EOTech widely used by SWAT units


PDA






nathan
April 20, 2013, 05:19 PM
I noticed most of the SWAT teams in the recent Boston week of terror , most of the SWAT teams were using EOTech sighting systems in their M4s. Are they much better and robust than the Aimpoints?
Other than that it was a showcase on what tactical gears US SWAT teams were using as the world watched on live TV. Pretty cool.

If you enjoyed reading about "EOTech widely used by SWAT units" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
N003k
April 20, 2013, 06:39 PM
Eh, I only have two optics for any of my guns. (And they're the only two I've ever had, so it's not because I think they're the best! hah)

One is a reproduction Soviet PU Scope mounted on a Mosin Nagant. The other is an Eotech mounted on my CT PreBan-I AR15. After zeroing in the Eotech, I was comfortable and could easily and comfortably make rapid hits on an 8" gong with it at 100 yards, and it's definitely built tough.

Not sure if it's any significantly better than an Aimpoint, but it's plenty good in its own right. And who knows, might just be as simple as better deals for PD's buying them in bulk.

taliv
April 20, 2013, 06:44 PM
they are cheaper than aimpoints. they are unquestionably less robust.

CSC_Saint
April 20, 2013, 07:17 PM
Having used both in austere places not of this country' EOTech are great to a point. The ones the military rocks has a nice kitty bitty dot in the center of the reticle for more precise aiming further out. Aim points is bigger but I've still nailed targets past 600m as well. The EOTech has a big shield that actually wraps around the sides and top of the glass portion, but it does take away from visibility while looking down the sights(peripheral). Taking off the shield not a good idea because I definitely broke the front glass on one shortly after removing the shield. But I did like the sight without it, just doesn't hold up rolling around on the ground with uncooperative insurgents. As for user ease, the EOTech adjusts with 1\3 MOA clicks whereas the Aim point uses 1\4 MOA adjustments. Not a big issue' just something to be aware of. As for one or the other, I likes em both, the torque screw on the mount that let's me hook it into my vest to ease the weight after carry it for hours on end at the low ready tips the scale in favor of the Aim point. But I would never turn down an EOTech if given one.:D

Aiko492
April 20, 2013, 08:00 PM
they are cheaper than aimpoints. they are unquestionably less robust.
the reticle is the most important aspect of an optic, cost is a secondary factor. Many special ops appear split on their use of the two which would exclude price.

musicman10_1
April 20, 2013, 08:35 PM
the dept and/or the individual LE officers probably got a good deal on their Eotechs.

RBid
April 20, 2013, 08:53 PM
EoTechs make sense, because they play to the strength of the RDS system. Red dots are not precision optics. They're great because they are fast to acquire. The EoTech reticle is even faster than most others. When you bring a rifle up from low ready, it takes zero time to find it. It's just there.

MrCleanOK
April 20, 2013, 10:25 PM
Nathan,

As someone who has used both (EOTech recreationally, and Aimpoints professionally), I can tell you that Aimpoints are tougher. The only place I consider the EOTechs better is in the reticle, and that's not really that important to me in a 1x optic.

As Taliv has said, EOTechs are less expensive, which is why I think you see a lot of law enforcement and military units using them.

As a frame of reference, I have an EOTech on XPS on one of my AR-15s. Since buying it, I have decided that I like Aimpoints better, but not so much better that I'd sell the EOTech just to spend a few hundred more on an Aimpoint.

DMK
April 20, 2013, 10:45 PM
I have both.

If the Aimpoint used the Eotech reticle, it would be pretty much perfect.

CSC_Saint
April 20, 2013, 11:00 PM
^^^^^^^^^
What he said, Aimpoint with EOTech reticle=perfection(at least close to it) in a reflex sight.

X-Rap
April 21, 2013, 09:56 AM
I think it has much more to do with the mission they are tasked with. The EOTech is very fast and precision accurate to at least 100yds.
For the task of entry and the quick shots it requires and the extended range it is pretty much in a class by itself.
I am no operator but have shot enough to believe that an EOTech from 0 to 100 yds is as fast a system as I have used.
There is little question that there are more robust sights with better battery life but for the CQB/entry and short distances that the police work in it is a good unit.

ol' scratch
April 21, 2013, 12:03 PM
Double Post

ol' scratch
April 21, 2013, 12:05 PM
I own an Eotech because it was faster for me with my eyes. It also worked better for my eys. I like the 1 MOA dot because I use a maginfier and it is still 1 MOA. Great optic and a great price.

Double Naught Spy
April 21, 2013, 12:08 PM
they are cheaper than aimpoints. they are unquestionably less robust.

And a lot of SEALs use EOTechs as well. I don't think cost is a factor there.

I always found the EOTechs big and bulky and the reticle early on was really weird, IMO. Clint Smith talked about rifles with TV sets on top of them in his carbine course. I still don't like them, but they seem to work very well for those who use them.

X-Rap
April 21, 2013, 12:22 PM
And a lot of SEALs use EOTechs as well. I don't think cost is a factor there.


I wish a real SEAL would speak up but I will speculate that many of them have multiple sight options that are mission specific or guns for that matter. It looks like the SEAL footage I have seen with EOTechs usually involves some sort of entry or CQB.

HKGuns
April 21, 2013, 01:48 PM
It looks like the SEAL footage I have seen with EOTechs usually involves some sort of entry or CQB.

Ummm, news flash. That is exactly what they are designed to be used for.......They are most certainly not precision medium to long range optics.

X-Rap
April 21, 2013, 02:00 PM
Ummm, news flash. That is exactly what they are designed to be used for.......They are most certainly not precision medium to long range optics.

Really Sherlock
Read post 11, I understand what they are good for but hearing it from a BTDT gives it a little more credibility.

hso
April 21, 2013, 05:15 PM
#6 is the most likely answer when you see an entire department using them.

Captains1911
April 21, 2013, 08:19 PM
I have both.

If the Aimpoint used the Eotech reticle, it would be pretty much perfect.
I could not agree more.

taliv
April 21, 2013, 08:42 PM
i'm not in any way disparaging the SEALs, but they are just people too, each with their own opinions and they range from very little experience to a great deal of experience. asking one SEAL what they think is like asking the magic 8 ball and it shouldn't be taken as a representation of what the organization thinks.

X-Rap
April 22, 2013, 10:14 AM
:rolleyes:There are people who by virtue of their occupation do know a little more than the public in general and while they are just people too in today's world there are probably a few SEALS who have little experience but they are exposed to a great deal of it as well as doctrine that has been developed over years or real combat. We all can have our opinions but it is always useful to hear how our speculation works out in the real world.
If I want to buy an airplane I want the advise and opinion of a pilot who has flown the plane, preferably through some dark skies.

jdh
April 22, 2013, 10:35 AM
Our armorer bought the EOTech 512 because it used common AA batteries which he kept in stock.

Double Naught Spy
April 22, 2013, 10:54 AM
i'm not in any way disparaging the SEALs, but they are just people too, each with their own opinions and they range from very little experience to a great deal of experience. asking one SEAL what they think is like asking the magic 8 ball and it shouldn't be taken as a representation of what the organization thinks.

Right, they are people too with a wide range of experience, but they also are funded with a lot of gear and have their choices of what to use. If the product was not sufficiently durable for their needs, I doubt you would see any of them with the product.

There are SEALs that don't use them as well. That is why I noted that a lot of them use EOTechs, not that "the SEALs" use EOTechs.

I wish a real SEAL would speak up but I will speculate that many of them have multiple sight options that are mission specific or guns for that matter. It looks like the SEAL footage I have seen with EOTechs usually involves some sort of entry or CQB.

Really Sherlock
Read post 11, I understand what they are good for but hearing it from a BTDT gives it a little more credibility.

Well, I am not Sherlock, but there are a plethora of SEAL-authored books out now and EOTechs are described as being used in several of them...as is the fact that SEALs have a tremendous amount of gear and they do pick and choice rifles, calibers, setups, etc. based on mission specific needs (as per those same books). However, the nice thing about the EOTechs is a nice 1 MOA dot that does make for nicely precise aiming at distances well beyond CQB.

And then there is this...
http://kitup.military.com/2011/01/eotechs-new-combat-sight-for-seals.html

taliv
April 22, 2013, 12:11 PM
i'm just saying they're not a monolithic group. i know several of them and some of them like eotechs and some of them hate them.

taliv
April 24, 2013, 02:10 PM
though not a SEAL, here's a good example: http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?p=1622347#post1622347

cbpagent72
April 30, 2013, 02:08 AM
I work in law enforcement and the short answer is that they are more prevalent because of the significantly lower price in comparison to the Comp M4. Many of the guys that I work with would love to trade in that unreliable eotech for an aimpoint.


Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 2

justice06rr
April 30, 2013, 11:39 PM
^ Right on.

Most LE units/departments don't have the funding for Aimpoints or Trijicon's like the Military. I personally like Eotech's as a civilian, but its not the cream of the crop by any means. They do work well in my experience, but If I had a tree made of money I'd be using Aimpoints and Trij

allaroundhunter
May 1, 2013, 04:38 AM
I recently shot with a Recon Marine who participated in the invasion of Iraq. While he is not a Navy SEAL, he has used Eotechs in combat over the course of the last decade and has formed his own opinions of them. His opinion? He would take one into combat over an Aimpoint. However, on his home defense AR he uses an Aimpoint (T1) because he is oftentimes out of the country and prefers being able to leave the optic on for long periods of time without worrying about the battery dying. Each member of his family has an AR in their gun safe, and each one has an Aimpoint mounted and powered on.

As to getting the opinion of a SEAL on here? Well, you might, but I have found that most in the special warfare community prefer to not do the whole 'Internet commando' thing. They are more than willing to talk to people about their gear and stuff, they just prefer to do it in person.

X-Rap
May 1, 2013, 11:29 AM
Is the cost difference between EOTech and Aimpoint that significant? Looks like the difference in the NV models could go either way depending upon the vendor.
I'm no expert but some of the BTDT's I have spoken with have broken it down like this, an EOTech is a fast sight for close up shooting, the ACOG is a good sight for primarily open country (like that in Afghanistan) the aimpoint is the best compromise between the two. All three have complaints and weaknesses as do most tools that are required to fill more than one roll.

allaroundhunter
May 1, 2013, 03:33 PM
The Aimpoint is not a compromise between an Eotech and an ACOG. If anything the Eotech is the compromise between the other two. It has a smaller center dot that lends itself to more precise shooting while also having a reticle that makes target acquisition quick.

LiquidTension
May 1, 2013, 04:12 PM
taliv nailed it in his first response. Lots of departments up until recently went with the EOTechs because they made the bean counters happy. Now that Aimpoint has released the PRO that price difference has shrunk basically to zero and I think we'll see a lot more departments going that route for new purchases or when their EOTechs break.

The Aimpoint has superior battery life, controls, and durability. It is also always on so there's no fidgeting with buttons when you need to use it. I like the reticle on the EOTech, but I haven't really found a use for the 65MOA circle for my applications.

herrwalther
May 1, 2013, 06:20 PM
I have used Eotech (552 I believe was the model) and Aimpoint CompM2 and M4s. I vastly prefer the Aimpoint since they are much sturdier since I have broken Eotechs, have never broken an Aimpoint.

Captains1911
May 2, 2013, 11:13 AM
I recently shot with a Recon Marine who participated in the invasion of Iraq. While he is not a Navy SEAL, he has used Eotechs in combat over the course of the last decade and has formed his own opinions of them. His opinion? He would take one into combat over an Aimpoint. However, on his home defense AR he uses an Aimpoint (T1) because he is oftentimes out of the country and prefers being able to leave the optic on for long periods of time without worrying about the battery dying. Each member of his family has an AR in their gun safe, and each one has an Aimpoint mounted and powered on.

As to getting the opinion of a SEAL on here? Well, you might, but I have found that most in the special warfare community prefer to not do the whole 'Internet commando' thing. They are more than willing to talk to people about their gear and stuff, they just prefer to do it in person.
This really makes no logical sense. He admits that he prefers the more expensive Aimpoint for his personal rifles and provides reasoning for it, yet prefers to take the EOTech into combat?

allaroundhunter
May 2, 2013, 11:18 AM
This really makes no logical sense. He admits that he prefers the more expensive Aimpoint for his personal rifles and provides reasoning for it, yet prefers to take the EOTech into combat?

It actually does. When he is overseas he is able to change batteries before going out on a mission. When he is home there is no telling when he will need his rifle so he uses the optic with the longest battery life. He feels like his peripheral vision is less affected by the open style of the Eotech as opposed to the tube style of the Aimpoint.

herrwalther
May 3, 2013, 12:42 AM
The battery life is something the Aimpoints do have going for them. Especially on the CompM4s. The CompM2 used the smaller (DL1/3N?) batteries that needed to be replaced every time you turned around. The CompM4 runs on the ubiquitous AA battery. I put a package fresh lithium AA in my Aimpoint and it stayed on until I turned it off 8 months later.

If you enjoyed reading about "EOTech widely used by SWAT units" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!