Credit Union refused to Open account for NFA Trust


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Flyboy73
April 7, 2013, 01:41 AM
Just finalized my NFA Trust last week and went to my Credit Union to open a checking account for the trust. After filling out the trust account application and waiting awhile they can back said they would be unable to open the account. First they said it more of a commercial account, then said it was because the work firearm is in the trust name. At this point i was PO'd and had to get going to make it to work, so i left.

I talked to my trust attorney and said he had never heard of this. I went to another bank we have a account with and they opened a account without question.

I plan on going in next week and talk with the credit union management, why they are discriminating against firearms.

Brion

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AlexanderA
April 7, 2013, 07:37 AM
Credit unions often have a "field of membership" requirement, such as people working for a particular employer, etc. Maybe your trust fell outside the required class of membership.

DoubleMag
April 7, 2013, 07:41 AM
Name them

OilyPablo
April 7, 2013, 08:28 AM
For sure ask for that rule in writing.

bill3424
April 7, 2013, 11:07 AM
I'm interested to know what credit union said this.

Flyboy73
April 7, 2013, 04:17 PM
I am allready a member there, didn't have a issue opening a trust account until later. Its a credit union for a large chemical company in mid michigan.

Arizona_Mike
April 7, 2013, 05:36 PM
I grew up in Midland :)

Mike

Zane
April 7, 2013, 07:58 PM
Your MI NFA trust does not need to be funded with actual money. It may need a list of assets, but no actual money.

Flyboy73
April 7, 2013, 09:50 PM
I grew up in Midland

I see you knew where i am talking about. :) However I hope to be heading your way soon.

Your MI NFA trust does not need to be funded with actual money. It may need a list of assets, but no actual money

I realize there is debate about this issue and paying with your own money versus opening a account for the trust.

My trust attorney recommended opening a trust bank account and pay all the NFA items and fees with it.

He gave the reasons for it, makes senses to me, its more of CYA. I paid him good money for his recommendations.

Brion

Jim K
April 7, 2013, 10:34 PM
As I understand it, credit unions, unlike banks, are considered private and can pretty much make their own rules. Since they clearly don't like you, your hobby, or your membership, why beg them to allow you to stay with them?

Jim

medalguy
April 7, 2013, 11:56 PM
I funded my trust with $1,000 and used that money to buy postal money orders for stamps. You can add funds to the trust at any time. The only advantage of a bank account is you can absolutely tell when the check is cashed, if you don't like waiting. :D

Flyboy73
April 8, 2013, 12:06 AM
why beg them to allow you to stay with them

There is no issue with my other accounts there. Only they would not open a account for my trust. I suspect is some pencil pusher there personal beef with guns. Will know a lot more when i talk to management.

Brion

Charger442
April 10, 2013, 03:04 PM
been getting in arguments a lot lately about actually needing a trust bank account.

i guess this is one more reason why i dont feel like i need one. No one can point me to any laws or statutes requiring one.

Flyboy73
April 10, 2013, 10:47 PM
been getting in arguments a lot lately about actually needing a trust bank account

No law that i know of for one. As it was explained to me by my lawyer. Its shows the NFA item was for sure bought by the trust and not the individual. Creates a line of paper ownership. Its more of a CYA.

W5BYR
April 11, 2013, 02:01 AM
My Chase bank notarized the trust documents then called me two days later and asked if I could destroy them and have the trust notarized elsewhere! That is to say, start over.

You can open an account at a small local savings bank or simply list other property as held in trust. The bank account I finally used was closed as soon as I assembled an SBR Uzi and listed it on the asset list. Checked with my lawyer who said that was fine.

How do you "un-notarize" legal documents already notarized? I didn't, sent them along with the forms to obtain tax stamped form 4.

Take care and shoot safe. Jim

mo_dingo
April 17, 2013, 09:32 PM
My Chase bank notarized the trust documents then called me two days later and asked if I could destroy them and have the trust notarized elsewhere! That is to say, start over.

You can open an account at a small local savings bank or simply list other property as held in trust. The bank account I finally used was closed as soon as I assembled an SBR Uzi and listed it on the asset list. Checked with my lawyer who said that was fine.

How do you "un-notarize" legal documents already notarized? I didn't, sent them along with the forms to obtain tax stamped form 4.

Take care and shoot safe. Jim
Wow, this is just insane.

You can't un-notarize a document. You would have draw up the documents fresh and have someone else notarize them.

I would ignore their plea and use the docs you have already signed.

Singletracker
April 17, 2013, 09:48 PM
Neither my bank nor my credit union would open an account for my trust

Talked to my attny who did the trust and her opinion was as long as the check is from a trustee then the check is from the "trust"

Lichter
April 17, 2013, 11:15 PM
Why do you need a bank account for the trust?

pjlaw1
April 20, 2013, 07:40 PM
@ Lichter

You need to "fund" a trust. Easiest way is to open a bank account in the trust's name.

My credit union opened an account for my trust. Was not the easiest but I just had to have my paperwork and had to explain to the bottom level CSR at the bank what I needed. We had to get on the phone and talk to someone who knew what they were doing.

tepin
April 22, 2013, 03:16 PM
The easiest is to get a postal money order for $200 and on the money order in the "From" field you list your Trust name. To fund the trust I added $10 to my schedule "A". No bank involved and my form approved w/o issue.
If your Trust's bank account earns interest, your Trust will have to pay taxes on the earnings.

crazy-mp
April 22, 2013, 10:08 PM
Looks like it would be easier to do the Form 4 as a individual...

There is no requirement for the Trust or LLC to have its own bank account, get a cashiers check use your trust or llc as a memo and be done with it.

BigLar
April 23, 2013, 10:47 AM
I work for a financial institution and I'd wager being declined has nothing to do with firearms. In my particular case, when we have trust documents come in, we send it to an employee who's rather well versed in trust and estate documents. But that employee is not a lawyer, rather, they've just been told by the lawyers what to look for. I can't imagine this kind of trust is all that common, especially for someone in a smaller bank or a credit union. The credit union probably had never seen anything like it before and instead of having the real lawyer review it, they erred on the side of covering their own butts.

Of course, it could be some anti-gun lawyer being a jerk. But, as the saying goes, never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence.

Elessar
April 23, 2013, 12:15 PM
This is not the "easiest way to fund the trust". It seems quite difficult. The easiest is for the Grantor to add some piece of property to the trust, via the "schedule A". This can be a collection of books, coins, some socks your grandmother made, etc.

Bubbles
April 23, 2013, 01:12 PM
Why in the world would you put the word "firearm" in your trust name? It's just extra stuff that has to be engraved when you file a Form 1, which costs you space on the firearm plus increased engraving costs since most charge by the letter. "Smith NFA Trust" is short, clean, and doesn't raise eyebrows.

It's the same reason FFL's don't have the word "firearm" in the name, whenever packages get shipped, guess which ones get swiped by a dishonest employee from the courier? Something going to/from "Bob's Gun Emporium, LLC" is at more risk than one labelled "BGE, LLC"

mbogo
April 23, 2013, 03:53 PM
The trust can have any name; it does not need to have 'firearm', 'NFA', 'SBR', or any other revealing noun or adjective in the name.

When you have the trust drawn up, you can fund it with a single dollar (on Schedule A. Neither BATFE or anyone else requires that the payment for the tax stamp come from an account with the trust's name.

You can pay by money order or personal check. Put the trust's name in the memo field, and you're done.

mbogo

au_prospector
April 23, 2013, 08:34 PM
How do you "un-notarize" legal documents already notarized? I didn't, sent them along with the forms to obtain tax stamped form 4

You dont "un-notarize",
A notary is simply an agent of a state and county. I am a notary in Georgia, my signature and sworn oath are located in my county's records. It is a common misconception that "the document matters" when in fact the actual document is very irrelevant. All a notary does is state in writing and with signature and stamp that the SIGNOR of a document is identified and is who he says he is.

The poop will not go back into the horse. :)

jaysouth
April 24, 2013, 08:37 AM
I invoke Occam's Razor on this one. The action of your credit union had nothing to do with deep seated conspiricy theories and latent anti-gun sentiment.

Your trust is NOT you. You are NOT the trust. You and your trust are separate legal entities. Your trust or LLC or Corporation does not qualify for membership in this credit union.

Flyboy73
April 24, 2013, 11:34 PM
Your trust is NOT you. You are NOT the trust. You and your trust are separate legal entities. Your trust or LLC or Corporation does not qualify for membership in this credit union

I disagree.

As when I asked about opening a account for my trust it was not a issue, they didn't say they don't open accounts for trusts. Matter of fact they even had pre made paperwork to open a trust account. Only after looking at the trust did it become a issue. First BS about it being a commercial account, then the trust name. That sounds like some personal bias to me.

But any rate the other bank was alot better and less of a hassle to open.

Brion

Murcielago
May 11, 2013, 06:40 AM
You invoke WHAT? Why such fancy terminology?

Occam's Razor. Pretty common term actually. In other words: "If you hear hoof beats, think horses, not zebras." but that's nine words instead of two.

Lennyjoe
May 11, 2013, 07:53 PM
mbogo, do I need the same for a suppresser? I know a little about the trust but no about an account

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