Help on 45acp loads with particular powders


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balderclev
April 28, 2013, 08:30 PM
Tested some 45acp rounds today using Unique from 5.0 to 6.5 behind a 185 gr Hornady xtp boolit.

Had a lot of soot on the casings but the 6.0 gr was the least.

I also have 700x and SR7625 powders. Thinking about testing some loads with those powders as well. Have had good luck with 700x in 40s&w and 38spc but have never shot the 7625 as yet.

Anyone have comments that would help me with these 3 powders?

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rsrocket1
April 29, 2013, 12:19 AM
5.0g Unique under a 185g bullet would result in a pretty low pressure round. I'll bet you were getting blowback in your face too. I had that happen when I started loading with an ultra conservative charge of 4.0g Unique under a 230g RN bullet. Most pistol powders like to burn at least in the 9k psi range and the 5g load is in the 8500 range.

I personally haven't shot 700-X since the early 80's, but it seems to be getting a resurgence with the current shortages and folks are finding that its performance is good despite having to deal with the big flakes.

noylj
April 29, 2013, 01:05 AM
Well, if you are shooting a low pressure cartridge, and are shooting it a low charge weight, one can expect to get soot all over the place.
Of course, this soot is a non-issue. It is mostly graphite and, if you haven't bathed your gun in oil, well still be a dry lube.
I do not see how the 6.5gn could have more soot than the 6.0gn--they all should have been at least slightly sooty.
For any bullet weight in .45, up to 230gn, I find the two "magic" loads to be 5.0 and 6.0gn.
Here is my compilation of load data from many manuals. Start at the lowest starting load and work up.

Bullet Weight Powder Weight Velocity Note Power Factor COL
JSWC 185 700X 3.5 Target
JSWC 185 700X 4.3 731 Start 135 1.275
JSWC 185 700X 4.7 798 Max 148 1.275
Nos JHP 185 700X 5.2 909 Near Max 168 1.220
JHP 185 700X 5.3 845 Max 156
JHP 185 700X 5.3 845 Max 156 1.210
JHP 185 700X 5.3 845 156 1.210
Rem MC-HP 185 700X 5.3 845 156
Rem MC HP 185 700X 5.3 845 1.210
GD-HP 185 700X 5.8 889 Start 164 1.200
GD-HP 185 700X 6.5 997 Max 184 1.200
JSWC 185 SR7625 4.4 706 Start 131
JHP 185 SR7625 4.9 633 Start 117
JSWC 185 SR7625 5.1 705 Start 130 1.275
JSWC 185 SR7625 5.6 793 Max 147 1.275
Spr TMJ-SWC 185 SR7625 5.7 761 141 1.135
Sie JHP 185 SR7625 6.2 857 159 1.180
JSWC 185 SR7625 6.5 972 Max 180
JHP 185 SR7625 6.9 890 Max 165 1.210
JHP 185 SR7625 6.9 890 165
JHP 185 SR7625 6.9 890 165 1.210
Rem MC-HP 185 SR7625 6.9 890 165
Rem MC HP 185 SR7625 6.9 890 165 1.210
GD-HP 185 SR7625 7.0 810 Start 150 1.200
JHP 185 SR7625 7.0 960 Max 178
Fed/Sie JHP 185 SR7625 7.1 1003 V. Acc. 186
Spr GD-HP 185 SR7625 7.8 981 Max 181 1.200


PS: it's a nit, but a slightly irritating nit:
they are cases and not casings. Casings are used around windows or to make sausage.

RugerBob
April 29, 2013, 06:51 AM
I prefer 700x for 45 ACP, but thats with 200gr bullet. 5.0 is good for me, but 5.5 is max for the 200gr SWC that I load via load books.

balderclev
April 29, 2013, 09:39 AM
Noylj,

Thanks for the data, it will be very helpful.

And I'll try to remember that casings are for making sausage.:uhoh:

ljnowell
April 29, 2013, 11:00 AM
I haved used many pounds of 700x in 45acp, but not with 185gr bullets. I would gladly use it over Unique.

Steve C
April 29, 2013, 01:45 PM
I load 185gr JHP's from Remington, Sierra, and Hornady on top of 7.7grs of Unique. With the JHP bullets this gives me a velocity a little over 1,000 fps that will generally ensure proper expansion. Loads below 7.0grs are fine for paper punching with solid bullets for low recoil target loads.

For 230gr FMJ bullets I use 6.0grs of Unique that duplicates military ball at 850 fps.

moxie
April 29, 2013, 08:28 PM
I always use Unique and Bullseye in .45acp with good results.

Never have used 700X in .45acp but did use a lot of in .44 Spl. Dirtiest powder ever in that caliber.

ArchAngelCD
April 30, 2013, 05:20 AM
Tested some 45acp rounds today using Unique from 5.0 to 6.5 behind a 185 gr Hornady xtp boolit.

Had a lot of soot on the casings but the 6.0 gr was the least.

I also have 700x and SR7625 powders. Thinking about testing some loads with those powders as well. Have had good luck with 700x in 40s&w and 38spc but have never shot the 7625 as yet.

Anyone have comments that would help me with these 3 powders?
I will never understand why someone who is using a powder known to be dirty and then they complain when their gun gets dirty.

Unique is a good powder but is dirty and like most powders it's cleanest at the top end of the pressure range. It's very dirty with light loads so if that's unacceptable you will need to change your powder choice. W231/HP-38 works quite well BTW.

USSR
April 30, 2013, 07:16 AM
Agree with ArchAngelCD's assessment. While I LOVE Unique in revolvers with semi-stout loads, using it in a low pressure round in a semiauto makes no sense to me. There are just so many better suited faster burning powders available.

Don

NELSONs02
April 30, 2013, 07:32 AM
Push all those powders to the back and pick up a pound of W231? And some hardcast... :D

Tony k
April 30, 2013, 09:37 AM
I just worked up my very first 45acp loads using 700x and powerpistol. I was using 230gr hornady xtp bullets. I loaded them based on the specs in the hornady manual.

My results shooting 8 round groups, 25 yards supported on sandbag at a paper plate:

700x 4.3 grains-two out of 8 bullets hit the very bottom of the plate. the others were too low to see.

700x 4.6 grains- 4 1/8" group, but the last round failed to feed. I attribute it to not enough pressure to fully cycle the round. I've never had a fail to feed with this gun before.

700x 4.9 grains- 4 1/8"" group. no feed issues

Powerpistol 6.3 grains- 4 1/8" group, but the last round failed to feed exactly the same as the 4.6 grains of 700x.

Powerpistol 6.7 grains- 3.5" group

Powerpistol 7.1 grains- 3" group.

I believe that the powerpistol was generating more velocity based on where the bullets were hitting. the max load 700x grouped about 3" lower than the max load powerpistol.

the 700x meters poorly through my rcbs powder dispenser. It's easily the worst i've tried, but like others have said, it is a flake powder, so that is to be expected.

The powerpistol seemed dirtier than the 700x.

overall, I liked the powerpistol better, but I'm not giving up on the 700x.

give it a shot and let us know how it worked out

Tk

jem375
April 30, 2013, 10:05 AM
I use 6.5 grs of Unique in 45ACP with a 230 gr bullet fmj or jhp...

balderclev
April 30, 2013, 12:07 PM
I will never understand why someone who is using a powder known to be dirty and then they complain when their gun gets dirty.

Unique is a good powder but is dirty and like most powders it's cleanest at the top end of the pressure range. It's very dirty with light loads so if that's unacceptable you will need to change your powder choice. W231/HP-38 works quite well BTW.

You misunderstand. I was not complaining, just trying to understand. I am new to reloading and trying to be as conservative as I can. I see now from some of the comments that I probably need to boost the charge somewhat and see if I still have dirty loads. If that doesn't work then I will try the other powders. I know 700x works well in my 40s&w and 38spc. I thought that was the reason for testing loads and powders. Don't you experiment with different powders??

Changing my powder choice is not an option right now for me. I am very lucky to have the selection I have. Being new to reloading and thus not having already had powder stocks on hand, I have to go with what I can find. My only option until last week was 700x. Now I am experimenting with the other two powders I have so as to spread them around if possible in my 3 pistols if I can find loads that work well.

ljnowell
April 30, 2013, 12:47 PM
I just worked up my very first 45acp loads using 700x and powerpistol. I was using 230gr hornady xtp bullets. I loaded them based on the specs in the hornady manual.

My results shooting 8 round groups, 25 yards supported on sandbag at a paper plate:

700x 4.3 grains-two out of 8 bullets hit the very bottom of the plate. the others were too low to see.

700x 4.6 grains- 4 1/8" group, but the last round failed to feed. I attribute it to not enough pressure to fully cycle the round. I've never had a fail to feed with this gun before.

700x 4.9 grains- 4 1/8"" group. no feed issues

Powerpistol 6.3 grains- 4 1/8" group, but the last round failed to feed exactly the same as the 4.6 grains of 700x.

Powerpistol 6.7 grains- 3.5" group

Powerpistol 7.1 grains- 3" group.

I believe that the powerpistol was generating more velocity based on where the bullets were hitting. the max load 700x grouped about 3" lower than the max load powerpistol.

the 700x meters poorly through my rcbs powder dispenser. It's easily the worst i've tried, but like others have said, it is a flake powder, so that is to be expected.

The powerpistol seemed dirtier than the 700x.

overall, I liked the powerpistol better, but I'm not giving up on the 700x.

give it a shot and let us know how it worked out

Tk

Odd results, imo. /i load 4.6gr of 700x under a 200gr bullet(even less pressure) and find it to bevery clean burning. No soot, no nasty left on my gun. As far as power pistol, when loaded to the top of its data I have always found it to be a super clean powder. Nothing like Unique or even Bullseye for that matter.

cfullgraf
April 30, 2013, 06:51 PM
700-X is my main powder for use in the 45ACP for decades. I only shoot 230 FMJs in my 45ACP guns.

I have had good luck with Unique and AA#5 as well.

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