Run on ammunition:


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ROW
April 27, 2013, 01:43 PM
Run on ammunition:

When will this school shooting thing blow over. There has been several shootings over the years and not one of them has had this type of effect on gun and ammunition sales.

So why this one and not the others.

I went to Academy to look for some 223 for my Winchester model 70. And of course none to be found. She said call at about 7:00 AM and we can tell you if a truck came in that morning. She also said at least 40 to 45 people line up for every truck that comes in, so get their early.

To my astonishment this run is still going on. I can see a guy building up a supply of a few 100 or so, but there canít be that many people with 223ís. I canít shoot my Winchester for fear I can not replace the ones I shoot.

And why is this run only on cretin size of ammunition and not others. It seems to be on only 223, 308, 9 mm and 22ís the others appear to be unaffected.
If this continues for the rest of the year I may sell my 223 and get a 22-250, at least you can get ammunition for it.

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Certaindeaf
April 27, 2013, 01:47 PM
You should really just get a .375 H&H.

ID-shooting
April 27, 2013, 01:49 PM
"There can"t be that many people with .223's"

Really? Did you notice the huge back log and empty selves where AR rifles were supposed to be the last few months? .223 will be tight for a while. I keep 1000 on hand but have been shooting other calibers.

gbeecher
April 27, 2013, 01:55 PM
There's always online sales. Check out www.ammunitionstore.com. The most popular calibers are in short supply, it's been that way for ahwhile now. I buy all my ammo online, always have. I pay extra for the shipping, but it's convenient and easier to find ammo.

Certaindeaf
April 27, 2013, 01:57 PM
.221 Fireball is where it's at.. granted all the tens of thousands of military magazine caches aren't full of them nor are all closets stuffed with them but if you have the proper components, you might be able to make it go bang.

arizona98tj
April 27, 2013, 02:09 PM
When will this school shooting thing blow over. There has been several shootings over the years and not one of them has had this type of effect on gun and ammunition sales.

So why this one and not the others.

You do realize that the Sandy Hook shooting was mostly all children....so the emotional aspect was pushed sky high....Obama is in his 2nd term with no concern about being elected again.....two Supreme Court decisions regarding 2nd Amendment rights did nothing to help the anti-gun supporters. Time to ramp it up and put it to the honest gun own citizens of this country. Does that help explain why this one may have been more of a "perfect storm" than previous shootings?

Kiln
April 27, 2013, 02:44 PM
You do realize that the Sandy Hook shooting was mostly all children....so the emotional aspect was pushed sky high....Obama is in his 2nd term with no concern about being elected again.....two Supreme Court decisions regarding 2nd Amendment rights did nothing to help the anti-gun supporters. Time to ramp it up and put it to the honest gun own citizens of this country. Does that help explain why this one may have been more of a "perfect storm" than previous shootings?
Yup, that's why.

Oddly when there were other shootings, Obama kept his mouth shut about his anti gun views.

Now that he has been reelected and can't run again he's shown his true colors, proving that all that "sky is falling" stuff the NRA has been spouting was absolutely true.

After he went public with his ideas for a firearm registry, assault weapons ban, and background checks between all sales, people started buying up guns and ammo like crazy for fear that some of that stuff might pass and prevent them from buying it in the future.

It has had a positive effect though. All of the legislation has failed so far at a federal level, the NRA's donations and memberships are through the roof, and there are more gun owners than ever.

cwo2lt
April 28, 2013, 12:29 AM
I can understand a run on .223, 9mm, and 40. I don't understand the run on .30-30.

JVaughn
April 28, 2013, 12:52 AM
I can understand a run on .223, 9mm, and 40. I don't understand the run on .30-30.


Copy that good buddy, I miss shooting my lever action. I'm unaware of any semi-auto 30-30 out there. What gives?

cwo2lt
April 28, 2013, 01:14 AM
Copy that good buddy, I miss shooting my lever action. I'm unaware of any semi-auto 30-30 out there. What gives?
My Mother finally decided she would never hunt again so I got her Win 94! Had to get a new buttstock as it was cut way down for her. 1st .30-30 I've owned so I had nothing and my Dad still has his so he wouldn't give up anything. Took 3 months but finally found some Federals at Sportsmans Warehouse last week. $20.99/20. Thieves.

mnrivrat
April 28, 2013, 01:40 AM
I can understand a run on .223, 9mm, and 40. I don't understand the run on .30-30.

The same mentality of stocking up extra spills out to all calibers .

Also while the cartridge companies are trying to meet demands for 223 they are not making 30-30 .

First time gun buyers are also in the mix and would like some ammo. They are buying more than just 223 caliber guns.

4tsmith
April 28, 2013, 03:21 AM
All this didn't happen in a vacuum.
I tried pointing out to a few people after VA.TECH and the Giffords shooting,that the cable networks like SUNDANCE,IFC and a few others were running worn out anti gun documentaries almost non stop and most people gently suggested that there might be therapy for rampant paranoia or perhaps a better design for my tinfoil hat.

Pointing out that DOT-GOV listed a mountain of anti-gun bills by the likes of Schumer,Durbin,Leahy,Lautenberg and Diane Frightstein that simply couldn't make it to the floor of the Senate BEFORE the election:only yielded replies that perhaps an antenna on the tin-foil hat would yield better signals.

On top the list of scarce calibers are perhaps the three most popular rounds for non loading shooters,not to mention that most 22lr is seasonally/batch loaded and probably doesn't account for extremely unusual demand or surge in bulk buying.

Finally there has NEVER been such a concentrated,all out assault on gun rights fraught with complete propaganda,misinformation,faulty statistics,flawed data,misleading polls and blatant lies supported by a corrupt administration and a 90%+ biased media.

At least one political party decided to perch like" Blood Thirsty Vampires,Ghouls,and Vultures",over the barely cold bodies of twenty dead children in an attempt to implement corrupt agendas that had been simmering in their feeble pro socialist neo communist minds for over three decades.Is it any surprise that a few people are a little panicked?

The smart money was buying when supplies were cheap and plentiful to avoid the rush.But I guess now,keeping a fat predictable supply for a rainy day is called hoarding.

M2 Carbine
April 28, 2013, 08:58 AM
There has been several shootings over the years and not one of them has had this type of effect on gun and ammunition sales.
I hang around at the small local gun store a bit. The manager says he hasn't been able to get ANY ammo in months.

I've seen quite a few people come there looking for their first gun. Mostly these are people that never owned a gun before but "because of the way things are" they feel they now need a gun.

One thing they ALL have in common is they dislike and distrust obama and his gang and they think crime will get worse.

Friday a older couple came in the store looking for a gun for the lady. Their story was the same, they hated and feared obama and they were afraid of being a crime victim.
They bought a SIG P238 but the store had no .380 ammo and we couldn't tell them where they could get any.
I told them, "Wait five minutes and I'll go home and get you a box of .380".
When I gave them the ammo they thanked me.:)

Almost everyone that owns or is buying guns are buying ammo whenever they see it. That's a LOT of ammo buyers.

Queen_of_Thunder
April 28, 2013, 09:25 AM
We are entering the fifth month of this crises. There are no signs of it slowing down. Thing is it may be years before things settle own becuase people will be buying huge amounts of ammo in case lots. Future threads asking how much one has for backup may look like this.

45ACP ...10,000
9mm...15,000
223/556....20,000
SPP...50,000
LPP...50,000
POWDER...100LB
Bullets...20,000 per caliber.


If it does happen there will be increased demand for storage space. Possibly a 3 car garage standard for new homes. It might not get that bad but who knows. I never thought it would get this bad or last this long and I usually expect the worse to occur. Add in the off year elections, the 2016 elections and the "anti's" do or die push it may not clear up till 2017/2018 timeframe.

JRH6856
April 28, 2013, 09:30 AM
Think about this for awhile:

The administration is using the DHS to issue indefinite delivery/indefinite quantity contracts for large amounts of ammo requiring ammo manufacturers to keep large stocks in reserve to meet the potential demands they must meet if and when the demand is made. The creates a shortage in the civilian market resulting in panic buying and hoarding.

As gun owners become increasingly frustrated with the lack or ammo and reloading components, they begin to sell their guns which they can't get ammo for. This drives down the price of the guns and encourages more owners to try to sell their (useless without ammo) guns while they still have some value. The lower prices do not increase demand because of the unavailability of ammo, and as shooters move to other calibers, the ammo shortage spreads to those calibers as well because manufacturers are still responding to the DHS contracts which are issued as needed to keep the shortage in place.

When the price on guns drops low enough, initiate "buy-back" programs that pay at or just above the depressed market value which encourages owners to turn in these "useless" guns.

Destroy the guns.

Repeat as necessary until the number of gun owners is reduced to a non-impactful number, depriving the NRA of its base, and driving many gun manufacturers out of business due to lack of demand. (Govt then subsidizes those that supply only govt. needs.)

With political influence waning, along with the public's interest in guns that they can't use, mount a campaign to repeal the 2nd Amendment, then register and confiscate all firearms still in private hands.

Destroy the guns.

How long will it take?

Keep in mind that the spending this would require dovetails nicely with the administration's goals to destroy the economy for political gain by spending us into oblivion.

alsaqr
April 28, 2013, 10:11 AM
The administration is using the DHS to issue indefinite delivery/indefinite quantity contracts for large amounts of ammo requiring ammo manufacturers to keep large stocks in reserve to meet the potential demands they must meet if and when the demand is made. The creates a shortage in the civilian market resulting in panic buying and hoarding.

Not so.

Ammunition makers are not storing vast quantities of ammunition in anticipation of US governmant purchases. That is not how IDIQ works.

The US government notifies the ammunition maker that x number of rounds of y caliber are required. The ammunition maker ramps up and manufactures x number of rounds of y caliber.

scaatylobo
April 28, 2013, 10:14 AM
My only answer to the problems we are facing as honest decent Americans is ---- look who is in the white house.

Maybe,next round of elections will 'loosen' the ammo,maybe !.

bigdaa
April 28, 2013, 10:18 AM
You should really just get a .375 H&H.
Oh you don't know how bad I want one!

Potatohead
April 28, 2013, 10:21 AM
man, their is supposedly 40-60 MILLION new gun owners if you go by how many background cks over the last coupla years....thats a lot of people starting off with zero ammo...i was one of them...

j1
April 28, 2013, 10:34 AM
After reading and trying to purchase ammo in stores I am convinced that this run is fueled by fear. The moment that the shelves go bare for the first time almost every shooter including me start a buying frenzy. I want 22 long rifle and have had to curtail my shooting. My 10 22 has been put on a non hi cap magazine diet indefinitely. I miss the old days but see nothing which I can do about it. The high price and unavailability of rimfire ammo seem here to stay.

BSA1
April 28, 2013, 10:57 AM
ROW,

It appears that you are new to THR. Welcome!

It also appears that you are just beginning to pay attention to the ammunition shortage and fail to understand the reasons for it.

The American Caesar Obama has declared his intentions to disarm as many American citizens as possible. In fact Assistant Caesar Biden has publicity stated the only firearm they will consider legal for citizens to own is a double shotgun and the right to self defense is firing warning shots in the air.

Millions of gun owners understand this threat and are preparing for a long fight.l

AlexanderA
April 28, 2013, 11:29 AM
With so many people storing large amounts of ammunition and reloading components at home, we have to consider the increased fire hazards. The ammo won't start a fire by itself, but if a house fire gets started otherwise, ammo might cook off and endanger firefighters. And of course, bulk powder and primers would make the fire much worse. Eventually, these risks will drive fire insurance premiums upward. The insurance companies will either raise the premiums for everyone, or they'll selectively raise premiums even more for shooters and reloaders (questions will be asked on insurance applications, and if you don't answer truthfully, you may find your coverage voided in case of a claim). Perhaps the insurance companies will require ammunition storage in a separate building, apart from the residence.

rust collector
April 28, 2013, 11:33 AM
We have become a nation bent on instant gratification. If I can't have what I want right now, someone must pay (or at least be spoken of in unflattering terms).

If you look at the long term, this most recent brouhaha has activated millions of new gun owners, ramped up ammunition and firearm industries, and focused attention on many misrepresentations at state and local levels.

Someone will pay for this if folks are paying attention at election time. Meanwhile, an industry that was hurting is revitalized and Americans will rise to the occasion.

I am sorry that folks are experience shortages, but they will last a short while unless greed creates and maintains a blue market of middlemen who make money at the expense of folks who work for a living.

jhfleet
April 28, 2013, 11:35 AM
ROW,

It appears that you are new to THR. Welcome!

It also appears that you are just beginning to pay attention to the ammunition shortage and fail to understand the reasons for it.

The American Caesar Obama has declared his intentions to disarm as many American citizens as possible. In fact Assistant Caesar Biden has publicity stated the only firearm they will consider legal for citizens to own is a double shotgun and the right to self defense is firing warning shots in the air.

Millions of gun owners understand this threat and are preparing for a long fight.l
Over a year here and he's still new? Some of us have been reading this site for many years with no need to sign up so we could post.

Onward Allusion
April 28, 2013, 12:00 PM
I'm surprised no one has pointed to the droves of people who wait diligently in line every morning at the big box stores for their ammo deliveries. Think about this logically - people with their mornings open are usually not working stiffs with regular jobs (yeah, yeah, I know 2nd & 3rd shifts...talking generalities so don't get undies in a bundle). So, these people are usually either unemployed, under-employed, or retired, right?

What is a better way to double or triple your money from waiting in line and unloading the goods on Gunbroker or another site? Is this the only cause? No. A key contributor? Most definitely.

JRH6856
April 28, 2013, 12:05 PM
Ammunition makers are not storing vast quantities of ammunition in anticipation of US governmant purchases. That is not how IDIQ works.

Yeah, I knew I should have had more coffee before I posted that. :uhoh:

One thing I do worry about though is reloading supplies. Primers are the critical component, followed by powder. Brass is reusable and bullets can be cast. But primers and powder seem be going to factory ammo.

Independent bullet makers need reloaders buying bullets to stay in business. MBC is buying new equipment, cash up front, to keep up with current demand, but people can only buy so many bullets before the lack of primer and powder turns them into little pieces of scrap lead. Then they stop buying and the folks that ramped up their capital investment suddenly have cash flow problems.

firesky101
April 28, 2013, 12:06 PM
Copy that good buddy, I miss shooting my lever action. I'm unaware of any semi-auto 30-30 out there. What gives?
I believe remington made one. The model 8 iirc.

Never mind, just looked it up it did not come in 30-30. Sure glad I did not buy the one I saw at the last gun show labeled as such. I would have had to buy some new dies when I figured out the actual chambering.

alsaqr
April 28, 2013, 01:24 PM
One thing I do worry about though is reloading supplies. Primers are the critical component, followed by powder. Brass is reusable and bullets can be cast. But primers and powder seem be going to factory ammo.

Popular caliber bullets and primers are almost non-existent. Muzzleloader supplies are getting scarce too. i can't find musket caps for my sidelock.

Potatohead
April 28, 2013, 02:14 PM
Im seeing oodles of 40s and 45s. This things about to come unraveled

Jim Mac
April 28, 2013, 06:51 PM
went to walmart today at 815, missed out on the .223 100 round bulk packs. Guy in front grabbed the last two. BUT the cashier was telling me that .22 is showing up regularly lately. Of course its sells out the same day it comes in. But its coming in. jim

rodregier
April 28, 2013, 09:59 PM
AlexanderA:

SAAMI video on ammunition and fire fighter safety

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=687125

Stored propane and gasoline is a lot more dangerous.

58limited
April 28, 2013, 10:07 PM
Went to Academy today. They had .223 in stock. I bought a box of 7.62 X 39 for $5.99. They are still limiting purchases to one box per caliber per day, 3 calibers maximum.

Jlr2267
April 28, 2013, 10:13 PM
I canít shoot my Winchester for fear I can not replace the ones I shoot. and therein lies a big part of the problem

Bruno2
April 28, 2013, 10:52 PM
I was at the rural Walmart in Broken Arrow today. They had a few boxes of 270, one box of 25-06, Several 7mm and a few 7mm mag. They also had 300 Win Mag and 300 WSSM.They had a few 12,20 ga and some 410 slug stuff(I assume for the Judges and what have you). No pistol ammo, rimfire or popular center fire stuff though.

Jcinnb
April 28, 2013, 11:05 PM
Our Walley is full of 7mm and nothing else. What is up with that? If I shot a 7mm I would probably get a complex or something!

Oklacoyotekiller
April 28, 2013, 11:31 PM
I got a 7mag, but got enough ammo and components to last me for several years.:D love my 7mag! Makes a big boom, and a bigger hole!

Silverado6x6
April 28, 2013, 11:35 PM
I bought and restored a Winchester model 70 Sporter in 7mm mag 10 years ago, its never been fired and I never bought any ammo for it, until now. Plenty of 7mm mag in Alaska and all the other long range magnum rounds.

Blackbeard
April 28, 2013, 11:48 PM
Still bare shelves around here. I guess because Illinois still has bans looming, people are still panicked.

Cee Zee
April 29, 2013, 03:22 AM
I've seen quite a bit of .223 ammo lately. I bought a few boxes about a month ago. I just bought up enough to do some shooting.

I did what any one familiar with how things went in 2008 should have done. I bought ammo before there was any shortage. I bought it when it was cheap in fact. I haven't really "needed" to buy ammo since then although I could have easily shot up all that I have. That's the thing. You just don't know how long it will be before there is more ammo around so that you don't feel like what you have has to last a lifetime.

I didn't buy up a bunch after the panic. I won't be blamed for that. I knew to buy ahead of time. I can't believe other long time gun owners didn't know that too. Heck I bought up ammo before the 2008 election. I'm still stocked up on certain calibers from back then.

Don't get caught with your pants down guys. Pay attention to what's going on and compare that with what has happened in the past. That way you'll know when to buy before there's nothing to buy.

Again I've seen a good bit of .223 lately. What irks me is not being able to get .22. I shoot it every day when I have it to shoot. I have a good supply put back but it wouldn't last that long if I started shooting like I normally shoot. I sometimes shot 3 bricks a week back in about 2010 and 2011. Yeah it gets expensive especially when it's Wolf that you're shooting. I wanted to get to a higher level of accuracy and I did. But I'm probably not there now. Practice makes perfect and there's nothing to use to practice with unless I shoot up my stash and I figure I need to save that just in case.

But I really think things are slowly getting better.

TNboy
April 29, 2013, 05:40 AM
All my Walmart had the other day was 3 boxes of 7mm Mag. We can't get much of anything around here.

TheSaint
April 29, 2013, 05:43 AM
Ammo shortages really depend upon where you live. I've seen everything from continued bone dry shelves to nearly completely stocked except for 22LR. Once again, some LGS/big box stores are better able to keep ammo in stock versus others. You have to do your research, and also sign up for in-stock notification emails for online shopping if you're willing to go that route.

Batty67
April 29, 2013, 09:10 AM
I do believe it is slowly getting better, and that there will be no magical sharp threshold when ammo become plentiful; that is, it will continue to slowly get better, with some areas of the country coming back sooner than others.

ny32182
April 29, 2013, 09:38 AM
I wonder how many remember 2008.

This has happened before and it will happen again; the same MO will be followed.

In 2008 it was about 8 months before everything really returned to "normal". Based on that, I would expect normal availability of most stuff in free states to return sometime around the fall timeframe. AR stuff is already pretty much back. Ammo and components was the last to return in 2009 and I don't see any reason to expect something different this time.

What we have is a market bubble driven by emotion and unrealistic expectations. What happens to all bubbles? They pop.

End of 2009 to 2012 saw the cheapest AR prices I ever recall seeing. Everyone bought them for up to $3000 in the election rush, then inevitably the demand fell off, and the market and prices bottomed. That isn't good for the industry either. As someone mentioned, sure they are loving it now with the rush, but they can't increase capital investment in greater production capacity, because they will be left holding the bag when the demand inevitably pops. They have to maintain production at a relatively low level to at least try to avoid "feast or famine" roller coaster.

Bottom line, we are our own worst enemy.

Onward Allusion
April 29, 2013, 03:33 PM
Got a notification from MidwayUSA. 40 grain Agulia Interceptors were in!!! I got to the site, threw a brick into the cart, prep'd for check-out...

All GONE!!! As I was trying to check out!!! OMG! This is insane! 4 minutes.....

TheSaint
April 29, 2013, 03:57 PM
@Onward:

I've had the same thing happen.

My advice:

- Make sure you have your credit card info/contact info saved on file with them that way when the email alert comes in, you can check out super quickly
- If you have a smartphone, MidwayUSA has a mobile-friendly website, use your phone to check out right away when the alert notification comes in if you're not near your computer
- Keep a tab open to MidwayUSA on your computer so you can just refresh if you get the alert

Doing all of the above has scored me three ammo orders through them, even in this time of shortage. Good luck!

Potatohead
April 29, 2013, 04:29 PM
Oh man, dont get me started. I had a lady on the phone ringing up my order" yes we have some 380 sir", "ok i'd like to order some" "ok what is your ..oh no wait..it looks like we just sold out" -as we were talking

Potatohead
April 29, 2013, 04:36 PM
Man just hang it up for awhile would be my advice. Ive tried everything, leaving computer on, staying logged in, calling every 5 minutes. Theyre always sold out right after the notifications. Usually just after a minute or two, one of the salesman told me.

Potatohead
April 29, 2013, 04:51 PM
went to walmart today at 815, missed out on the .223 100 round bulk packs. Guy in front grabbed the last two. BUT the cashier was telling me that .22 is showing up regularly lately. Of course its sells out the same day it comes in. But its coming in. jim
Ive seen 22 on 6 of the past 7 mornings when i ck wally. I dont shoot it but its startin to show back up.

Bruno2
April 29, 2013, 04:55 PM
I just read this article from the Daily Caller: http://dailycaller.com/2013/04/25/ammo-maker-ammo-shortage-fueled-by-rumors-and-conjecture/ . People from Hornady and from Remington are commenting on production.

Hornady, a major U.S. ammunition manufacturer, is doing everything it can to meet the high demand for bullets that it says has been ďall fueled by rumors and conjectureĒ and has put pressure on gun stores across the country.

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2013/04/25/ammo-maker-ammo-shortage-fueled-by-rumors-and-conjecture/#ixzz2Rt7ICbsa

Hanzo581
April 29, 2013, 04:59 PM
Just went to a gun show Saturday where they had as much .223 as you wanted to buy $10/20rnd Federal. I honestly didn't expect to see any. Other tables wanted more, but it was still there in pretty good quantities.

Potatohead
April 29, 2013, 05:00 PM
Hey thats true i see 7 mm EVERY time i go to walmart to ck ammo (and thats everyday) whats up w that? I guess it could be the same boxes just sitting there LOL but for real, what kind of round is that? What do you shoot it from and all that?

Potatohead
April 29, 2013, 05:02 PM
No doubt on the 223. Ive actually bought so much in the last 10 days that im really not even needing any more

flphotoguy
April 29, 2013, 06:42 PM
Hey thats true i see 7 mm EVERY time i go to walmart to ck ammo (and thats everyday) whats up w that? I guess it could be the same boxes just sitting there LOL but for real, what kind of round is that? What do you shoot it from and all that?
My local Walmart has had ONLY 7mm plus 12 and 20 gauge shotgun ammo recently but today they had 4 boxes of .380. I was surprised and took home three (max purchase allowed) for my P3AT. The clerk said he was surprised to see that ammo because it hasn't been in stock for weeks.

Oklacoyotekiller
April 29, 2013, 07:21 PM
My 7mag is a 66 rem 700, stainless heart barrel, weaver v9.

CLP
April 29, 2013, 08:01 PM
Run on ammunition:

There has been several shootings over the years and not one of them has had this type of effect on gun and ammunition sales.

So why this one and not the others.


Because this one is being exploited...

Potatohead
April 29, 2013, 08:06 PM
thx coyote i'll ck that one out

Bruno2
April 29, 2013, 09:51 PM
Somebody needs to make an AR7MM.

Oklacoyotekiller
April 29, 2013, 10:46 PM
They make a 7mmx45. 223 necked up

bayesian
April 30, 2013, 12:41 PM
If you check 'gunbot.net', you'll see the in stock lists and price per rounds. I've been watching the prices on 9mm, and what you see is that the price per round will be ... say 92 cents for the places in stock, then you'll see a couple of places at 80 cents, then they sell out. A week later, a couple of places have it at 80 cents per round, but still in stock.

About 10 days ago, a couple of places were coming in at 72 cents, and sold out. A couple days later, 72 cents was back and holding (not selling out). Go back today, 5 or 6 places with 72 cents, so you'll probably see another drop coming, maybe to 66 cents.

It has been interesting to watch and it is clear that supply is slowly chipping away at demand.

Interestingly, also on armslist, i'm starting to see alot more listings for blocks of ammo. I suspect that the sellers see the price coming down and are hoping to unload some stock before it drops further.

bayesian
April 30, 2013, 12:44 PM
Then as I'm typing the above reply, at 52 cents per round price pops up. This will sell out but I suspect that this will be back in a week probably without selling out...

r1derbike
April 30, 2013, 01:13 PM
M2Carbine, you are truly a gentleman and a scholar, not to mention a helluva nice guy. Kudos!

I'm still waiting on some .38 special target ammo for my wife, ordered online. supposedly in stock. Called around, the closest a GS has some is about 39 miles away.

Has been 4 days with no word yet, but I bet they are swamped and behind getting stuff out the door.

Shooting much less here, LGS where I shoot has no guns or ammo. Their cases and cabinets are bare.

Wondering how close these guns stores are to declaring bankruptcy, because they can't get product.

hso
April 30, 2013, 01:55 PM
There was a pallet load of 9mm Blazer Brass 350ct at Gander this weekend, but still no .22lr.

Trunk Monkey
April 30, 2013, 01:56 PM
I saw A box of CCI .22 in a pawn shop yesterday, 50 rounds 25.00$

sixgunner455
April 30, 2013, 02:37 PM
The 7mm in my Wally World is 7mm Remington Magnum. It is a big cased, high pressure and high velocity hunting rifle round, capable of taking anything in North America handily, and probably capable of taking anything in the world under the right conditions. Capabilities are on par with/slightly better than the .30-06.

I am tempted to buy one, just because of the availability of rounds. At my local WM, 7mm Rem Mag, .270 Win, .300 Win Mag are almost always on the shelf. .243 is there some days/weeks, as well as some other hunting calibers, but most of the time, that's it, except for right after the truck gets unloaded.

I haven't bought one because I reload. I have components enough to get me through the year for all the calibers I shoot, if I am prudent about how I consume it. I can have my kids out shooting their hunting rifles, practicing with .22lr, and shoot some centerfire pistol, probably every month, through this fall's hunting season, without buying anything else all year.

But I'd jump on a couple pounds of the right powder with both feet.

Potatohead
April 30, 2013, 03:13 PM
i too have seen the 270 and 300 almost everytime in wally , 6 gunner. evidently, most of you hunters reload and dont need to buy any because it sure is always there... My wife has taken me out of the ammo market for awhile!! probably a good thing

justice06rr
April 30, 2013, 11:30 PM
I wonder how many remember 2008.

This has happened before and it will happen again; the same MO will be followed.

In 2008 it was about 8 months before everything really returned to "normal". Based on that, I would expect normal availability of most stuff in free states to return sometime around the fall timeframe. AR stuff is already pretty much back. Ammo and components was the last to return in 2009 and I don't see any reason to expect something different this time.

What we have is a market bubble driven by emotion and unrealistic expectations. What happens to all bubbles? They pop.

End of 2009 to 2012 saw the cheapest AR prices I ever recall seeing. Everyone bought them for up to $3000 in the election rush, then inevitably the demand fell off, and the market and prices bottomed. That isn't good for the industry either. As someone mentioned, sure they are loving it now with the rush, but they can't increase capital investment in greater production capacity, because they will be left holding the bag when the demand inevitably pops. They have to maintain production at a relatively low level to at least try to avoid "feast or famine" roller coaster.

Bottom line, we are our own worst enemy.

I would say that not many may remember 2008. Add to that all the new shooters and gun owners within the last year or 2 that have no clue about the last shortage.

In my area ammo is slowly coming in but still with limits, usually 3-boxes max. Prices are still normal in big-box stores like Walmart or Dick's. the problem is getting there early enough to grab what little ammo they have. Usually Walmart will only have 10boxes of a particular caliber when I find 9mm or 7.62

sixgunner455
May 1, 2013, 01:04 AM
colonel kernel, most hunters either reload or they don't shoot very much.

The ammo is freaking expensive under normal conditions. Reloading makes it affordable to actually shoot.

nelsonal
May 1, 2013, 05:48 PM
Here's why there's a run on ammo. NRA estimates 10 billion rounds are made annually for the domestic market. (http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/04/04/The-Great-DHS-Ammunition-Stockpile-Myth://) And it's an oft cited statement that there are 300 million guns in the US (and that was before the recent boom).

Simple division means that there are 33 rounds (less than a 50 round box) produced per gun per year! If everyone who owned a gun wanted to shoot or store a single box of ammo, based on those figures, it would take almost two years!

That's why ammo is impossible to find, lots of gun owners who normally don't shoot their guns, all decided they needed a stockpile of ammo after Sandy Hook.

joeschmoe
May 1, 2013, 06:07 PM
all decided they needed a stockpile of ammo after Sandy Hook


Everyone DOES need a stockpile. Just many didn't realize it until after the run on ammo began. I hope everyone has learned to keep a large stockpile of ammo on hand from now on. You don't buy toilet paper 20 sheets at a time either. You buy packs of large rolls to last a while. When it's on sale you might even pick up 2 or 3 large packs.
I recommend you keep at least 1000 rds of your main rifle and pistol in reserve (in case of emergency only) in addition to normal stocks that get used up.
That way when these MINOR interruptions of supply/demand occur you don't need to panic.

guitarguy314
May 1, 2013, 06:56 PM
I wish it were only those calibers, i can't find 45 colt or 45-70 in my academy.

nelsonal
May 1, 2013, 07:36 PM
Based on those numbers, many people buying probably normally shoot rarely (likely less than once every two years). If 10% of the guns out there were getting a box a month that's the entire production! I'd guess that in normal times that's much more likely to be what happens 30million guns shoot most of the ammo produced, and 270 million sit in safes, closets and nightstands getting shot once every several years. Suddenly there's an reason for a portion of that 270 million coming out of the woodwork (even 60-90 million of them) and there's far too little ammo produced to meet the demand.

12many
May 1, 2013, 08:02 PM
It is important to distinuish between demand to buy and store and demand to buy and shoot it. I would offer up that much of this demand is for buy and store and not buy and shoot.

Is there more shooting going on in your parts of the world, or just more buying and storing?

Using toilet paper analogy, I know I need it, I know I will continue to use it, but I don't need a thousands of rolls filling up every room of my house. Under no situation proposed or imagined are companies going to stop making toilet paper or ammo.

joeschmoe
May 1, 2013, 08:29 PM
A couple of thousand extra rounds won't fill up every room in your house. Last year people with more than one or two thousand were considered by many to be "paranoid". Now we are maligned as "hoarders". By next year we will probably be considered "wise". Everyone crying about ammo now would be much calmer if they had 2k rounds and 5k of primers in their closet. Get some and next time you won't have to cry either.

I distinctly remember not being able to buy either toilet paper or ammo just before or after several natural and man made disasters. That is why I keep plenty of both on hand. BTW, old phone books make good back ups for one of those two needs. The other cannot be improvised.

I also keep a fire extinguisher and first aid kit. Even though I don't plan on hurting myself or setting my house on fire.

12many
May 1, 2013, 08:52 PM
I have lots of ammo and no one is crying Joe.

I still bet most of ammo being sold is not being shot, just talked about and looked at. Nothing wrong with that. I have not bought ammo since this whole thing started.

Any range reports from anyone from all this ammo being shot up?

I am thinking about selling my guns and just collecting ammo.

joeschmoe
May 1, 2013, 09:52 PM
You should also buy, and store, more batteries than your going to use right away. You should have and EXTRA supply of batteries.
My hope is that all gun owners do stock up. Every American should have a good supply of ammo, batteries, food, water, etc.
If you live hand to mouth you will feel every little ripple in the supply chain. Buying/storing in bulk gives you some security.

People are crying about ammo on here every day. I'm not one of them.

PT92
May 1, 2013, 10:23 PM
Run on ammunition:

When will this school shooting thing blow over. There has been several shootings over the years and not one of them has had this type of effect on gun and ammunition sales...

I feel your pain (we all do). Yet IMO you severely underestimate the real cause of the panic (not justifying just explaining as I see it). Absolutely, the shooting(s) of late with Sandy being the most notable due to the innocence of youth involved can be partly attributed to the "run." But I think it goes even further than that in that Americans no longer trust their Government and foresee a very bleak future, economically, socially (chaos) and politically with an ever increasing inability to distinguish "Police" from "Military" (again IMO Boston exemplified this as I could not distinguish police from military even spec ops). Moreover, DHS is beginning to look like 1939 all over again.

We could write pages on end concerning this but suffice it to say that the "Leave it to Beaver" I Love Lucy" "Brady Bunch" America we used to know has "left the building" meaning we have perhaps lost our identity as Washington looks to "redefine" our Nation in ways that surely cause our beloved Founding Fathers to roll over in their graves...

orionengnr
May 2, 2013, 12:52 AM
As gun owners become increasingly frustrated with the lack or ammo and reloading components, they begin to sell their guns which they can't get ammo for. This drives down the price of the guns and encourages more owners to try to sell their (useless without ammo) guns while they still have some value. The lower prices do not increase demand because of the unavailability of ammo, and as shooters move to other calibers, the ammo shortage spreads to those calibers as well because manufacturers are still responding to the DHS contracts which are issued as needed to keep the shortage in place.

When the price on guns drops low enough, initiate "buy-back" programs that pay at or just above the depressed market value which encourages owners to turn in these "useless" guns.

Destroy the guns.

Repeat as necessary until the number of gun owners is reduced to a non-impactful number, depriving the NRA of its base, and driving many gun manufacturers out of business due to lack of demand. (Govt then subsidizes those that supply only govt. needs.)

With political influence waning, along with the public's interest in guns that they can't use, mount a campaign to repeal the 2nd Amendment, then register and confiscate all firearms still in private hands.

Destroy the guns.

How long will it take?

I think it that we may find out in the next 2-5 years...essentially in the mid-term elections (which I do not put a lot of hope into) and the 2016 elections...in which the American people may truly face a one-time, winner-take-all, use it or lose it election. The future of America, if you will.

joeschmoe
May 2, 2013, 02:25 AM
This drives down the price of the gunsWell that plan is failing miserably. Used guns are selling for more than new guns were a few years ago. 19 million new gun sales in the last year alone.

justice06rr
May 2, 2013, 10:43 PM
I still bet most of ammo being sold is not being shot, just talked about and looked at. Nothing wrong with that. I have not bought ammo since this whole thing started.

Any range reports from anyone from all this ammo being shot up?

I am thinking about selling my guns and just collecting ammo.

I would bet easily that most ammo is being stored and not shot.

I sold a couple bricks of my 22lr stash to a guy who said he actually had more than what I have stockpiled. I had about 2k+ of 22lr at the time, and the buyer said he had about 7k. I doubt he even shoots it, just wants to have a stockpile for himself.

When I buy from private sellers online, they always say they have thousands of rounds of a particular caliber. So why would you sell it if you plan to shoot it? I normally do not sell any of my ammo supply because I will eventually shoot it and run out.

Onward Allusion
May 5, 2013, 03:30 PM
So why would you sell it if you plan to shoot it?

Because they know that what goes up does come back down (for the most part). Anyone coughing up $80 for a brick of Remington 22LR is a complete and utter idiot who is fueling the pain.

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