THR: Battle Rifle Discussion & Picture Thread


PDA






dak0ta
March 7, 2013, 09:13 PM
The heavy-hitter equivalent of the pea-shooting AR-15 picture thread! :) Let's seem 'em! Anything that fires a full power rifle cartridge is game! M14, FAL, G3, M1 Garand, SVT 40, Milsurps!

Here's my M14 - 7.62x51 NATO

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/knightofcydonia87/Firearms/M14/988da55d-05e6-46dd-b617-f8e5f33dfcbb_zpsed257b9f.jpg

I need a M6 bayonet...
http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/knightofcydonia87/Firearms/M14/WP_000106_zps0674c51d.jpg

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/knightofcydonia87/Firearms/M14/538f5fdf-f794-43e5-ad32-96ad4033146e_zps38729482.jpg

http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx226/knightofcydonia87/Firearms/M14/WP_000104_zps2c237131.jpg

If you enjoyed reading about "THR: Battle Rifle Discussion & Picture Thread" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
ID-shooting
March 7, 2013, 09:30 PM
What about the in betweens? Say, 7.62x39?

PGT
March 7, 2013, 09:36 PM
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y124/PatagonianGT/GunStuff/Saiga308v21.jpg

Ian
March 7, 2013, 11:04 PM
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=176989&stc=1&d=1357079337

Costs 5 grand for a repro in either 8mm or .308. Given the way M1A pricing is going, that'll be pretty competitive before too much longer...

dak0ta
March 7, 2013, 11:13 PM
That's a beauty! Semi-auto or FA? Is that chambered in 8x57?

TCBPATRIOT
March 7, 2013, 11:23 PM
I don't even know what that is but I know I like it.

dak0ta
March 7, 2013, 11:35 PM
It's an FG-42 developed by the Germans in WWII. It was issued to paratroopers (FG for Fallschirmjaeger). Has a cool diopter sight, folding bipod, 8x57 cartridge, typical futuristic and AGGRESSIVE German styling/design, not very controllable in full auto, but accurate in semi-auto.

The guy shooting above has videos on Youtube:

jN4lvZbAe04

TCBPATRIOT
March 7, 2013, 11:56 PM
Hpmh I learn something new everyday as a kid I was fascinated by everything WW2 and never heard of it. Looks cool nonetheless.

nwilliams
March 8, 2013, 12:00 AM
My heavy hitter. PTR-91 that I camo'd to give it that retro european woodland look.

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb264/nwilliams27/PTR-91/PTR91-1_zps66bc9e0c.jpg

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb264/nwilliams27/PTR-91/PTR91-2_zps13cb20ea.jpg

rugerdude
March 8, 2013, 12:02 AM
M14 Designated Marksman Rifle

I certainly never felt under-gunned.
http://i.imgur.com/bYCrb5l.jpg

Also, before anyone tries to mention trigger discipline: The safety is located inside the trigger guard, so I index my finger on the safety.

JShirley
March 8, 2013, 12:12 AM
My favorite battle rifle is my M1917.
Your definition excludes a lot of battle rifles- there is no requirement to be self-loading.
John

dak0ta
March 8, 2013, 12:17 AM
Sorry pulled that definition from Wiki without really reading it completely. Yes, bolt-actions are game too.

TexasPatriot.308
March 8, 2013, 12:24 AM
I was a grunt 40 years ago, think most modern day grunts will agree...the puny 5.56 whether in M16 or M4 whatever they call em nowadays is a hammer, though a small hammer. the M14 by any name is a sledge hammer by any name, face off 600 yards or meters, 7.62 x 39 or M4 against an M14....you lose.

1858
March 8, 2013, 12:27 AM
rugerdude,
What the heck kind of shovel is that behind you? That must have a 10' handle on it?!!

dak0ta
March 8, 2013, 12:30 AM
I'd say it's a modern day pike/spade/entrenching tool 3 in 1. Can stop cavalry charges I bet.

highpower
March 8, 2013, 12:35 AM
How about a few Springfields?

Top to bottom:
Remington '03-A3
Smith-Corona '03-A3
Remington 1903
Springfield 1903 (1918)
Springfield 1903 (1906)

http://highpower.smugmug.com/Firearms/Springfield-1903/i-3xLZqwX/0/XL/IMG_1621-XL.jpg

1858
March 8, 2013, 12:37 AM
Lee-Enfield No4 Mk2 ...

http://thr.mcmxi.org/rifles/lee-enfield/no4_mk2/photos/lee_enfield_4.jpg

Springfield M1A Scout Squad ...

http://thr.mcmxi.org/rifles/springfield/m1a/scout_squad/photos/scout.jpg

DSA SA58 PARA ...

http://thr.mcmxi.org/rifles/dsa/fal_sa58_para/photos/fal_para_2.jpg

rugerdude
March 8, 2013, 01:05 AM
@ 1858 Yeah, I would imagine it's for digging canals without actually having to get into the trench. You find tons of strange stuff in Afghan homes.

Eaglestroker
March 8, 2013, 01:12 AM
I like a full sized Garand and have one or two. I'll have a 'Mini G' conversion this summer. Cheaper than a Scout length M1A by more than a little and I already have a surplus of ammo for it.

http://i961.photobucket.com/albums/ae95/Ssthis07GT/mini-g-2_zps0f4c84aa.jpg

TCBPATRIOT
March 8, 2013, 01:21 AM
Hey Rugerdude, I'm in contention for that being my issue rifle. I'm only a guardsman now but I carried a SAM-R on my last deployment in 2009-2010 I loved it.

Trent
March 8, 2013, 01:29 AM
Oh dear... this thread is going to make me dig out the camera tomorrow.

I love "battle rifle" show & tell. It's what I collect. :)

:evil:

tahunua001
March 8, 2013, 01:36 AM
you aware that there is already a milsurp thread (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=703938) going on that is less than 2 weeks old and is still ongoing?

Girodin
March 8, 2013, 02:30 AM
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=175853&d=1354821291

nwilliams
March 8, 2013, 02:31 AM
you aware that there is already a milsurp thread going on that is less than 2 weeks old and is still ongoing?

And.....

There is a difference between battle rifles (as defined in this thread) and military surplus guns.

tahunua001
March 8, 2013, 02:35 AM
There is a difference between battle rifles (as defined in this thread) and military surplus guns.
words of the OP himself
Let's seem 'em! Anything that fires a full power rifle cartridge is game! M14, FAL, G3, M1 Garand, SVT 40, Milsurps!... Yes, bolt-actions are game too.
bolt actions are battle rifles, just as much as semi autos and full autos are as well.

anything in this thread could also fit in the already existing milsurps thread.

nwilliams
March 8, 2013, 02:44 AM
anything in this thread could also fit in the already existing milsurps thread.
Not really. Military surplus usually refers to guns that were manufactured for a military during times of war and then sold to the civilian public after, hence surplus.

There are a few surplus rifles in this thread but there are more here that wouldn't fit into the milsurp thread.

tahunua001
March 8, 2013, 03:04 AM
sooo... the springfields, FG42, PTR91, whatever PGT posted(I'm guessing a vepr of some kind?), enfield, M14, SA58, and m1 garand never belonged to any military force?
so far every picture that's been posted with the exception of a couple M1as which unless you are a real nit picker could pass as a M14 reproduction would be passable as a military surplus rifle and therefore welcome in the milsurps picture thread.

OldTex
March 8, 2013, 03:11 AM
For starters.....

Not milsurp but definitely a heavy hitter at long range, a GAP Crusader in .308

http://www.pbase.com/texindian/image/137190428.jpg

LaRue 7.62 OBR before a lot of dressing out

http://www.pbase.com/texindian/image/141910156.jpg
Including a NV option:
http://www.pbase.com/texindian/image/148759004.jpg

And an M1A in JAE stock
http://www.pbase.com/texindian/image/149107160.jpg

AethelstanAegen
March 8, 2013, 03:33 AM
FG42, [...] whatever PGT posted(I'm guessing a vepr of some kind?)

Actually, yes those aren't milsurps. Ian's FG42 in that picture is a reproduction and that .308 AK, and the Mini-G M1 (to name but a few so far) were never sold as military surplus. This thread and the milsurp thread are not the same thing at all. Why not post some pictures or just pass by the thread instead of being a busy-body with nothing to contribute? Seriously, dude, if you don't like a thread you don't have to post in it, especially to make a critique that's wrong anyways.

Do please continue with the battle rifle pictures...they're awesome so far! OldTex, I'm usually a big fan of the original-style wood stocks on M1A's but I've got to admit that JAE stock is pretty swanky.

dak0ta
March 8, 2013, 04:12 AM
Hey fellas, nice looking rifles you all got. I'm glad that I started this thread now as it seems to be a hit mostly. Feel free to open discuss, debate, or ask questions regarding battle rifles, I'm sure there are some experts among us.

Cheers!

Girodin
March 8, 2013, 04:21 AM
sooo... the springfields, FG42, PTR91, whatever PGT posted(I'm guessing a vepr of some kind?), enfield, M14, SA58, and m1 garand never belonged to any military force?


I'm pretty sure that none of the Springfields posted belonged to a military force. I'm positive the PTR91 wasn't. Those are not military surplus guns that have then been sold to civilians. They are guns produced for and originally sold to civilians. As such they are not mil surps (military surplus). And they never belonged to a military. They may be derived from designs that were/are used by military. That, however, is simply not the same as being a mil surp gun. I think you have a misunderstanding of what a milsurp gun is. It is a gun that is just what its name implies, a surplus military that is then sold. Guns like Moisins, 1903s, k31s, enfields, etc, etc,

so far every picture that's been posted with the exception of a couple M1as which unless you are a real nit picker could pass as a M14 reproduction would be passable as a military surplus rifle and therefore welcome in the milsurps picture thread.

In addition to the guns pointed out in post 29 as not being mil surps the saiga S308 isn't one nor is the DSA FAL. In fact only a the rifles posted in post 16 and the enfield in 17 are mil surps. As such lets not bicker further about whether there is some cross over between this and another thread. Enjoy it or leave it be.

Ian
March 8, 2013, 08:06 AM
Here's a couple more oddballs:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=180997&stc=1&d=1362744399

Adam123
March 8, 2013, 09:32 AM
VEPR 7.62x54R

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8088/8495732587_4114da5337_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8381/8495703879_aceb557842_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8373/8495730393_548f1ae232_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8226/8495696787_fda7704638_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8242/8496800164_37ebd72c92_c.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8528/8496839852_ea3b1fd297_c.jpg

PGT
March 8, 2013, 09:55 AM
OOOF. That's hot. :D

My first post was my Saiga 308 Version 21 (21" barrel, "normal" trigger group from the factory and thumbhole furniture) with a BeLoMo red dot sight.

Here's what I got to replace it:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y124/PatagonianGT/Swizz_K-31_1.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y124/PatagonianGT/Swizz_K-31_7.jpg

Trent
March 8, 2013, 12:35 PM
Not a good cameraman.

But maybe this will induce cardial infarction in any trolling anti-gunners.

http://i.imgur.com/0noPfLL.jpg?1

http://i.imgur.com/oJgr4p5.jpg?1

(Sorry some of the "junior varsity" got mixed in with the "battle rifles")

AethelstanAegen
March 8, 2013, 01:11 PM
Here's a couple more oddballs:

Ian, is the Enfield in the bottom picture one of the semi-auto conversions? It might just be my eyes playing tricks on me but it looks like there is a gas system structure added to the hidden side of the gun.

Trent
March 8, 2013, 01:27 PM
Ian, you've got some cool guns, dude. ;)

How do you come across that rare oddball stuff anyway?!

natescout
March 8, 2013, 01:41 PM
WOOD AND STEEL...

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm10/natesyz250/ec51d094-e64c-42e1-aec0-439b646a3efd_zps789e1ad6.jpg

Ian
March 8, 2013, 04:16 PM
Sadly, Trent, they are almost all guns I have fiddled with, not guns I actually own myself. I get my hands on them by being interested and hanging around advanced collectors for a long time.

AethelstanAegen - Yes, that's a British Howell semiauto conversion of an SMLE. (http://www.forgottenweapons.com/rifles/howell-automatic-rifle/)

Here's my favorite battle rifle...it's definitely not the best by any objective measure, but I just really like it:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=181019&stc=1&d=1362773596

Most early selfloading rifles are pretty awkward and heavy, but the Cei Rigotti really fit me great and was very nice handling (I didn't get to shoot it, though). Perhaps this has something to do with the designer having an infantry background rather than being a civilian inventor/engineer?

GCMkc
March 8, 2013, 04:21 PM
PTR-91k. Hits with authority.

Trent
March 8, 2013, 04:27 PM
Ian, every time you post a picture of an old gun that I've never heard of I waste a half a day looking for one to buy, only to be disappointed. :)

Most of my 'rare' stuff doesn't qualify as a 'battle rifle'.

I might be able to get away with this one, since I *could* actually shoulder it. Not very effectively... but.. I could. :)

http://i.imgur.com/MRGDw.jpg?2

Unfortunately (or fortunately, with the price of ammo!) mine is Semi.

I did get the opportunity to shoot a full auto at KCR once.

UGvxYGcOfAY

1 old 0311-1
March 8, 2013, 05:48 PM
http://i1136.photobucket.com/albums/n489/kcq1/P1020900_zpsf4c3a46a.jpg

Trent
March 8, 2013, 05:50 PM
I take it you are a Yugo M70 fan? :)

Nice guns.

EDIT:

Hey what pistol grip is on those lower two? Those look comfy.

ifit
March 8, 2013, 06:31 PM
Ian, really enjoy your videos:cool:, fan of czech firearms and came across one of your videos http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TTGC4zz6eA, if only they massed produced these i would definately get one. and the zh29 very interesting but the bolt release....:eek:

MCgunner
March 8, 2013, 06:40 PM
Chambered for 8x57


http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh305/goose150/PICT0364.jpg

Trent
March 9, 2013, 12:44 AM
Nice Hakim!

Ian
March 9, 2013, 01:49 AM
Thanks, ifit. The 420S was a great piece of machinery, but in the wrong place at the wrong time.

HorseSoldier
March 9, 2013, 02:22 AM
http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j132/jboschma/081707_14371.jpg

Real Austrian StG-58 (part of the foreign weapons set we had for training back when I was assigned to the secret squirrel world).

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j132/jboschma/HK21.jpg

HK 21 from the same source.

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j132/jboschma/Type5.jpg

Japanese Type 5, their clone of the Garand that was never produced beyond a few experimental models (from the Buffalo Bill Historical Center).

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j132/jboschma/RhodieRtSide.jpg

Rhodesian parts kit built FAL.

Medusa
March 9, 2013, 08:49 AM
Those two are fun. I still have no love for G3, I can manage with it, but no warm feelings nonetheless. Other is Finnish, dated 1935.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=181094&stc=1&d=1362832861

Spent a lot of time with that, learning all kinds of ropes and hangs.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=181095&stc=1&d=1362832861

No explanation needed. Works just as well today as during those times.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=181096&stc=1&d=1362832861

As far as battle rifles go, I do like that the most, at least until my own SCAR-H or SSR.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=181097&stc=1&d=1362832861

I do have a secret fancy for the FG42, even a repro, but that has to wait a bit...

dak0ta
March 19, 2013, 11:29 PM
Chris Costa running an M1A

http://sphotos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/549900_551844698180773_1068833597_n.jpg

ball3006
March 19, 2013, 11:34 PM
but I love my M1D Garand and my MAS 49/56......chris3

stubbicatt
March 21, 2013, 10:04 AM
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j187/stubbicatt/Tula%20SVT40/IMG_0187_zpsd89a8fd8.jpg

Neat old SVT40.

Warp
March 21, 2013, 12:15 PM
Garand with Leupold 2.5x IER scope in Ultimak M12 mount

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g105/austin3161324/Firearms/20130202_205554_zpsf8c9b165.jpg

MachIVshooter
March 21, 2013, 02:14 PM
Modern:

Armalite AR-10A2C

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/AR-10_zps9fed040c.jpg

DSA SA58 Para carbine

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/FAL_zps33e9aab1.jpg
Century C91:

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/101_1563_zps665e65a0.jpg

Pre-1950:

I no longer have the VZ52. Not parting with the other 3:

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/100_0911.jpg

Sold the jungle carbine to another THR member, gave the G98 to a friend as a birthday gift. Still have the rest:

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/100_0910.jpg

Warp
March 21, 2013, 03:18 PM
Modern:

Armalite AR-10A2C

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/AR-10_zps9fed040c.jpg


What kind of a chin-weld can you get with that?

MachIVshooter
March 22, 2013, 02:42 AM
What kind of a chin-weld can you get with that?

Pretty much rest my lower jaw on it (STR is much more comfortable than standard M4 stock)

I actually like the heap's-up position of carry handle mounts. Use the same set-up on my M15:

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/M15A2C_zps4463045a.jpg

meanmrmustard
March 22, 2013, 07:03 AM
Garand with Leupold 2.5x IER scope in Ultimak M12 mount

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g105/austin3161324/Firearms/20130202_205554_zpsf8c9b165.jpg
Ha!

Your cat isn't very photogenic.

Adam123
March 22, 2013, 11:03 AM
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8244/8529182512_9a29cb8258_b.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8229/8529184638_28f0122f90_b.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8512/8528070797_cba9380721_b.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8230/8529181866_73f34a8ab6_b.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8103/8528067399_2cb237cf12_b.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8510/8529181172_6ff24c25d8_b.jpg

WardenWolf
March 22, 2013, 11:45 AM
PSL:

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s279/WardenWolf_1982/th_RifleScope.jpg (http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s279/WardenWolf_1982/RifleScope.jpg)

SVT-40:

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s279/WardenWolf_1982/th_IMAG0029.jpg (http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s279/WardenWolf_1982/IMAG0029.jpg)

I've got a number of bolt action rifles as well, but to me "battle rifle" means a semi-automatic rifle firing a full-sized cartridge.

happygeek
March 22, 2013, 05:08 PM
7.62x51mm in an old school looking National Match M1A shown with a 30-06 M1.

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x297/fdhs_runner/Firearms/imgp0399.jpg

7.62x54R Mosin made in 1931.

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x297/fdhs_runner/Firearms/IMGP0013-1.jpg

8x56R Steyr-Mannlicher M1895. I've given up on getting any ammo for that thing anytime soon.

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x297/fdhs_runner/Firearms/1930sSteyrM95.jpg

I wouldn't call the 7.62x39mm a 'battle rifle' round as it's an intermediate caliber, but since others are posting their Kalashnikovs

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x297/fdhs_runner/Firearms/P2220437.jpg

I've got a Kar98k on the way from Wideners, but they're really slow on shipping. Not that it matters, everywhere I look is out of 7.92x57mm so that rifle will probably join the Steyr as a safe queen for the foreseeable future.

dmazur
March 22, 2013, 05:40 PM
Garand with Ultimak mount, Eotech and brake -

OK, image seems to have disappeared. I'll try again.

mf-dif
March 23, 2013, 10:11 AM
The Century CETME...gets a lot of bad rap but mine was a tack driver that ate all. Most problems can be corrected with $10 in parts and $3 surplus mags.

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c32/MF-DIF/20121208_135757.jpg

MachIVshooter
March 23, 2013, 01:12 PM
^^^^

I see the YHM flash hider; did yours actually have a threaded barrel? Mine is swedged onto splines :mad:

centurion20000
March 23, 2013, 01:51 PM
How about a new 21st century Battle Rifle? AR Rifle chambered in 30-06.

I put this over on the AR thread but since this is a full power round, I thought I would add it here.

Full disclosure, I do not have any stake or interest in this company. I just LOVE this product offering.

http://www.onlylongrange.com/_graphics/bn36/bkg_middle.jpg

The 30-06 AR. The company is Noreen firearms. http://www.onlylongrange.com

While shopping for my 50 BMG last fall I ran across them and Nemo Arms. http://www.nemoarms.com

I actually wound up going with an SHF50 by Safety Harbor Firearms, but that's another topic in an of itself.

Both companies are producing either a 300 Win Mag or 338 Lapua semi automatic AR platform. At $5999 (Noreen) and $5300 (Nemo) I about had a heart attack. Then I asked Noreen if they were ever planning a 30-06 chambered AR system (because the ammo is cheaper). They said they had a prototype and were working on it.

At the time, of course I said TAKE MY MONEY. And ordered it in very early November (pre-election) for $1XXX. 2013 prices have gone up (thanks Obama) but they are still very VERY reasonable at $1799.

Initial production was slated for January of this year but production delays and reworking the magazine have pushed it to early April 2013. Apparently I am damn near the top of the list on private citizen orders (serial number SHOULD be below 100 for those who like that kind of stuff)

I've spoken for about a total of 90 minutes on the phone with their engineers and reps getting some information so I'll put everything I know here. (A review will be coming after the rifle arrives.)

So here are the specs right off their web page. Here's the link but I'll type them out here.

BN 36 Rifle (http://www.onlylongrange.com/bn36.asp)

Caliber: 30-06, 270, 25-06
Operation: Direct Gas Impingement, Side Charging Semiauto
Barrel : 22"
Muzzle Brake attached, uses 5/8 X 24 threads
Weight: 8 pounds
Rifling: RH 1 in 10
Stock: A2
Magazine: 5/10/20 rounds
Trigger: Milspec or optional

Notes from my discussions with them.

If you go on their website you will also see the Bad News 338 Lap / 300 WinMag rifle as well. That rifle is 13.5 pounds while the BN36 is only 8 pounds. I was told that the receivers for the BN36 are slightly lighter and thinner because the brute force strength is not required for 30-06 versus the other cartridges.
Comes with a Hard Case.
270 Winchester & 25-06 Remington will be forthcoming after intial orders are filled and shipped [pending]
That muzzle brake WILL be coming off when I work up accelerator rounds for this beast.
The entire system is based off the AR-15 platform. The custom parts on this are the upper receiver, bolt carrier, lower receiver, mag and obviously the barrel [who else makes a 30-06 chambered AR barrel ... I need to know]
The bolt is a standard AR-10 bolt system but Noreen is using a proprietary heat treat system on them to make them stronger in order to accomodate the 270 Winchester and 25-06's higher chamber pressures (65K psi / 63k psi per SAAMI specs).
What this means is that 65K psi 30-06 cartridges are possible in a semi-auto chamber and I intend to slowly and SAFELY work up loads [while checking for pressure signs obviously] for long range and specialized 30-06 loads specific to this rifle.
Triggers and internal parts are completely AR-15 compatible
Noreen does offer a Timney trigger option for $260 or so [not an exact price quote so just ask em]
For Class 3 guys I was informed that an RDIAS will fit and operate in this platform. Obviously, let's play by the rules and be legal (of course) ... (They have a video of a full auto Bad News 338) ....
Full Auto Bad News 338 Lapua (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vfFg5FRDubU)
The stock uses a rifle length buffer tube for the AR-15
Magazines: This is the part that is not so fun. The rifle comes with 2 magazines and they are using a proprietary design. Extra mags are at $80 a pop (at last quote) but if you order more than 10 they will drop the price at bit ($60 seems reasonable). On the bright side they use a pinning option to modify the 20 round to handle only 5 or 10 depending on what's legal for hunting around you.
The second bright spot on the magazines is that the magazine well will be larger than 85mm (OAL for 30-06). This should allow very heavy bullet loads to be worked up.
I'm sure that everyone is watching ammo prices like a hawk but here's an interesting twist. 30-06 is now regularly cheaper than 5.56/.223 ammo that I have been finding in stock in places.
(http://www.gunbot.net)
At last check if you order direct from Noreen you can expect roughly an August to September delivery date. They did however state that they have a few thousand in the pipeline going out to various dealer orders. So if you just HAVE to have it now, you can probably get it in May with a bit of a premium.


Now for myself I have some seriously interesting plans for this puppy.

I do intend to get a second upper receiver so that I can alternate calibers. Noreen has already stated that they will only sell complete rifles at this point until they catch up with initial demand.
I also intend on working up that 1500 yard 30-06 load (more on that in a second post)
Accelerator rounds: Been doing a LOT of homework and talking to some serious gun nuts that do have 1 MOA working versions of their pet sabot loads. Every shooter that has a decent load says the key is tuning barrel harmonics for it.

Alternate calibers: Noreen admits to having working models for 270 Win and 25-06.
For my second upper receiver I can picture that a custom barrel will allow for some much more interesting chamberings

6mm-06 / 6.5mm-06
338-06 A-square
35 Whelen
375 Whelen
Any of the Ackley Improved models of chambering
8 X 57 mm Mauser
7 x 57 mm Mauser
God only knows what else that has an OAL around 3 - 3.34 inches
I'm going to do a lot of measuring but with their report of extra space in the magazine their MIGHT be enough room for some longer beltless magnum cartridges with the right gunsmith. OAL for 338 RUM and 300 RUM are 91mm. Dakotas and others might be a possibility as well. [and a mag mod will have to be done of course]
For those magnum cartridges you will obviously have to modify the bolt face from .473 in (12.0 mm) to .534 in (13.6 mm) [and probably more stuff too, not a gunsmith so don't crucify me] . I freely admit this might not be the best idea considering prior comments from Noreen but a man can certainly tinker a bit ....

Wolf extra power springs (like what guys are using for 50 Beowulf and 450 Bushmaster) should help with additional recoil. Experiments to follow obviously. :D
My Geissele SD3G trigger is sitting on the shelf waiting for this rifle to arrive. Considering how fast guys can dump mags with those things this is some serious firepower. Can you say 3 gun with a 30-06? Should be interesting to say the least ...

In conclusion I think Noreen's got one seriously winning product here. If it's as strong and reliable as I think it is (and they are marketing it as), Noreen Firearms might have just created the 21st century true battle rifle. Or maybe just a 21st century version of the Browning Automatic Rifle.

Either way, we (the customers) WIN. :D
I also know I'm already abandoning the 5.56 permanently.

Hope this helps,
Brandon

dmazur
March 23, 2013, 06:37 PM
One more try -

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=181792&stc=1&d=1364074583

krinko
March 23, 2013, 11:11 PM
1940 Tikka M91 from AV3---

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL165/1109208/7081205/406080437.jpg

1934 Tikka M27---

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL165/1109208/7081205/404249649.jpg

Just a couple of Finnish Mosins.
-----krinko

MachIVshooter
March 23, 2013, 11:28 PM
Centurion-

That is awesome! You had better do a full report here when you get it.

I don't personally see much use for one in .30-06, since .308 is so close. But an AR chambered in 6mm-06AI would be VERY tantalizing......:D

dmazur
March 23, 2013, 11:58 PM
I don't personally see much use for one in .30-06...

Is someone questioning the utility of the .30-06?

Not possible. Must be a server error... :)

barnbwt
March 24, 2013, 01:01 AM
http://www.libertytreecollectors.com/productcart/pc/catalog/FN493327Rifle(5).JPG
Not my pic, but a better shot of a 30-06 Luxembourg FN49 than I can take :o. Comfiest and prettiest stock of any milsurp I own, good peep sights, 2 more rounds than a Garand, and the brilliant inner workings of what became the FAL a few years later. Definitely my largest rifle--until I get this next one put back together...:evil
http://www.prebanarmory.com/wp-content/uploads/marketimages/withstuff2.jpg
Also not my pic, but I do happen to have 3 mags, the sling, cleaning kit, and a bayonet for the STGW57 ;)
http://www.prebanarmory.com/wp-content/uploads/marketimages/left22.jpg
Close up (minus the import stamp) of the ridicuous workmanship in these things
http://www.securityarms.com/photos/1275500736.jpg
Biiiiig long rifle at over 4 ft with bayonet on :D
http://www.weaponeer.net/_image_resize.asp?Height=527&Width=1132&Path=http://www.weaponeer.net/forum/uploads/Weaponeer/images/2008-01-11_030820_2008-01-10_214431_DSC00065.jpg
The huge bolt with delaying rollers 1/3rd larger than the H&K G3

TCB

fireside44
March 24, 2013, 02:49 AM
Garand with Leupold 2.5x IER scope in Ultimak M12 mount

I can't put my finger on it but there is something awesome about that garand. Pure business, clean, traditional, yet modern. I need to look away.

MachIVshooter
March 24, 2013, 06:32 AM
Is someone questioning the utility of the .30-06?

Not possible. Must be a server error...

No, but I'm questioning the utility in a totally custom rifle that uses expensive proprietary mags to gain 50-100 FPS. I'd rather have the lower price tag and accessory options of a more conventional .308 AR.

In a bolt rifle, the only difference is about 1/2" in length and 4 ounces; Same rifle cost, no mag cost issue, same accessories available for short and long action guns. Then the added velocity and flexibility of the .30-06 is worthwhile. In this case, though, I just don't see that it is. I think the market for this one will be as a hunting AR, and chambered for the .270, .25-06 and other cartridges that better justify the added expense of a semi-custom gun and mags.

madcratebuilder
March 24, 2013, 09:49 AM
I've always thought of "battle rifles" as semi or select fire, otherwise I could post pics of my 1873.

M1 Garand is grand.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d37/madcratebuilder/M1%20Garand/garand02.jpg

M1 Carbine
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d37/madcratebuilder/M1%20Garand/pix237906272.jpg

M1A's
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d37/madcratebuilder/2M1As.jpg

AR-10
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d37/madcratebuilder/case02.jpg

303tom
March 24, 2013, 10:15 AM
French 49/56.............

happygeek
March 24, 2013, 02:21 PM
I've always thought of "battle rifles" as semi or select fire, otherwise I could post pics of my 1873.


IMHO, 'battle rifle' was a term made up by purists to differentiate their M1s, M14s, etc from the "poodle shooter" M16. It is used to refer to full power rifles (as opposed to intermediate calibers like 7.92x33, 7.62x39, 5.56x45, etc) though, and that's how the OP is using it.

barnbwt
March 24, 2013, 03:00 PM
^Pretty much. The Battle Rifle typically refers to the more-powerful-than-usually-needed bolt action (then semi auto) rifles that were ultimately replaced by today's mid-power small bore cartridges. The FALs and G3's and whatnot that had selectable fire modes kinda fall into either "battle rifle" or "light machine gun" depending on their selection, in my opinion. The post WWII theory of infantry long-arms was to make every footsoldier a light machine-gunner (since LMGs were found to be very effective in WWII, and the brass can't help but to strategize around the last war). We've since learned that suppressive fire is so useful, that higher capacity ends up trumping power/range in most sorties, making the smaller/lighter cartridges more advantageous (for now ;)).

As history repeats, we're now seeing renewed calls for using heavier calibers (6mm and the like) going forward on the premise that 223 can't reach out across valleys in A-stan ('cuz we'll totally be fighting our next war in Afghanistan :banghead::rolleyes::D)

TCB

centurion20000
March 25, 2013, 12:21 AM
No, but I'm questioning the utility in a totally custom rifle that uses expensive proprietary mags to gain 50-100 FPS. I'd rather have the lower price tag and accessory options of a more conventional .308 AR.
...
Then the added velocity and flexibility of the .30-06 is worthwhile. In this case, though, I just don't see that it is. I think the market for this one will be as a hunting AR, and chambered for the .270, .25-06 and other cartridges that better justify the added expense of a semi-custom gun and mags.

Allow me to make a small, short respectful rebuttal on your post. :)
First point: Uses all standard accessories for an AR-15. Moot point. Second point , a 30-06 loaded to 65K psi loadings will blow a 308 in the dust.
Second point: Logistics Have you priced 308 ammo lately? 1.00 - 1.50 a round is common. 30-06 can still be acquired very very easily for 60 cents for surplus. I can walk into almost any wal-mart in America and still pick up a box at will. Cant do that with a 308 / 7.62x51.
Finally, using that long action AR which is actually priced about the same as an AR-10 (google it) allows me to load and customize into some very exotic and interesting cartridges.

Tinpig
March 25, 2013, 02:16 AM
Springfield 03 and Remington 03A3:

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc91/ccanhamjr/Guns/IMG_0125-1.jpg

Things of beauty. And loaded to about 75% they're just as accurate at 100-200 yds. and comfortable to shoot all day.

Tinpig

centurion20000
May 24, 2013, 11:22 AM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/Centurion20000/20130523_210009-2_zps8dddac1e.jpg

Time to get rid of all my 5.56 stuff. I've found the PERFECT battle rifle. :D

Eaglestroker
May 24, 2013, 12:19 PM
Do the magazines load with enbloc clips? I'm drooling over here...

MJ
May 24, 2013, 12:41 PM
Some may think this post has lost it's way but it's still interesting for a few reasons. But I have one question. Do they really shoot better if you paint them?? LOL ;)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v130/montereyjack/04548b7d.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/montereyjack/media/04548b7d.jpg.html)

centurion20000
May 24, 2013, 03:55 PM
Eaglestroker : No, they don't need enblocs. I just put that there because so many people already commented elsewhere ... so it's a 308 AR-10 ... big deal.

No, it's a 30-06 ... which at 65k psi (it's rated for 270/25-06 loadouts as well) will blow a 308 in the dust.


I cant wait to get a second upper for it. Then I can have a 338-06 / 35 Whelen / 9.3X63 or 375 Whelen battle rifle. :)

mljdeckard
May 24, 2013, 04:00 PM
If it works. Others have tried and failed.

What exactly is your idea of "blow a .308 in the dust"? What is it you think a 30-06 will do that a .308 won't?

I don't necessarily think that giving up compatibility with the .308 casing is a trade up. AR-10s can be chambered in .243, 7mm-08, .260 Rem, .308, and .338 Federal, all with the same bolt and magazine.

leadcounsel
May 24, 2013, 06:38 PM
Chris Costa running an M1A

Why is Chris holding his support arm up and awkwardly off to the side?

leadcounsel
May 24, 2013, 07:01 PM
I'll play...

Picked up this PTR91 for $650 with a bunch of mags and ammo circa 2006. I put an M4 style stock and aluminum forearm on it. Nice shooter.

Bought this M1A with match barrel, VLTOR rail/bipod, several mags, and 4,000 rounds of ammo for $2,000 circa 2009 at a gun show. Guy was carrying the rifle around for hours with a sign on it and he was exhausted and frustrated and wanted to go home. He had the ammo in his truck. Basically bought the rifle and got the ammo for free!

Warp
May 24, 2013, 07:01 PM
Why is Chris holding his support arm up and awkwardly off to the side?

Doesn't look awkward to me.

Because that's how he runs it. Support hand forward with thumb over the top or high/pointed forward is very good for quick action/reaction and pointability/control

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2550/4056259324_c42e2ce1c5.jpg

leadcounsel
May 24, 2013, 07:23 PM
Doesn't look awkward to me.

Because that's how he runs it. Support hand forward with thumb over the top or high/pointed forward is very good for quick action/reaction and pointability/control

Guess we all have our opinions. But I was always trained to keep your support arm elbow North/South as much as possible. Adds stability, is more natural, less tiresome, and your elbow doesn't tend to poke around corners when you "pie" around corners or are behind cover. And even more weird is that he's reaching in front of, and not using, the forward grip.

When I was a staff officer in Special Forces, we had an incident where a Green Beret blew his thumb off reaching too far forward on his Short Barreled M4... Chris appears to be dangerously close to the end of that rifle he's operating... I can see NO need and lots of reasons against reaching so far forward. And it's actually SLOWER to reach the extra distance both to reload and get your hand back on the forearm...

Quicker: I disagree.
Better control vs. either holding the mag well, standard rifle forearm hold, or the FOREWARD GRIP?!: I strongly disagree.

But I digress.

Warp
May 24, 2013, 08:21 PM
Guess we all have our opinions. But I was always trained to keep your support arm elbow North/South as much as possible. Adds stability, is more natural, less tiresome, and your elbow doesn't tend to poke around corners when you "pie" around corners or are behind cover. And even more weird is that he's reaching in front of, and not using, the forward grip.

When I was a staff officer in Special Forces, we had an incident where a Green Beret blew his thumb off reaching too far forward on his Short Barreled M4... Chad appears to be dangerously close to the end of that rifle he's operating... I can see NO need and lots of reasons against reaching so far forward. And it's actually SLOWER to reach the extra distance both to reload and get your hand back on the forearm...

Quicker: I disagree.
Better control vs. either holding the mag well, standard rifle forearm hold, or the FOREWARD GRIP?!: I strongly disagree.

But I digress.

He probably is using the vertical foregrip as a reference point. Notice that his support hand is up against the VFG. You don't have to grab a VFG and wrap your hand around it in order to use it. It can be used much the way a handstop would be as well. And be used other ways at other times and in other situations that a handstop couldn't (or couldn't do as well at).

For many people what is 'natural' comes down to what you spend time doing. Personally I find it more natural to point/aim at something with my elbow to the side than up/down. Look at somebody who reaches their arm out to point at something, they probably do it palm down/elbow pointed where it would bend out.

Who is Chad?

Have you watched any of Chris Costa's videos? There are a lot of short examples on YouTube. You should check them out.

leadcounsel
May 24, 2013, 08:38 PM
I have not watched his videos. People can learn all sorts of wrong but comfortable stances. Ever watch female shooters stand on one foot with all their weight on one foot, or lean completely back, arching their back rearward?

I'm no infantryman, but I've had my fair share of combat training and deployment experiences. I'd suggest that he could improve with a different forearm grip. And again, it's not tactically sound either, pointing your elbows out to the side. Makes you a bigger target, and exposes you from cover. Get shot in that wing sticking out, and you won't be combat effective any longer...

But that's not what this thread is about and I don't want to hijack. Just an observation.

Warp
May 24, 2013, 08:58 PM
I have not watched his videos.

Perhaps you should before you go on a rant saying why he shouldn't do what he does.

PS: With the forward grip your elbow isn't sticking way out the side like you seem to be implying.

murf
May 24, 2013, 09:04 PM
lets drop it. this is going in a bad direction.

murf

centurion20000
May 24, 2013, 09:17 PM
If it works. Others have tried and failed.

What exactly is your idea of "blow a .308 in the dust"? What is it you think a 30-06 will do that a .308 won't?

I don't necessarily think that giving up compatibility with the .308 casing is a trade up. AR-10s can be chambered in .243, 7mm-08, .260 Rem, .308, and .338 Federal, all with the same bolt and magazine.

Well I certainly do think it's a trade up considering the 308 was a compromise cartridge from the get-go for logistics reasons and MG functionality. Not saying 308 won't kill, but I just prefer to carry the same cartridge my grandfather carried in WWII.

Things a 30-06 will do that a 308 wont ... extra 20% powder capacity, make 1500 yards supersonic with the right 200+ grain bullet, hits harder, has an AP round the cops won't give you crap about (M2-AP is specifically expempted from AP ammo laws) and is available and cheaper than 308 in any Wal-Mart even through the worst of the ammo crisis of 2013.

Surplus 30-06 is still plentiful and the cartridge itself is the top selling round in America.

As far as compatibility .... 25-06, 270, 280 Rem, 338-06 A-Square, 35 Whelen, 9.3x62 and if I go wildcat I have about 12 more cartridges to choose from (Hawk series, pretty much anything from .224 to .416 and all the derivatives in between) on the same bolt face as well.

If anything the 30-06 derived rounds have MORE chamberings than the 308.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v236/Centurion20000/20130523_205427-1_zps3c67e563.jpg

mljdeckard
May 24, 2013, 11:58 PM
20% more case capacity does not equal a 20% boost in performance. The whole idea of the .308 was to make a .30 caliber cartridge which near equals a 30-06 in performance. And making a hot load is one thing. Making it work in a long-action AR is another thing entirely. There is a reason that all previous attempts at a long-action AR have gone away.

If you want an -06 because it's what your grandfather carried, do whatever you want. But he didn't carry an AR-pattern rifle in 30-06. I inherited my grandfather's 1917 Enfield.

barnbwt
May 26, 2013, 12:56 PM
Mainly, the bigger case allows for bigger bullets. In that respect, the '06 is beyond the capabilities of 308. The 45-70 vs 45-90 performance difference has less to do with higher power delivery than higher lead delivery.

The primary benefit of an '06 length AR is that it could be rechambered to all sorts of neat cartridges that you'd never get the chance for in an AR10, let alone an AR15 pattern.

Someone should make a 45-06 upper for that baby! :cool:

Surplus 30-06 is still plentiful and the cartridge itself is the top selling round in America.

I agree with the second part, not the first part. And 30-06 costs a bit more simply due to raw materials, in a normal market. I can't remember the last time I saw milsurp '06 that wasn't priced about the same as cheap new-production, or was not corrosive (which I wouldn't feed to anything as expensive/nice as an auto-loading 30-06)

TCB

*since this thread is tending toward caliber and tactic wars, I'll chip in with "my FNAR qualifies as a battle rifle" :D ;)

http://i1159.photobucket.com/albums/p630/barnbwt/P7220050.jpg

mljdeckard
May 26, 2013, 03:24 PM
However, it still remains to be seen that this rifle or magazine will be able to chamber say, 30-06 in 220s.

AGAIN, this is not the first time someone has built an AR for LA cartridges.

Hanshi
May 26, 2013, 03:50 PM
This is my battle rifle.

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt74/hanshi_photo/7aec43e1-99ab-4076-b0be-a869c91de4c8_zps01de9e6c.jpg (http://s599.photobucket.com/user/hanshi_photo/media/7aec43e1-99ab-4076-b0be-a869c91de4c8_zps01de9e6c.jpg.html)

Not too modern but still effective.

Send_It
June 10, 2013, 07:08 PM
Centurion 20000,

Any information you can post about this rifle would be very helpful!

Some of us still have 3 months to wait before our rifles ship.

I cant wait to launch 208 AMAXs at 2,800ft/s...try that with a 308 of similar barrel length and SAAMI OAL.

Miami_JBT
June 10, 2013, 08:28 PM
http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a553/40_SuperAwesome/CAM00506_zpsfb20523f.jpg

From left to right

Remington 1917 M91 Finnish Civil Guard Issue
Izhevsk 1939 M91/30 Finnish Army Caputre and Rebuild
Izhevsk 1943 M91/30 Soviet Issue
Izhevsk 1934 M91/30 Soviet Issue Ex-Dragoon
VKT 1941 M39 Finnish Issue
Polish 1953 M44 Carbine
Izhevsk 1944 M38 Carbine Soviet Issue

CharlieDeltaJuliet
June 10, 2013, 10:07 PM
My long range needs...300WM
http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/ff464/ChadJohnson1976/Firearms/IMG_3176.jpg

My close range HK MR556
http://i1237.photobucket.com/albums/ff464/ChadJohnson1976/Firearms/IMG_1833.jpg

JShirley
June 11, 2013, 05:23 PM
centurion20000,

I was excited about Noreen, too, but after a very pleasant conversation, they have not returned my emails since.

leadcounsel,

You're barking up the wrong tree. My training was similar to yours. Unlike you, I was infantry...but I also pay attention. And a lot of competitors are using a similar stance to Costas...so until you can demonstrate that you outshoot these pros, I suggest you clam up. Your hypothetical female shooters are not the ones winning matches.

John

blarby
June 11, 2013, 05:49 PM
Well, I suppose I only have two that qualify.

Both belong to my wife, go figure.

Top is a VEPR in .308 win. Nothing hard to obtain there.

Bottom is an Inland M1 Carbine, with a VERY low 4 digit # and a 7-42 Date. Thanks to that, I KNOW where this one was- and it was used against things with red dots on their flags. Love this'n.

Battle on......

Although if it ever comes to it, I still think I prefer lighter ammuniton. Unless you've ever had to hump a battlepack like some of the folks that have posted here, I don't think you get to make the call on what makes a better battle round !

Carry 10 mags for that VEPR.... I'll take ten mags for M4.... have double the rounds, and have enough weight savings for water or an extra 'plate.


make 1500 yards supersonic with the right 200+ grain bullet, Not that it really matters, but there aren't a lot of combat shots that call for this. If you regularly need 1500 yard shots, you should choose a much different rifle.

JShirley
June 11, 2013, 05:56 PM
The M1 Carbine is an intermediate power round like the 5.56x45mm, 5.45x39mm, and 7.62x39mm, to name a few.

I love the platform, though...:)

John

Merle1
June 11, 2013, 06:53 PM
Try Graf & son, I have bought ammo for the 8x56 Steyr from them.

JShirley
June 20, 2013, 07:08 PM
Here's (http://demigodllc.com/photo/6.8SPC-sgn2/inline_size/360/B100_0859_img.jpg)a picture on Zak Smith's site of a shooter using the hand position in question...Zak is correctly considered a subject matter expert.

Trent
June 21, 2013, 11:43 AM
Here's (http://demigodllc.com/photo/6.8SPC-sgn2/inline_size/360/B100_0859_img.jpg)a picture on Zak Smith's site of a shooter using the hand position in question...Zak is correctly considered a subject matter expert.

What sort of range do they shoot with that hold?

I tried it out on the range this week @200 and my hits went from good to notsogood.

JShirley
June 21, 2013, 11:50 AM
Well, it's an alternative hold for controlling recoil. I don't use it myself, and I'd imagine it takes some adjustment- but then again, I never shoot offhand past 100 meters.

John

Sam Cade
June 21, 2013, 12:03 PM
What sort of range do they shoot with that hold?


Relatively close.

It is for recoil mitigation and rapid target transitions, not punching paper. Having the support hand out toward the muzzle allows you to really yank it around with alacrity.


Watch this team Colt shooter:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y_4m0q7PlQ

Warp
June 21, 2013, 05:19 PM
What sort of range do they shoot with that hold?

I tried it out on the range this week @200 and my hits went from good to notsogood.

It's better for speed, speed of acquisition, and speed of transferring between targets.

Of course nothing is guaranteed, but if I have to shoot something that is 200 yards /meters away, I'm probably going to be able to go prone or at least sit or kneel, or use a barricade type solid object for support, I'm probably not going to stand motionless upright

Trent
June 21, 2013, 05:30 PM
It's better for speed, speed of acquisition, and speed of transferring between targets.

Of course nothing is guaranteed, but if I have to shoot something that is 200 yards /meters away, I'm probably going to be able to go prone or at least sit or kneel, or use a barricade type solid object for support, I'm probably not going to stand motionless upright

You should practice it.

It's a good way to win cases of beer in bets with friends. :)

Warp
June 21, 2013, 07:20 PM
You should practice it.

It's a good way to win cases of beer in bets with friends. :)

Practice what?

JShirley
June 21, 2013, 07:22 PM
I think he means longer-distance offhand shooting.

Personally, I think that's like practicing knife throwing: potentially useful somewhere, sometime, but very far down the list of priorities.

Trent
June 21, 2013, 07:46 PM
I think he means longer-distance offhand shooting.

Personally, I think that's like practicing knife throwing: potentially useful somewhere, sometime, but very far down the list of priorities.

Yup, that's what I meant. :)

Shooting from the bench, or prone, gets pretty boring after awhile. Gotta up the difficulty.

Warp
June 21, 2013, 07:48 PM
Yup, that's what I meant. :)

Shooting from the bench, or prone, gets pretty boring after awhile. Gotta up the difficulty.

I do not know how you concluded that I never practice shooting while standing. But just to be clear...I do practice shooting offhand, standing upright, rifle, shotgun, and pistol.

And I never shoot anything from the bench, unless I get suckered into going to one of those piece of **** ranges that requires it.

My interpretation of the thread at the time was that the stance shown above wouldn't be as good for shooting offhand at 200 yards, and my position is that it is faster on target and faster in transitions, and faster in moving (your body), which is why it's my primary practical stance for shooting a rifle/carbine. And, practically speaking, for uses other than trying to win bets with people for poops and giggles, if I need to shoot something 200 yards away I'm probably not going to do it standing motionless upright. ;)

taliv
June 21, 2013, 08:09 PM
i shoot kind of as pictured out to about 100 yards on 8x10 torso sized targets. any smaller or farther away and i switch to more of a high power/cmp stance.

lately, i'm mostly shooting a 10" SBR so i can't put my hand nearly that far out, but the concept is still pretty much the same

Trent
June 22, 2013, 12:45 AM
I do not know how you concluded that I never practice shooting while standing. But just to be clear...I do practice shooting offhand, standing upright, rifle, shotgun, and pistol.

And I never shoot anything from the bench, unless I get suckered into going to one of those piece of **** ranges that requires it.

My interpretation of the thread at the time was that the stance shown above wouldn't be as good for shooting offhand at 200 yards, and my position is that it is faster on target and faster in transitions, and faster in moving (your body), which is why it's my primary practical stance for shooting a rifle/carbine. And, practically speaking, for uses other than trying to win bets with people for poops and giggles, if I need to shoot something 200 yards away I'm probably not going to do it standing motionless upright. ;)

I have no doubt if offers more control over transitioning the muzzle fast from one point to another. And I certainly wasn't trying to insult you or imply you don't practice shooting standing. I should have phrased it differently, "everyone" should practice, not "you", specifically.

To clarify, if you practice offhand shooting at short range, and ONLY short range, you (may) find it builds in bad habits that become more difficult to correct for longer range shooting. The finesse and body control required to shoot accurately at long range can be difficult to get a grip on. Little things like slight inward leg tension, bending the knees just right (not too little, not too much), tightening the stomach muscles to stiffen the torso, rotating the hips slightly to create sprung tension to create a relaxed lock in the middle, can be ignored.

If the skill is acquired to shoot offhand at 200+ yards, it naturally translates in to shorter ranges. Ramp up the difficulty and it *requires* you tweak and finesse to score hits. That becomes muscle memory to become that much better at any range.

Anyway, wasn't trying to pick a fight, just trying to make a point. :)

Warp
June 22, 2013, 12:47 AM
How many MOA are you talking with the standing shooting?

Trent
June 22, 2013, 01:18 AM
How many MOA are you talking with the standing shooting?

If I watch my caffeine intake, and I'm in the zone, 2.5-3 MOA @200 offhand. I shot 2.5 on the nose (10 shot group) this Tuesday, offhand, when I was out practicing with my son. I've done better, and I've done a lot worse, but that's been about my average lately. Score wise, I'm normally 80+/100 on a standard NRA target on offhand, 85-90 on kneeling, 90-95 on sitting, and 96+ on prone (no bipod). Benchrest, I'm 100/100 unless I do something stupid. :)

Ro1911
June 22, 2013, 02:45 AM
I guess my battle rifle is my 1918a2 BAR

Get ready to drool lol.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=185530&d=1371879731

185530

Aaron1100us
June 22, 2013, 03:31 AM
7.62x54R Fun :)

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/06/22/u5e9a3y4.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/06/22/u2y3a8aj.jpg

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/06/22/nemy7u2a.jpg

Sent from my SCH-R760 using Tapatalk 2

fragout
June 22, 2013, 03:53 AM
From left to right:

M14S, M1A-A1, WASR 10-63

EDIT: Disregard the WASR, as it dont count for purpose of this thread. The wife claimed it regardless.....lol

henschman
June 22, 2013, 05:13 AM
The squared up/support hand far forward grip is a very effective close range speed shooting and competition position. But try it sometime when you are worn out and exhausted. It doesn't work so well, as it relies on a lot of muscle. Something closer to a mag well grip where you can get your support elbow against your body is good for when you are tired... like at a 7 mile run n gun in the desert, or any number of real world situations.

If you have a small or distant target and are forced to shoot from standing (as real world conditions often require), first off utilize any solid support you can find. If none, to get the absolute most stability out of standing, stand about 90 degrees off target, relax the support hand, use a sling if you can, get the support elbow against the rib cage, feet about shoulder width apart, chicken wing the trigger elbow to open the pocket, and get the stock high in the shoulder pocket so you are standing more upright rather than hunched down to get cheek weld.

No one technique is best for all situations. The well-rounded shooter knows all of them, and when they are best employed.

PabloJ
June 22, 2013, 09:38 AM
The heavy-hitter equivalent of the pea-shooting AR-15 picture thread! :) Let's seem 'em! Anything that fires a full power rifle cartridge is game! M14, FAL, G3, M1 Garand, SVT 40, Milsurps!

Here's my M14 - 7.62x51 NATO...


Gee, with those pics you stole the thread. There is no better semi-auto military style rifles that a civilian could ever wish for.

taliv
June 22, 2013, 11:12 AM
200 yard NRA target used for standing has 3" x ring and 6" 10 ring so shooting 3 moa would give you a clean 100/100

Trent
June 22, 2013, 12:56 PM
200 yard NRA target used for standing has 3" x ring and 6" 10 ring so shooting 3 moa would give you a clean 100/100

If we were using the standing targets, yes it would. :)

We use A-21's @200, TQ4(T) A-15's at 100, and TQ3/1 A-9 at 50.

The A-21 X ring is 2", 10 ring 4" so 3 MOA won't get you a perfect score. I also have this problem finding the exact center, and always seem to somehow get 1 or 2 shots that I twitch on. The TQ3/1 targets we use on our standing stage (which is at 50 yds), are proportionally scaled to the A21s we use at 200, but feel soooooo tiny. The bull is 0.5".

This was my best run of 4, this week with a scoped FNAR.

http://i.imgur.com/JxHsL5ml.jpg

That high-left shot probably puts it closer to 5 MOA than 3.

(This is why you should never believe shooting stories without pictures - I mentally chalked it up as 1/2 of what it actually was; fortunately my son took pictures to keep me honest!) My son says I have "aimhacks" in my head. Not sure what that means.


FWIW my iron sight skills with a lighter rifle are not quite so good. Same day, same ammo, but SCAR17 w/ iron sights instead of FNAR w/ scope. Light rifles are so damn "bouncy".

http://i.imgur.com/jrMu6Khl.jpg

Trent
June 22, 2013, 12:59 PM
Gee, with those pics you stole the thread. There is no better semi-auto military style rifles that a civilian could ever wish for.

Yeah those pictures are jawdropping!

highpower
June 23, 2013, 01:05 AM
Another M1A: This one was produced in January of 1987 and came from the factory with all GI parts. I bought this recently and it seems to be virtually unfired

http://highpower.smugmug.com/Firearms/Springfield-M1A/i-Vhwnhm4/0/XL/IMG_2579-XL.jpg
http://highpower.smugmug.com/Firearms/Springfield-M1A/i-6xg3dRD/0/XL/IMG_2581-XL.jpg

avs11054
June 23, 2013, 12:26 PM
Deleted

henschman
August 9, 2013, 01:44 AM
Here is my latest battle rifle. The painted parts have been drying all week... I just got it all put together today. We will see how she shoots on Saturday.

It started as a basic DPMS Oracle. I installed a Criterion 18.5" lightweight CL barrel with rifle length gas, Troy TRX-308 12" FF handguard, JP adjustable gas block front sight, mil spec buffer tube, ACS-L stock, and MOE+ grip. It's got a Burris TAC30 1-4x in a PA mount, and a KAC 2-600m folding rear sight.

It weighs 8.5 lbs. without the optic, 10 lbs. with.

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/kk201/henschman/guns/image_zps829ed5c6.jpg

highpower
August 9, 2013, 09:22 AM
M24 Sniper, pictured with it's shipping container and accessories as issued to C Co 1/4 Calvary.

http://highpower.smugmug.com/Firearms/M24-sniper/i-Q5XpHPQ/0/XL/IMG_2612-XL.jpg
http://highpower.smugmug.com/Firearms/M24-sniper/i-9S26DjZ/0/XL/IMG_2610-XL.jpg

A couple M1A's
http://highpower.smugmug.com/Firearms/Springfield-M1A/i-vVvwJ2h/0/XL/IMG_2631-XL.jpg
http://highpower.smugmug.com/Firearms/Springfield-M1A/i-Vhwnhm4/0/XL/IMG_2579-XL.jpg

happygeek
August 10, 2013, 02:26 AM
Got this one since I posted in this thread the first time, 1938 Kar 98K. Well at least the receiver is marked 1938, it's a Russian capture and none of the other serial #s match any other serial #. I'm pretty sure at least a couple of the parts in this rifle were near a battle in the course of the largest conflict in human history.

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x297/fdhs_runner/Firearms/CandRs/1938Kar98k_zps6c85de18.jpg

Yes, that's a straight bolt. I'm guessing it's from a Gewehr 98 and maybe was around in WWI. I got lucky too, the rifle was marked down quite a bit because of the straight bolt but all the German markings were intact. The only Russian marking I found was an X on the butt plate.

AIM Surplus got some 8x56R in stock and I found some German marked en bloc clips on teh interwebs, so I'll be able to finally shoot my Hungarian Steyr when I get home.

coosbaycreep
August 11, 2013, 08:00 PM
PTR-91 with a bunch of extra crap on it:
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg161/dillardzach82/hk%20stuff/th_013_zps7f543439.jpg (http://s248.photobucket.com/user/dillardzach82/media/hk%20stuff/013_zps7f543439.jpg.html)
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg161/dillardzach82/hk%20stuff/th_011_zpsa7cd7092.jpg (http://s248.photobucket.com/user/dillardzach82/media/hk%20stuff/011_zpsa7cd7092.jpg.html)
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg161/dillardzach82/hk%20stuff/th_012_zpsbe3b95a7.jpg (http://s248.photobucket.com/user/dillardzach82/media/hk%20stuff/012_zpsbe3b95a7.jpg.html)
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg161/dillardzach82/hk%20stuff/th_008_zps0cee88c3.jpg (http://s248.photobucket.com/user/dillardzach82/media/hk%20stuff/008_zps0cee88c3.jpg.html)
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg161/dillardzach82/hk%20stuff/th_010_zps01125d92.jpg (http://s248.photobucket.com/user/dillardzach82/media/hk%20stuff/010_zps01125d92.jpg.html)

Willie Sutton
August 11, 2013, 08:21 PM
FG-42, from SMG Guns.


Mine is "almost ready for me to fly to Texas to pick up"...



Willie


.

DMH
August 11, 2013, 10:09 PM
Heavy hitter.........battle rifle? (45-70)
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-flM4gwBYZdc/UJbmcOCQ2LI/AAAAAAAAB98/fsDXZNZoWgs/w390-h585-no/IMG_1891.JPG

Just kidding!

Here we go! .308

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-1KfdXyfIR84/UY7Py1S4v3I/AAAAAAAAD-Q/AKrJoyZ4kvQ/w390-h585-no/Marlin+1894+SRC+44-40+dom+1911+001.JPG

DMH

johnnydollar
August 12, 2013, 12:11 AM
SOCOM-16
http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/cc422/johnnydollar1949/073.jpg (http://s1211.photobucket.com/user/johnnydollar1949/media/073.jpg.html)

Stevie-Ray
August 12, 2013, 04:17 PM
SAR-48HB

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s66/GitchiManitou/100_0499.jpg

AethelstanAegen
September 14, 2013, 06:14 PM
Did someone say Battle Rifles? Yes, please. I finally dragged some of the collection out for a few pictures.

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn100/AethelstanAegen/IMG_9265_zps5d7c26fa.jpg
M95 Steyr

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn100/AethelstanAegen/IMG_9303_zpsaac8355d.jpg
Yugoslavian M24/47 that picked up an M48 stock somewhere in it's life. Bonus, M57 Tokarev.

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn100/AethelstanAegen/IMG_9317_zps29f4a57c.jpg
Egyptian Hakim rifle which is based off the Swedish AG-42 Ljungman.

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn100/AethelstanAegen/IMG_9350_zps389321c9.jpg
M91/30 and M44 with a bonus M1895 Nagant revolver.

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn100/AethelstanAegen/IMG_9365_zps4da31be5.jpg
The battle rifle or all battle rifles, the M1 Garand with a bonus 1911.

MistWolf
September 15, 2013, 04:01 AM
Imbel FAL
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Brazilian%20Beauty/DSC_00013.jpg
Agentine FAL
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Argentina%20Girl/Argy.jpg
Austrian StG-58. One of my favorite FALs
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/StG58/StG58002.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/StG58/DSC_0208.jpg
Another favorite- Para FAL
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Para%20Mods/Para001.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Para%20Mods/DSC_0077.jpg
I love my FALs but it's American iron that holds a special place in my heart. Every red blooded American should have an M1 Garand
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Liberty/014.jpg
and an M14
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Liberty/030.jpg
The M&P-10 is a new comer and not battle tested, but we'll give it a chance to earn it's place
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n289/SgtSongDog/Liberty%20Belle/DSC_0024_zps7559c666.jpg

IndianaBoy
September 15, 2013, 09:15 AM
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb264/nwilliams27/PTR-91/PTR91-1_zps66bc9e0c.jpg

Awesome!!!

duelist1954
September 15, 2013, 12:33 PM
My CETME in 7.62 NATO

http://i.imgur.com/h9hP8qV.jpg

MistWolf
September 15, 2013, 02:17 PM
M-14... w/a 25 round mag no less.

As in Post 129 BTW...
Actually, that's a 30 round mag in the M14. I got the rifle from my father. It came with a gorgeous, custom made, tiger flame walnut stock. I still have the stock but I've got it put away to keep it from getting banged up. It's now in a GI fiberglass stock. Dad had used this rifle to shoot Service Rifle. One day, he took it to the Big Gun Show to sell- he was always buying, selling and trading something. When I'd call Dad on the phone, I always started the conversation by asking "Ok, what did you get this week, and what did you get rid of to get it?" I told Dad he couldn't sell his M14, I wanted it.

He said "You got the money?" Being young, newly married and not long out of the Air Force, I did not. I badgered him to let me make payments. He said he'd let me buy it on payments if it didn't sell at the gunshow. Normally, he'd hand me what he wanted sold, give me a bottom dollar he'd take and how much commision I'd get. I always got the price he wanted and made a good buck or two. I figured he'd hand the rifle to me and all I had to do was carry it around all day and simply not sell it. It was mine!

Instead, Dad told me he was going to have a friend who had a table sell it. When we got there, Dad told his friend how much he wanted for it and his friend assured him, at that price and with it's gorgeous wood, it'd sell fast. With that, Dad wandered off into the crowd. I spent the entire day watching that table. There were soft gun cases on that table and I'd shift them to cover up the M14. Sometimes Dad's friend would see the cases out of place, frown and put them back, but when he'd turn away, I covered the rifle again. If someone wandered over to the table and showed a bit too much interest in the rifle, I'd push my way in, pick it up and pretend to give it close scrutiny and mutter about how this looks odd or that isn't right until they went away.

At the end of the day, Dad came back to see if it had sold. His friend scratched his head bewildered and said no. "It's the darndest thing," he added. Me, I just tried to look as innocent as the cat who just ate the canary can, cased the rifle and personally carried it out to the car- and haven't let go of it since. It's a fine rifle and a damn good shooter, one of my favorites. Come to think of it, almost all my favorites I got from my father.

The FALs I built. The Imbel is an Imbel kit built on an Imbel receiver. The finish is worn from being carried a lot but the barrel is in excellent shape. Doesn't look like it was shot much.

The Argy was a new rifle that was part of a shipment sent to the US right before the ban went into place but arrived too late. Customs held them up until it was agreed the importer could break the rifles into it's main parts. The parts, including barrel, were sold as kits and the receivers sold seperately. The kit is like new and the numbers of the lower, bolt & carrier all match (the Argentines didn't number the barrels) but I'm fairly certain it's the original. I built this kit on an Argy receiver.

The StG started off as a DSA built rifle on a Type II receiver. The kit is Austrian and all the numbers matched except the barrel. I bough the rifle complete and used and due to some rather unusual circumstances, didn't shoot the rifle for awhile. Found out later the chamber of the barrel was damaged so I took a deep breath, and ove into the world of FAL building by breaking down my beautiful FAL into a kit and reciever. I used the Type II receiver to do my first build- the Para FAL. It uses a DSA aluminum lower and a SA barrel that was cut back to 18". It's very accurate for a FAL and that's using milsurp ammo. I adapted a forearm from a PTR-91 to help protect my hands from the barrel heat. An HK rear drum sight was used to get the right elevation with the mish-mash of parts. A Battlecomp BABC keeps the muzzle flat and helps with recoil. The Para is a controlled, soft shooting 308 powerhouse and has proven to be very reliable

I found a barrel and a Type I receiver to rebuild the StG. The difference between the Type I, II and III is in the lightening cuts. The Type I is the lightest, the Type II is more durable for full auto fire and the Type III is heavier and easier to manufacture. (There is also what FAL Filers call the "Type 1.5" which the South Africans used on their R1 but that's a story for another time). The Austrian StG is by far my favorite FAL. With the bipod and carry handle removed and a folding charging handle installed, it's the cleanest looking, lightest and best balanced of the fullsized rifles and the sweetest shooting. With just the flash supressor, it's muzzle rise isn't much more than a FAL equipped with the Belgian muzzle brake and it's very controllable. Recoil is comfortable but not as soft as the Para with the BABC. It too, has proven to be ver reliable. The StG and the Para are the FALs I like shooting the best

Tommygunn
September 15, 2013, 03:07 PM
Mistwolf -- where do you get those 30 round M-14 magazines?? I have a number of 20 rounders and once tried to order a 25 rnd mag but the company didn't have them in stock & returned my $$.
Must REALLY weigh down the M1A to have 30 rounds. ;)

natescout
September 15, 2013, 03:34 PM
My M14S and EBR , my favorite shooters..

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm10/natesyz250/dc5fb4b5-f6f8-4b27-ac80-71d152221da2_zpsc048679b.jpg (http://s292.photobucket.com/user/natesyz250/media/dc5fb4b5-f6f8-4b27-ac80-71d152221da2_zpsc048679b.jpg.html)

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm10/natesyz250/8BC69BFD-5654-420D-A8BA-BACD90E5FC4D-70254-000012DC2036AFC2_zps2b7755dd.jpg (http://s292.photobucket.com/user/natesyz250/media/8BC69BFD-5654-420D-A8BA-BACD90E5FC4D-70254-000012DC2036AFC2_zps2b7755dd.jpg.html)

MistWolf
September 15, 2013, 07:24 PM
Mistwolf -- where do you get those 30 round M-14 magazines?? I have a number of 20 rounders and once tried to order a 25 rnd mag but the company didn't have them in stock & returned my $$.
Must REALLY weigh down the M1A to have 30 rounds. ;)
I don't remember where. I think I got it in the 90s. It does weigh a bit more when fully loaded, but it lightens up quick. I like it, but it looks like a cartoon caricature of itself:).

Every once in awhile, I keep my eyes peeled for 30 round mags and pick them up when the budget allows. I have 30 round mags for the M14, FN-FAL and the HK91. Trouble with them is they can be hit & miss. One of the 30 round FAL mags has proven to be unreliable. I also picked up a 60 round 5.56 Surefire mag for the AR before The Panic and got lucky that it works very well. When I get a chance, I'm gonna get some Magpul 5.56 40 rounders and see how they do

Reloadron
September 15, 2013, 08:37 PM
Mistwolf -- where do you get those 30 round M-14 magazines?? I have a number of 20 rounders and once tried to order a 25 rnd mag but the company didn't have them in stock & returned my $$.
Must REALLY weigh down the M1A to have 30 rounds. ;)
The largest I see anymore is 25 round magazines for the M1A / M14 rifles (http://www.brownells.com/magazines/rifle-magazines/magazines/m14-m1a-magazines-prod27330.aspx). Places like Midway did carry the 30 round at one time but they seem to be a discontinued item everywhere I look for them. Like MistWolf I have one around here somewhere going back to the 90s and don't have a clue why I have it or where I got it. Looks ugly hanging so low out of the rifle. Anyway, per the link Brownell's is showing the 25 round in stock for a price of $35 bucks plus S&H.

Ron

Medusa
September 20, 2013, 04:15 PM
My rifle has seen some minor adjustments since the last time I put the pic here. It has a pre-production prototype rail on, with the bipod module, it is also combat proven with our forces in Afg. With the Sako 3-ring scope mount the S&B sits very low, clearance between the rail and objective cover is only about 1 mm. And it is 7 kg as it is on the pic, unloaded.

Picture is just a cellphone one, when I have a proper photoshoot I will put up new ones.

Tommygunn
September 20, 2013, 08:29 PM
The largest I see anymore is 25 round magazines for the M1A / M14 rifles. Places like Midway did carry the 30 round at one time but they seem to be a discontinued item everywhere I look for them. Like MistWolf I have one around here somewhere going back to the 90s and don't have a clue why I have it or where I got it. Looks ugly hanging so low out of the rifle. Anyway, per the link Brownell's is showing the 25 round in stock for a price of $35 bucks plus S&H.

Ron

I dunno about Brownell's -- trying to navigate their website is like trying to hold a swim-match in a vat of cold molassas.
Anyhow I just found some at .... *SIGH* .... Cheaper than Dirt and ordered 3 of the 30 rounders. They ARE cheap too -- just under $11.00 apiece. We'll have to see if they're any good.

KYamateur
September 20, 2013, 11:42 PM
VZ58 by Ohio Ordnance. It is light, accurate, and reliable any any environment. I have an SKS, AR, and AK, but if I'm going to battle this is going with me. I actually haven't shot this one yet but I have shot one I got from czechpoint and it handles and shoots awesome. The one pictured seems to be of better quality than the other one I have. With that being said I haven't had a chance to try the Glock AR15 9mm shotgun that CNN was talking about.

http://http://i1350.photobucket.com/albums/p778/jreed576/VZ58_zpseca319f9.jpg (http://s1350.photobucket.com/user/jreed576/media/VZ58_zpseca319f9.jpg.html)

selector67
September 21, 2013, 09:11 PM
Here are mine, FN FAL, M1A
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l67/selector67/DSCF0577_zps009b30ed.jpg (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/selector67/media/DSCF0577_zps009b30ed.jpg.html)
CETME and M1 Garand
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l67/selector67/DSCF0578_zps75cc2d1a.jpg (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/selector67/media/DSCF0578_zps75cc2d1a.jpg.html)
MAS 49, HAKIM, and SVT-40
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l67/selector67/DSCF0579_zps59584aec.jpg (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/selector67/media/DSCF0579_zps59584aec.jpg.html)
FN-49 and MAS 49/56
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l67/selector67/DSCF0580_zps5e6f4321.jpg (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/selector67/media/DSCF0580_zps5e6f4321.jpg.html)
FR-8, M-95, K-31 and Enfield No3
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l67/selector67/DSCF0581_zpse8a13bc5.jpg (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/selector67/media/DSCF0581_zpse8a13bc5.jpg.html)
Enfield No 4, M44, Type 99
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l67/selector67/DSCF0582_zps002d5407.jpg (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/selector67/media/DSCF0582_zps002d5407.jpg.html)
M-27, M-91/30 and MAS 36
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l67/selector67/DSCF0583_zpsf4390f4e.jpg (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/selector67/media/DSCF0583_zpsf4390f4e.jpg.html)
M-91/30, M-39, 308 Mauser, Krag carbine, and carcano carbine
http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l67/selector67/DSCF0584_zpsdae82cb3.jpg (http://s93.photobucket.com/user/selector67/media/DSCF0584_zpsdae82cb3.jpg.html)

selector67
September 22, 2013, 09:33 PM
Nice collection there MistWolf :)

If you enjoyed reading about "THR: Battle Rifle Discussion & Picture Thread" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!