Effective range for .32ACP?


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el Godfather
March 3, 2013, 06:08 PM
Dear THR:
What is the maximum effective range for a .32 ACP bullet fired out of a handgun? What would the ideal effective beyond which the bullet remains effective, but not at its best?

Please discuss any experiences that you may have.

Why do we not see more .32s and perhaps a +p+ versions? If we could get potent energy packed in to small bullets they will be ideal for ccw.

What is the biggest disadvantage that you can think of with .32, but at it ideal range?

I have Walther PPS made in France. Which do you prefer?
Thank you

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SharpsDressedMan
March 3, 2013, 06:44 PM
Most .32ACP or 7.65mm pistols are blowback, and would not lend themselves well to cartridges loaded to higher pressure. The shooter would get a lot of blowback from those cartridges in their face. I have shot my Walther PPK .32 at 50 yards in slow fire and it will group all shots in the head of a standard size silhouette target at that range.

kBob
March 3, 2013, 08:09 PM
Cartridges do not have maximum effective ranges.

Maximum Effective Range applies to the range at which the average trained soldier can achieve 50 percent hits on a kneeling man target with the given firearm and ammunition in question.

The Maximum effective range of a KelTec P32 would not be the same as a Browning 1922 with high adjustable sight for instance. A Bayard Baby would not have the same Max Effective Range as a Beretta 84 (?)

Likely none would have the same as a .308 rifle with decent scope and .32 ACP shell shrinker.

I had a buddy that would occassionally shoot a Browning 1922 with original sights and Waffen Amt marks at 100 yards that could pretty much without a doubt had hit such a target at least 50% of the time....but he was not your average shooter.

Other have pointed out that the problem with loading the .32ACP hot is that most guns that use it are blow back.

There was and maystill be available a gun that fired a .380 case necked down to .32 (I believe it was NAA but check me on that) for folks that wanted more go intheir .32 pocket pistol.

I do believe the .32 ACP to be under rated as I think old JMB had a good idea there. Sure would not turn my nose up at a 1903 Colt or a 1950's Star in .32 ACP if you have one to give away.......

-kBob

groundhog34
March 3, 2013, 08:22 PM
It is a weak cartridge at best. With 9mm the same size as 32 why have one. Blowback design limits the power of the cartridge thus negating the possibility of a +p.

SHR970
March 3, 2013, 08:43 PM
It is a weak cartridge at best. That can put a FMJ through all layers of a mid 60's station wagon tailgate at 100 yards. I have three recovered slugs from that experiment. It may not have a lot of foot pounds but it will penetrate to the vitals.

But that wasn't the question.

The question was effective range. I did repeatedly hit a vertical standing station wagon tailgate at 100 yards with a Manhurin Walther PP. The rounds went through and stopped in the rock / dirt behind it.

A blow back gun may have power limitations, but the pinned barrel does lend to good accuracy potential.

Robbins290
March 3, 2013, 08:52 PM
With my 1903, I can hit a paper plate at 50-75 yards. My cz is even more accurate. I can hit a human size target at 80-100 yards

SharpsDressedMan
March 3, 2013, 09:20 PM
Effective? It WILL have an effect. I don't think it would knock me down at 100 yards, but if a shooter was good enough to put it ON me at 100 yards, I'd sure take cover! :D

Walkalong
March 3, 2013, 09:44 PM
I can hit my 10" steel plate at 25 yards pretty easily with my .32s, but I don't want to use it for self defense at that distance if I can help it. My CZ holds 12 and my Beretta holds 16 (IIRC), so I could probably deter someone at that distance if I had to. It's like a .22 LR, if you hit the right spot, it will stop them. It just doesn't have a lot of room for error.

usp9
March 3, 2013, 09:44 PM
The practical range for most small handguns, regardless of caliber, is fairly close proximity to your target. The maximun range would depend on what that target is. Most people can't hit much of anything outside of 25 yards, especially in dangerous situations. Just plinking and having fun would extend the range to your skill level. Small .32acp pistols are mainly meant to protect. These are all close-in guns.

twice barrel
March 3, 2013, 11:49 PM
6" or less.

460Kodiak
March 4, 2013, 03:18 PM
6" is pushing it

Just Kidding

Fishbed77
March 4, 2013, 05:05 PM
Why do we not see more .32s and perhaps a +p+ versions? If we could get potent energy packed in to small bullets they will be ideal for ccw.

Well, the +P+ question has been thoroughly answered at this point. As to the other question of why we don't see more .32s, the simple answer it that there are .380 pistols available today that are smaller and lighter than the .32s of yore. Heck, there are 9mm Luger pistols available that are about the same size, and it's a vastly superior cartridge.

SHR970
March 4, 2013, 07:31 PM
Why do we not see more .32s?

Because not even NAA has seen fit to make a mini revolver the size of a S&W 1 1/2 in 32 ACP.

IdahoSkies
March 4, 2013, 07:45 PM
Quote:
Why do we not see more .32s?

I think its because they started shoving .380 and 9mm rounds into .32 ACP sized pistols.

I think the .32 is a wonderful marriage between size and control ability. One of my favorite rounds, despite its limitations.

Kiln
March 4, 2013, 09:04 PM
Quote:
Why do we not see more .32s?

I think its because they started shoving .380 and 9mm rounds into .32 ACP sized pistols.

I think the .32 is a wonderful marriage between size and control ability. One of my favorite rounds, despite its limitations.
I actually prefer compacts in .32acp because due to the lower recoil, malfunctions due to limp wristing are much less common.

European surplus sidearms chambered in .32acp are excellent because they're all steel and have extremely low recoil.

MedWheeler
March 4, 2013, 11:35 PM
I like my P32 Kel-Tec far more than I can even imagine I'd like the P3-AT version. But, I accept its limitations. If I'm defending from 25+ yards away, I probably also have some self-extraction options available as well.
That being said, I still carry my PF9 far more often..

Jim Watson
March 5, 2013, 01:15 AM
There have been two modern European projects for super .32 with locked breech actions to overcome the blowback limitations. One is on Glock actions, one in cahoots with STI, of all people. Neither has amounted to much.

The very best of .32s is about a 25 metre pistol for good accuracy.
No doubt it would hurt an assailant. But not as much as a larger calibre.

WCraven
March 5, 2013, 03:02 AM
There are afew handguns like Colt and the S&W K frame that fire this 32-20 Winchester.. no +P+ needed..

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v400/crazycrave/003-6.jpg

ku4hx
March 5, 2013, 06:40 AM
About the same as a baseball bat.

SHR970
March 5, 2013, 10:23 PM
You bring the baseball bat....I'll bring the PP. :evil:

10 paces turn and have at. :neener:

It only gets better if you say "Hold my beer and watch this" first. ;)

scaatylobo
March 5, 2013, 10:47 PM
I was shooting a BUG at a coon in a friends barn a few years back [ didnt want to use the .40 - too much noise for the horses ] so I used my BUG,a Seecamp .32 with Silvertips.

the distance was approx. 12 feet and it took 5 body hits till I dropped it from the rafter.

It was a large momma coon and weighed about 10 pounds.

That might give you an idea as to 'stopping power',no head shots as near as I could see - but the Seecamp has no sights.

Deaf Smith
March 6, 2013, 12:12 AM
Out of my P32 Keltec the max effective range (if I consider the ability to hit all shots in a 6 inch circle) is about 10 yards slow fire. But out of my Beretta 1934 .32 ACP it's at least twice that distance.

Now a .32 auto can kill someone several hundred yards away. Maybe even 1000 yards, but most .32s have such poor sights, grips, trigger, etc.. that it takes a good shot to hit past 5 yards.

The best ammo in power for the .32 tends to be european in nature as U.S. factories tend to load the round low.

Deaf

Bovice
March 6, 2013, 12:31 AM
I didn't know they made a .32 ACP SIG. I wonder how it sounds with a suppressor. More or less awesome than a USP 45?

Jim K
March 6, 2013, 02:11 AM
I have a pre-WWII .32 Walther PP that will shoot under two inches at 25 yards, so I think if I had to fire at a person 100 yards away, I would at least make him pretty uncomfortable. (Of course, I would have to aim about 5 feet over his head!)

Jim

Shadow 7D
March 6, 2013, 12:16 PM
Love my .32's
if you want hot you can buy a .327mag in revolver, most European ammo is loaded hotter than US in this caliber.
It's for social distance, yeah you can hit MUCH further out, but this round (and most of the guns) are optimized for easy carry, not target shooting...

el Godfather
March 6, 2013, 05:10 PM
I read the responses and I feel quite strange that people generally tend to think .32 is week as water at over say 10 yards or so.

I do not think this caliber is meant to hitting enemy ways out. It is rather a bug caliber that can be easily managed in recoil and ccw, intended to be used in a situation where you have to get out of a sticky situation.

Starting this tread, I had 15 yards in mind as optimal range.

SharpsDressedMan
March 6, 2013, 06:00 PM
You can compare a Walther PPK in .32 to a Walther PPS in 9mm. Similar size, with the differences being negligible, depending on what you prefer. However, what do you feel a .32 is going to do BETTER than a 9mm from a similar sized gun? The .32 will kill someone, but it probably is always going to fall short of a 9mm at STOPPING someone who is determined to fight if the bullet is not placed in any "high incapacitation" part of the body (brain, heart, groin, etc). And that requires a high level of skill, or luck. The ODDS are in the 9mm's favor, due to mass and penetration advantages over the .32.

SHR970
March 6, 2013, 07:42 PM
However, what do you feel a .32 is going to do BETTER than a 9mm from a similar sized gun?

Controllability. In the hands of a large segment of the population the 32 will be far more controllable than a 9mm in a similar size weight package. Being more controllable; they will put more rounds on target quicker. Rounds on target beats misses every time.

SharpsDressedMan
March 6, 2013, 08:01 PM
Shoot a Walther PPS in 9mm. Most everyone states that it is an extremely comfortable and controllable gun to shoot. Another plus is the sights are larger, and faster on target than most smaller sights found on the .32's. It might be easier, and more accurate than a comparably sized .32.

SHR970
March 6, 2013, 09:51 PM
http://www.stellarpath.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/riiight.jpeg

Tried one. Also shot a LC9 this past weekend. These are closest to a Walther PPK in size and weight. Having shot many Walthers over the years in 32 and 380, the recoil does not even compare. The 9mm is waaaay snappier.

Considering that you can get 32's that are significantly smaller / lighter than the PPS you are comparing apples to oranges. A heavy pocket 32 is the Beretta Tomcat at 17 oz. loaded. That compares to a PPS at 19.5 oz. empty.

Old Fuff
March 6, 2013, 10:28 PM
Well one time while at a rifle range during a DCM qualification shoot I hit a 200 yard target at 200 yards using a Colt 1903 Pocket Automatic. :what:

Of course I did have to shoot a few sighters, and my point-of-aim was a crow sitting at the top of a dead tree located on a burm behind the targets... :uhoh:

According to an advertisement in my reprint copy of a Sears Roebuck 1909 mail order catalog that featured the Colt, "... is accurate up to 300 yards, and will penetrate four one-inch boards at a distance of 15 feet."

Clearly, the marksmanship skills of some of today's younger shooters leave much to be desired. :neener:

That said: Effective range is more determined by the skill of the shooter, then the handgun being used. Most quality pistols and revolvers will perform better then the person using them.

returningfire
March 6, 2013, 10:39 PM
The 32 is a very effective round, and the little steel European pistols, and colts, are a pleasure to shoot. My Favorite is the Beretta 70.
It is not known as a long range handgun, but most hand guns are not for long range but for close range, and the 32 is great at close range. If you don't believe that do some research on the number of 32 cal pistols the Military forces of the world have used, and quite effectively. The 32 is also easier to keep on target than some of the smaller 380's and 9's.

R.W.Dale
March 6, 2013, 11:09 PM
I think the general shooting ccw public would be better served if the current crop of micro 380's were also offered in 32.

These tiny guns in 32 all of a sudden become controllable for multiple shots and begin to show surprising accuracy particularly when equipped with a laser. The 32 offers more capacity and in the case of the kel tec gains a last shot slide lock. As one poster once said shooting the p3at is like holding onto an exploding credit card.

The arguments about small modern 9's making the 32 obsolete ignore one glaringly obvious fact. Modern 32's are still that much smaller. 32 acp development didn't end with hitler's suicide gun.


Honestly I'm extremely underwhelmed by 380 and 32 penatration numbers in gel with jhp IMO both are firmly FMJ only proposals. As such I'm always going to lean towards more capacity, speed and accuracy.


I like my p32's they're light and extremely thin. For the same footprint as a pf9 I can fit a laser AND a 10rd mag.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y96/krochus/2013-03-06204636-1_zpse036205d.jpg





posted via that mobile app with the sig lines everyone complains about

Curator
March 6, 2013, 11:22 PM
I carried a Browning FN M1922 in .32 ACP back up throughout my 1966 tour of S.E. Asia. I can vouch for it's effectiveness on human-sized targets at 100 yards. While not exactly "knock-down" power, nobody likes getting shot. Pretty much took the starch out of a few miscreants, despite the range. Don't believe that lack of power is also lack of effectiveness. You are not exactly unarmed with the old 7.65 Mauser pistol round. Heck if it was good enough for 007-----

R.W.Dale
March 6, 2013, 11:28 PM
I carried a Browning FN M1922 in .32 ACP back up throughout my 1966 tour of S.E. Asia. I can vouch for it's effectiveness on human-sized targets at 100 yards. While not exactly "knock-down" power, nobody likes getting shot. Pretty much took the starch out of a few miscreants, despite the range. Don't believe that lack of power is also lack of effectiveness. You are not exactly unarmed with the old 7.65 Mauser pistol round. Heck if it was good enough for 007-----

Good post

However I do want to point out that 7.65mauser is a vastly different cartridge than 7.65browning/32acp

7.65 Mauser would take the fight out of anything on the planet short of big bears and cats and perhaps even then.




posted via that mobile app with the sig lines everyone complains about

wlewisiii
March 7, 2013, 12:19 AM
The .32 ACP Mauser HSc I posted an appreciation of recently is my EDC. It's more than enough for any realistic threat I'd face here in the north woods.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-VyCkFxPiXow/USrKxHkCr8I/AAAAAAAAEzM/YsEymghLzFg/s640/P2241240.JPG

chicharrones
March 7, 2013, 12:54 AM
Starting this tread, I had 15 yards in mind as . . . range.

That's what I think of my Taurus TCP 732 in .32 ACP. At 15 yards shooting slow fire, 5-shot groups I've cared to record were 3 to 5 inches. Same with a surplus CZ27 in my hands.

Then, there is my NAA Guardian in .32 ACP that shoots paper plate size groups at 5 yards.

So, it can depend on the gun.

Eb1
March 7, 2013, 01:20 AM
My .32 H&R Magnum doesn't need a +P or +P+ rating. With that said, I would like to own a smaller pistol. Right now my main carry is a Taurus 731UL, J Frame.

Big_John1961
March 7, 2013, 02:41 AM
It is a weak cartridge at best. With 9mm the same size as 32 why have one. Blowback design limits the power of the cartridge thus negating the possibility of a +p
First, .32's are considerably smaller than even the smallest 9mm. Second, do your comments mean you'll volunteer to take a .32ACP for the team? You know, just to prove how weak a cartridge it is.

SHR970
March 7, 2013, 09:18 AM
Originally posted by groundhog34: Blowback design limits the power of the cartridge thus negating the possibility of a +p.

Must not have checked Buffalo Bore's offering 32ACP +P (https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_list&c=31)

220 ft. lbs. rated is right in at 380 / 38 Spec.+P power levels last time I checked.

amd6547
March 7, 2013, 09:32 AM
Early on in my carry journey, I bought a European police surplus Manurhin Walther PP in 32acp.
It carried beautifully IWB. It was extremely accurate at 25yds and fed everything I tried without fail. I would certainly have called that a 25yd pistol.
Of all the pistols I have owned and traded away, I would love to have that one back.

Bohemus
March 7, 2013, 11:03 AM
Sights of Škorpion go to 150m for some reason..

SharpsDressedMan
March 7, 2013, 02:07 PM
However I do want to point out that 7.65mauser is a vastly different cartridge than 7.65browning/32acp

7.65 Mauser would take the fight out of anything on the planet short of big bears and cats and perhaps even then.



I think you are thinking of the 7.63 Mauser "Broomhandle" round. That is a different animal all together!:D

R.W.Dale
March 7, 2013, 03:59 PM
However I do want to point out that 7.65mauser is a vastly different cartridge than 7.65browning/32acp

7.65 Mauser would take the fight out of anything on the planet short of big bears and cats and perhaps even then.



I think you are thinking of the 7.63 Mauser "Broomhandle" round. That is a different animal all together!:D

It is an interesting cartridge and the predecessor to 7.62x25

7.65 Mauser however = an old time 308win




posted via that mobile app with the sig lines everyone complains about

seeker_two
March 7, 2013, 04:28 PM
Sights of Škorpion go to 150m for some reason..


Because most gun designers are optimists....

:D

Certaindeaf
March 7, 2013, 05:32 PM
If a .22 will kill a rabbit at 50 yards, I'd think a .32 would.

golden
March 8, 2013, 05:53 PM
GODFATHER,
I have been shooting the .32ACP a lot lately. I have taken to collecting pocket pistols.

I found that really small guns like the NAA Guardian have such poor sights, that a 10 yard range is the maximum I would shoot it. On the other hand, a compact or mid-size pistol like the WALTHER PPK and BERETTA model 82 can keep all the rounds inside the target at 15 yards. With the sights on the BERETTA or SIG 232, 25 yards would still be reasonable for me.
I am not talking about a slow fire, taking you time, target shooting, but rather using a .32ACP on the same qualification drill my agency uses with the .40 S&W pistols we are issued.

The smallest guns have small grips and sights.
They also have considerable recoil because of the light weight and small grips. I find shooting more than 25 rounds at a time out of the NAA Guardian, to be painful.
On the pre-WW II guns that I shoot, the small sights make it more or a challenge than on modern pistols.
On a larger gun like the BERETTA 82, it is fun and no work at all.

The lack of stopping power and the semi-rimmed case are the biggest defects on the .32ACP.
The ease of shooting such a low recoil round and the small guns that this allows are its biggest strengths.

I will probably shoot the .32ACP more and more as I get older and less recoil tolerant.

Jim

bill3424
March 8, 2013, 06:00 PM
I'd say 50 or so yards. I can group them pretty nicely at 50yds with my PPK.

WCraven
March 9, 2013, 11:54 AM
According to an advertisement in my reprint copy of a Sears Roebuck 1909 mail order catalog that featured the Colt, "... is accurate up to 300 yards, and will penetrate four one-inch boards at a distance of 15 feet."


I have seen that before but in S&W adds.. the 38sp and 32-20 is rated at 6 and1/2 pineboards 7/8" thick..

Walt Sherrill
March 9, 2013, 12:06 PM
You bring the baseball bat....I'll bring the PP.

10 paces turn and have at.

I've seen similar tests done from a slightly closer distance, using hard rubber knives and AirSoft pistols, and the guy with the knife almost always wins.

Make it a total of 10-15 paces or 15 (rather than 10 by each participant) and the results may surprise you. Unless your gun is out, up, and ready to fire. If it's in a holster (on the belt or in a pocket), you'd still be in the process of getting it out of the holster or pocket by the time the guy with the knife or baseball bat is delivering the first blow.

And, if it comes as a surprise, where you aren't expecting the attack (as with "10 paces turn and have at it), it's even worse... If you've got an AirSoft pistol and a stick, this is one test you and a friend (or child) can do yourself, without risk.

SHR970
March 9, 2013, 11:19 PM
And, if it comes as a surprise, where you aren't expecting the attack (as with "10 paces turn and have at it), it's even worse...

Really???? :banghead:...you really don't get he reference?? :what:

I know the 21 foot rule. I also know (and I think most everyone else gets it) that 10 paces turn and fire = duel where both opponents have their weapons out.

10 paces (march step is 25 feet) by two people is 50 feet.

Lets cut march step down to 15" (half step). That still means each person is 25 feet from one another.

So once again.....you take the bat; I'll take my PP. ;)

Walt Sherrill
March 10, 2013, 12:32 PM
Without the pre-warning, I might take the bat. Carried properly, the bat would be hard to see, and you might not even know what hit you.

JERRY
March 10, 2013, 12:36 PM
Its been reported that is takes 48 kfp of engery from a (bullet) projectile to inflict a fatal wound.

Do the math: velocity squared X bullet weight in grains DIVIDED BY 450436 to see where the .32acp drops below that.

THAT WOULD BE A 71GR. ROUND AT ABOUT 550 FPS.

Walt Sherrill
March 10, 2013, 01:17 PM
Its been reported that is takes 48 kfp of engery from a (bullet) projectile to inflict a fatal wound.

A lot of folks have DIED from .32 and .25 and .22 wounds.

For self defense, it's not just inflicting a fatal wound that is sought -- it's getting the other guy to STOP trying to inflict wounds on you, to disable them, or to allow you to get the hell out of Dodge.

A .32 to the eye socket would arguably be fatal, but I don't know that I'd be able to do that, when under pressure, struggling, etc.

Saying all that, I'd like a larger diameter round delivered with more force, so that the likelihood of dissuading the other person is more likely, if I'm not able to get the best shot placement.

Clark
March 10, 2013, 02:44 PM
el Godfather
Please discuss any experiences that you may have.
Why do we not see more .32s and perhaps a +p+ versions? If we could get potent energy packed in to small bullets they will be ideal for ccw.
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=191655
Left to right; welded up G22, stock P32, modified P32 with increased case support and barrel length

It was more than 10 years ago when the P32 came out, I got one, and started experimenting to see how much power I could get out of it.
To make a long story short:
1) Factory ammo will penetrate 1" of Douglas Fir lumber.
2) I got handloads up to penetrating 5" of the same piece of wood.
3) The way I did that was:
..a) Over load work up with Power Pistol
..b) 110 gr bullet
..c) Seat so long that it will not feed
..d) Weld up the feed ramp and re cut the chamber and feed ramp for better case support
..e) Weld and extender on the end of the barrel.

Discussion:
1) That 5" penetration round sheared off the ejector with excess recoil.
2) The P32 has better case support and chamber wall thickness than a P3AT, but the P3AT makes a bigger hole, so the hyper velocity of a P32 will not have the stopping power of a relatively wimpy Buffalo bore 380 +P 90 gr hollow point at 1050 fps.
3) Pressure
..a) The 32acp is SAAMI registered at 20.5 kpsi, and that is no warming to me for the P32, with it's great case support at .25" with a .15" case web.
..b) The 380 is SAAMI registered at 21.5 kpsi, and that is serious warning for the P3AT, and it's case support at .29" when the case web is only .175", given the larger inside diameter makes more hoop stress.

JERRY
March 10, 2013, 02:53 PM
A lot of folks have DIED from .32 and .25 and .22 wounds.

For self defense, it's not just inflicting a fatal wound that is sought -- it's getting the other guy to STOP trying to inflict wounds on you, to disable them, or to allow you to get the hell out of Dodge.


he asked about the effective range, not "stopping power", pointing a gun at a would be attacker could "stop" them from assaulting you.

for a caliber to be "effective" it must be able to inflict a lethal wound, not scare somebody or drop them on a dime.

there are too many folks shot with a .45acp who kept fighting for some time and never died or stopped until they chose to, does that make the .45acp ineffective?

SHR970
March 10, 2013, 03:26 PM
You can see the difference between stopping power and killing power in the following news story from my local rag. Note; this story is about a 22 but it is still relevant. You can find documented stories over the last 20 years that show successes and failures with almost any handgun caliber. Success and failure being relative to what YOU determine the line to be. In my book, success is making the aggressor STOP doing what he intends to or is doing to harm me or someone else. If the aggressor dies....well by definition we are talking about a use of deadly force incident in the first place.

Daily Breeze Story (http://www.dailybreeze.com/news/ci_22731504/torrance-police-use-dna-tie-slain-would-be)

In this case the 22 STOPPED the attacker in a timely manner. :)
In this case the 22 KILLED the attacker in a less than timely manner. ;)
I'm sure that in the remaining minutes of this guys life he pondered his failure in the victim selection process. I doubt to this day you could convince the would be victim that a 22 is an ineffective paperweight.

To the OP's question.....effective range? If we assume the definition starts with the trigger has been pulled; then we must first start with how far away can you reasonably hit with it. A 45-70 out of a rifle is effective at a fair range...out of a derringer the dynamics change drastically. Therefore an important part of the discussion is platform.

Walt Sherrill
March 10, 2013, 05:18 PM
for a caliber to be "effective" it must be able to inflict a lethal wound, not scare somebody or drop them on a dime.

And this piece of scripture is found in which Shooter's Bible?

A lot of lethal wounds aren't rapidly lethal -- sometimes the wounded must bleed out or go into shock; the person thus wounded often has have the ability to harm or kill his opponent.

That being the case, just how quickly must that lethal shot take effect to be truly "effective"? A lot of non-lethal wounds STOP the fight quickly and most would say THAT is EFFECTIVE, too.

If you haven't read about the infamous FBI shootout in Miami you should. point... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout

Please note: I'm not making the case FOR .32 acp as a self-defense round, only that your earlier claim about the traits of an "effective" round is too simplistic as stated, and doesn't conform to what is seen in the real world.

JERRY
March 10, 2013, 05:53 PM
The op did not mention time of incapasitation.

Effective range would end where the bullet fails to have enough enery to create a lethal wound. IT IS SIMPLE MATH. CALCULATE AT WHAT VELOCITY A 71GR. 32ACP ROUND NO LONGER HAS A CERTAIN LEVEL OF ENERGY.

Walt Sherrill
March 10, 2013, 06:02 PM
The original poster didn't mention lethal, either -- YOU injected that variable -- and not all experts would agree with that insertion or the assumptions underlying the related formula. He asked about EFFECTIVE RANGE. (He wanted to know MAXIMUM RANGE he could use a .32 round, and a bit about what how much farther than that it might be somewhat effective...)

You wrote: velocity squared X bullet weight in grains DIVIDED BY 450436 to see where the .32acp drops below that. THAT WOULD BE A 71GR. ROUND AT ABOUT 550 FP. Your focus was on LETHALITY.

You can see performance tests all of the time in gun mags for rifles and pistols, where the results vary with the powder used, the length of the barrel, and the weight of the projectile. The formula as used above seems to use unstated values for velocity and bullet weight, but velocity would also be affected by barrel length and the powder used -- and we can't be sure that the OP's gun would match that used in the formula. Most importantly, the formula doesn't seem to tell us EFFECTIVE RANGE, which was the question.


.

majortoo
March 10, 2013, 06:42 PM
I seem to recall (great opening line, often used by old guys like me!) that Mr. Browning himself carried a .32 of his design as his weapon of choice. I wish I still had an 03 Colt that my father carried....I learned to shoot a handgun under his careful supervision with that little .32, and he taught me how to perforate beer cans out to 15 yards with no problem. Great memories!
I also seem to recall that "Bad LeRoy Brown" carried a .32, as well as a "razor in his shoe!"...
If confronted by anyone carrying a .32, it might behoove one to consider that he or she might know how to use it! There is the story of the girl from Idaho (you may adapt the story to meet your needs)... She was out with her boyfriend and they were attacked by an angry grizzly bear. All she had was her trusty .32 Colt 03. (Again, fill in the blanks with your weapon of choice!) She simply took aim, shot her boyfriend in the kneecap, left him to deal with the bear and was able to walk away at a brisk pace, unscathed! Well, you can a lot in this forum?!

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