[pax]

From http://www.uexpress.com/unconventionalwisdom/viewuw.cfm Published in July of 2001, but I only just now saw it. :)

UnConventional Wisdom, by Richard Morin

IN GUNS WE TRUST

We all know why so many law-abiding Americans own guns: Some buy them for protection against crime. Others collect them as objets d'art. Some love to hunt or target shoot.
But two Ohio State University researchers argue there's another significant factor behind America's infatuation with firearms: Many Americans who own guns don't trust the federal government. Sociology professors Robert M. Jiobu and Timothy J. Curry assert that this mistrust complicates government efforts to control the sale and possession of guns. In fact, they suggest that gun control laws may have exactly the opposite effect: "To mandate decreased gun ownership through gun control legislation may only encourage those people who have little faith in the government to stockpile weapons," they claim in the latest issue of Social Science Quarterly.

Curry and Jiobu analyzed data collected between 1988 and 1996 from the General Social Survey (GSS), the nation's most closely watched barometer of social trends. The survey included questions about gun ownership and three questions that asked how much confidence people have in the executive branch of government, in the Supreme Court and in Congress. Overall, the researchers found that 44 percent of the more than 6,000 respondents had "hardly any" confidence in at least one of the government branches -- "significantly more than expressed similar levels of mistrust in the 1960s," Curry said.

They also found that those who mistrusted all branches of the federal government were significantly more likely to own a gun (37 percent) than those who trusted all three (23 percent) -- a finding that remained strong even after they controlled for relevant variables such as political ideology, gender, age, education, general fear of crime, whether the respondents had been crime victims in the previous year, whether they or someone in their household hunted, what region of the country they lived in and whether they lived in a city, in the suburbs or in a rural area. "If a policy goal of the federal government is to decrease gun ownership among the general population, then our results suggest that increasing trust in government ought to be an equally important goal," Jiobu and Curry wrote.

Well, duh. How many people do you know who went out and bought an eeeeevil black 'assault rifle' just cuz the gov't was about to pass a new law?

pax

[CAP]

| Well, duh. How many people do you know who went out and bought an eeeeevil black 'assault rifle' just cuz the gov't was about to pass a new law? |

BUNCHES!

[DeltaElite]

I had been looking for an AK variant, when Clinton banned importation of more "assault rifles". I responded by buying an SLR-95 the very next day. :D

I trust my Govt, really I do.
Honest, I wouldn't lie. ;)

:neener:

[El Tejon]

Golly, I was a decade or two ahead of these supergeniuses in Ohio. I read about this guy, Little Jimmy Madison, and HE didn't trust the federal government and he had a hand in designing it!:p

Guns are for shooting people. If you want to know who those people are, just read the works of our government--Washington, Madison, Jefferson, Jay, Hamliton, Mason, Lee, etc., et al.

[trapshooter]

Rifle?

What rifle?:scrutiny: :evil:

[Pilgrim]

During the Watts riot of 1965, I sat on the roof of my parent's home with a .22 rimfire rifle across my lap. From my vantage point I could see into south central Los Angeles. I could see the fires and the smoke. If the wind was just right, I could hear gunfire.

I worked at the Crenshaw May Company department store. On the second day of the riot I think, I was sent home early. I think that night the display windows were broken and some looting took place.

While I sat on the roof, two carloads of people who didn't fit in the neighborhood pulled up and stopped in the street in front of my parent's home. A few of them got out of the car. I looked around and didn't see any Los Angeles County Sheriff's deputies. They were busy trying to contain the riot east of Crenshaw. I figured if anything started it was just me with my puny .22 rifle. Fortunately the occupants of the two cars decided to drive on.

I have always had a firearm within easy reach since the Watts riot.

[Mike Irwin]

I own firearms for the same reason that I own screwdrivers or a circular saw.

They're useful to me.

[M1911]

don't trust the government? Who woulda thunk it? Couldn't have been the framers of the Constitution?

[Waitone]

The entire concept behind our form of government is that of mistrust of central government. That is why it is so inefficient.

Checks and balances is a marvelous concept and really ought to be thumped in public.

Efficiency = bad
Checks and balances = good

Citizen ownership of guns = the final check on an out of control central government.

Sorry is that offends someone's PC theology.

[Art Eatman]

Er, uh, it seems to me that the very idea of a Bill of Rights is an indication of distrust of the State? No?

Art

[Atticus]

"In fact, they suggest that gun control laws may have exactly the opposite effect: "To mandate decreased gun ownership through gun control legislation may only encourage those people who have little faith in the government to stockpile weapons," they claim in the latest issue of Social Science Quarterly."


"If a policy goal of the federal government is to decrease gun ownership among the general population, then our results suggest that increasing trust in government ought to be an equally important goal," Jiobu and Curry wrote."


Good study. Evidently someone needs to point out the obvious to academics and politicians. I hope it finds it's way to a lot of both.

[Baba Louie]

Why?

Cause it says "In God We Trust", not "In Government We Trust"

Adios

[Don Gwinn]

Yup. Sky's blue, too.

[coonan357]

Mostly and I am asonished by you guys for not saying it first Because I can !!!

[Marko Kloos]

I own guns because they remove me from the realm of coercion.

Anyone who wants something from me will have to use logic and reason in order to get my voluntary cooperation, because I cannot be forced into compliance.

[Hkmp5sd]

They also found that those who mistrusted all branches of the federal government were significantly more likely to own a gun (37 percent) than those who trusted all three (23 percent) -- a finding that remained strong even after they controlled for relevant variables such as political ideology, gender, age, education, general fear of crime, whether the respondents had been crime victims in the previous year, whether they or someone in their household hunted, what region of the country they lived in and whether they lived in a city, in the suburbs or in a rural area.

Why is it necessary for "controlled for relevant variables"? Seems they are implying that gun owners distrusting the government are a separate group from those owning guns for all other reasons.

What the data is saying is that 77% of ALL gun owners distrust at least one branch of the federal government regardless of any other reason for owning firearms.

[Standing Wolf]

To mandate decreased gun ownership through gun control legislation may only encourage those people who have little faith in the government to stockpile weapons.

Wow! What prescience! What scholarship! What insight!

[Blackhawk]

"If a policy goal of the federal government is to decrease gun ownership among the general population, then our results suggest that increasing trust in government ought to be an equally important goal," Jiobu and Curry wrote. Which is to say that a government that wants to control guns needs to also want to increase trust in it.

There's something mighty perverse about that.... :rolleyes:

The government should increase ITS trust in the citizens in order for them to increase their trust in it.

[Ryder]

I've got about 10 times more "hicapacity" magazines now than before they enacted the ban. If the ban doesn't sunset I'll probably double that and get a few more firearms as well.

Purchased my first military style firearm well before the ban (1987) when "they" merely began discussing the possibility. I'm just getting warmed up here. :D

Overly restrictive laws are oppressive laws. If it is going to end up in an us-vs-them situation who wouldn't want to be prepared? A buddy of mine isn't, he told me yesterday that if the SHTF he's heading for my place. Allies are a good thing.

Micro-manage this! :fire:



(edit: darn typos)

[Atticus]

Bill Clinton hit the daily double. He was responsible for putting more guns in the hands of citizens than any other President AND he proved that the Executive branch was untrustworthy, all in one fell swoop. I'd say this study confirms that.

[NewShooter78]

Its funny though. How many people got into firearms for other reasons. I didn't trust the gov't before I owned a gun. Now that I own one, I don't trust them any more or any less. Now I have better and more clarified reasons to not trust the gov't, and it has something to do with my owning of a firearm, but also because of recent legislative attacks on our personal freedoms. What I did also gain is a better understanding of the RKBA, and a firmer belief in the Constitution, most notably the BoR since I found TFL and now here on THR.

[geekWithA.45]

...If a policy goal of the federal government is to decrease gun ownership among the general population...

Since when is this a legitimate perogative of government?


Gun ownership is a perogative of the people, and, short of issues of actual, bona fide criminality, it is simply not part of their bailiwick.

At least, that's how the Framers envisioned it.


Gah.

Feh.

Hawk. Spit.

I feel better now.

[Politically Incorrect]

Just think of all the guns that would have been purchased if Al Gore happened to get into office.

I buy guns because I'd hate to end up like a country with a centralized government like North Korea. Oh yeah, and because I can!

[TexasVet]

------------------------------------------------
Well, duh. How many people do you know who went out and bought an eeeeevil black 'assault rifle' just cuz the gov't was about to pass a new law?
-------------------------------------------------

So THAT'S how that funny black (sorta grey, actually) gun got in my safe with all those WW2 collectables!

[PATH]

I have the God given right and I exercise that right!

[Bob Locke]

All of the Above

:cool:

[Monte Harrison]

"If a policy goal of the federal government is to decrease gun ownership among the general population, then our results suggest that increasing trust in government ought to be an equally important goal," Jiobu and Curry wrote.Yep, since gun control laws are ineffective at best and counterproductive at worst, what the gubmint really needs is a good PR campaign.

[JohnBT]

Why? Because you have to have the right tool for the job.

John

[Delmar]

because I will, always

[Frohickey]

"If a policy goal of the federal government is to decrease gun ownership among the general population, then our results suggest that increasing trust in government ought to be an equally important goal," Jiobu and Curry wrote.

Hmm... increasing trust in government.

Sounds like to do that, government should start abolishing the various gun control laws that are on the books.

A government that trusts me with guns, is a government that I would trust.

[Jmurman]

but distrust my Govt.

[Ed N.]

Quote:

===============================
"If a policy goal of the federal government is to decrease gun
ownership among the general population, then our results
suggest that increasing trust in government ought to be an
equally important goal," Jiobu and Curry wrote.
===============================


That statement seems oxymoronic. Why would I trust a government that has disarming me as a policy goal? Governments that seek to disarm the people usually get around to some form of genocide, eventually.

I own guns for many reasons: hunting, target shooting, self defense, etc. The ONE reason that trumps all others, though, is the realization that the founders of this country once faced the necessity of removing, by armed force, an oppressive government.

God forbid that the need should ever arise again, but God forbid that we find ourselves unarmed if and when it does.

[10-Ring]

I do because I can!:scrutiny:

[Kaylee]

self-reinforcing cycle to -- not only are those less inclined to trust the gov't more likely to get armed, those who arm for other reasons will quickly see just how untrustworthy the government can be. ("what, did we say that SKS you registered last year was legal?... our mistake... turn it in or go to jail..") :banghead:

Speaking just for myself, I had significantly more faith in our government before I got to experience the joy of being painted continually as a psychopath-to-be by my own CongressCritters.


-K

[Sam Adams]

"To mandate decreased gun ownership through gun control legislation may only encourage those people who have little faith in the government to stockpile weapons,"
________________________________

How about the fact that the very act of discussing, let alone passing, gun control legislation encourages people to have little faith in government? Stockpiling weapons is a great American tradition for those that distrust government, but it sometimes takes more than the mere existence of government to cause such distrust. The clearest overt action that would cause (or exacerbate, as the case may be) such distrust is the passage of gun control legislation.

As for me, I bought my first gun after Gov. Flim-Flam Florio of NJ rammed his "Assault Rifle" ban through the NJ legislature. This was an actual ban - not just a prohibition on future purchases, and was combined with another outright ban - on any magazine of more than 15-round capacity. I first bought only in NJ (not knowing any better), but later stopped all purchases of long guns in NJ - I bought them in NY and PA in order to avoid tracing to NJ. I also acquired LOTS of "illegal" magazines outside of the state. Later yet (only 2 years ago), I got smart and removed myself from NJ altogether. Now I'm in TX, where I can buy pretty much anything I want (except where Fedgov violates the Constitution).

Oh, and every time that Clinton talked about or rammed through another gun law, I bought more weapons and/or ammunition. He sure must've liked the gun industry, because I (and everyone I spoke to) bought a load of stuff while he was in office.

As an aside, when passing over the Delaware Memorial Bridge on the way out of NJ, I remarked to my wife, "Now you won't have to bail me out of jail." As I expected, she looked at me with real wide eyes, like I was a Martian or something. A couple of seconds later came the inevitable "Why?," to which I responded, "Well, I've got enough large capacity magazines in the back of the car to have sent me to prison for at least 150 years in NJ" (at 5 years a pop). More wide eyes, followed by shaking of the head and unintelligible muttering. Next question: "What are 'large capacity magazines,' and why are they illegal in NJ?" (she wasn't a gun person, even though she tolerated them. I'm working on changing this, apparently successfully - now she wants her own). I explained the history and politics of the matter to her. Then she asked, "Why aren't they illegal now?" To which I responded that most states didn't outlaw metal boxes with springs inside, no matter how large they were. The final response from my wife was: "Now I'm really glad that we're leaving Jersey." Amen!

[Atticus]

"To mandate decreased gun ownership through gun control legislation may only encourage those people who have little faith in the government to stockpile weapons,"


And grows the number of people who have little faith in government...which in turn grows the number of stockpilers.

It's a vicious cycle, therefore all gun control laws must be abolished immediatly in order to reduce the number of guns in this country.:D