PPK and PPK/S aquisition


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Rexster
March 3, 2013, 02:25 AM
Well, actually, the dealer has placed a two-day hold on them for me, which took just a couple of minutes. It was so busy inside the gun store, that I could not examine the Walthers until shortly before closing, after waiting for over half an hour; typical Saturday madness, of late. I live near the dealer, so I will go back on Monday or Tuesday, when it should be more peaceful, and conduct the transaction(s) in un-rushed peace. I may buy one, and layaway the other, or might layaway both, to make for just one transfer after an anticipated check arrives and clears in the near future.

One thing, for certain, is that these newer S&W Walthers have smooth DA and SA trigger pulls. The serial number engraving looks like crap. Ah, well, these will be working tools, carried concealed, not jewelry.

Why these older Walther designs, as carry guns? Well, my wife favors her German PP for carry, and having shot it, myself, I know the PP/PPK design is a good pointer in my hands. (I do believe in using the sights, whenever possible, but a handgun that points well helps me get on-target quicker.) As my right wrist deteriorates, and my right shoulder might require some structural work in the future, I am leaning more toward guns that work well in my left hand, and shoot well for me without the aid of a support hand. The PP/PPK is a good one-handed lefty gun for me; all else being equal, I tend to shoot DA/SA pistols better in lefty mode, and DAO better in rightie mode.

Also, my wife is not the best at toting spare magazines, so I can tote mags for both of us. :) Moreover, there are places that she cannot carry under the provisions of a Texas CHL, but I can carry on my badge, under the provisions of the LEOSA; in an emergency, she could arm herself with a familiar weapon I am carrying.

In case anyone is wondering, no, I have not yet seen the newest James Bond movie.

I have no immediate plans to abandon my carry of heavier ordnance, nor my tendency to carry multiple handguns; when toting a Walther or two, I am likely to continue to have a .357 or .45 on or about my person. ;)

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9mmepiphany
March 3, 2013, 03:27 AM
If you plan on sharing mags with your wife's PP, you're limited to getting the PPK/S. The PPK's magazine will be too short for her PP

Rexster
March 3, 2013, 03:35 AM
True, of course, only the longer mags would be feasible for sharing.

Gary A
March 3, 2013, 09:09 AM
True, of course, only the longer mags would be feasible for sharing.
However, you could still carry the PPK and carry PPK/S mags as spares and for sharing. Nicht wahr?

Rexster
March 3, 2013, 03:21 PM
However, you could still carry the PPK and carry PPK/S mags as spares and for sharing. Nicht wahr?
Yes, we nearly started doing that several years ago, when I briefly owned an Interarms PPK, but I never learned to like that one, and I never qual'ed with it. (My employer, a big-city PD, expects me to qual with every handgun I will be carrying concealed for defense, on or off the clock. I am considered to be always subject to duty, and engaging any bad guy, by definition, is in the line of duty.)

Ever since I traded that first PPK, however, I had planned to eventually buy a PPK/S or PP. When I saw the S&W versions, with the duckbill tang, I had thought of trying an S&W PPK. Now, I will be doing both.

Life is good! :)

Gary A
March 3, 2013, 04:29 PM
Life is good!
Ain't that the truth!

armedwalleye
March 3, 2013, 04:48 PM
...and it beats the daylights out of the alternative!

returningfire
March 4, 2013, 12:16 PM
What is Bond carrying in the new movie?:confused:
I haven't had a chance to see it yet.

Gary A
March 4, 2013, 12:22 PM
...and it beats the daylights out of the alternative!
That's why getting older is a fine thing! ;)

Hurryin' Hoosier
March 4, 2013, 09:25 PM
Rexster - Just be careful how you grip either gun. In case nobody has warned you, the slides are notorious for "biting" (or, in my case, slicing) the web of your hand between your thumb and forefinger. Don't grip them too high!

(As for me, I'll stick with my Pistolet Makarova. "Ten times the gun for one tenth the price." :D )

mdauben
March 5, 2013, 03:45 PM
What is Bond carrying in the new movie?


"Walther PPK/S, nine-millimeter short" (9mm Short = .380ACP). His gun is also supposed to have palm-print identification courtesy of "Q".

http://www.imfdb.org/images/thumb/c/c7/SkyF-pistol-1.jpg/800px-SkyF-pistol-1.jpg

Hurryin' Hoosier
March 5, 2013, 06:56 PM
I believe that's a PPK (not a PPK/S), Mike.

Rezin
March 6, 2013, 10:34 AM
I owned an interarms PPKs for years. It was a beautiful looking gun, but it jammed often. I would stove pipe at least once per magazine. It got to the point where I was only positive the round in the chamber would fire, everything after that was up in the air. Nice for collections, but due to that fact I got rid of it for my daily carry.

Rexster
March 6, 2013, 02:11 PM
Rexster - Just be careful how you grip either gun. In case nobody has warned you, the slides are notorious for "biting" (or, in my case, slicing) the web of your hand between your thumb and forefinger. Don't grip them too high!

(As for me, I'll stick with my Pistolet Makarova. "Ten times the gun for one tenth the price." :D )
Fortunately, for using a pre-S&W PPK, my skinny hands have so little meat on them, I don't get bitten. The S&W-made PPK and PPK/S have extended tangs, compared to earlier versions, largely mitigating the problem for those who have meatier hands.

I have nothing against the excellent Makarovs, but do want my little mini-pistols to share mags with my wife's PP, and for her to be able to arm herself with a familiar weapon if one of mine is nearest at hand in an emergency.

Rexster
March 6, 2013, 02:18 PM
I believe that's a PPK (not a PPK/S), Mike.
The quoted line is from the movie script, spoken by Q. I just saw the trailer! (I have not seen the movie yet.) Those grips are differently-shaped, potentially causing an optical illusion, so, just eyeballing it, I am not sure where that is an actual PPK, or an /S, or, of course, a prop gun that that may be a true match with neither.

Gary A
March 6, 2013, 02:31 PM
That different grip in the photo muddies the water a bit, but the length of the grip appears more that of a PPK/S than a PPK, at least to my eyes.

To Rezin, years ago, I had an Interarms PPK that I don't remember ever jamming in a modest amount of shooting. Don't remember if I shot any HPs out of it, or not, but I think I did. My current SW PPK/S-1 has also not jammed, again in a modest amount of shooting, and all with FMJ.

Both proved to be very accurate.

mdauben
March 6, 2013, 04:54 PM
I believe that's a PPK (not a PPK/S), Mike.
As other's indicated, the character "Q" called it a PPK/S in the movie. It might well be a PPK, but the prop "palm-print" grip makes it hard to say.

pockets
March 7, 2013, 11:07 AM
Yep, the new young Q says PPK/s in 'Skyfall' and it appears to be so, the odd grip makes it look....well...odd.

I've had an old Interarms/Walther PPK/s in .380acp for awhile. It has been flawless with everything I've put through it over the years, FMJ or JHP.
I've had no real slide bite issues with mine.
.

Hurryin' Hoosier
March 7, 2013, 03:28 PM
Rexster: "I have nothing against the excellent Makarovs, but do want my little mini-pistols to share mags with my wife's PP, and for her to be able to arm herself with a familiar weapon if one of mine is nearest at hand in an emergency."

So, get two Makarovs - one for you, and one for the frau. Problem solved! :)

golden
March 8, 2013, 04:22 PM
REXSTER,

I have been shooting a pre-war PPK in .32ACP for the past month and I am getting used to the BAD SIGHTS and heavy trigger. It is a handly little thing. Next to my SIG 232, it is noticably smaller in length and width.
The accuracy is also pretty good for a pocket pistol.

On the other hand, my SIG is more controllable and accurate and has much better sights and trigger. The SIG also has a power edge as it is a .380ACP.

The first time I shot the PPK, I was surprised by the amount of recoil that is generated. That small grip made me think that a PP might be better, but the PP would be even harder to conceal than the SIG.

I will keep shooting both. The SIG is one of my carry guns and works perfectly with REMINGTON hollow points and I love the sights and smooth trigger.

The PPK, on the other hand is smaller and more easily concealled, which is what is was designed for. I will be curious to see how it does with hollow point ammo.

OH HOOSIER, you must be single. YOU NEVER TRY TO CHANGE YOU WIFE'S GUN! YOU JUST SAY, "YES DEAR".

Jim

Rexster
March 15, 2013, 05:51 PM
Thanks to all who have read and replied!

I finally got a chance to shoot them. First through each was 50 rounds of Remington Leadless, from the PD range. I made one error, by not getting my thumb sufficiently out of the way of the safety lever while dropping the slide of the PPK/S, and the slide did not go fully into battery. A slght nudge, and the slide closed. I do not consider that a weapon malfunction. The PPK ran fine for the first 50 rounds.

Next, I ran 50 rounds of Federal red box Eagle FMJ through each. The PPK/S ran fine, while the PPK had one failure to go completely into battery. So, the PPK/S, at least, I consider a success, but that is tentative, as I plan to run several hundred more round through each.

One thing is certain: These S&W Walthers, of traditional design, absolutely need to be thoroughly lubed before firing. They are shipped with just a bit of light oil. I used white grease, before shooting, and the different in slide movement and trigger return was
dramatic.

The red dots in the sights helped me better focus, without the need to view the sights through the lower part of my progressive bifocals. Nice touch; I like this!

Very importantly, I did not notice my aging right wrist aching any worse than normal upon awakening today. Being of fixed-barrel blow-back design, the PPK-series pistols have vigorous recoil, relatively, that tries to eat the web of one's hand, even with the extended tang that distinguishes the newer generation. Actual torquing of the wrist joint, however, seems to be minimal, for which I am grateful. It looks like I have found my new right-hand carry pistol. I may well continue to carry a heavier, more-powerful weapon for use by my healthier left hand. As my right wrist deteriorates with age, I am grateful that I am a fairly ambidextrous lefty! (I have carried "primary" on the right hip since 1984; long story.)

Even with my thin hands and skinny fingers, there is no room on these diminutive pistols for using the current state-of-the-art support-hand method. I used the lower, thumb-over-thumbnail grasp.

MICHAEL T
March 15, 2013, 09:48 PM
I carry Corbon DPX in my Interarms PPK/S and I have always shot it 1 handed . I think some pistols are just not made to try and shoot 2 handed . My KelTec's are another one .

Be suprised with a little practice how well you can do 1 handed.

River Wraith
March 17, 2013, 01:21 AM
I had an interarms PPK/S and also had a lot of trouble with it jamming. In fact I sent it back to the company and they "fixed" it. It still jammed. It always jammed so I bought a Glock 19. It never jammed. I like Walther though so I traded the 19 for a P-99. Loved that gun. When the fire control broke I had it fixed, then traded it for a new P-99 from Earl's. (which has never jammed or broken in ten years.) When I was talking to him, I mentioned the old PPK/S that I really liked, but that was pretty much unuseable. He said he could fix it. I sent it to him and never had another problem with it, except as time went on and I used the P-99, the less I wanted to shoot the PPK/S due to the sights. They just weren't as good as the sights on the P-99. I eventually traded it for a newer PPS. I like the PPS better because it is 9mm and the sights are much better. The PPS still isn't as good as the P-99. The P-99 is a violent work of art. The PPS trigger and mag release are not as smooth as the P-99, but in my opinion, the PPS is much better than the PPK or PPK/S. The only thing is it is pretty pricey, and why buy a PPS when you can buy a P-99 for the same price. I paid 5 or 6 hundred for my P-99 and now they cost 999. Crazy. PP is an awesome model, though, just dated.

bannockburn
March 17, 2013, 09:46 AM
I have had a couple of PP models (Walther and Manurhin), as well as a stainless PPK/S from Interarms. I would have to rate the Manurhin PP as the best of the three as it had a really great DA/SA trigger. The most problematic one was the Interarms PPK/S; far too many sharp edges and burrs, an extremely heavy DA trigger, and frequent jams and extraction issues made for it being far too unreliable for any sort of CCW work.

Rexster
March 24, 2013, 09:22 AM
The Interarms PPK, that I briefly owned several years ago, was reliable for the number of rounds I put through it, but I cannot recall the quantity. The reason I never learned to like it was the recoil equation; it kicked and squirmed more than a Kahr K9, while firing a weaker cartridge. It is not that the recoil hurt; it just seemed inefficient. I cannot recall if it had a serrated trigger; if it did, that would have been another point of irritation.

The Kahr fell from favor, too, as it just could not induce me to give up snubby revolvers for back-up duty, and I tended to carry full-sized 1911 pistols as primary weapons, on and off the clock. Now, however, it hurts my aching, aging wrist to shoot a snubby right-handed, whereas a PPK/S is painless.

In hindsight, of course, I wish I would have kept that first PPK. There are now adapters that, in effect, extend the grip when using the longer PP-length magazines, that might have sufficiently helped mitigate the recoil and squirming.

Back to the new Walthers; I am eager to get to the range again!

Storm
March 24, 2013, 12:06 PM
It is not that the recoil hurt; it just seemed inefficient

That is well put. Exactly how I saw my PPK in .380. I got rid of it (an InterArms) despite being a beautiful gun and have now replaced it with a 1965 PP in .32 ACP, the caliber that was meant for the gun. It is a wonderful shooter.

EHL
March 24, 2013, 12:23 PM
PM sent. I have the newer S&W version of the PPK/s. I know there is alot of bashing on this version over the older German made ones, (no doubt fine pieces of workmanship) and the Interarms ones as well, but mine has recieved nothing but singing praises from all who have fired it. I made a few mods to it though and I did have to send it back for the safety replacement as well as a trigger job completed by S&W free of charge when I sent it back for the safety replacement on their mandatory recall.

A great little pistol!

gym
April 2, 2013, 06:25 PM
I loved mine, it was a 1976 German nickel plated with cocobolo style grips, and it shot dead on. But as mentioned it got traded for other small 9mm's, after 2 trips to the factory it still jammed and stovepiped. Since it was NYC, and you only got one gun "at first", I went to a revolver, a 38 snub model 60. this was in the 70's and 80's, pre glock. Once I moved to FL, in the 90's, & all the small pistols started to appear, like the AMT backup 45, "another problem gun", and the glock 26. I got rid of it.
The colt mustangs and pony's, were smaller and more reliable in 380. I should have held on to them, the way they skyrocketed.

Jessie James 58
April 3, 2013, 11:53 AM
I still own a PPK/S (Interarms) and shoot it occasionally. It is reliable with no jams of any kind. When shooting the heavy self defense loads there in a sharp recoil, but nothing painful.
I Love how accurate the PPK/S is and I was able to score some ammo when everybody was grabbing all of the 9MM and 45 ACP ammo.

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