SD pistol for small hands....


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BigBore44
April 11, 2013, 07:06 AM
Hey guys,
A girlfriend of mine has had a few recent events that she FINALLY believes she needs a SD pistol. As you can tell by my handle I'm not real big on smaller caliber pistols. I'm going to be helping her purchase a new pistol but I'm a little ignorant of the subcompact 9mm's. I've been tossing around an XD Sub (I carry an XD45 and love mine) but her hands are TINY. I don't have any experience with keltec's or Taurus or the LCP's. I don't care about cool looking. I care about function. If she pulls the trigger I want it to go bang. What would you all recommend?

Now someone is going to ask about her price range. I would say around 500 or under.

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Thompsoncustom
April 11, 2013, 07:19 AM
Have the released the XDS in 9mm yet? that might be up your alley.

mnhntr
April 11, 2013, 08:49 AM
Look at the Kahr line up. Much better than the Keltec and LCP IMO.

hardluk1
April 11, 2013, 09:03 AM
So up to this point your lady has how much handgun experience??

Don't pick her handgun for her. Let her handle some models. have her at the bersa thunder 380 line and maybe a , maybe a cw9 kahr but avoid the light weight pistols in 40 and 45 right now. maybe even a snubby would be a good choice do to the fact she will have a wide range of ammo and grip sizes with a old school snubby. If the ruger lcr fit HER well that maybe a good choice to start with.

I have a very tinny daughter that can shot my small kahrs but because of recoil she not yet ready to invest the time to get comfy with it PLUS racking the slide on some small pistol is a work out for some females.

If you have a range near you many today have female instructors to help along with the choice. As it turns out my youngest 100lb girl carries ether a TCP and a bersa 380CC and can manage both. My oldest girl favores a 13oz snubby with 125gr +P ammo for carry.

KenW.
April 11, 2013, 09:49 AM
My wife found the grip on a J-frame too small for her liking. Then I installed a Tyler T-Grip and we are fighting over who gets to use that little .38.

fatcpa
April 11, 2013, 09:49 AM
I've been through most of the pocket 380's and 9mm's the last couple of years. The Kahr PM9 or CM9 would both fit the bill for a 9mm. They handle recoil as well as any that I've seen. They both have a pretty stout recoil spring, so it takes a fair amount of effort to work the slide. Kahr now makes the CM380, but it's pretty much the same size as the 9mm, so why bother? The softest shooting 380 that I've owned is the Sig P238. It has great sights and shoots like a bigger gun. A possible drawback, depending on the person, is the fact that being patterned after a 1911, it would need to be carried "cocked and locked" to be effective. Not sure how that might work as a purse gun. When I carry a 380 these days, it is a S&W Bodyguard 380. I resisted trying one for a long time but now that I own one, it is my favorite carry 380. Small gun that feels good in the hands. The laser works pretty well, but activation is a little hokey. Small hands might have a hard time reaching the activation button. Another smaller gun that I haven't tried is the Walther 380. I know a few people that rave about theirs. I have never even held one, so I can't really comment. Had a Walther P22 once and it was a jamamatic. My go to carry gun is still the S&W J-frame. Simple, light and effective (for a small bore).

MedWheeler
April 11, 2013, 10:49 AM
If she pulls the trigger I want it to go bang.

That's not enough. She should have one that will go "bang", hit near or on target with relative ease, and not make her feel like she'd never want to fire it again.

Remember that they are her hands. Like you admit, you'll probably have to back off the "big bore machismo" quite a bit. The Kel-Tec PF9 is quite a handful for thin-wristed people, particularly those with small hands. The gun is just too light. You'll likely find that to be true with a lot of the "sub-compact" nines. She's gonna have to try a couple of them out. The Ruger LC9 might be a little (little) more comfortable. Ruger also offers the same gun in .380 now, though I'm not sure how readily available it is, having just come out.

The "keychain" .380 pistols can also be quite a handful for many petite shooters, both male and female, and are hard to hang on to for some bigger-handed shooters. Any in blowback configuration will be likely even worse.

If it's for carry (concealed), the Kel-Tec P32 (or P3-AT if she can handle the caliber) is far from an unwise choice.

Bigger options that are easy to grip and shoot, but can still be concealed in many ways, are available from Bersa, CZ, and Taurus, in .32, .380, and 9mm.

Don't rule out revolvers. With the right grips, she might well surprise you by handling a .38 snub (or even a .44 Special!) quite well.

None of these is a suggestion for something for you to run out and buy her. They are simply suggestions of guns she can check out and possibly try out.

How about you two browse www.corneredcat.com together some?

At the end of the day, it will be her choice. If she tries out a lot of things and settles on a .22 revolver (Ruger LCR in .22LR or WMR), don't belittle her for it. Let her learn to rock it, and support her. Many a bad guy has been driven off, captured, or neutralized (even killed) by "some girl and her little .22".

By the way, my wife's hands are tiny as well. She used to get teased about it when we first got together and she was waiting tables ("how can you hold all that stuff with those little hands!?")

scaatylobo
April 11, 2013, 10:54 AM
Since its her hands and her ergonomics that will matter,she will have to decide.

I would suggest she get to handle and SHOOT all the above suggestions before she decides.

A small framed 9 MM might feel perfect --- till she pulls the trigger 50 times.

then its a PITA to shoot AND load [ need hand strength to pull slide back ].

My friends wife LOVED the Ruger LCP - just has a heck of a learning curve to pull the slide back to chamber a round.

Yes she carrys one,but she needed to learn to handle it,with a laser she does very well.

btg3
April 11, 2013, 11:49 AM
All size 9 shoes do not fit all size 9 feet. Gotta try 'em on. Same for guns.

460Kodiak
April 11, 2013, 11:59 AM
XDs maybe?

MarshallDodge
April 11, 2013, 12:02 PM
I agree with those that recommend letting her decide.

While I am not a big fan, the Sig P238 and XDsc seem to be popular with the ladies around here. The M&P9c is also popular and would be my first choice.

My wife likes our Kahr K9 and 9mm 1911. The 1911 has an easy trigger to manipulate and hers is a compact version. If your budget allows, you should have her try the Springfield EMP or Dan Wesson CCO in 9mm.

smalls
April 11, 2013, 12:05 PM
I never really need an excuse to head to the fun shop and fondle the toys. This seems like a pretty good excuse for you two to go! Go check em all out, see what she likes.

allaroundhunter
April 11, 2013, 01:25 PM
Obviously, it should be her decision. But she should want a soft-shooting gun that fits her.

In that category, the Sig P238 and S&W Shield 9mm are good choices. Put some guns in her hands, let her shoot some, and then let her pick what she likes.

The above two are guns that my mother gravitated to. She is barely 5' tall and probably is not 100 lbs soaking wet (so her hands are also quite small). She ended up with the P238 because she wanted a manual safety.

PabloJ
April 11, 2013, 02:06 PM
Hey guys,
A girlfriend of mine has had a few recent events that she FINALLY believes she needs a SD pistol. As you can tell by my handle I'm not real big on smaller caliber pistols. I'm going to be helping her purchase a new pistol but I'm a little ignorant of the subcompact 9mm's. I've been tossing around an XD Sub (I carry an XD45 and love mine) but her hands are TINY. I don't have any experience with keltec's or Taurus or the LCP's. I don't care about cool looking. I care about function. If she pulls the trigger I want it to go bang. What would you all recommend?

Now someone is going to ask about her price range. I would say around 500 or under.
I would go with heavier trigger pull DA weapon. My top pick would be S&W CS9 (was also made in .40S&W and .45ACP). Sadly it con only be bought on second-hand market now.

Shadow 7D
April 11, 2013, 02:08 PM
YOU must go fondle the goods
sorry BUT, your hands are your hands, what you will accept is up to you
BTW, if you look in Handguns, you'll see the sticky

"So you want to buy a guy for your mother/wife/girlfriend"
you should read it....

BullRunBear
April 11, 2013, 03:42 PM
My wife has tiny hands and is a bit recoil sensitive. The center fire handguns she is most comfortable with are a CZ 75b 9mm and a S&W M&P Shield 9mm. The CZ is heavy enough to soak up recoil and the grip fits her hands. The Shield, for all its smaller size and weight, is easy to rack the slide and recoil is very manageable. Don't know how S&W did it so well. She doesn't like small revolvers.

But don't assume anything. I helped a friend's daughter choose a SD gun and she is VERY petite. After testing a dozen or more, she ended up choosing a Ruger GP100 357 mag (loaded with standard 38 specials) with 4" barrel. She shoots it very well.

If the young woman ends up with a pistol, make sure she can easily load the magazine. If not, an Uplula (sp?) loader is a huge help.

Have fun with the process.

Jeff

BigBore44
April 12, 2013, 03:01 AM
Hey guys,
Just wanted to say I truely appreciate the advice. I may shoot big bore guns but I never belittle those that don't. And I know that ultimately it's her decision. And the only advice I'm giving her is to find what feels comfortable to her. She's a small woman 5'2" and 125 lbs but she's actually quite strong. She doesn't have experience with handguns, but she's not afraid of them. Respect? Yes. Fear? No. She just didn't grow up in a "gun family" like I did.

I'm not really opposed to any brand of firearm for her. And after I make this reply I'm going to compose a list of all the pistols mentioned for when I'm FORCED to go Academy, Bass Pro, and my LGS. How depressing. Lol.

*Bullrunbear,
I would like to know more about what you think of the Shield. How easy is it to disassemble? What's the trigger pull like? Those were just 2 of the reasons I chose my XD.

If anyone else has any opinions, I'm all...eyes I guess. Again, I truely appreciate the input.

bigfatdave
April 12, 2013, 08:47 AM
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=564531

BullRunBear
April 12, 2013, 09:11 AM
BB44,

I found the Shield was easy to take down for cleaning. It's a simple mechanism but it takes a bit of strength the hold the slide back while pushing out the retaining pin. The trigger is not light and smooth but not bad either. I describe it as 'deliberate'. Certainly nothing uncomfortable. (Admittedly, I am spoiled by the triggers on my K frame revolvers.) The slide was easy to operate. Even my wife, with a bit of arthritis, had no problem racking it. And at 15 yards, rapid fire, I had no trouble keeping 2 to 3 inch groups. After about 300 rounds there have been no jams or FTF.

Hope this helps. I'm sure there are a gazzilion reviews of the Shield out there.

Jeff

BigBore44
April 12, 2013, 10:58 AM
Thanks bullrun,
I'm going to put it on the list to check out for sure. I found a great deal on XD subcom 9's. $439 new and in stock. But then again it doesn't matter the price if it doesn't fit her hand.

Thanks everyone, I really do appreciate it.

Bovice
April 12, 2013, 11:31 AM
Joe Biden says to buy a shotgun, shoot it twice in the air, and hope they leave.

MedWheeler
April 12, 2013, 12:02 PM
^^Actually, he says they will leave. Problem solved.

BigBore44
April 12, 2013, 12:04 PM
Yeah well Joe is an idiot and I wouldn't take advice from him on how to wipe someone's butt. He'd just get my hands dirty. But I trust the members of THR. They don't have an underlying agenda.

Hunter125
April 12, 2013, 12:18 PM
I have been surprised by both the PT709 and the BPCC9 and how slim the grips on both were. You might have her try them, might be good for small hands.

bainter1212
April 12, 2013, 12:23 PM
My suggestion is the Walther PPS. 9mm, super compact but not too small, single stack for a slim grip. Easy recoil and Walther quality control is great. "Glock" style action so no messing around with clunky external safeties or DA/SA trigger pull confusion.

Shadow 7D
April 12, 2013, 01:58 PM
The gist, (esp. for a frist gun)
DO NOT GET A SMALL CCW TYPE GUN (not as a first gun)
get a standard/service size 9mm
Large, means much easier to control, better sight radius, and LESS recoil

When you get small to CCW
Light = more recoil
power(ful) = more recoil
little/small = difficult to manipulate, difficlut to grip
lighter slide for caliber = heavier springs

For a "little CCW semi auto"
I think MOUSE GUN (which is a specialist gun to begin with ie. not a 'do everything')
I suggest a Kel Tec P32 if you MUST have little and light, the .32 is adequate at 'social' distances in FMJ, the modified browning lock, means the springs are MUCH softer than a blowback, it holds more and is MUCH more controllable than similar .380's (which can be little pocket monsters)

Now, my suggestion, take all that money you are thinking about spending on a gun and
SEND HER TO A WOMANS ONLY SHOOTING CLASS
Not saying you can't teach her, but women tend to listen to strangers better than men in their life, stupid I know, but...

460Kodiak
April 12, 2013, 02:37 PM
You know, I was thinking about my suggestion of an XDs and something sprung to mind. How is her hand strength? I assume that if she has small hands they are not real strong?

If so, the XDs probably wouldn't be good. It is a stiff tight little gun, and not easy to manipulate for anyone with low hand strenght.

Based on the size and ease of trigger pull, I'd suggest a Ruger LCR if it fits her hand properly.

bigfatdave
April 12, 2013, 02:55 PM
Why do we even have a sticky? (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=564531)

So you want to buy your girlfriend/wife a gun (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=564531)

One hundred and twenty-one posts on this subject (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=564531)

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=564531

X-Rap
April 12, 2013, 03:11 PM
Let them pick their guns but make sure they have full command of all the functions of that gun, semi autos take some strength and technique that revolvers don't. Also broaden their horizons and get them out of their comfort zones just like we do or should do to ourselves by learning and mastering different types and calibers.

Shadow 7D
April 12, 2013, 03:23 PM
WAIT...
we forgot the http://www.corneredcat.com/ link....

btg3
April 12, 2013, 05:27 PM
Why do we even have a sticky?
That's rhetorical, right?
LOL... if we only read the sticky, it would eliminate all the chest-thumping. :rolleyes:

josephbw
April 12, 2013, 08:23 PM
My niece has very small hands. Someone bought her a Kel Tec P32 thinking it would be perfect for her. She stopped here to stay overnight a couple years ago, and as she was ready to leave, she asked me if I would look at her pistol. She brought it in and had a round stovepiped. I racked the slide and dumped it out showing her how to clear it. I replaced the round in a stovepipe position, and had her clear it like I showed her. Then I found out what the real problem was. She didn't have the hand strength to rack the slide.

If she wants a semi auto, make sure she has the strength to rack it, otherwise she may be much better off with a revolver.

Mosbyranger
April 12, 2013, 08:37 PM
You might want her to take a look at a Beretta 3032 or 21A. Yeah, I know, heresy suggesting a .32 or .22. However, they are easy to use, load, control, conceal, hold and fire. Perfect for a person with smaller hands. Well within the budget also.
MR

non2os13
April 12, 2013, 10:29 PM
I would try a snub revolver. My wife can't rack the slides on small autos, but she can lay waste to a target with a ladysmith 442.

Tomcat47
April 12, 2013, 10:51 PM
BigBore44 .... I love my XDs also, but share the same scenario with the wife.

Keep in mind Springfield will start shipping XDs in 9mm in June. (And I did call Springfield and they did confirm this)

I am in the hat to get one from my gun store... and I got one of the first XDs 45 when they were released as well, so I have faith it will arrive.

I think the 9mm will be an awesome package in the XDs

FireInCairo
April 12, 2013, 11:36 PM
Look at the Kahr line up. Much better than the Keltec and LCP IMO.
yes, though the Kahrs have a strong spring.

BigBore44
April 13, 2013, 09:34 AM
Ok guys,
I must admit, I didn't read the sticky until I made my thread. My bad! Geeze bite a guys head off. But i guess I deserve it. If I HAD read it I wouldn't be getting my head bitten off. Think they call that cause and effect. Lol.

To the ones mentioning hand strength. She has strong hands. She's a nurse on a med-surge floor. She has moved people weighing over 300 lbs up farther in a hospital bed by grabbing the sheets and pulling. But with anything especially something like lifting weights, proper technique and leverage can drastically reduce the strain needed to move the weight. So no matter what gun, she's gonna need lots of tap rack practice. And the more she does it, the better and more proficient she will become.

I'm seeing a few replies about revolvers. I'm definitely not opposed to a revolver at all. But so many revolvers are made with so little weight in them now trying to advertise them towards women. But in truth, a man needs to be shooting these "air weight" revolvers. I suppose a "classic" style S&W, Taurus, or Ruger could be a possibility.

Shadow,
I understand what you're saying about going full size to start. I'm gonna take her out and see how she does with my XD45. We might be surprised. I learned a long time ago not to doubt the abilities of someone with conviction and determination.

And as far as her taking a female shooting class, I suggested that. She got mad because she thought I didn't want to teach her (ugh, women). She wants me to teach her. And while I don't have the title of "Range Master" or anything like that. I'm VERY patient and have been through Police Pistol 1&2. Was the best shooter in my class and our instructor (Range Master for Tulsa PD) had me helping other students more than shooting my own weapon.

KTXdm9
April 13, 2013, 10:18 AM
I'm a huge fan of the Shield. I find recoil to be quite manageable for a smaller pistol. The slide was a bit stiff to work at first, but it loosened up nicely over time.

Bottom line is that she is going to have to shoot a bunch of pistols herself to decide. How will she carry it? Purse carry is going to have a lot more flexibility around size of the pistol.

Oh, and I would be ecstatic if my wife wanted me to take her shooting. Choose your complaints wisely. ;)

BLB68
April 13, 2013, 10:50 AM
I'm just going to second reading the Cornered Cat together. It's a great resource.

As far as pure hardware concerns go, I'll vouch for the Shield for the reasons stated by others (should it meet her criteria), and in a revolver suggest she looks at an LCR. The LCR trigger is very new shooter friendly.

A few comments on other posts:


In that category, the Sig P238 and S&W Shield 9mm are good choices. ...

The above two are guns that my mother gravitated to.... She ended up with the P238 because she wanted a manual safety.


The Shield has a manual safety. I know you probably weren't saying it doesn't, but just pointing that out for those who may not realize it.


I found the Shield was easy to take down for cleaning. It's a simple mechanism but it takes a bit of strength the hold the slide back while pushing out the retaining pin.


You must be thinking of another gun. The Shield uses a takedown lever. Here's a takedown video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTvujx8WTkw


Why do we even have a sticky?


To present general information so that people don't clog the boards with repeated questions. Not to give out advice on what's currently on the market that fits a certain criteria. The OP asks what's reliable and suited for a petite woman.

Plus, that sticky says a lot less than the Cornered Cat blog. It's not particularly useful for specifics of chosing a gun or dealing with a new shooter. It doesn't even link to the info. (Someone may have it linked in a post in the thread, but it's not in the OP of the thread, and not as likely to be seen.) Pretty useless as an information resource, though as a bit of advice, it's priceless.

460Kodiak
April 13, 2013, 05:08 PM
Well man, if she has small, but strong hands, and can work the slide, I return to my suggestion of an XDs. 6 shots of .45 acp out of a very accurate and easy to shoot gun would serve her well. They are a breeze to carry also, and you can throw the smaller backstrap on to help it fit her. If you can find one, I'd have her try one on.

May still be a tad large though.

non2os13
April 13, 2013, 11:52 PM
My wife is also a nurse, but bed transfers are nothing like compressing a super stiff spring.

threefeathers
April 15, 2013, 01:59 PM
Shadow 7D gives excellent advice.

bruzer
April 15, 2013, 04:21 PM
Out of all the hand guns my Wife has shot she likes a Browning Hi-Power 9mm the best. The MK III with the larger safety. The older ones had a very small safety and smaller sights. So far she does not like the sub-compacts. Coles on Gun Broker has Israeli Trade-Ins for under $500.
Good luck, stay safe and may God bless us all,
Mike

velocette
April 15, 2013, 05:12 PM
Folks;
The question asked originally is one I see the wrong answer to every day.
I work 20 hours a week as a range officer at a large municipal run public range.
On a daily basis, I see women, younger men, small framed non-athletic people being given .40 S&W, .45acp, little pocket .380s, pocket 9mm, snubby revolvers etc. I watch as they wince, flinch, grimace, close their eyes and yank the trigger, struggle to pull the double action trigger, then are taught to cock the revolver first. :uhoh: Their flinching with the recoil and muzzle blast is disheartening to watch. :banghead: Then they go to the seats behind the firing line and insist that the "teacher" do the shooting.
Folks, Please start these people out on a .22 pistol.
There are any number of medium frame .22 pistols that are easy to shoot, little recoil and muzzle blast. Ruger, Beretta, S&W, and many more make fine inexpensive pistols that are great for training and fun to shoot.
Remember, you can train all day long with a .22 rf for $20.00 worth of ammo. Opposed to $200.00 for the same centerfire ammo, not to mention the beating from the muzzle blast and recoil.
They also will work for defense. OK they lack "stopping power" But how many people do you know that would like to be shot with a .22 rimfire?
Something to consider. Which is better, 5 or 6 misses with a blaster or 5 or 6 confident hits with .22 Velocitors?
In any case, a .22 rf is better than "Please Mister Don't Hurt Me!" :eek:
Remember, that once the training is done and competence with a .22 is at hand, he, she or it can transition to a more powerful round with confidence and a basis of good and pleasant experience. :)

Roger

ArchAngelCD
April 15, 2013, 10:40 PM
The gist, (esp. for a frist gun)
DO NOT GET A SMALL CCW TYPE GUN (not as a first gun)
get a standard/service size 9mm
Large, means much easier to control, better sight radius, and LESS recoil

When you get small to CCW
Light = more recoil
power(ful) = more recoil
little/small = difficult to manipulate, difficlut to grip
lighter slide for caliber = heavier springs

For a "little CCW semi auto"
I think MOUSE GUN (which is a specialist gun to begin with ie. not a 'do everything')
I suggest a Kel Tec P32 if you MUST have little and light, the .32 is adequate at 'social' distances in FMJ, the modified browning lock, means the springs are MUCH softer than a blowback, it holds more and is MUCH more controllable than similar .380's (which can be little pocket monsters)

Now, my suggestion, take all that money you are thinking about spending on a gun and
SEND HER TO A WOMANS ONLY SHOOTING CLASS
Not saying you can't teach her, but women tend to listen to strangers better than men in their life, stupid I know, but...
Very well said... Small guns are not good for small hands and small sized shooters.

There are plenty of good pistols out there with changeable back-straps so they can fix most hands properly. The entire M&P line all have interchangeable back-straps for proper fit. The smallest pistols are not always the best. One good choice is the S&W M&P Shield which is a single stack pistol so the grip is thinner than most.

If a revolver is more her style there are plenty of different size and shaped grips that can make that revolver fit her well.

BigBore44
April 16, 2013, 06:54 AM
Guys, I'm really liking what I'm seeing with regards to the Shield, and LCR. We still haven't had a chance to go play at the gun shops yet. We have basically opposite schedules. But when we get the chance I definitely want her to hold, cycle, dry fire, both of those. I don't believe recoil will be such an issue with a pistol that fits her hands. But I also have a 22 and a smith 38 for us to practice with for the basics. But she can't keep them. They were my grandfathers. Sorry.

"Recoil vs Fit" for example, my 7.5 SBH in 44 mag was a real knuckle buster with the factory grips. It truely wasn't even that much fun to shoot. About 1 cylinder worth and i was done. It just didn't fit in my hands right (large hands long fingers). So I made some custom grips that were about twice the size of the originals and cut in some finger grooves. Now it's an absolute joy. And the felt recoil was reduced by I would say almost half.

Roadking Rider
April 16, 2013, 08:13 AM
You really should try the Kahr PM/CM 9 mm pistols. There ergo's and low bore axis make for a very controllable small 9mm SD pistol. I've been CC a PM9 for over 2 years and it has proven itself to be a very reliable pistol. I'd say it has approx. 2000 rounds through it +/-without a hiccup. Kahr did a real nice job when they designed that pistol.

ArchAngelCD
April 16, 2013, 08:41 AM
Guys, I'm really liking what I'm seeing with regards to the Shield, and LCR. We still haven't had a chance to go play at the gun shops yet. We have basically opposite schedules. But when we get the chance I definitely want her to hold, cycle, dry fire, both of those. I don't believe recoil will be such an issue with a pistol that fits her hands. But I also have a 22 and a smith 38 for us to practice with for the basics. But she can't keep them. They were my grandfathers. Sorry.
Before she buys be sure she fires both because the LCP feels good in the hand but generates a lot of felt recoil while the Shield is only slightly larger but seems to handle the recoil much better, even in 40 S&W.

The Bushmaster
April 16, 2013, 10:14 AM
Bersa Thunder in .380 ACP

BigBore44
April 16, 2013, 11:51 PM
Bushmaster,
What's the trigger pull like on a Bersa? I looked at those online and it got good reviews. But mixed emotions about the trigger.

BigBore44
April 16, 2013, 11:53 PM
Roadking,
I don't know much about Kahr. Don't even know where to find one. My LGS doesn't carry them. And I didn't see one at Academy. But their pistol selection sucks right now. If I'm not fishing in the morning, I'm going to go solo pistol shopping.

Guys I just want to say again, thank you all.

Shadow 7D
April 17, 2013, 02:53 AM
There are so many pistols out there, that when it comes time for her to get her 'own' pistol
(assuming she does't steal, er. 'appropriate' one of yours)
You can have fun, just remember, every pistol she discards, you get...
and you can never go wrong with a .22 (assuming you have ammo)
But for carry, is she is set on a mousegun, really look at a P32, it's a locked browning action, and very good compared to other pistols that small (wait, in .32 they they don't come that light and small)

E the B
April 17, 2013, 03:12 AM
Sig P239

Sent from my phone

The Bushmaster
April 17, 2013, 09:48 AM
Big Bore44...My wife had the chance to shoot one a year ago. It was a friends wife's CCW. My wife liked it for compactness, ease of loading, ease of racking, trigger pull [both double and single action]. The Bersa Thunder fits her hand well and easy for her to hide on her person. With the new bullets being manufactured for it and the fact that it seems to have no problem digesting whatever I feed it (I reload), it has become a viable CCW weapon. Most of all...Recoil is pleasent for most women.

BigBore44
April 17, 2013, 03:54 PM
Shadow,
I love that girl to death. But she tries to "steal er, appropriate" a pistol from me and we won't be friends anymore. Lol. Fortunately I don't have to worry about that. She knows all she has to do is ask.

So shadow,
Would your preference be Bersa 380, P32, S&W Shield, Walther PPK, or Walther PK380?
(It's just a question. Still not ruling out revolvers. Hell she may want 1911 or a Judge. She's a woman. I try not to predict their choices)

Shadow 7D
April 17, 2013, 04:14 PM
first, as lastly SHE has to be good and comfortable with it (sorry, but I'm one of the biggest cheerleaders of 'let her choose' on her, would hate to be called a hypocrite)

For me, it was a P32, adequate round (and in all things here, there's a trade off)
only thing smaller I've found is some of the OLD .25's, and they weigh about half again unloaded. FOR a pocket gun, it's smaller than my wallet, lighter than my wallet, and hold 8 rounds.

Compare it to the next up, the P3AT, Ruger's knockoff the LCP, and that side.
VERY snappy, all the P32's compromise faults magnified for a larger round...

Sights suck on a P32, HOWEVER, I can put the mag quickly in a pie tin at 15 yards, so they work.

As for the others, Walthers, price and feel put me off of them, for a pocket gun, no, others got passed over due to size, weight when compared to the P32.
After I got the P32, I was happy, and that was that (and remember they can have teething problems, but its a sub 300 gun, well made, not 'Finely' made)

When it comes to guns, much is dictated by how you carry, I'm not high risk, I'm happy to have a gun, and accept that, drawing from a pants pocket is SLOW... and by pocket carry, I limit the practical size.
OK, OWB (sorry but, most people don't noice open carry, so Ive gone to the idea, of why bother UNLES it's to comply with state law) easier for any size to be carried, deep cover, you have ALL sorts of carry systems, Hell you can get a neck lanyard for a P32 or even a NAA mini-mag revolver.

Point is, there's just about someway to carry anything you like
limiting factors are YOU, what you want to carry, how you want to carry it, what you want to carry it in. You can go with a $30 leather superfly poctet holster, a $3 uncle Mike's, or me, a $9 blackhawk pocket holster. She can get a Bang Bra (think that's it, tucks the gun up in/under her breasts) a belly band or a drop leg, it's what she is comfortable and WILLING to carry.

SO, it's not just the gun, its an entire system, ask any of the old timers, they have guns and boxes of holsters that have rotated into use and OUT as they found what they like and works for them. The gun is one piece, for her, she has to decide, just remember, in LITTLE, .380 isn't tame, but at the same time, she may feel more comfortable with a 1911 on her hip.... Or a Baby
Bronwing in her cleavage.

EDIT: Sorry, JUDGE BASHING COMMENCE----> Not a SD gun, sorry, but, it's a 'toy' not a serious working firearm, there are MUCH better guns that do what it does, your job is to keep her from junk, it's fine for snakes and such, and offers versility, however, for CCW, there are better, just as you wouldn't put an Airweight .357 snubby loaded with fullhouse loads in a first time shooters hands, neither should you let her buy crap.

dadof11
April 18, 2013, 10:37 AM
Wow,

Lots of great replies. Since it hasn't been mentioned I will put in a plug for Springfield EMP in 9mm. It has a very small grip, which fits my wife's small hands perfectly, and she seems to have no problem racking the slide. It is really a pleasure to shoot, and from the first round she shot, my wife has loved it. It is also my favorite handgun to shoot, out of the 13 we own, and it is very accurate. It is, however, pretty expensive.

Orion8472
April 19, 2013, 10:11 AM
I have a 9mm XDs on order and really hope they ARE released [with a good number] and can get one shortly after. I have no idea [at this point, . . . no one does] if that gun will be good for small hands, but if they can handle the grip on the .45acp, it will be the same for the 9mm, . . . . and the 9mm SHOULD have less recoil, as far as I know.

hardluk1
April 19, 2013, 12:48 PM
bigbore44 Go with a bersa 380. thunder, thunder plus , CC or combat.. Great pistols at a reduce cost compaired to the walther design. Good DA sa trigger with decocker. The CC and combat are 16oz pistols , the thunder plus is a double stack in the 20oz range . Cost a little more but with a 15+1 round capacity. We have 2 of them and both my wife and youngest daughter cc them.

I love the kahr line but the smaller kahrs for many little guys and some ladys the slide can be hard to rack and recoil can be a cause of cycleing issues with out solid handgun control. Not a best buy for less experienced shooters.

To me when the weight of a pistol gets into the weight range of 20oz+ most any 9mm or 45 can be much easier to shoot.
Mouse gun comparison chart- http://www.southernoutdoorlife.com/mouseguns/

BigBore44
April 22, 2013, 04:44 AM
Ok so my current list of prospects is the Bersa line, S&W Shield, XDs (not sure if it will work), and maybe a few different revolvers. Sorry but the EMP is to expensive.

Shadow,
You can ease up on the Judge bashing. I was only using it as an example my friend. I really need to find a Bersa to see what they are like. I know I can eliminate a few different guns just from handling them myself. As far as the "system", I doubt it will ever be on her person. She always wears tight fitting clothes. And wouldn't feel comfortable OC. It's probably going to be a purse gun mostly.

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