns, ammo and reloading components come in last night. They opened their doors at 10 AM today and there must have been about 150 people in line before the store opened. They had a 1K limit on primers of any kind and the SPPs were gone at 10:05. No Varget, Bullseye, H-335, IMR 4198, or Unique. However they did have a few 8lb jugs of Blue Dot and IMR-4064. Most folks appeared to be looking for ammo. The bulk Rem-UMC 9mm & 45 ACP ammo were extremely popular. I didn't see any .223, but I'm sure there was some available.

I snagged 8lbs of IMR-4064 and 1K LPP. The primers were 31.99/1K and the jug of IMR was 169.99. Not a bargain, but not gouging either.

Kachok
February 22, 2013, 02:38 AM
LUCKY! I am out of 335 and IMR 4064, but I won't start freaking out until I run out or RL19, Longshot, IMR4350, RL22, and Big Game, those are my MUST HAVE powders especially the 4350, I can get at leased acceptable accuracy/performance with 4350 in all of my rifles though the 308 and 7mm-08 don't like it as much as the others.

kyhunter
February 22, 2013, 03:32 AM
No problems with primers here. Ive bought 4K in the last 2 weeks. There were another 10K of spp srp and lrp at my lgs. No powder or bullets however

41 Mag
February 22, 2013, 03:47 AM
I went to the LGS the other day and it still looks like a grocery store just before a hurricane.

I think they had a total of 10 or 11 bottles of powder some of which was pyrodex, no primers, and only a few rifles and handguns compared to what they normally have.

I did manage to find the shotgun powders I was looking for though so it wasn't a total waste of a trip. I have to get some light field loads worked up for the grandson, so he can start practicing for dove season this year.

JT-AR-MG42
February 22, 2013, 05:45 AM
Say 1k,

Are you loading, or plan to, on a single stage press?

I might be able to help out anybody who'll pay that for primers;)

Seriously, let's hear back.

JT

hueyville
February 22, 2013, 06:12 AM
What I have found is most big box stores due to anyone being able to find them with a quick Google search or just the ability to find a shopping mall suffer the same stocking issues as the internet companies. Too easy access from a majority of users. The medium to small town real LGS type places seem to produce better if still spotty results. I have over 30 LGS that stock reloading supplies within an hour drive in any direction. May be closer to 50 stores. I know their habits and many of them know me as a regular. Not been a single item of any type that I have not been able to go pick up the day I want and walk out the door with at a fair price. Out of curiosity I have called local big box stores about one a week. Long hold times, no stock when you finally get through and no answers as to when they will as they are up to whims of corporate. My favorite LGS no longer answers phones. He checks and returns emails twice a day. 90% of the time what I need is on the shelf at one of three shops all within ten minutes of work. Don't wait till its all hands on deck to make friends with the supply officer. Build a relationship with a good LGS and you will seldom find yourself without at least a hot cup of coffee and some of what you need.

XD 45acp
February 22, 2013, 07:14 AM
Primers ???? What is this "Primers" you speak of? I aint seen none round here in so long, I forget what they are.....:neener:

kingmt
February 22, 2013, 07:19 AM
All of the Ma & Pa places I know there only friend is the dollar. I won't go to them unless I have to. As bad as I hate Walmart I'll go there but use the internet first.

I bought at least 6 handguns from the LGS in till last shortage I bought a gun he couldn't get rid of because there was no ammo for 380 & everyone already had one. He had a box he snagged from Walmart to resale. He charge me $40 go the junk ammo. I bought it after telling make sure he got enough because that was the last thing is but from him. Wonder if he is still there?

1KPerDay
February 22, 2013, 08:14 AM
Say 1k,

Are you loading, or plan to, on a single stage press?

I might be able to help out anybody who'll pay that for primers;)

Seriously, let's hear back.

JT
Be gentle, I'm still sore from the beating I took at the cash register. :D
I haven't loaded .223 before... My only rifle experience is with .30-06. I have a single stage and a LCT.
I got 1k 50 grain noslers coming from shooters pro shop for .12 ea, and some old H4895, so I'd appreciate any favorites with that combo. I am loading primarily for plinking and 3-gun; the local club recently changed the requirements and no longer allows bimetal/magnetic jackets so most of my meager .223 stash is off the menu.

beatledog7
February 22, 2013, 08:31 AM
ECON 101. Prices will remain at market levels as long as we have a shred of a free market remaining. That means, unfortunately, as long as people will pay the price, the price will hold or even rise. If we stop buying, the price will fall in response to that perceived decrease in demand.

If you were a retailer of widgets, and your livelihood depended on keeping your business open and making a profit, would you not raise your prices if your ability to get more widgets shrank? When you found customers willing and able to pay that higher price, would you lower that price?

Fellow shooters/reloads, calling people out for responding to "marginally-free-market" forces, tossing out terms such as "gouging" and "highway robbery" to label this response, is not going to change anything. If you feel better for having gotten it off your chest...well, there's something to be said for feeling better, I suppose.

If you don't like the price, and you have an alternative--perhaps, stop buying for a while--the slackening demand will force prices down. Retailers will not long hold prices at a level that keeps merchandise on their shelves instead of in your shopping basket.

However, if you continually pay the asking price, it becomes the market price. That encourages retailers to nudge the price up yet another notch, to see just how high you'll go. That's not wrong--that's business.

jack44
February 22, 2013, 09:04 AM
Lee been out of 243& 40 dies for so long!

dickttx
February 22, 2013, 11:33 AM
+1 on this Beatledog7.
People are in business to earn a living.

Kachok
February 22, 2013, 11:43 AM
Beateldog you are forgetting economics 102 when excessive profit exists more competition will arise, let a couple new companies start taking some of Remington's/CCI's/Sierra's market share and see what happens. Or you can expect to see smaller companies expand their product line, heck I would love to see Starline get into the rifle brass business.

Otto
February 22, 2013, 12:28 PM
That's funny...I ordered 11,000 CCI small pistol primers from Cabelas on Tues. and they're on a UPS truck today.
The laws of supply and demand don't always hold.

1KPerDay
February 22, 2013, 12:50 PM
...........

hueyville
February 22, 2013, 01:04 PM
KingMt, I am known to be opionated but to make a blanket statement about all LGS's based on an experience at one shop may be harsh. I doubt the online companies are in business just for fun. They won't survive without turning a profit either. That is the goal of all businesses to make a living. I currently own and operate three businesses and actually owned a retail outdoor outfitting store for two years which was the hardest row I ever had. Over half my customers would come in and spend hours leaning on our expertise, sometimes come in for multiple visits, then eventually come in to tell us they appreciate our help but found the item they were interested in for a few dollars less online or on-sale at a big box store. It was disheartening to see how the average customer would eat hours of your time then buy elsewhere over less than ten bucks on a several hundred dollar purchase. It costs a lot of money to operate a hard location and maintain regular business hours. Nothing said you had to buy the ammo from him when it sounds like he may have cut you a deal on the gun. Since your participating in a reloading forum I assume you could have skipped the 40 dollar box of ammo and rolled your own. If he went to the trouble to pay retail from Wallyworld so could have it on his shelf, good on him for going to that effort to keep required inventory. This is a survival economy for most small businesses and when they get an opportunity to turn a dime they need to while they can. Otherwise they won't have operating capitol for when times are not good for their industry. My LGS's have raised their prices based on increased prices from distributors but the only one that is "gouging" has product sitting on shelf not moving. Seeing the prices people admit to paying on this board they are still cheap at 42 per thousand for primers but the other two are holding at 32 per thousand.

Beetledog seems to have a handle on this deal and how the business works. Just as food for thought. Only one of my businesses is retail now. It is in a paid for building with no rent or payments or I would have to close it. In our current market an average retail store front of ~1,000 square feet rents for around 2,000 per month. My retail business average daily expenses without rent is ~600 dollars per day before any salaries are paid. Liability, workmens comp, health insurance, business licensing, utilities, phone, website, and all adds up. Thus we have to move 1,800 dollars worth of product per day to break even on expenses. Then add in salaries for just two employees is another 400 per day plus matching social security etc. That is another 1,200 in product to pay the help. Unless we turn 3,000 a day I lose money. Looking at running a business from real world perspective is tough. God forbid a truck or major piece of equipment breaks. Now look at the gun industry and the idea the federal government is currently trying to outlaw 50% of their current product. If that happens these LGS's are going to die. Then when you consider the loyalty of the majority of customers lies with wherever they can source a product for a couple dollars cheaper, I don't see how most gun shops make it. In fact, more seem to fail than succeed long term. In 2001 following the 9/11 disaster my business dried up for three months as the country was in shock. I had to pull 20,000 dollars out of savings to keep payroll met during that setback. Following the 2008 market crash and housing crash I operated at loss for two and a half years before we got our businesses restructured to meet the new economy. I went that entire time without a single paycheck for myself so that the help didn't have to hit the unemployment line.

Last real world statistics I read say 50% of new businesses fail in first six months. The ones that succeed take two years before turning a profit. It drives me nuts when folks that have never run a business accuse the ones that take the risk of financial ruin to offer a service to the community of charging too much for a product compared to Wallyworld or the internet. I miss my local hardware store that had service and expertise to offer. How many people would be able to enjoy the shooting sports without the guys behind the counter at a LGS being there to offer the expertise and advice on products? Factor in the LGS does not have enough ammo to sell currently because the big box stores get first choice. If an LGS owner has to go to Wallyworld to buy ammo to support his customers, I say kudos to the man that will so he can offer up a box of ammo when he sells a customer a gun. You could have beat him to Wallyworld and bought that box of ammo for the price he paid. Instead he risked his own money, put it on a shelf that costs money to keep the ammo sitting on, so he could be better prepared to sell a pistol he had invested capital in. I hope that some day the playing field gets leveled so small businesses are more able to be competitive with online and big box stores again. Just like I am not be opposed to an import tax on ammo or other foreign goods so that people were given more incentive to buy American made as opposed to import. I want to see my LGS make a good living so he can be there next year when I need a product instead of waiting on some person I never met to put it on a truck. I want to see my fellow countrymen working as opposed to buying a product 10% cheaper from a foreign vendor. We can can continue to outsource everything and not only will our local vendors fail, but our entire country will also. Guess we need to start teaching Chinese in our schools if our kids want jobs in the future.

subman47
February 22, 2013, 01:22 PM
hueyville is so right

buck460XVR
February 22, 2013, 01:44 PM
I been stopping at every little Gunshop/hardware store/gunsmith shop I see as I drive around the country. Funny thing is, this frenzy seems to not have hit the many small rural towns around here.:) While the big box stores like GM and Scheels are outta everything, places like "Bob's gunsmithing and archery" have components on their shelves still covered with dust. If I find someplace that has something I use, I buy it whether I need it or not. Stopped at a little outta the way shop in a town I've been working in the last few months and bought 8000 primers just yesterday. 2000 each of SP, SPM and 4000 WLP. $31.99 a thousand. Also bought a 4# jug of W296, a 4# jug of W231, 2# of IMR4227 and 2# of Unique. All of the powder was priced at before frenzy prices. They also had 4 boxes of .45 caliber 300gr Gold Dots(my preferred hunting bullet for my .460)with a handwritten price of $15.99 a box on them. :eek:I left broke, just under 5 c-notes lighter, but pretty dam happy. While the shop owner knew there was a shortage, he didn't believe me when I told him he had the only SP primers I had seen in over a month of lookin'.

TonyT
February 22, 2013, 02:22 PM
I would start shoting an airgun before I paid those scammers the outrageous prices they are quoting for primers. The manufacturers have not increased the prices to their distributors so it price gouging at the retail level and perhaps with some distributors.

kingmt
February 22, 2013, 02:49 PM
Hueyville
You are so wrong at every part. I didn't blanket all small gun shops. I said all of them that I know. Every gun I bought from this guy I knew what he gave & offered him a fair profit. He never thought about the offer because he knew he was making a lot of money off them. This time I didn't even make a offer & paid the sticker price. $40 on a $10 box of shells isn't a reasonable profit. He was a smart man to make 200% profit on that box of shells since I bought my next rifle with the $1000 price tag at Walmart. People remember how you take advantage of them.

I did start reloading for this cartridge but at the time it was the first gun I had in that chamber. Wife still has one but I gave mine to my sister.

I also ran a Advance Auto Parts for several years so I do understand retail. I also tried the Swans Food for a while. I always done better at sales by treating my customers well & had to go fix the stores that was failing because they didn't. If I got sent to a store the manger was already gone or soon would be with the exception of two.

I know I'm not anything spacial to these online retailers but when places like Powder Vally, GIBrass(Jeff), & the sweet lady at FS Reloading makes me feel like I am it makes me want to spend my money with them. It is a big plus that they mail it to me since I don't have to go out of my way & take time I don't have. It is also nice to know I saved a few dollars. Getting ready to spend about $500 with FS Reloading now. They know so much more about there product then the morons around here that sell guns & ammo.

There is one gun shop around here that is out of my way & there a little high but they do have at least as much knowledge as me. If I get to stop in I like talking to these guys & I'll buy from them. There not really a small time Ma & Pa place tho.

KansasSasquatch
February 22, 2013, 03:16 PM
The problem with the gougers isn't he local gun shops that are selling at elevated prices. They will either survive or go out of business based on what they charge and the willingness of customers to pay those prices. The problem is the guy down the street, buying EVERYTHING at Walmart and the LGS on a consistent basis, just to turn around and sell it for 5x the store price. With so many people doing it, it makes it look like there's a shortage and the people that don't know any better pay the ridiculous prices. Then the rest of us have to rely on anything we might have stashed or hope to find a "deal", a deal being non elevated prices.

Constrictor
February 22, 2013, 03:20 PM
the thing about so called "gougers" is you dont know what they paid for the stuff usually. I have had my local range asl me to sell them some 22 ammo just so they could have some on the shelf. I made a tiny profit before i sold it to them so they had a higher cost.

Trent
February 22, 2013, 03:23 PM
Kansas, the solution to that is to stop buying at 'elevated' prices altogether, then MR. BuyItAll gets stuck holding the bag, and has to sell it at normal prices (or a loss) to put food on the table.

:)

kingmt
February 22, 2013, 03:26 PM
Kansas, the solution to that is to stop buying at 'elevated' prices altogether, then MR. BuyItAll gets stuck holding the bag, and has to sell it at normal prices (or a loss) to put food on the table.

:)
I agree.

beatledog7
February 22, 2013, 03:28 PM
Kachok, I didn't forget that concept; it was simply beyond the scope of the original point.

I'd love to see more competition in the rifle brass field as well, as well in the primer making field.

GLOOB
February 22, 2013, 03:46 PM
I hope to never pay inflated prices. I was stocked for probably a year or more. But I'm starting to believe the shortages may last longer than that. I can't even buy Hornady 223 gas checks. And I couldn't hardly buy Zero jacketed bullets even before the shortage!

Before I started reloading I was shooting a lot less, and I was happy. I only started shooting buckets of ammo at a time because of reloading. If I can't reload at the old price, I will certainly be adjusting my ways.

I have a local supplier with some primers at jacked up prices. And there's always Back Page, where everyone and their cousin is trying to sell primers for triple last year's price. And that's fine with me. It just means I know what I might have to pay if my stockpile runs completely dry. These guys are providing a service. Means you don't have to worry so much about not having ANYTHING, at all.

If it comes down to it, I can see myself counting down the rounds. Down to where I have to start shooting that crude milsurp gun collecting dust at the back of the closet. Down to where I am carrying around a gun with my last mag of ammo in that caliber. Maybe I'll take out the cartridges and polish them once a month, lol. I look forward to that, more than to overpaying for stuff today just to increase my "hoard." Maybe I'll watch "The Road Warrior," again, to remind me what a "real" ammo shortage would feel like, lol. But what I won't do is to stock up on overpriced components, just in case they are even more expensive or unavailable, later. If they were this expensive, I never would have gotten this deep into the hobby to begin with! Even before the price crunch, I always felt the hit of what I was paying. This is a unique sort of hobby in that you're literally burning money in exchange for some ragged holes on paper. I reckon the only thing worse is golf. :) I'll probably hold onto enough ammo for SD use or for hunting, and even enough for sharing with friends and neighbors for the same. But that doesn't take a whole lot.

It's been awhile since I took my air rifle out for a spin, anyway. :)

Trent
February 22, 2013, 04:08 PM
I wish I'd stocked up more on 9mm components.

At the time the shortage started I had (what I thought) was a good supply; about 1500 projectiles, 3000 small pistol primers. I have a massive bucket of brass, and enough Bullseye to shoot 9mm until it's time for me to take a long dirt nap.

Well, this week I've been loading for the upcoming USPSA season. I've got two matches a month scheduled from April through November. I have enough loaded ammo left to get me through April, and enough components to get through May (maybe). I can stretch it out to mid summer if I don't train in the off weeks. (Normally I'd burn through 1000 rounds a month in 9mm).

Hopefully the projectile situation resolves itself at some point within the next few months. I don't like shooting the 45's in competitions and don't want to find myself changing from minor to major mid season. :(

Certaindeaf
February 22, 2013, 04:11 PM
You could buy a mold but I think they cost like a million dollars these days.

Kachok
February 22, 2013, 05:10 PM
Kachok, I didn't forget that concept; it was simply beyond the scope of the original point.

I'd love to see more competition in the rifle brass field as well, as well in the primer making field.
YEP that would be really nice, would also like someone else to make a 4064 burn rate powder, I am OUT and have not seen any since this mess started. Lucked up and found Big Game, RL22, Blue Dot and finally found 4350 but 4064 has eluded me. Bought four bricks of primers right after the school shooting happend, I could read the writing on the wall, just wish I would have had the extra $$$ on hand to grab up a few more powders and some more 165 Game Kings.

GLOOB
February 22, 2013, 05:12 PM
You could buy a mold but I think they cost like a million dollars these days.
You will not find any gas checks in 223 or 30cal, either. We have some industrious types selling homemade aluminum checks on Ebay, already.

If you ever do find a Lee mold for your firearm, it's not a bad "investment." They are (or were) only $20.00 each.

splattergun
February 22, 2013, 08:39 PM
That's great news!

What facts lead you to that pronouncement?

Oh, and when, specifically, is "soon?"
Soon is soon enough to suit me. A few weeks? I dunno, I don't care.
The fact that my local store had several varieties of powder that weren't there the week before, the fact they had guns and ammo that weren't there before, and the fact that the shelveswere not emptied immediately tell me that things are beginning to turn around. I can wait.
I'm not going to pay $52 for primers! I don't care if you do, it's your money. I'm not playing the gouge game this time.

KansasSasquatch
February 22, 2013, 09:51 PM
Trust me Trent, I'm not buying anything at "scare" pricing. I've been watching my local Cabelas about as much as I possibly can. I've only been reloading for a year and had no idea this would happen with reloading components. I'm stocked up decently on primers for the shooting I'll do this year, picked up 6000 Tula .223 primers from Powder Valley, 2000 Federal SPM from Cabelas, and 2000 CCI LPP from Cabela's. The 150 Win LRP that I have will probably last me 2 years. I've had to scrounge up usable powders but I'm sure I can get by with the 10-12lbs of various stuff on my shelf. Bullets are the components giving me trouble, locally at least. I'll probably make an order with MBC in a week or two and wait on them. The 1000 .224 bullets I have would normally last me 3 months, guess I'll have to stretch them out or get lucky.

JT-AR-MG42
February 23, 2013, 05:32 AM
1K,
Never heard of fire problems with bi-metal bullets, just steel cores and tracers. You will lose your membership at either club I belong to (several fires at both from steel cores) if caught shooting any of the latter two.
Your range must be a bit drier than mine and a magnet cannot distinguish between bi-metal and steel core.

I have reloaded with 4895 and the 55gr. in a .223. Going from memory.
I was shooting 25.5 grains, that filled the case as I recall, with tracers. The stick powder seems to light them better than ball powder. Functioned my 16 fine, but I never did chrono them.
748 is the powder of choice for me, as it meters MUCH better.

If you are still looking for dies and 55gr. FMJ bullets as you mentioned in your OP?

I've got a standard base RCBS size die/shell holder with the RCBS competition (straight line) seating die/extended shell holder (their version of the Vickerman with micrometer adjustment) lying around.

The competition seating die is new and while I've never tried it, I believe it will only work in a single stage. 4895 doesn't meter well, so it might be the ticket.
Could probably round up 300 non-magnetic 55gr. FMJs to send along with them.

If you still have the need, let me hear back or PM me your address and I'll send them.

JT

mgmorden
February 23, 2013, 08:56 AM
I think things are slowly getting better. Heck I stopped into Wal-mart today and they actually had 4 boxes of .223 sitting on the shelf. It was Tula, but better than nothing. I bought the allowed 3 at $5.30 per box.

leadchucker
February 23, 2013, 12:04 PM
I found two pounds of Hodgdon Universal for $22 each at a gun show today. That blew my mind. While I was paying for them, I asked the guy about small pistol primers, and he said he had them too. I thought I had lucked out until he told me they were $75/1000. That blew my mind too.

lightman
February 23, 2013, 06:32 PM
I have been accused of hoarding but I keep enough stuff on hand to dodge these crises. This was not the first one of these, and the last one was not the first either! It happens about anytime that it looks like a Dem will win a major election. I do feel sorry for the newby, just getting started, and the guys on a tight budget, as I have been there. Sometimes economics 101 sucks! Lightman

1KPerDay
February 23, 2013, 06:40 PM
If you are still looking for dies and 55gr. FMJ bullets as you mentioned in your OP?

I've got a standard base RCBS size die/shell holder with the RCBS competition (straight line) seating die/extended shell holder (their version of the Vickerman with micrometer adjustment) lying around.

The competition seating die is new and while I've never tried it, I believe it will only work in a single stage. 4895 doesn't meter well, so it might be the ticket.
Could probably round up 300 non-magnetic 55gr. FMJs to send along with them.

If you still have the need, let me hear back or PM me your address and I'll send them.

JT
Awesome! PM sent. Thanks!:cool:

redneck2
February 23, 2013, 07:33 PM
The sad thing is that most guys here still won't stock up when the supplies come back to normal. Right now I've got over 13k of primers, probably 40# of powder, and over 10k of .223 and other brass. Bought them over the past few years when I ran into deals.

Some of my CCI SR primers were $19/k when they were on sale at Cabelas about 18 months ago. I bought 7k that day. The .22's that nobody can find?? I've got maybe 2-3k of those. So, when you go to Wally World a year from now, buy those .22's for $1.99 a box instead of just walking by.

GT1
February 23, 2013, 08:03 PM
If a person is patient and actually goes through the trouble of looking for components, setting up bookmarks, setting up notifications, then re-supplying isn't hard, and the prices haven't changed.
The only folks getting gouged are the panicky types, and they are enablers. They reap what they sow.

I thought reloaders were the constitutional types, do it for themselfers, etc etc. No?

I will shoot my pellet rifle before I gave the double and triple chargers a dime.

Jhass
February 23, 2013, 11:56 PM
My buddy bought a dpms ar a15 today at scheels

David E
February 24, 2013, 12:41 AM
My buddy bought a dpms ar a15 today at scheels

And he paid how much?

How about ammo?

hueyville
February 25, 2013, 12:17 AM
I have never let my primer stock go below 200,000 since the late 1990's. When the Y2K scare for all product to food and toilet paper I got really fat on primers, powder, bullet molds and gas checks. Stocked bullets every time I saw a bulk super deal. Have split pallet of factory ammo at times. Right before the election I bought an additional 5,000 rounds of U.S. made 5.56 at a slightly higher price than I wanted to but had that "feeling" again. My quarterly primer order hit and then during the afternoon of S.H. event I dropped 1,500 bucks on some additional essentials. I bet in the future some gun shops will be marking up product as the rounds are still flying. I was sitting at 290,000 primers by time gun stores closed that day. That is 10 to12 years of shooting at current rate. I could still shoot till age 79 on that if I cut down to 10,000 rounds per year never buying another. When I pass on, somebody is going to be hooked up as I plan to keep stocking till I am too old to carry them down the stairs.

David E
February 25, 2013, 01:15 AM
Hueyville, I'm curious what press you use to load all that.

Queen_of_Thunder
February 25, 2013, 01:16 AM
I'm down to a slingshot and pebbles.

hueyville
February 25, 2013, 05:08 AM
David, Dillon 550b, Dillon 650, Dillon square deal b, multiple rock chuckers, lee turret and a RCBS 50bmg kit. The 550b and my rockchuckers are most used.

David E
February 25, 2013, 09:38 AM
David, Dillon 550b, Dillon 650, Dillon square deal b, multiple rock chuckers, lee turret and a RCBS 50bmg kit. The 550b and my rockchuckers are most used.

Somehow, I knew you had multiple presses!

hueyville
February 25, 2013, 09:57 AM
A fair amount is posted in the reloading picture thread but not all. About half of equipment currently in service as still trying to get all put back from the big gun room remodel. All this while building the indoor range deal at work and a frame up build on a '88 Softail and sick wife has time a bit taxed. I usually only have two of the Dillon's mounted at a time, two Rockchuckers and a turret press. Due to available real estate on four benches, I mount the presses I need at the time and the rest go in a storage cabinet. Truthfully, I only need 1 turret, 2 single stage and one progressive to keep it rolling. Changing calibers with the 550b is so easy I could do without the other two blue machines but they are paid for and never change calibers with them. 70% o my shooting is 45acp thus do everything else in large runs that allow those setups to stay out of the way for a year at a time.

Buck13
February 25, 2013, 03:09 PM
I have never let my primer stock go below 200,000 since the late 1990's.

Wow. I hope your shelves are carefully earthquake-proofed. If that ever falls over, there might not be much left of your house! :D

ldlfh7
February 25, 2013, 03:26 PM
Geeze - 200,000 primers is crazy. Hope your house never catches on fire.

Constrictor
February 25, 2013, 03:50 PM
Geeze - 200,000 primers is crazy. Hope your house never catches on fire.
that dude didnt learn did he? thats just the minimum one should have on hand

GLOOB
February 25, 2013, 04:37 PM
[200,000 primers is] just the minimum one should have on hand
Wow. At 55 grains per bullet, you'd have enough primers to shoot 1,571 lbs of bullets. At 230 grains, you could go through 6,571 lbs of bullets. An average of 150 grains puts you over 2 tons.

At 6 grains of powder, you'd need 172 lbs of pistol powder. At 40 grains, that's 1,143 lbs of rifle powder. Say an average of 12 grains, that would be 343 lbs of powder. That's 42 x8 lb jugs.

The Lewis and Clarke expedition carried 400 lbs of lead and 200 lbs of rifle powder through the country when it was full of big game and hostile natives, and there were no grocery stores or Cabelas or Jack-in-the-Box on every corner. Divided by the 36ish members, that's only 11.1 lbs of lead and 5.5 lbs of powder per person.

Put in another perspective, DHS has recently purchased enough ammo to equal 4 rounds per man, woman, and child in the US, which is cited as part of the current shortage. Imagine if every reloader went out and purchased 200,000 rounds of ammo/components. I imagine that would make the DHS procurements a drop in the ocean. If 0.1% (1 out of a thousand) of the population reloads, that's 300k people. That's 60 billion rounds.

1KPerDay
February 25, 2013, 04:51 PM
Geeze - 200,000 primers is crazy. Hope your house never catches on fire.
He has each primer stored in individual, shock-and-fire-proof .50 cal ammo cans.

kingmt
February 25, 2013, 07:48 PM
He has each primer stored in individual, shock-and-fire-proof .50 cal ammo cans.
Now if he only had it stored in a 50 cal brass padded with powder & sealed with a 650gn projectile he would be all set.

hueyville
February 25, 2013, 07:49 PM
First off there are no earthquakes where I live, two little tremors is all anyone in my living family can remember. Second my primers are split into three locations. 2/3rds at home and 1/3rd at work. All are in OSHA explosion proof fire lockers. Each fire locker has a automatic fire suppression head above it as does my bench. At each end of every bench is a 4.75 pound DuPont FE-36 Clean-Agent fire extinguisher. My powder is split into two locations of which each are also OSHA explosion proof flammables cabinets with automatic fire suppression units overhead. If you put your guns in fire proof vaults, your flammable components should be in an OSHA approved locker.

The four motorcycles in the garage are much more likely to cause fire problems than primers or powder. That said, also a fire suppression system in garage and a 2 pound real Halon extinguisher in each bikes saddle bags along with two additional 9 pound DuPont FE-36 extinguishers mounted on opposite walls. If you park your hot car full of fuel in your garage that is much more dangerous than any amount of my primers. Add to this, the local fire department (as most will) come out once every five years and update my fire plan for both my business and home. You will notice most fire trucks have computers on board now. If you get a free fire plan done, they put a diagram of your structure in the computer with key flammable locations, contents and places persons could likely be found into their system. They know what to look for and where before they show up. I have monitored alarm with fire detectors everywhere and am located four miles from my local fire station. The one time a smoke head went off at the house they were on scene within 8 minutes and actually caught a smoldering electrical short in a bad lamp before it flamed. They were happy to come and glad they had a fire plan to review on the way. It showed them where the exterior electrical disconnect is which is first thing they did. Which door is the only one that is not force entry rated so they didn't waste time entering nor mess up any 800 dollar doors, where the flammables are located and what they are. I arrived five minutes later to see a smoking lamp in the front yard and a bunch of happy fire fighters that had been bored up till they got to kick in my door. Security has multiple components which a good fire plan is as important as your alarms, safes, dogs and guns to fight off invading hoards looking for the primers. haha. When you get home tonight, look around... Where is the closest extinguisher? When was the last time it was inspected? Is it a quality unit? Do you have enough? I bet if a home invader kicks in your door tonight as you sleep you have a gun close at hand. If you wake up surrounded by flames, is the extinguisher as close and does it work? Do you have enough to fight your way to the kids and then fight your way out to safety? Remember extinguishers are just an escape tool in a real fire. YMMV, IMHO and all other disclaimers apply.

If you enjoyed reading about "Times are tough, my friends..." here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!